Israeli tank destroyed..

[Aimster]

This was supposed to be the best of the best in terms of armor.

I guess the same thing was said about the U.S tanks until they went into Iraq a few years ago and they started to get destroyed.

 

[Genx87]

That is impressive stuff, a single tank lost in 20 days of battle. Hizbollah keeps this up and they may be able to decimate Israeli tank forcces in a few hundred years.

No tank is invulnerable, especially in close fighting. The closer the range, the less a weapon has to be in order to penetrate the armor.

The key is did the crew survive? The M1A2 and M1A1's we sent into Iraw and were destroyed a lot of the crew survived.

Most of the talk about US tanks were in comparison to what they were going up against, T-72s, maybe a few T-80s. They decimated those at ranges the Iraq's didnt even know the M1s were around.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

IIRC, one of the earliest IDF fatalities was during an attack on their tanks.

 

[Aimster]

Originally posted by: Genx87
That is impressive stuff, a single tank lost in 20 days of battle. Hizbollah keeps this up and they may be able to decimate Israeli tank forcces in a few hundred years.

No tank is invulnerable, especially in close fighting. The closer the range, the less a weapon has to be in order to penetrate the armor.

The key is did the crew survive? The M1A2 and M1A1's we sent into Iraw and were destroyed a lot of the crew survived.

Most of the talk about US tanks were in comparison to what they were going up against, T-72s, maybe a few T-80s. They decimated those at ranges the Iraq's didnt even know the M1s were around.

This one the crew died instantly the report said (2). 2 others were seriously hurt.
Http://www.jpost.com

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: Aimster
This was supposed to be the best of the best in terms of armor.

I guess the same thing was said about the U.S tanks until they went into Iraq a few years ago and they started to get destroyed.

What's your point? Nobody expects 100% invulnerability from such weapons. Why do you think they call the counter measure an anti-tank weapon? :roll:

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: Genx87
That is impressive stuff, a single tank lost in 20 days of battle. Hizbollah keeps this up and they may be able to decimate Israeli tank forcces in a few hundred years.

No tank is invulnerable, especially in close fighting. The closer the range, the less a weapon has to be in order to penetrate the armor.

The key is did the crew survive? The M1A2 and M1A1's we sent into Iraw and were destroyed a lot of the crew survived.

Most of the talk about US tanks were in comparison to what they were going up against, T-72s, maybe a few T-80s. They decimated those at ranges the Iraq's didnt even know the M1s were around.

This one the crew died instantly the report said (2). 2 others were seriously hurt.
Http://www.jpost.com

That will happen, 1 tank being knocked out is nothing.
I believe in the sinai desert there were probably hundreds of tanks knocked out.
Kursk is another example of great tank battles. Hell even in the counter offensive of Normandy the Germans lost about 2300 AFVs, lots of them tanks to the British and Americans.

 

[Aimster]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Aimster
This was supposed to be the best of the best in terms of armor.

I guess the same thing was said about the U.S tanks until they went into Iraq a few years ago and they started to get destroyed.

What's your point? Nobody expects 100% invulnerability from such weapons. Why do you think they call the counter measure an anti-tank weapon? :roll:

yes they do. Go on military boards This was supposed to be the best tank.

Hezbollah is using ancient crap for their anti-tank missiles.

The U.S felt their tanks to be superior to all and were bragging about it for years until we invaded Iraq.

 

[Todd33]

The news said Hezbollah has Iranian guided anti-tank missiles, I don't think they are crap.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Aimster
This was supposed to be the best of the best in terms of armor.

I guess the same thing was said about the U.S tanks until they went into Iraq a few years ago and they started to get destroyed.

What's your point? Nobody expects 100% invulnerability from such weapons. Why do you think they call the counter measure an anti-tank weapon? :roll:

yes they do. Go on military boards This was supposed to be the best tank.

Hezbollah is using ancient crap for their anti-tank missiles.

The U.S felt their tanks to be superior to all and were bragging about it for years until we invaded Iraq.

Do not try to compare apples vs oranges.

Tank vs tank was the comparison.

Every tank and/or weapon system has it's vulnerabilites. The key is to minimize and protect those area as much as possible without handicapping the mission of the unit.

