Jay Leno's Garage: Porsche 918

[Phanuel]

Put a competitive engine in the Cayman and start seeing 911s in your rear view.

But Porsche won't do that because it would cost them brand identity. Oh well.

 

[JMapleton]

Put a competitive engine in the Cayman and start seeing 911s in your rear view.

But Porsche won't do that because it would cost them brand identity. Oh well.

Pretty general statement. Which 911? There are several engines.

 

[Phanuel]

Pick a 911 and match the engine. The Cayman is just a better platform overall from a balance and performance standpoint.

 

[Detailed Design]

I'm gonna go there: P1 would run circles around the 918. I don't care what the Top Gear track time is. P1 is 600 lbs lighter, has more power and even crazier aerodynamics. 918 is incredible don't get me wrong, but Jay made the right choice on this one

True. But totally different price range. It's like comparing a Boxter and a ZR1.

 

[Phanuel]

True. But totally different price range. It's like comparing a Boxter and a ZR1.

Between the P1 and the 918? Not really?

1,150,000 for the P1 and 850,000 for the 918. Knowing Porsche you'll be able to probably easily add 200k in "options" instantly to it.

 

[The Boston Dangler]

if porsche has an essence, it's this:

it's closest living relative:
porsche boxster

 

[olds]

Just built a Weissach. $1,054,600.
At that price I should get .2

 

[Detailed Design]

Between the P1 and the 918? Not really?

1,150,000 for the P1 and 850,000 for the 918. Knowing Porsche you'll be able to probably easily add 200k in "options" instantly to it.

$300,000 buys another exotic or ultra luxury car. A better comparison would be LaFerrari and P1.

 

[tweakmonkey]

Close enough.

If you can buy a super exotic $1 million Porsche I don't think the extra $200k for a super exotic Mclaren is going to be a deal breaker.

I bet the Mclaren will go UP in value and the Porsche won't, at least at close to the same rate.

 

[Detailed Design]

Close enough.

If you can buy a super exotic $1 million Porsche I don't think the extra $200k for a super exotic Mclaren is going to be a deal breaker.

I bet the Mclaren will go UP in value and the Porsche won't, at least at close to the same rate.

It has nothing to do with the ability to afford either car. It's about comparing a car that is $300,000 more than another one to each other. Pick any car in a category and then find another that is 25% more expensive...compare the two. Still doesn't make sense -no matter the category, even if someone could afford either.

 

[sandorski]

Close enough.

If you can buy a super exotic $1 million Porsche I don't think the extra $200k for a super exotic Mclaren is going to be a deal breaker.

I bet the Mclaren will go UP in value and the Porsche won't, at least at close to the same rate.

Not sure about this. The Porsche is a Technological milestone, on that alone it is always going to have collector cred.

 

[tweakmonkey]

Not sure about this. The Porsche is a Technological milestone, on that alone it is always going to have collector cred.

I think the Mclaren's even more of a technological milestone, and will be much less common. There are only 375 being made and all of them are sold. The 918s are not all sold yet... I think they're actually having a hard time finding buyers.

 

[tweakmonkey]

It has nothing to do with the ability to afford either car. It's about comparing a car that is $300,000 more than another one to each other. Pick any car in a category and then find another that is 25% more expensive...compare the two. Still doesn't make sense -no matter the category, even if someone could afford either.

I was just answering in response to someone else's question, about comparing the two on TG test track. I think it's unfair sure - you can throw $300k extra technology and have a faster car, but like it or not, people are going to compare these cars all day... Top Gear, EVO, magazines and video producers. The price difference isn't as important as the "entry fee"... this is supercar territory and these are all considered cream of the crop, best of the best etc., so they're going to be put head to head constantly. The La Ferrari will too I'm sure, and anything else over $500k

 

[Detailed Design]

I was just answering in response to someone else's question, about comparing the two on TG test track. I think it's unfair sure - you can throw $300k extra technology and have a faster car, but like it or not, people are going to compare these cars all day... Top Gear, EVO, magazines and video producers. The price difference isn't as important as the "entry fee"... this is supercar territory and these are all considered cream of the crop, best of the best etc., so they're going to be put head to head constantly. The La Ferrari will too I'm sure, and anything else over $500k

Fair enough. You're right about it being compared by those outlets regardless of the quarter million dollar difference.

 

[GoodRevrnd]

I think the Mclaren's even more of a technological milestone, and will be much less common. There are only 375 being made and all of them are sold. The 918s are not all sold yet... I think they're actually having a hard time finding buyers.

Well that's disappointing but I suspected it was the case. Was trying to convince my CEO to get one.

