Kaido's 2009 Camcorder Guide

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theblackbox

Golden Member
Oct 1, 2004
1,650
11
81
Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
What are the differences between these Canons?

the hf s100 is the top of the line canon (besides the hf s10) it has a huge sensor, a built in tele converter (that rocks) and does a really great job of recording video. it is one of the sharpest cameras available. i love mine (i have an hf s10).

the quality the hf s series puts out is unmatched by other canon cameras (my opinion). it also doubles really well as a digital photo camera. with an external mic, the camera is hard to beat as a consumer camera.

you can get a better price, amazon had it for under 1000 for a while.

i saw some footage by someone shooting directly to a field recorder outputting uncompressed footage, and it is georgeous. i don't think you could go wrong with the hf s100. plus, there are a good number of 35mm dof adapters that you can use with it.

 

theblackbox

Golden Member
Oct 1, 2004
1,650
11
81
well, it depends. they are both the same camera, the only difference is the the s10 has 32gb of built in flash. ideally, the s100 is the better deal, because you can buy flash memory cheaper then the price difference.
personally, the price difference didn't matter, and i like having the 32gb internal flash. i always carry an extra 16gb class 6 or two, but love having the choice.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,516
5,340
136
Originally posted by: theblackbox
kaido, i thought you would appreciate this:

http://cosprings.craigslist.org/pho/1187167527.html

one thing i would never expect to see on craigslist. i'd love to have that, especially with the flip module. man oh man.
too bad it's not in the barter category...

Haha wow, that's an amazing price...and you could upgrade it to the MP.2 easy...if I hadn't just bought a D90 w/ video I'd be all over that...even has a step-up ring for the Canon HVx0 line...
 

RaynorWolfcastle

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
8,968
16
81
I currently have a Sanyo FH1 and a Canon HF200 in my possession and will be running some tests comparing them in the next few days (before returning one of the two).

Here's what I have planned out in terms of testing (if I can find a way to post full quality video online, I will):

Indoor shoting:
- Low light performance: focus speed and accuracy, noise performance. Testing both at wide angle and telephoto end of the lens. I will shoot the Sanyo in 1080p60 and 1080p30, the Canon will be shot in 1080p30 and 1080p24 (1080i60 is kind of useless for both cameras in this scenario).

Outdoor shooting:
- Color accuracy and lens sharpness: Hopefully I can get a varied weather in the next few days to test auto white balance performance.
- Performance with high motion subjects: I'll see if I can manage to shoot some sports or something similar.

If anyone is interested in any specific tests, let me know and I'll see if I can oblige
 

RaynorWolfcastle

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
8,968
16
81
After spending a lot of time online reading reviews, I believe that in the mid-range price ($600-$700 Canadian) these are the top two cameras out on the market right now. As an aside, I refuse to buy Sony's flash-based camcorders on the basis that they still use Memory Sticks.

Here are my first impressions, for what it's worth, I've had the Sanyo for a couple of days now and just started playing with the Canon.

Sanyo FH1
The good
- 1080p60 mode at 24 Mbps is buttery smooth. The smoothness of motion and pans is really exceptional at the wide end of the lens.
- The 240 fps video at 448x336 is excellent, really nice slow motion video at a reasonably good resolution.
- 1080p60 MP4s can be a hassle to play back and edit since they are still uncommon. The included Nero Showtime does a good job of playback, but good luck sending full quality clips to someone else and hoping that they can play them. VLC, Quicktime and MPC-HC are unable to playback correctly (at least out I couldn't figure out how to do it)
- Low light performace at 1080p60 and 1080p30 is quite good and very usable at the wide end of the lens, as you start zooming in, the AF has trouble getting a lock and it's more touch and go.
- Smaller and lighter than the Canon HF200
- Excellent selection of manual controls, which are unfortunately, buried in a not-so-good menu system.

