It's been almost 7 years. When will Obama do any of the following?

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JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
You should seriously consider the fact that you are literally insane. Islam is totally opposed to homosexuality.


Well the inconvenient truth of our righties is they are just like "their" righties. The righties on both sides hate each other. Such simple people.
 

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
15,785
1,500
126
This is news to me. Would you care to share with us who you think was the CIC at the time?

"Reagan and the Pope killed Communism." This was an absurd myth, given some token acknowledgement by Democrats who may actually believe part of it, and the total embrace of Republicans who continue to embrace it to enlarge and extend homage to Reagan-as-icon.

Also widely popular is the idea that American defense spending just "caused the Russians to give up."

The USSR collapsed under its own weight. It had been a failing system from before Khrushchev.

The advent of cellphones and PCs had more to do with USSR's collapse than Reagan or the Pope.

Consider that the Old Enemy we're discussing here was a nation-state of "people." "People" figured out that Soviet authoritarianism without free markets was a bad idea; "People" figured out that maintaining a "buffer zone" in a captive Eastern Europe was too costly.

Reagan's brain was firing on three cylinders when he came into office -- a fact which has been clinically established. He may have been a "Great Communicator." But he began with a national debt left by Carter at 29% of GDP, and left after increasing it to 51%. And with Nancy conducting "séances" in the White House to sort out foreign policy, one has to wonder what else was going on. At least he didn't start a war, egged on by a contributor like Ray L. Hunt and Halliburton CEO Dick Cheney.

I give the American electorate a D- for picking shills for energy industrialists at the polls more often than not. If you want a "Gu-rreat Leader," pick someone who isn't in someone else's back pocket.

And . . . "Great Leader." What is the sound of one hand clapping? Obama couldn't even get the post-2010 Congress to accept Republican proposals for legislation.

As for "the price at the pump." Everybody's whining about their little short-run worries. In the long-run, "Maybe" running your air-conditioner will add to climate-change, with the climate-change adding to your need for air-conditioning. And in the long-run, the price at the pump will only go up, even with short-run discoveries of new oil deposits in North Dakota or new drilling in Alaska.

The "price-at-the-pump" doesn't reflect its true future cost, and the PResident doesn't call the shots. Not unless he's got support from the oil-sector.

As a footnote, Romney was going to appoint the former CEO of the American Petroleum Institute as his chief of staff. Golly! The marvelously enlightened electorate made two good choices in a row for a change!
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
20,664
5,349
136
"Reagan and the Pope killed Communism." This was an absurd myth, given some token acknowledgement by Democrats who may actually believe part of it, and the total embrace of Republicans who continue to embrace it to enlarge and extend homage to Reagan-as-icon.

Also widely popular is the idea that American defense spending just "caused the Russians to give up."

The USSR collapsed under its own weight. It had been a failing system from before Khrushchev.

The advent of cellphones and PCs had more to do with USSR's collapse than Reagan or the Pope.

Consider that the Old Enemy we're discussing here was a nation-state of "people." "People" figured out that Soviet authoritarianism without free markets was a bad idea; "People" figured out that maintaining a "buffer zone" in a captive Eastern Europe was too costly.

Reagan's brain was firing on three cylinders when he came into office -- a fact which has been clinically established. He may have been a "Great Communicator." But he began with a national debt left by Carter at 29% of GDP, and left after increasing it to 51%. And with Nancy conducting "séances" in the White House to sort out foreign policy, one has to wonder what else was going on. At least he didn't start a war, egged on by a contributor like Ray L. Hunt and Halliburton CEO Dick Cheney.

I give the American electorate a D- for picking shills for energy industrialists at the polls more often than not. If you want a "Gu-rreat Leader," pick someone who isn't in someone else's back pocket.

And . . . "Great Leader." What is the sound of one hand clapping? Obama couldn't even get the post-2010 Congress to accept Republican proposals for legislation.

As for "the price at the pump." Everybody's whining about their little short-run worries. In the long-run, "Maybe" running your air-conditioner will add to climate-change, with the climate-change adding to your need for air-conditioning. And in the long-run, the price at the pump will only go up, even with short-run discoveries of new oil deposits in North Dakota or new drilling in Alaska.

The "price-at-the-pump" doesn't reflect its true future cost, and the PResident doesn't call the shots. Not unless he's got support from the oil-sector.

As a footnote, Romney was going to appoint the former CEO of the American Petroleum Institute as his chief of staff. Golly! The marvelously enlightened electorate made two good choices in a row for a change!

