Keep Cuddling Up With Russians...

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Ventanni

Golden Member
Jul 25, 2011
1,432
142
106
Y'all are hilarious. This has absolutely zero nothing to do with Trump or Putin. Russia has been pulling these stunts for decades, and as long as they see the United States as their chief geopolitical rival, they will continue to do so.
 
Reactions: ibex333

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,313
534
126
While Trump is playing footsie with the Russians, get ready to be blindsided by an enemy that Americans own greed has created that is going to be doing a lot more than just ramming US navy ships.

https://www.scmp.com/video/china/21...ncounters-chinas-military-over-last-two-years

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/pol...ll-get-used-china-air-force-drills-encircling

Remember democracy through free markets and engagement nonsense so the 1% can make huge profits while telling the ever eroding middle class that they are doing it for altruistic reasons like spreading democracy, and the masses bought it, so they can get their near endless supply of cheap throwaway products including all the shiny gadgets and gizmos they enjoy.

Guess what no democracy, a hollowed out middle class that is desperate enough to vote for Trump, and a real military and economic threat on the horizon that is ready and willing to challenge American supremacy.

Mark Dubowitz Hong Kong's protests against China show U.S. appeasement of Beijing has failed to bring reform
A policy of moderation through economic seduction was delusional, but a shift to economic coercion without emphasizing human rights will be just as ineffective.
https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opini...gainst-china-show-u-s-appeasement-ncna1016201

June 11, 2019, 1:03 PM EDT
By Mark Dubowitz, CEO of the Foundation for Defense of Democracies
An estimated 1 million Hong Kong residents took to the streets over the weekend in ongoing demonstrations to protest a new bill that would allow extradition to mainland China of those suspected of criminal offenses. Hong Kong citizens fear that, if the bill is adopted, China’s notoriously repressive and corrupt criminal laws will be used against Beijing’s political opponents in Hong Kong.

Twenty-two years ago, on July 1, 1997, the British government handed over control of Hong Kong to China. Beijing inherited a thriving market economy shaped by British democratic norms and the rule of law. At the time, Western governments hoped that money — in this case, Hong Kong’s booming economy — would induce China to honor its pledge of “one country, two systems,” and ensure that the city remained the financial capital of Asia with its democratic traditions intact.
To its credit, the Trump administration seems to be acknowledging that a tougher line against China is finally warranted.
The proposed bill at the center of the protests now makes it abundantly clear that this was a delusion: The main imperative for Beijing is keeping its power intact, and taking away the remaining freedoms in Hong Kong that challenge the supremacy of the Chinese Communist Party.

Hong Kong is a model of openness that threatens the party because it demonstrates that the citizens of Chinese states can be both free and rich. These protests are exactly the sort of free expression that the U.S. should be championing so that Hong Kong can retain this character rather than cling to the quixotic notion that Beijing will reform without pressure because of the inducements of capitalism. To its credit, the Trump administration seems to be acknowledging that a tougher line against China is finally warranted.



Related
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Uncovering China's secret internment camps with Rian Thum
The idea that money would seduce the hard men of Beijing into becoming responsible global stakeholders has dominated the thinking of U.S. foreign policy and business establishments since President Richard Nixon and his national security consigliore Henry Kissinger engineered their historic outreach to China in the 1970s to further split the alliance between China and the Soviet Union, then already beginning to break due to ideological competition over leadership of the communist world. Their thesis: Money would moderate the revolutionary zeal and authoritarian repression of Chairman Mao.
Their geopolitical stra
tegy worked as Beijing moved closer to the United States and away from the Soviet Union. And, for a time, their moderation theory seemed to be validated, as Mao’s successor Deng Xiaoping undertook market reforms and dangled the possibility of further political reforms. With U.S. guidance, they believed, China would be integrated as a “responsible stakeholder” in the American-dominated liberal international order and the West would profit handsomely.