The bad
- The lack of optical stabilization is a major problem, especially when shooting at the tele end of the lens. At 16x zoom, the camera is essentially useless without a tripod. Handheld, the zoom has trouble focusing when you get near the tele end of the lens as it is so shaky.
- Colors seem oversaturated to my taste, when shooting plants, the greens look too punchy. I'm still new to the camera, so I have to see if I can find a way to desaturate the colors a bit.
- The lens is a bit soft when compared to the Canon, even at the wide end.
- No 24 fps mode, but this is really a minor quible. 60 fps can be turned into 24 fps with some motion blur added in software with good results (Sony Vegas does it, for example).
- The autofocus doesn't appear to be as fast or as accurate as the Canon's. I will try to dig deeper into this.
- The menu system kind of sucks, shortcut keys mitigate this to some extent, but the in-camera software is nowhere as good as the Canon's

Canon HF200
The good
- Optical image stabilizer does a good job of keeping handheld shots reasonably steady, even at the tele end of the lens.
- The instant auto-focus is quite good, even in low light
- The camera is excellent at wide end with good lighting, the color and sharpness are exceptional.
- Menu system is quite good and so are the manual controls.
- Better ergonomics than the Sanyo.

The bad
- No 1080p60 mode
- No High-speed shooting mode
- 1080p30 mode is kind of noisy in low light, but still very usable in my opinion.
- Bigger and heavier than the Sanyo
- More expensive than the Sanyo


All-in-all, my first impressions favor the Canon. The Sanyo is a nice camera, but it's just not as polished as the Canon. I'll post again with comparative video within a few days...
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,516
5,340
136
Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
What lens range is the Canon HF S100?

Zoom Ratio 10x Optical/200x Digital
Focal Length f=6.4- 64mm (35mm equivalent: 43.5 - 435mm)

The optical zoom is only 10x, but it's got a larger sensor so the zoom equals more than the cheaper cameras with bigger zoom numbers. Or something like that
 
Nov 26, 2005
15,110
316
126
What is the cost for a wide angle ~20mm lens for it; or which camera that is about equivalent to the Canon HF S100 has a default wide angle lens!?
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,516
5,340
136
Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
What is the cost for a wide angle ~20mm lens for it; or which camera that is about equivalent to the Canon HF S100 has a default wide angle lens!?

I'm not sure I'm getting my numbers right here, but if you got like a .45x wide-angle lens and set the camera on zoomed out @ 43.5mm, that should be about 19.6mm. I don't know if regular math translates to lenses like this however, can anyone confirm?

Cheaper lenses can be had for about $50, with prices going all the way up to $400.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,516
5,340
136
Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
what would someone do with that - sounds like trouble to me, heh

It's goofy but it'd be fun for kids - I film my 2-year-old neice playing all the time and then throw it on my media center for instant playback, she goes absolutely bananas watching herself on our projector. So novelty for kids is...probably about the only target market :laugh:
 
Nov 26, 2005
15,110
316
126
Originally posted by: Kaido
Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
what would someone do with that - sounds like trouble to me, heh

It's goofy but it'd be fun for kids - I film my 2-year-old neice playing all the time and then throw it on my media center for instant playback, she goes absolutely bananas watching herself on our projector. So novelty for kids is...probably about the only target market :laugh:

Where can you buy one of those?
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,516
5,340
136
Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
Originally posted by: Kaido
Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
what would someone do with that - sounds like trouble to me, heh

It's goofy but it'd be fun for kids - I film my 2-year-old neice playing all the time and then throw it on my media center for instant playback, she goes absolutely bananas watching herself on our projector. So novelty for kids is...probably about the only target market :laugh:

Where can you buy one of those?

I don't think they're out yet. Separately they are - you can get a pocket cam, or a mini projector.
 

Manuwell

Senior member
Jan 19, 2006
900
0
71
Is Kaido in the house ?

Tigerdirect is selling those models:

HF-100 for $424.99 after $75 cash back (refurbished - 3 months warranty)

HG10 for $424.99 after $75 cash back (refurbished - 3 months warranty)

HF10 for $467.48 after $82.50 cash back (refurbished - 3 months warranty)

HF200 for 509.99 after $90 cash back (new - 12 months warranty)

What is the best deal considering both camcorder capabilities and price ?

 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,516
5,340
136
For the extra $90 or so, I'd go with the HF200 - $509 is a slammin' deal with a 12 month warranty!
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,516
5,340
136
Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
Is 899$ a good deal for the HF S100?

$899 is a SLAMMIN deal on an HF-S100!
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,516
5,340
136
Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
Would this lens bring the focal lens to about 20mm or something equivalent to the Panasonic LX3's wide focal lens?

Well if I did my math right in my earlier response, you'll need about a .45x to get 20mm. It will give you a wider angle on your picture, but ultimately you'll really just have to try it out and see if it does what you want it to do. Another (more expensive) route is to get a 35mm adapter, like from Cinevate, and slap on whatever Canon or Nikon lens you'd like and get exactly the results you want!
 
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