So your opinion is that Reagan had nothing to do with the fall of the USSR. You could have just said that and not bothered with the rest of the rant.
For the record, my opinion is that he had a great deal to do with it, and that most of what you said was spin.
 

highland145

Lifer
Oct 12, 2009
43,563
5,967
136
So your opinion is that Reagan had nothing to do with the fall of the USSR. You could have just said that and not bothered with the rest of the rant.
For the record, my opinion is that he had a great deal to do with it, and that most of what you said was spin.
And that's how you rate "history" books, how they treat Reagan.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
So your opinion is that Reagan had nothing to do with the fall of the USSR. You could have just said that and not bothered with the rest of the rant.
For the record, my opinion is that he had a great deal to do with it, and that most of what you said was spin.

No. What he wrote made a lot of sesne. Its like saying america beat the nazis when in fact the russians had a major part in making sure that happened.
 

88keys

Golden Member
Aug 24, 2012
1,854
12
81
Am I to understand that you're crowing because he didn't turn out to be the worst president ever? That's not a real high bar you've set. I will freely admit that he's spent more money than anyone in the history of ever, so he has that going for him. And since that particular bomb won't explode while he's in office, I guess he did alright.

Which has been true for every 2 term president during their term since Eisenhower.
 

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
15,785
1,500
126
So your opinion is that Reagan had nothing to do with the fall of the USSR. You could have just said that and not bothered with the rest of the rant.
For the record, my opinion is that he had a great deal to do with it, and that most of what you said was spin.

Spin? No. The myth is the spin.

We somehow failed to mention in our high-school history texts that the Soviets lost 24 million pushing the Wehrmacht back to Berlin in WWII. It had happened to them before: Genghis Khan left an indelible mark on Russian psyche; they did to Napoleon in the War of 1812 what they did to Hitler later.

The Iron Curtain was as much a construct designed to keep it from happening again, as it was an "expansion of Soviet Empire."

But everything I've said here is true. It was a top-heavy, over-extended system. It was cracking at the seams before Reagan was ever governor of California.

He was already beginning to show the symptoms of Alzheimers the year he took office.

Reagan? The Pope? Maybe Lech Walensa. And what did Reagan do, exactly, to deserve these laurels? Oh! He got up in front of the cameras and said "Tear down this wall!"

Even Putin's predecessor, Medvedev, acknowledged that they couldn't exert the power of the State over the individual with devices like PCs and cell-phones that empowered individuals.

What you've got there is a Myth behind a "beloved" US President whose appointees initiated the long decline in the quality of civil service and public custodianship. He was "beloved" for being on General Electric Theater and starring in a second-rate remake of Hemingway's "The Killers."

The other part of the myth is a demonization of a whole nation with a history much older than the Revolution of 1917.

Tell me. What have I said here or in the previous post that isn't true? All you have is this Myth of a Colossus, who "single-handedly brought down the USSR."

I'm sure that a lot of Americans believe it. And it's still a crock.
 

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
15,785
1,500
126
No. What he wrote made a lot of sesne. Its like saying america beat the nazis when in fact the russians had a major part in making sure that happened.

As I said, and I'm fulla wind today, all that history was distorted in Cold War HS history-books.

The Russians waited. . . . and waited . . . for the US to enter the war against Germany. So in June, 1944, the Battle of Normandy began. We lost 500,000; they lost 24 million. Maybe our military leaders were "more efficient." But that's not the point.

There are all sorts of Cold War myths that proliferated. I went to a Catholic grade-school; they used to distribute these weekly student newspapers, published under the nihil obstat and imprimatur of Cardinal Spellman.

Spellman, together with the Luce's of Time-Life, were -- more (for the Luce's) or less (for Spellman) -- US "intelligence assets." They had some influence on shifting American focus from Europe to Asia.

So the little newsletter would contain repetitive stories about how Ngo Dinh Diem was "such a great man . . . a great man . . . " Father of his People! When the US established the Saigon Military Mission in 1952, it was followed by Ed Lansdale's orchestration of rescuing 1.6 million North Vietnamese Catholics and establishing Diem as their candidate. They were his constituency. The ballots were designed to appeal to Vietnamese superstition; Diem was elected in a "landslide."

These things were supposed to be "secret" indefinitely, but you cannot prevent document declassifications or penetrating historical research. You cannot prevent the truth from leaking out even decades later. You can only raise an argument against "new" facts by calling it "historical revisionism."
 

Meghan54

Lifer
Oct 18, 2009
11,573
5,096
136
Personally, I'd take a look at some of the figures in your meme again.

For instance, the national debt figure attributed to Bush is given in your meme as $9T. I do believe that's a little low. The actual figure for the national debt at the end of Bush's budgeting was closer to $12T, not $9T.

