Israel's Anniversay - Same Date as Palestinian Holocaust. How'd that Happen ?

[EagleKeeper]

When the Palestinians that bailed at the recommendation of the Arab countries

Myth

History actually has it differently.

Given the amount of refugees and the size of the Irsraeli population at the time; external forces had much greater impact than internal forces.

The Palestinians ran because of the wars - caused by the Arabs.
The first batch ran because they were told to.

Had Israeli retaliation been the only reason as the Palestinian lovers would want you to believe, then riddle me this.
Why did so many stay in Israel during and after the war? Point of a gun?

Even your links indicate such when coming from a neutral source

 

[Sinsear]

Simple question:

Which side suicide bombs civilians deliberately?

I'll do a count of how many diversions occur before I get a one-word response (Either Israel or Palestine) to this question.

Islam.

 

[Atreus21]

Islam.

Wow. I confess I didn't expect any honest answers, although I wasn't intending to do a wholesale indictment of Islam; just the Palestinian leadership.

 

[Sinsear]

Wow. I confess I didn't expect any honest answers, although I wasn't intending to do a wholesale indictment of Islam; just the Palestinian leadership.

Spade is spade. Islam regularly condones suicide bombings of civilians, not just by its Palestinian members.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Spade is spade. Islam regularly condones suicide bombings of civilians, not just by its Palestinian members.

Look at Afghanistan, Pakistan, Indonesia, Iraq for additional examples

 

[Doboji]

Look at Afghanistan, Pakistan, Indonesia, Iraq for additional examples

Radical Warped Islam.... most Muslims don't adhere to or follow the breed of Islam that condones these actions.

Very important distinction. Unless we can hold all Christians responsible for the actions of it's crazy members as well...

 

[JEDIYoda]

Radical Warped Islam.... most Muslims don't adhere to or follow the breed of Islam that condones these actions.

That`s what you say...the facts paint quite a different story --
You Muslim apologists say not all Muslims...well that is sort of true....
But if you take a look at additionally Afghanistan, Pakistan, Indonesia, Iraq it would seem to be more of the same.....

The religion of peace......hahaaaaa

 

[kylebisme]

I hadn't visited this thread in a few days because I got lost in The Witcher 2, but I won't let this slide:

When the Palestinians that bailed at the recommendation of the Arab countries

myth

History actually has it differently.

Then cite some historical documentation rather than waving your hands at the ones I presented, eh? You can't, because you're FoS.

 

[piasabird]

The Arabs were lined up to kill Isreali's from every nation surrounding Isreal. They were going to all attack at once and wipe Isreal out. Isreal did what it had to do to survive. In a War if you take land, you can keep it. Too bad Isreal let all the prisoners of war go after the war. If it was not for Nato, Isreal would have just wiped them all out. Makes you wonder if we should have intervened at all. I think the only way you will see peace is if Nato takes over every country surrounding Isreal. Maybe the USA should just quit interfering.

As soon as some militant faction takes over all of a sudden all the Christians start to die. We see this all over the middle east. Makes you wonder if there is such a thing as a good Muslim?

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Is it just me, or does anyone else think that the Palestinians brought "Al Nakba" down on themselves by attacking kibbutzes and whatnot. Has everyone forgetten that the Arab world tried to genocidely exterminate the Israelis in the late 1940s?

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Palestinians sure are. Like vermin, no one wants them in their home.

Their Arab and Muslim brethren don't seem to want them in their countries, that's for sure.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Nobody likes Israel nation. Europe doesn't like Israel. Asia doesn't like Israel. South America doesn't like Israel. When you got a bunch of people not liking you, perhaps it's time to ask "am I an asshole?". But apparently, Yahwee did not endow the Jewish people with this self examining ability.

That's because the Jews don't embrace Jesus and Allah the way Christians and Muslims do.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Here's a challenge to folks. Go read the novels Exodus and The Haj by Leon Uris.

Now take everything we know about Muslims and Islam and integrate that with your reading of those novels. What seems more plausible--the facts as described in those novels or the facts as wwwSwimming describes them?

Is the Arab world a civilized place where women have individual rights, or is it mostly barbaric and backwards? Uh, yeah, I believe Leon Uris's description of the situation in those two books because it is 100% consistent with the Arab and Muslim world as it is today and for the Palestinians and Arabs to have not been the instigators of conflict would be 100% inconsistent. To hear some people tell it, the Palestinians' demeanor and behavior was like that of Harvard and Oxford grads.

 

[kylebisme]

Has everyone forgetten that the Arab world tried to genocidely exterminate the Israelis in the late 1940s?

the 1940's a way before my time, but looking back at the historical record I find piles of evidence which contradicts your claim. For example the NYT reports from 1947 compiled in this article, notably, "Palestine Jews Minimize Arabs: Sure of Superiority, Settlers Feel They Can Win Natives By Reason or Force," from over a year before the Arab states declared war on Israel:

Whatever the degree of their superiority complex, however, the Jews are certainly confident of their ability to bring the Arabs to terms -- by persuasion if possible, by might if necessary. The program of the largest terrorist group, the Irgun Zvai Leumi, is to evacuate the British forces from Palestine and declare a Zionist state west of the Jordan, and "we will take care of the Arabs."