A "generic" tank design has flaws. If a weapon can be setup to get to the flaw, then the tank/vehicle can be disabled/destroyed.

We do not know what advanced weaponry Iran has provided. Just like the anti-ship radar guided missle last month. The old Russian equipment may be known about; what Iran has up their sleeves is not known.

Just like Russia used the Arab couintries as test beds for their weapons; Iran may be using Hezbollah as a testing ground for their stuff.

 

[Gamer X]

Originally posted by: Genx87
That is impressive stuff, a single tank lost in 20 days of battle. Hizbollah keeps this up and they may be able to decimate Israeli tank forcces in a few hundred years.

No tank is invulnerable, especially in close fighting. The closer the range, the less a weapon has to be in order to penetrate the armor.

The key is did the crew survive? The M1A2 and M1A1's we sent into Iraw and were destroyed a lot of the crew survived.

Most of the talk about US tanks were in comparison to what they were going up against, T-72s, maybe a few T-80s. They decimated those at ranges the Iraq's didnt even know the M1s were around.

Hizbollah destroyed around 20 tanks since the beginning of the war but western news networks do not report it. Today Hizbollah destroyed 4 tanks and 2 armoured bulldozers.
I watch Al Manar channel which is a satellite channel of Hizbollah and I see the destroyed tanks.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: Aimster
yes they do. Go on military boards This was supposed to be the best tank.

Hezbollah is using ancient crap for their anti-tank missiles.

The U.S felt their tanks to be superior to all and were bragging about it for years until we invaded Iraq.

They're freaking machines, and no matter how strong they're built, as an engineering problem, the existence of the design presents the design target to defend against them.

Anyone who believes a specific design or plan can never be defeated or overcome hasn't been on this planet long enough to grasp reality. Ronald Dumbsfeld comes to mind.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Aimster
This was supposed to be the best of the best in terms of armor.

I guess the same thing was said about the U.S tanks until they went into Iraq a few years ago and they started to get destroyed.

What's your point? Nobody expects 100% invulnerability from such weapons. Why do you think they call the counter measure an anti-tank weapon? :roll:

yes they do. Go on military boards This was supposed to be the best tank.

Hezbollah is using ancient crap for their anti-tank missiles.

The U.S felt their tanks to be superior to all and were bragging about it for years until we invaded Iraq.

Ancient crap? Define what that is please. I think at a range of 10 meters a panzershrek may give the best tanks in the world a run for their money from the side or rear.

That weapon is about 65 years old.

American tanks are right up there with the British challenger and German Leopard II.
This has been proved time and time again on many battlefields. I didnt see many US tanks lost to Iraqi armored forces, did you?

The Israeli tanks are built a bit different for close fighting, but that doesnt make them invulnerable to being knocked out.

 

[Aimster]

The report Hezbollah "destroyed" the tanks is accurate but there is one flaw in that reporting.

Destroyed should be changed to disabled. Many of these tanks were hit by tank weapons and were disabled and the tanks had to be towed back into Israel.

Several have been destroyed, but the other ones I heard about were destroyed by anti-tank mines and not misssiles.

I am just surprised that this tank was taken out by a missile. I love this tank and I thought it was invincible.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Gamer X

Originally posted by: Genx87
That is impressive stuff, a single tank lost in 20 days of battle. Hizbollah keeps this up and they may be able to decimate Israeli tank forcces in a few hundred years.

No tank is invulnerable, especially in close fighting. The closer the range, the less a weapon has to be in order to penetrate the armor.

The key is did the crew survive? The M1A2 and M1A1's we sent into Iraw and were destroyed a lot of the crew survived.

Most of the talk about US tanks were in comparison to what they were going up against, T-72s, maybe a few T-80s. They decimated those at ranges the Iraq's didnt even know the M1s were around.

Hizbollah destroyed around 20 tanks since the beginning of the war but western news networks do not report it. Today Hizbollah destroyed 4 tanks and 2 armoured bulldozers.
I watch Al Manar channel which is a satellite channel of Hizbollah and I see the destroyed tanks.

I'd like to see a better source for that. I dont doubt Israeli tanks are being knocked out, but what is a tank? AFV's do not equal tanks.

 

[Aimster]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Aimster
This was supposed to be the best of the best in terms of armor.