Why? Bush's last budget was FY '09, which ran from Oct. 2008-Sept. 2009. By the time Obama took office in Jan. 2009, the FY '09 budget was into its second quarter. Hell, at the end of FY '08, the debt was $10T, so where in the heck did you every get $9T as the debt Bush ended his administration upon? Oh, I see.....the $9T was the natl. debt at the end of FY '07. (These are figures from the GAO audits done each year. Here are the 2008 and 2009 GAO audits....take a read.)
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/feddebt/feddebt_ann2008.pdf

http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/feddebt/feddebt_ann2009.pdf


It's been accepted for decades upon decades that the outgoing administration is responsible for the first year of a new admin., in respect to spending/budget, since the outgoing admin. already put that budget in motion before the election.

Honestly, it's frankly decent the job that's been done reviving the dead cat world economy after the near worldwide depression of 2007-2008 and beyond. And this doesn't address the cost of the Iraq misadventure coming home to be paid for finally.




 

Annisman*

Golden Member
Aug 20, 2010
1,918
89
91
blah blah blah Reagan didn't end the cold war just like Obama didn't 'get' Bin Laden, that's all I see in this thread.
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
20,664
5,349
136
Nancy's astrologist.

That's about as believable as most of the stuff I read here. I expect someone will now come along with expert testimony and a peer reviewed paper conclusively proving the truth of that statement. Then the next two pages of posts will be the needy cheerleaders jumping in with the hope of some form of acceptance from the herd.

I love reading this shit, you guys make me feel downright superior.
 
Feb 4, 2009
34,703
15,951
136
Personally, I'd take a look at some of the figures in your meme again.

For instance, the national debt figure attributed to Bush is given in your meme as $9T. I do believe that's a little low. The actual figure for the national debt at the end of Bush's budgeting was closer to $12T, not $9T.

Why? Bush's last budget was FY '09, which ran from Oct. 2008-Sept. 2009. By the time Obama took office in Jan. 2009, the FY '09 budget was into its second quarter. Hell, at the end of FY '08, the debt was $10T, so where in the heck did you every get $9T as the debt Bush ended his administration upon? Oh, I see.....the $9T was the natl. debt at the end of FY '07. (These are figures from the GAO audits done each year. Here are the 2008 and 2009 GAO audits....take a read.)
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/feddebt/feddebt_ann2008.pdf

http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/feddebt/feddebt_ann2009.pdf


It's been accepted for decades upon decades that the outgoing administration is responsible for the first year of a new admin., in respect to spending/budget, since the outgoing admin. already put that budget in motion before the election.

Honestly, it's frankly decent the job that's been done reviving the dead cat world economy after the near worldwide depression of 2007-2008 and beyond. And this doesn't address the cost of the Iraq misadventure coming home to be paid for finally.

Guess its time to vote Clinton, since essentially every stat in this meme will be in Clintons favor.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,722
6,201
126
That's about as believable as most of the stuff I read here. I expect someone will now come along with expert testimony and a peer reviewed paper conclusively proving the truth of that statement. Then the next two pages of posts will be the needy cheerleaders jumping in with the hope of some form of acceptance from the herd.

I love reading this shit, you guys make me feel downright superior.

Don't forget that the need to feel superior and the pleasure such a supposition produces is based on an unconscious feeling that one isn't.
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,751
3,068
121
Nancy's astrologist.

That's about as believable as most of the stuff I read here. I expect someone will now come along with expert testimony and a peer reviewed paper conclusively proving the truth of that statement. Then the next two pages of posts will be the needy cheerleaders jumping in with the hope of some form of acceptance from the herd.

I love reading this shit, you guys make me feel downright superior.

The scary part is it was true.

You're lack of history is the problem.

It has been well documented.
 
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MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,751
3,068
121
Last edited:

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
20,664
5,349
136
Don't forget that the need to feel superior and the pleasure such a supposition produces is based on an unconscious feeling that one isn't.

Ain't nothing unconscious about about it my friend, I'm not superior at all. It's just that are a few around here that think the're the worlds greatest experts on pretty much everything. I get a kick out of it.
 

Meghan54

Lifer
Oct 18, 2009
11,573
5,096
136
The scary part is it was true.

You're lack of history is the problem.

It has been well documented.


Heck, Nancy Reagan even wrote about using an astrologer in her memoir, My Turn. I do believe it was White House Chief of Staff Donald Regan who first revealed the Reagans' use of an astrologer in his 1988 book, For the Record.
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,751
3,068
121
Ain't nothing unconscious about about it my friend, I'm not superior at all. It's just that are a few around here that think the're the worlds greatest experts on pretty much everything. I get a kick out of it.


Why would you state you feel downright superior then ?



Not worth arguing about really.
 
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