Keep Cuddling Up With Russians...

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VRAMdemon

Diamond Member
Aug 16, 2012
6,572
7,823
136
Putin will continue to troll the US. Putin will continue to deny any culpability in these events and Trump will believe him. We've seen it before
 
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pcgeek11

Lifer
Jun 12, 2005
21,512
4,607
136
But does that apply to surface ships or just submerged submarines.


Well on the surface you can see behind and radar and such...... So no it doesn't apply. My point that you obviously missed is they have been challenging the US and others for decades with these types of stunts.
 
Jan 25, 2011
16,634
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Generally accepted rules of the sea.

CROSSING PATHS
  • Your vessel: You’re on a crossing course with another vessel that could result in a collision if neither boat changes course or speed.
  • The other vessel’s on the right: It’s the privileged or stand-on vessel and you must let it pass in front of you.
  • The other vessel is on the left: You’re the privileged or stand-on vessel and you must pass in front of the other vessel.

From the perspective of your ship. The ship on your port side (left side) has to give way. The ship on your starboard side (right side) has right of way.

Apply it and see what happens.

By the way, anyone remember how many collisions occurred in the Pacific fleet over the past few years. An Admiral even had to be fired as the inquiry found very poor training, etc, in his command.

"The move follows four Navy accidents in the Pacific since late January, including two collisions that left sailors dead and missing.

Issue with that general rule of navigation is it doesn’t apply here. The US ship was involved in active aircraft recovery. Steady course and speed as well as flying flags warning other vessels they were under operations. No one should have come close to them while they were doing recoveries of helicopters.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,812
49,498
136
I know dick all about big boats but that looks fucking close!

Sailing that close together at speed is super dangerous because of something called the Venturi effect. Basically a suction forms between the two ships that tries to pull them into a collision.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,812
49,498
136
I don't see why this is treated as something new that Russia is doing. It is not.

Ever hear of a Crazy Ivan Maneuver? The Russians have been doing this shit since the cold war days.

The crazy Ivan was an attempt to clear their baffles, not purposefully risk a collision.
 

maddie

Diamond Member
Jul 18, 2010
4,787
4,771
136
Sailing that close together at speed is super dangerous because of something called the Venturi effect. Basically a suction forms between the two ships that tries to pull them into a collision.
Fair enough, but that helicopter looks quite far away. If the craft was close to landing it would be very dangerous, but 1/2 mile? It's not like a carrier with a long approach flightpath.

The previous record in that command however says a lot as to the operational effectiveness. Firing an admiral these days for a loss of confidence in his leadership is not trivial and should not be disregarded.

US Pacific Fleet boss set to sack three-star fleet commander after a rash of accidents.
https://www.navytimes.com/breaking-...ar-fleet-commander-after-a-rash-of-incidents/


To be honest, I can see the Russians saying to themselves "we have the right of way, they have to bear off, maintain course" and the US captain saying" we have a helo inbound, let them bear off, maintain course". From these small acts of bravado, a disaster almost occurred.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,548
13,115
136
Settle the fuck down everybody, this is just Putin saying .. yea Trump still my bitch yall
 

pcgeek11

Lifer
Jun 12, 2005
21,512
4,607
136
Point 1: The crazy Ivan was an attempt to clear their baffles.
Point 2: not purposefully risk a collision.


Point 1: No shit.

Point 2: I was there and to clear the baffles this way is crazy that is why the maneuver was called a crazy ivan. Before the invention of the towed array all submarines cleared their baffles by turning and listening back along their track. They did not do it by hauling ass back down their own track.
 

brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
6,330
1,203
126
Still waiting for our resident Russian troll farm workers who insist this happens all the time to list all the times this has happened in open waters recently, how many rimes American ships/planes were the aggressors, and how many times it happened in the past when our sitting POTUS was an installed Russian stooge...

Tick tock. Apples meet oranges....

Russian troller waiting on Russian trollers? Wait, what?
 

brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
6,330
1,203
126
Like Trump you just outright lied and exaggerated you make your false point.

Obama told Mitt that the 1980's called and wanted their policy, Slick Willy used the WH as an AirBnB for the Chinese and Biden stated that China wasn't a threat. Iran got money and a nice deal under Obama, and Democrats were/are supporting Maduro. Tell me again how I lied.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,810
29,564
146
I don't see why this is treated as something new that Russia is doing. It is not.

Ever hear of a Crazy Ivan Maneuver? The Russians have been doing this shit since the cold war days.