 

[AMCRambler]

It seems more like Porsche was going for a ground breaking car to showcase the technological advancements that will in ten years filter down to us mere mortals in our Mazda 3. Rear wheel steering and aerodynamics coupled with slick hybrid technology, it seems like they had a bunch of tech that they asked their engineers to integrate into a very seamless package. Reminds me of the 959, another car built by Porsche showcasing features ahead of its time.

 

[darkswordsman17]

I think the Mclaren's even more of a technological milestone, and will be much less common. There are only 375 being made and all of them are sold. The 918s are not all sold yet... I think they're actually having a hard time finding buyers.

I think they both are, to a certain extent (I don't know why you think the McLaren is so much more so) although I frankly don't find either one to be anything revolutionary (other than it signaling that if the car companies would pull their heads out of certain orifices, they could develop hybrids/electric cars that actually do more than just get somewhat better MPG, and they can get rich people to subsidize development in the process).

Its easy for manufacturers to game the "sales" on limited ones like these. If I'm not mistaken McLaren basically required the P1 to be sold out before they'd actually produce it whereas Porsche had a bunch of offers to buy the 918 if they'd build it (IIRC Porsche said that it was just a concept but they received such an overwhelming amount of people saying "build that and I'll buy it" that they built test mules to see if they could actually produce it). I saw something that said Porsche had a couple thousand offers prior to it being greenlit.

Plus, never say never on stuff like this. The F40 had its production ramped up significantly due to popularity and I believe those all appreciated.

And who's to say. I won't be surprised if there's a P1S or P1R or something, basically a revised version with a couple hundred extra units produced. Or maybe they'll just come out with an all new car that just plain trounces the P1 in a few years. There's definitely things that could offer marked performance improvements (supercapacitors, possibly paired with newer ultra dense batteries to up range and electrical performance). Much like how the Enzo and Carrera GT are much less impressive now, I think we'll see some newer ones that will make these seem dated.

Personally, I like the 918's looks better, its more classic while not looking throwback. The P1 I think will age more poorly (its far from bad, but something about it has never looked that good to me), especially if McLaren dilutes things by passing its looks onto its lower cars like they've already done. Likewise, McLaren's even had grumblings of disapproval over them using the "same engine" across their ranges as people want more for that extra almost million over the MP4-412C.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

It seems more like Porsche was going for a ground breaking car to showcase the technological advancements that will in ten years filter down to us mere mortals in our Mazda 3. Rear wheel steering and aerodynamics coupled with slick hybrid technology, it seems like they had a bunch of tech that they asked their engineers to integrate into a very seamless package. Reminds me of the 959, another car built by Porsche showcasing features ahead of its time.

In fairness, rear wheel steering has been around a LONG time. You could buy a Honda Prelude with rear wheel steering in the 1980s. I do agree with your general point that the 918 is a great technological showcase, though.

 

[JCH13]

The aero thing is interesting. Automotive engineers know how to make aerodynamically efficient cars. They have for a long time. Hopefully one of these years consumers will value fuel economy enough at accept the styling compromises of an aerodynamically efficient car, or that sort of styling becomes popular.

In fairness, rear wheel steering has been around a LONG time. You could buy a Honda Prelude with rear wheel steering in the 1980s. I do agree with your general point that the 918 is a great technological showcase, though.

That got me thinking: "what's the oldest 4ws car?"

There have been a bunch, but here's a 1937 Mercedes Benz with 4ws:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Mercedes_Kübelwagen_G5.jpg

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

The aero thing is interesting. Automotive engineers know how to make aerodynamically efficient cars. They have for a long time. Hopefully one of these years consumers will value fuel economy enough at accept the styling compromises of an aerodynamically efficient car, or that sort of styling becomes popular.



That got me thinking: "what's the oldest 4ws car?"

There have been a bunch, but here's a 1937 Mercedes Benz with 4ws:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Mercedes_Kübelwagen_G5.jpg

Interesting! I figured there would be some horseless carriage with it, since there seems to be very old precedent for every "new" automotive technology (e.g., the fact that there were fully electric cars 100 years ago), but was going off the top of my head.

 

[MagickMan]

Agreed. Fugly.

Glad they built it though. Gives the P1 something to run against.

The P1, now that IS fugly.

LaFerrari, 918, P1... I'd still take a Huayra, or even an Agera R, over any of them. Hybrids, eh, whatever.

 

[flatty]

And don't forget is just the "top of the iceberg" in Leno's garage )

 

[MagickMan]

Tip, not top.

 

[TridenT]

Saw one of these about a week ago in North Austin, TX. It had California plates. Quite a distance to drive that car...

 

[halik]

Take all the electric stuff out of it and see how it does.