IT jobs......

[UDT89]

lol its so funny how everything is 50/50.

but it seems as though getting certified is good since i dont have work experience in this field.

now i just need to research mcse and mcsa.

 

[Marinski]

Originally posted by: jbourne77
Certs mean jack. There was a time and place when they held some value, though. In the late 90's the tech boom was in full swing, and no one could make heads or tails of what was going on. Certs were the easiest way for a company to determine if you were qualified for the job (even though most people holding certs - myself included - were book experienced).

When I interview someone, I'm going to tech them to the fullest extent of MY knowledge. I want to know exactly what they know and don't know, and I also want to make sure they're capable of admitting they don't know something, as opposed to making a bunch of bullshit up. I don't claim to know it all, and I don't want people around me or my team who think they know it all.

All a cert tells me is that you can buckle down for a couple weeks. I can glean that info from the previous project experience you have.

Does the cert help you get an interview though?

 

[2Xtreme21]

I got mine by knowing the daughter of my boss. *shrugs*

Edit: That and obviously having knowledge of computers / going to school for IS.

 

[classy]

Originally posted by: jbourne77
Certs mean jack. There was a time and place when they held some value, though. In the late 90's the tech boom was in full swing, and no one could make heads or tails of what was going on. Certs were the easiest way for a company to determine if you were qualified for the job (even though most people holding certs - myself included - were book experienced).

When I interview someone, I'm going to tech them to the fullest extent of MY knowledge. I want to know exactly what they know and don't know, and I also want to make sure they're capable of admitting they don't know something, as opposed to making a bunch of bullshit up. I don't claim to know it all, and I don't want people around me or my team who think they know it all.

All a cert tells me is that you can buckle down for a couple weeks. I can glean that info from the previous project experience you have.

Couple of weeks huh? To hear you say that and knowing you actually interview people is scary.

 

[jlbenedict]

Originally posted by: Marinski

Originally posted by: classy

Originally posted by: UDT89

Originally posted by: SoulAssassin
If you don't have the experience, you'll get a better job having a cert vs not having one but experience is preferred. Most jobs that list 'MCSE required' also say 'or relevant experience'.

tahts the thing. i think getting a cert or two would be good.

its hard to put on a resume what you know how to do, when you never got paid for it or your job title didnt reflect what you did.

Soul really wraps it up in a nutshell. To be honest I would do MCSA and then do CCNA. That should round you out pretty good. Oh don't overlook a career working with Linux either . While its not my bag, linux brings a lot to the table. But it really comes down to what you want to do.

Hey, I already have an A+ cert and I signed up for a Cisco class at community college this fall. Would i be better off getting a Net+ instead? Or just go after the CCNA?

The CCNA will carry alot of weight over the Net+.. alot of the Net+ stuff, you should/will know by having the knowledge to pass the CCNA anyway.. they are both network related certs.

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: classy

Originally posted by: jbourne77
Certs mean jack. There was a time and place when they held some value, though. In the late 90's the tech boom was in full swing, and no one could make heads or tails of what was going on. Certs were the easiest way for a company to determine if you were qualified for the job (even though most people holding certs - myself included - were book experienced).

When I interview someone, I'm going to tech them to the fullest extent of MY knowledge. I want to know exactly what they know and don't know, and I also want to make sure they're capable of admitting they don't know something, as opposed to making a bunch of bullshit up. I don't claim to know it all, and I don't want people around me or my team who think they know it all.

All a cert tells me is that you can buckle down for a couple weeks. I can glean that info from the previous project experience you have.

Couple of weeks huh? To hear you say that and knowing you actually interview people is scary.

What... Classy doesn't approve? Success.

 

[neovan]

certs will get you in the door, experience will keep you inside.

 

[KaChow]

1. Join military
2. Get TS clearance
3. ???
4. PROFIT

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: Marinski

Originally posted by: jbourne77
Certs mean jack. There was a time and place when they held some value, though. In the late 90's the tech boom was in full swing, and no one could make heads or tails of what was going on. Certs were the easiest way for a company to determine if you were qualified for the job (even though most people holding certs - myself included - were book experienced).

When I interview someone, I'm going to tech them to the fullest extent of MY knowledge. I want to know exactly what they know and don't know, and I also want to make sure they're capable of admitting they don't know something, as opposed to making a bunch of bullshit up. I don't claim to know it all, and I don't want people around me or my team who think they know it all.