I guess the same thing was said about the U.S tanks until they went into Iraq a few years ago and they started to get destroyed.

What's your point? Nobody expects 100% invulnerability from such weapons. Why do you think they call the counter measure an anti-tank weapon? :roll:

yes they do. Go on military boards This was supposed to be the best tank.

Hezbollah is using ancient crap for their anti-tank missiles.

The U.S felt their tanks to be superior to all and were bragging about it for years until we invaded Iraq.

Ancient crap? Define what that is please. I think at a range of 10 meters a panzershrek may give the best tanks in the world a run for their money from the side or rear.

That weapon is about 65 years old.

American tanks are right up there with the British challenger and German Leopard II.
This has been proved time and time again on many battlefields. I didnt see many US tanks lost to Iraqi armored forces, did you?

The Israeli tanks are built a bit different for close fighting, but that doesnt make them invulnerable to being knocked out.

Hezbollah's weapons are from the 70s, no? I would assume that current armor technology has been made to withstand most of those weapons. That, or maybe Hezbollah has newer weapons that I don't know about.

American tanks didn't take losses during the Gulf War, but during the invasion plenty of tanks were taken out by roadside bombs and anti-tank weapons.

Military boards are filled with hundreds of pictures of U.S vehicles destroyed. People who love to see the U.S fail have a hard on posting those pictures.

 

[daniel49]

Originally posted by: Aimster
The report Hezbollah "destroyed" the tanks is accurate but there is one flaw in that reporting.

Destroyed should be changed to disabled. Many of these tanks were hit by tank weapons and were disabled and the tanks had to be towed back into Israel.

Several have been destroyed, but the other ones I heard about were destroyed by anti-tank mines and not misssiles.

I am just surprised that this tank was taken out by a missile. I love this tank and I thought it was invincible.

that does it. I'm canceling my tank order.

 

[Gamer X]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Gamer X

Originally posted by: Genx87
That is impressive stuff, a single tank lost in 20 days of battle. Hizbollah keeps this up and they may be able to decimate Israeli tank forcces in a few hundred years.

No tank is invulnerable, especially in close fighting. The closer the range, the less a weapon has to be in order to penetrate the armor.

The key is did the crew survive? The M1A2 and M1A1's we sent into Iraw and were destroyed a lot of the crew survived.

Most of the talk about US tanks were in comparison to what they were going up against, T-72s, maybe a few T-80s. They decimated those at ranges the Iraq's didnt even know the M1s were around.

Hizbollah destroyed around 20 tanks since the beginning of the war but western news networks do not report it. Today Hizbollah destroyed 4 tanks and 2 armoured bulldozers.
I watch Al Manar channel which is a satellite channel of Hizbollah and I see the destroyed tanks.

I'd like to see a better source for that. I dont doubt Israeli tanks are being knocked out, but what is a tank? AFV's do not equal tanks.

They're Merkava tanks

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Aimster
This was supposed to be the best of the best in terms of armor.

I guess the same thing was said about the U.S tanks until they went into Iraq a few years ago and they started to get destroyed.

What's your point? Nobody expects 100% invulnerability from such weapons. Why do you think they call the counter measure an anti-tank weapon? :roll:

yes they do. Go on military boards This was supposed to be the best tank.

Hezbollah is using ancient crap for their anti-tank missiles.

The U.S felt their tanks to be superior to all and were bragging about it for years until we invaded Iraq.

Ancient crap? Define what that is please. I think at a range of 10 meters a panzershrek may give the best tanks in the world a run for their money from the side or rear.

That weapon is about 65 years old.

American tanks are right up there with the British challenger and German Leopard II.
This has been proved time and time again on many battlefields. I didnt see many US tanks lost to Iraqi armored forces, did you?

The Israeli tanks are built a bit different for close fighting, but that doesnt make them invulnerable to being knocked out.

Hezbollah's weapons are from the 70s, no? I would assume that current armor technology has been made to withstand most of those weapons. That, or maybe Hezbollah has newer weapons that I don't know about.

American tanks didn't take losses during the Gulf War, but during the invasion plenty of tanks were taken out by roadside bombs and anti-tank weapons.

Military boards are filled with hundreds of pictures of U.S vehicles destroyed. People who love to see the U.S fail have a hard on posting those pictures.