Are you of the opinion that the Cold War is still happening?
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,810
29,564
146
Obama told Mitt that the 1980's called and wanted their policy, Slick Willy used the WH as an AirBnB for the Chinese and Biden stated that China wasn't a threat. Iran got money and a nice deal under Obama, and Democrats were/are supporting Maduro. Tell me again how I lied.

now that you're playing whatabouts, how about Dubs telling you that he looked into Putin's eyes and saw...whatthefuckever it was. A good man, a dreamy man...something. All I remember is that Dubs lost his train of thought because he cummed a little in his pants when thinking about Putin and his sexy eyes.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,095
513
126
OP acting like this is something new or something. This crap has been happening for decades. Anybody remember when Russian jets overflew a US destroyer in the black sea during Obamas administration? I'm sure the OP was creating posts about how cozy Obama was with the Russians. And how we need to be tough and start a shooting war over dick measuring contests by two world powers.

https://news.usni.org/2014/04/14/russian-fighter-buzzes-u-s-destroyer-black-sea

Or when they actually ran into one of our ships.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1988_Black_Sea_bumping_incident

Reagan, that damn Russia lover!
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,812
49,498
136
OP acting like this is something new or something. This crap has been happening for decades. Anybody remember when Russian jets overflew a US destroyer in the black sea during Obamas administration? I'm sure the OP was creating posts about how cozy Obama was with the Russians. And how we need to be tough and start a shooting war over dick measuring contests by two world powers.

https://news.usni.org/2014/04/14/russian-fighter-buzzes-u-s-destroyer-black-sea

Or when they actually ran into one of our ships.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1988_Black_Sea_bumping_incident

Reagan, that damn Russia lover!

The OP was saying that it was worrying that DESPITE these provocative actions conservatives in the US have been cuddling up to the Russians, not that this incident was evidence of how cozy Trump is with Putin.

It's important to remember that we have a president, today, who is potentially compromised by one or more hostile foreign powers and no one in the Republican Party cares to find out. Hell, Jared Kushner was asked flat out if he would report it to the FBI if the Russians offered to help them again in 2020 and said 'I don't know', despite the fact that would be a crime.
 

pcgeek11

Lifer
Jun 12, 2005
21,512
4,607
136
Are you of the opinion that the Cold War is still happening?


You can call it whatever you like.

My point that you want to disregard was that they have been doing this for decades. My personal experience with these types of stunts were during the cold war with Russia ( Late 1960's and into the 1980's ) and I gave an example of it.

Are you of the opinion that the cold war is still happening?
 

ibex333

Diamond Member
Mar 26, 2005
4,092
123
106
https://www.businessinsider.com/photos-show-russian-destroyer-dangerously-close-to-us-warship-2019-6

https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/07/politics/us-russia-navy-near-collision-intl/index.html

Shocking photos show Russian destroyer playing a dangerous game of chicken with a US warship



A Russian destroyer challenged a US warship to an unusual showdown in the Pacific on Friday, forcing it to take sudden evasive action.
The destroyer, according to US 7th Fleet, engaged in "unsafe and unprofessional" behavior, sailing extremely close to the Ticonderoga-class cruiser USS Chancellorsville and risking a collision with the US vessel.
It came just a few days after a Russian fighter aggressively buzzed a US Navy aircraft over the Mediterranean Sea.


In spite of all this, there is a huge swath of our population cozying up to all things Russian... They are attacking our democracy at every level and one party is digging it so long as it makes a libtard cry...

In the end, Putin and Trump's little affair is going to cost real human lives... I don't fear brown people crossing my border or blowing up my churches any more... Now I have a healthy fear that when two narcissistic children start dick measuring contests we all lose...

Treason...


Ok, first of all, you linked CNN as a source. Which just shows you as an AntiRussian troll. Your goal is to incite the public against the Russians, so you fabricate fake info and put up links to fake news to make Russia look bad. How original.

Everybody knows CNN lies. EVERYBODY. CNN is pure garbage. No one with half a brain should believe anything CNN says.


There have been plenty of dangerous maneuvers throughout history, on BOTH sides. Not just Russians but Americans as well. Nothing new under the sun, and no reason to treat this minor, insignificant occurrence as anything special.

How do you get off saying the Russians are attacking your democracy? It's a ridiculous claim. Russians have better things to do than to attack YOUR democracy, which is actually not yours. Democracy, as a "system of government " does not "belong" to United States. It exists since ancient Rome and used by many countries. The Russians, especially the general public, (since you choose to blame Russians a whole) do not aim to take down the American government system any more than the Americans aim to topple the Russian government.