All a cert tells me is that you can buckle down for a couple weeks. I can glean that info from the previous project experience you have.

Does the cert help you get an interview though?

Back in the day it did, but people learned their lesson: generally speaking, a cert doesn't tell you anything about the candidate. It could mean that they know their stuff, or it could mean that they don't know their stuff and need to appear as if they know their stuff. The term "paper cert" didn't just come out of thin air.

When I'm looking through a pool of candidates, I look at their skills/qualifications to see if they're a match for the position rather than relying on a cert. I can do a better job than a certification test can in determining if someone knows XYZ. It's not because I'm a wizard... it's because my questions aren't canned questions that can be found on a bunch of free practice tests with multiple choice answers:

"So, it says here you know OO really well. Tell me what you think of generics and when/where they should be used."

"Comparing interfaces and abstract classes to one another, tell me the advantages and disadvantages of each."

You can get certified without being able to answer either one of those questions, because the way the questions are formulated require that you have a deep understanding of the topic. It requires that you be able to hold your own in a rich conversation.

And for what it's worth, I have NEVER been asked if I was certified when I've interviewed for a position. ***NEVER***

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: KaChow
1. Join military
2. Get TS clearance
3. ???
4. PROFIT

No kidding. If you're going to spend time doing something, spend it getting your clearance. If you want to make some serious jack, that's where it's at. I don't care if you can't tie your own shoes: if you have TS clearance, you can cherrypick damn near any job you want.

:thumbsup:

 

[ultimatebob]

Originally posted by: jbourne77
Certs mean jack. There was a time and place when they held some value, though. In the late 90's the tech boom was in full swing, and no one could make heads or tails of what was going on. Certs were the easiest way for a company to determine if you were qualified for the job (even though most people holding certs - myself included - were book experienced).

When I interview someone, I'm going to tech them to the fullest extent of MY knowledge. I want to know exactly what they know and don't know, and I also want to make sure they're capable of admitting they don't know something, as opposed to making a bunch of bullshit up. I don't claim to know it all, and I don't want people around me or my team who think they know it all.

All a cert tells me is that you can buckle down for a couple weeks. I can glean that info from the previous project experience you have.

True... Certification only shows that you're good at memorizing information for an exam. It doesn't teach real troubleshooting skills, which is what IT support as all about. It might help you get promoted later, but it's not going help figure out why server X is crashing or why Ms. Y can't get on the network.

 

[jimbob200521]

Starting at the bottom here by doing support. Hopefully I'll be able to move on eventually, but the way this company does with its employee's...

 

[KaChow]

I've found that certs are something that you get when your company says "We have $xxx to send you to a class and get a cert. What do you want to get?" Otherwise, they're not very useful.

 

[KaChow]

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: KaChow
1. Join military
2. Get TS clearance
3. ???
4. PROFIT

No kidding. If you're going to spend time doing something, spend it getting your clearance. If you want to make some serious jack, that's where it's at. I don't care if you can't tie your own shoes: if you have TS clearance, you can cherrypick damn near any very well paying job you want.

:thumbsup:

I had to fix that up for you.

 

[jlbenedict]

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: KaChow
1. Join military
2. Get TS clearance
3. ???
4. PROFIT

No kidding. If you're going to spend time doing something, spend it getting your clearance. If you want to make some serious jack, that's where it's at. I don't care if you can't tie your own shoes: if you have TS clearance, you can cherrypick damn near any job you want.

:thumbsup:

We have a guy that claims he is an MCSE, and has like 20 years of experience that is hired as a system engineer where I work...
He doesn't even know how to open a command prompt and perform tracert's and pings

:roll:

 

[SuperNaruto]

Originally posted by: jlbenedict

We have a guy that claims he is an MCSE, and has like 20 years of experience that is hired as a system engineer where I work...
He doesn't even know how to open a command prompt and perform tracert's and pings

:roll:

good one.. what's a command prompt ?

 

[jlbenedict]

Originally posted by: SuperNaruto

Originally posted by: jlbenedict

We have a guy that claims he is an MCSE, and has like 20 years of experience that is hired as a system engineer where I work...
He doesn't even know how to open a command prompt and perform tracert's and pings

:roll:

good one.. what's a command prompt ?