You make a bomb big enough with a hardpoint and it will knock anything out, including a big battleship. No tank is invincible and no tank ever will. Because once a tank becomes invincible to a weapon system, a new weapon system is developed to destroy it.

The basic premise is the same as it has been since WWII. Hard metal x velocity = penetration. The only difference is the technologies have moved ahead.

 

[Harabec]

Hizballah have some modern weaponry, including Kornet E's and older Spigot\Fagots. (google it...)

 

[linkgoron]

Originally posted by: Gamer X

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Gamer X

Originally posted by: Genx87
That is impressive stuff, a single tank lost in 20 days of battle. Hizbollah keeps this up and they may be able to decimate Israeli tank forcces in a few hundred years.

No tank is invulnerable, especially in close fighting. The closer the range, the less a weapon has to be in order to penetrate the armor.

The key is did the crew survive? The M1A2 and M1A1's we sent into Iraw and were destroyed a lot of the crew survived.

Most of the talk about US tanks were in comparison to what they were going up against, T-72s, maybe a few T-80s. They decimated those at ranges the Iraq's didnt even know the M1s were around.

Hizbollah destroyed around 20 tanks since the beginning of the war but western news networks do not report it. Today Hizbollah destroyed 4 tanks and 2 armoured bulldozers.
I watch Al Manar channel which is a satellite channel of Hizbollah and I see the destroyed tanks.

I'd like to see a better source for that. I dont doubt Israeli tanks are being knocked out, but what is a tank? AFV's do not equal tanks.

They're Merkava tanks

Obviously Almanar is a credible source. All they want to do is Glorify Hizballah...

 

[Gamer X]

Originally posted by: linkgoron

Originally posted by: Gamer X

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Gamer X

Originally posted by: Genx87
That is impressive stuff, a single tank lost in 20 days of battle. Hizbollah keeps this up and they may be able to decimate Israeli tank forcces in a few hundred years.

No tank is invulnerable, especially in close fighting. The closer the range, the less a weapon has to be in order to penetrate the armor.

The key is did the crew survive? The M1A2 and M1A1's we sent into Iraw and were destroyed a lot of the crew survived.

Most of the talk about US tanks were in comparison to what they were going up against, T-72s, maybe a few T-80s. They decimated those at ranges the Iraq's didnt even know the M1s were around.

Hizbollah destroyed around 20 tanks since the beginning of the war but western news networks do not report it. Today Hizbollah destroyed 4 tanks and 2 armoured bulldozers.
I watch Al Manar channel which is a satellite channel of Hizbollah and I see the destroyed tanks.

I'd like to see a better source for that. I dont doubt Israeli tanks are being knocked out, but what is a tank? AFV's do not equal tanks.

They're Merkava tanks

Obviously Almanar is a credible source. All they want to do is Glorify Hizballah...

Also Al Jazeera and what about the destroyed Merkava tanks that I see.

 

[SamurAchzar]

The reported anti tank missiles were AT14 Kornets (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AT-14_Kornet), which are an advanced missile from the mid-90.

The Merkava tanks have several generations, most advanced of which is the Mark IV, which only entered service about two years ago.
Some of these were hit, usually with minor injuries to the crews. The report doesn't seem to tell what type it is.

Israel will soon deploy the TROPHY system. I know the US bought these systems from Israel as well. Quite amazing.
It's an active protection suite that destroys anti tank missiles during their flight.

 

[imported_toxigun]

Merkava tanks are also very old. This might just be a Merkava Mk 2 tank. This is a quite old model, from 1989. Obviously, modern weapons can destroy them.

I don't believe Hezbullah destroyed the more modern, Mk 3 and Mk 4 tanks.

 

[Aimster]

Why would Israel send the older tanks into the middle of a battle where they know the enemy has these kind of weapons?

It would make sense that the tank was in fact the latest one.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Aimster
Why would Israel send the older tanks into the middle of a battle where they know the enemy has these kind of weapons?

It would make sense that the tank was in fact the latest one.

They send units, each unit has an inventory of tanks. It just so happened that some of the units in S. Lebanon might have had older tanks. I believe in the 67 war some units were using WWII Shermans.

They dont sit back and decide to pick and choose individual tanks out of the inventory for the job like your would in an rts