And most importantly, I see a picture showing two ships. Neither one of these ships is ramming each other, there's no shots fired, nothing at all. Just a picture of two ships. It is not clear from the picture which ships these are. They might as well be African or Estonian ships for all I know. I do not see an American or Russian flag on either of these ships. If I show you a picture of two people with one looking like he is walking toward another, are you also going to scream that the person walking toward the other one acted aggressively or in a dangerous manner?! Give me a break!
 
Last edited:

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
23,652
10,515
136
Ok, first of all, you linked CNN as a source. Which just shows you as an AntiRussian troll. Your goal is to incite the public against the Russians, so you fabricate fake info and put up links to fake news to make Russia look bad. How original.

Everybody knows CNN lies. EVERYBODY. CNN is pure garbage. No one with half a brain should believe anything CNN says.


There have been plenty of dangerous maneuvers throughout history, on BOTH sides. Not just Russians but Americans as well. Nothing new under the sun, and no reason to treat this minor, insignificant occurrence as anything special.

How do you get off saying the Russians are attacking your democracy? It's a ridiculous claim. Russians have better things to do than to attack YOUR democracy, which is actually not yours. Democracy, as a "system of government " does not "belong" to United States. It exists since ancient Rome and used by many countries. The Russians, especially the general public, (since you choose to blame Russians a whole) do not aim to take down the American government system any more than the American aim to topple the Russian government.
Troll bot trolls.
 
Reactions: umbrella39

Maxima1

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,522
759
146
Hell, Jared Kushner was asked flat out if he would report it to the FBI if the Russians offered to help them again in 2020 and said 'I don't know', despite the fact that would be a crime.

According to Mueller, it's not a crime if he doesn't know. Why would Javanka admit to it when they're going to do it again?
 
Jan 25, 2011
16,634
8,778
146
Ok, first of all, you linked CNN as a source. Which just shows you as an AntiRussian troll. Your goal is to incite the public against the Russians, so you fabricate fake info and put up links to fake news to make Russia look bad. How original.

Everybody knows CNN lies. EVERYBODY. CNN is pure garbage. No one with half a brain should believe anything CNN says.


There have been plenty of dangerous maneuvers throughout history, on BOTH sides. Not just Russians but Americans as well. Nothing new under the sun, and no reason to treat this minor, insignificant occurrence as anything special.

How do you get off saying the Russians are attacking your democracy? It's a ridiculous claim. Russians have better things to do than to attack YOUR democracy, which is actually not yours. Democracy, as a "system of government " does not "belong" to United States. It exists since ancient Rome and used by many countries. The Russians, especially the general public, (since you choose to blame Russians a whole) do not aim to take down the American government system any more than the Americans aim to topple the Russian government.

And most importantly, I see a picture showing two ships. Neither one of these ships is ramming each other, there's no shots fired, nothing at all. Just a picture of two ships. It is not clear from the picture which ships these are. They might as well be African or Estonian ships for all I know. I do not see an American or Russian flag on either of these ships. If I show you a picture of two people with one looking like he is walking toward another, are you also going to scream that the person walking toward the other one acted aggressively or in a dangerous manner?! Give me a break!
And this entire bullshit rant is nullified by the fact that the US ship was flying flags indicating they were involved in active aircraft recovery. The Russian ship should have stayed over 1000 yards away. They didn't. End of story.
 

nOOky

Platinum Member
Aug 17, 2004
2,896
1,916
136
Maybe if Putin and Trump exchange beautiful letters with each other it'll be alright?
 

VRAMdemon

Diamond Member
Aug 16, 2012
6,572
7,823
136
It makes you wonder...Will Russia become more provocative?... Suppose there is an international incident - what if the 2 ships *had* collided? How would Trump handle himself during this sort of crisis? If Trump responds aggressively then would Putin will make him look like a fool on the world stage? If Trump capitulates (highly likely) would that make him look weak to our soldiers overseas? How or would Trump prevail in this sort of statesmanship? Where's Mattis, gone. Where is McMaster? or even Tillerson who was seasoned in Russian diplomacy..gone. He has suggested that some of our military leaders are stupid. Who the hell is running the show with regards to foreign policy? Is Russia trying to prove to the military that Trump is an incompetent leader. Or are they sending a message to the American military - We can mess with you because your Commander in Chief is our bitch.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,680
7,180
136
OR, I can see Trump and Putin colluding to create a sorely needed distraction in order to divert attention away from Trump's destiny date with the Mueller Steamroller that the Dems are driving 'round and 'round the White House.

Putting those two together is like putting a thoroughly spoiled brat and a congenitally disposed trouble maker tyke in the same playpen.

Anything, and I mean ANYTHING can happen when those two heads of state needs things from each other.
 
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