 

[LanceM]

Many employers state that they require certs. Some are strict on this; others will be happy with experience. This goes for ANY field.

You either gotta know someone or start from the bottom. Chances are you'll know someone that can help you get a job at the bottom. Again, this goes for any field. IT is no exception to any rule.

Originally posted by: KaChow
1. Join military
2. Get TS clearance
3. ???
4. PROFIT

We now know that the third step is, "Make her open the box."

 

[classy]

Originally posted by: jlbenedict

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: KaChow
1. Join military
2. Get TS clearance
3. ???
4. PROFIT

No kidding. If you're going to spend time doing something, spend it getting your clearance. If you want to make some serious jack, that's where it's at. I don't care if you can't tie your own shoes: if you have TS clearance, you can cherrypick damn near any job you want.

:thumbsup:

We have a guy that claims he is an MCSE, and has like 20 years of experience that is hired as a system engineer where I work...
He doesn't even know how to open a command prompt and perform tracert's and pings

:roll:

So did he lie he was an MCSE or did he lie he had 20 years of experience? And interesting note you said he claimed to be a MCSE? Did anyone verify he was telling the truth? Last time I checked all my certs are tied to my ID number which is easily verifiable.

 

[jlbenedict]

Originally posted by: classy

Originally posted by: jlbenedict

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: KaChow
1. Join military
2. Get TS clearance
3. ???
4. PROFIT

No kidding. If you're going to spend time doing something, spend it getting your clearance. If you want to make some serious jack, that's where it's at. I don't care if you can't tie your own shoes: if you have TS clearance, you can cherrypick damn near any job you want.

:thumbsup:

We have a guy that claims he is an MCSE, and has like 20 years of experience that is hired as a system engineer where I work...
He doesn't even know how to open a command prompt and perform tracert's and pings

:roll:

So did he lie he was an MCSE or did he lie he had 20 years of experience? And interesting note you said he claimed to be a MCSE? Did anyone verify he was telling the truth? Last time I checked all my certs are tied to my ID number which is easily verifiable.

Well, I do know the guy was fairly old..well older than me.. he is probably in his early 40's..
I think he was an MCSE in Windows NT 4.0

 

[UDT89]

wow im really torn now.......

i just dont wanna waste my money.

 

[richardycc]

I got in thur a training pool, my company is hiring people for SAP training pool too, see the posting in the job networking tread up on top.

 

[classy]

Originally posted by: jlbenedict

Originally posted by: classy

Originally posted by: jlbenedict

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: KaChow
1. Join military
2. Get TS clearance
3. ???
4. PROFIT

No kidding. If you're going to spend time doing something, spend it getting your clearance. If you want to make some serious jack, that's where it's at. I don't care if you can't tie your own shoes: if you have TS clearance, you can cherrypick damn near any job you want.

:thumbsup:

We have a guy that claims he is an MCSE, and has like 20 years of experience that is hired as a system engineer where I work...
He doesn't even know how to open a command prompt and perform tracert's and pings

:roll:

So did he lie he was an MCSE or did he lie he had 20 years of experience? And interesting note you said he claimed to be a MCSE? Did anyone verify he was telling the truth? Last time I checked all my certs are tied to my ID number which is easily verifiable.

Well, I do know the guy was fairly old..well older than me.. he is probably in his early 40's..
I think he was an MCSE in Windows NT 4.0

So in other words you really didn't know a damn thing about the old dude, so you just decided to throw some crap up against the wall and see if it would stick?

 

[imported_Imp]

Funny thing I found out over the summer by working IT for a huge 'corporation'. Got the chance to talk/work with every IT analyst in the area offices and my main head office. My supervisor was actually a caseworker, a coworker was a support assistant and same goes for at least 2 of the IT staff in the area offices. One of them studied psychology in university. I was expecting everyone to have a CS degree or something. So pretty much, know people or start at the bottom and transfer in somehow.

 

[Kwaipie]

Certs can get you through the door. Any interview process worth a crap is going to determine if you're a paper MCSE or not. On the other hand, I've been in the field for 15 years, starting with desktop support, now I'm in charge of every windows server in the company, 18 countries, 28 sites, 160 servers. I don't have a single cert and would have to get a job based on my experience.