Furthermore, the article I linked cites many other NYT reports of Palestinians fleeing from Zionist attacks prior to the war. So, WhipperSnapper, where did you get your understanding of history from, or you the one who has forgotten to check the record?

 

[brandonb]

I have no interest in reading novels by a Jew, as it's going to be biased.

Thanks though.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

That should be the first immutable rule of international law. If you attack your neighbor and your neighbor kicks your ass and takes some of your land, you should NEVER get back that land. That should be the penalty for launching an attack.

This makes too much sense, but remember, the people you're asking to accept that are crazed Islamic fanatics.

 

[kylebisme]

Oh that's right, WhipperSnapper shuns looking at historical documents in favor of reading novels which conform to his distorted view of the world.

 

[Sinsear]

Their Arab and Muslim brethren don't seem to want them in their countries, that's for sure.

Funny isn't it? No one wants them.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

the US didn't lose (militarily) in Vietnam, you pussied out, there's a huge difference.

Didn't the U.S. have a kill-to-death ratio of around 40-to-1 in Vietnam? If so then it's hard to say that the U.S. was defeated. Had the U.S. really wanted to win the war it could have done so, but it didn't want to break out the nukes and other nasties we may have had in our arsenal.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Oh that's right, WhipperSnapper shuns looking at historical documents in favor of reading novels which conform to his distorted view of the world.

The NY Times article you linked to doesn't really say whether the Jews or the Palestinians initiated the hostility. However, it does seem to confirm that the Palestinians were almost primitive relative to the Jews and that the best thing that could have happened to them would be for the Jews to establish a Jewish state and help lift them out of poverty. I didn't really read the 2011 piece because, based on the author's name, it's probably safe to assume that it's full of Arab-bias.

 

[Broheim]

the 1940's a way before my time, but looking back at the historical record I find piles of evidence which contradicts your claim. For example the NYT reports from 1947 compiled in this article, notably, "Palestine Jews Minimize Arabs: Sure of Superiority, Settlers Feel They Can Win Natives By Reason or Force," from over a year before the Arab states declared war on Israel:


Furthermore, the article I linked cites many other NYT reports of Palestinians fleeing from Zionist attacks prior to the war. So, WhipperSnapper, where did you get your understanding of history from, or you the one who has forgotten to check the record?

take those articles with a grain of salt, anti-semitism was rampant in the US (and the rest of the world) up until the late 40's, something that has conveniently been forgotten since then.

 

[werepossum]

This makes too much sense, but remember, the people you're asking to accept that are crazed Islamic fanatics.

True. That does make negotiating more difficult, if not impossible.

 

[kylebisme]

The NY Times article you linked to doesn't really say whether the Jews or the Palestinians initiated the hostility.

The NYT report I link documents the fact that Zionists were prepared to drive Palestinians out of their homeland over a year before the war broke out, and NYT articles such as this and this document that process of ethnic clenching going on in the months prior to the Arab states declaring war on Israel.

However, it does seem to confirm that the Palestinians were almost primitive relative to the Jews and that the best thing that could have happened to them would be for the Jews to establish a Jewish state and help lift them out of poverty.

Please quote whatever part of the report you believe confirms this.

take those articles with a grain of salt

I take your contention with a bucket of salt, since the articles I reference agree with the rest of the contemporary accounts of the events that I've read, while you apparently can't cite anything from the historical record to refute such accounts and have to resort to handwaving arguments instead.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

The NYT report I link documents the fact that Zionists were prepared to drive Palestinians out of their homeland over a year before the war broke out, and NYT articles such as this and this document that process of ethnic clenching going on in the months prior to the Arab states declaring war on Israel.

Maybe there's more to the story than what the NY Times reported in that article, such as years of attacks on Kibbutz's, the Mufti's Nazi-like call for the Palestinians to slaughter the Jews, etc.

Please quote whatever part of the report you believe confirms this.

That seems to be what the article was saying or at least reporting what other people said. I don't feel like reading it again and quoting relevant parts for you. Heck, the Israeli's of the late 1940's may have been more advanced than most Muslims and Arabs today. Got individual rights for women yet?

What do you make of my argument that if you take what we know about Arabs and Muslims today and then integrate it with what's presented in those two Leon Uris novels, that they seem very believable?

 

[Lemon law]

Funny isn't it? No one wants them.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sincear understands nothing as he says no one wants the Palestinian people.

As he totally misunderstands the conflict from the perspective of Arab or Palestinian eyes.

Because we have to face the facts, the now 3 million plus Palestinian refugees, were the co inhabitants of the British Palestinian mandate in 1948.

As as Israel became an Independent State, Israelis shamefully and with no justification pushed out all their fellow Palestinian residents and stripped them of all human rights.

On one hand the Arabs will now help feed Palestinian refugees, but they refuse to assimilate the Palestinians because the Arabs justly maintain, its an Israeli responsibility to redress the grievances of the Palestinian people Israel previously robbed.

Any other Arab position is tantamount to letting Israel off the hook for their prior shameful
behavior.

So now Israel hopes in vain that the Palestinian people will grow gills and swim away.