But Washington became a hostage to these expectations. When Deng unleashed the Chinese military in 1989 against student protestors in Tiananmen Square, the George H.W. Bush administration resisted calls for American action against those who’d ordered the brutal crackdown. Punitive measures would only empower the “hard-liners” against the Deng “moderates” with whom the West needed to engage.
Subsequent administrations both Democratic and Republican perpetuated this policy, which was based more on hopeful theories than the rather depressing facts. China was permitted to join the World Trade Organization without evidence that it was prepared to play by WTO rules, including the protection of intellectual property. (Despite its international reputation for money laundering and proliferation finance, China in July is set to assume the presidency of the Financial Action Task Force, which is the global standard-bearer in combating illicit finance.)
Meanwhile, former government officials seeking to cash in on China adopted the Kissinger model of working with lucrative advisory firms to facilitate market access for Chinese companies to the West and vice-versa.



Related
Opinion
30 years after Tiananmen, China doesn't even hide its human rights abuses
The Chinese saw this acquiescence as a green light for continued bad behavior. The Chinese economy boomed as state-supported companies dominated export markets and stole Western intellectual property with Chinese state connivance. Chinese hackers targeted U.S. companies and stole the background data of hundreds of thousands of U.S. national security officials.




On the human rights front, China’s repression of its own citizens was met with a collective global yawn even as Beijing jailed dissidents, deployed mass surveillance of its citizens and imposed severe censorship of the internet and news media. Most egregiously, up to 1 million Muslim Uighurs are estimated to have been herded into concentration camps in China’s western Xinjiang province. Entire families reportedly have vanished while others have faced torture and been required to renounce their Islamic faith because Uighur separatist movements have sought independence from Beijing.

What’s to be done? The Trump administration has thankfully abandoned the delusions of economic seduction and forced official Washington to confront the economic and military threats from China. The administration’s national security strategy has driven a bipartisan shift from engagement to strategic competition. The president’s trade wars, while regrettably roiling markets and undermining the allies most likely to join the U.S. against China, are a shrewd move that’s starting to shift global supply chains and penalize Chinese predatory trade and intellectual property practices.
On the human rights front, China’s repression of its own citizens was met with a collective global yawn.

But if a policy of moderation through economic seduction was delusional, a shift to economic coercion without a focus on Chinese Communist Party repression will be equally ineffective. It’s the totality of China’s bad actions that must be confronted in order to effect the change that its citizens and the world need.

The hard men of Beijing fear their own people and the tens of millions of prosperous and free Chinese in the region. Defending Hong Kong’s protesters, Xinjiang’s imprisoned Uighurs and China’s other repressed citizens is not only a moral imperative for America. It’s a smart and strategic one, too.
 

VRAMdemon

Diamond Member
Aug 16, 2012
6,572
7,823
136
Y'all are hilarious. This has absolutely zero nothing to do with Trump or Putin. Russia has been pulling these stunts for decades, and as long as they see the United States as their chief geopolitical rival, they will continue to do so.


Yeah, yeah..we know this is nothing new for Russia and they have been doing this for decades, yada yada. What is new and never seen before in decades is the United States is being run by a Russian stooge, A poodle who seems to believe everything Putin tells him. A man who is willing to do his bidding. This is uncharted territory if Putin decides to test him or force his hand.

The questions still remain and are valid...how would a person like Trump handle a international incident which requires diplomacy, something he knows nothing about. How would Trump handle this sort of statesmanship? How does he handle the situation if Russia becomes more provocative?

There also this little incident:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/11/politics/russia-us-sweden-jets/index.html

How does Trump respond if Russia is sending Trump messages such as: "We can push our influence in your elections whatever way we wish to. We can move support toward you or away from you. Don't forget to do our bidding, else we'll reconsider which way we fuck with your elections in 2020." with little incidents made to push his buttons

After all, this idiot thinks he knows more than all of his Generals..This Commander in Chief is a guy who threatens to end NATO. Right now Putin can do what he wants..and Trump will shrug it off...and he knows it
 
Reactions: hal2kilo
Mar 11, 2004
23,175
5,641
146
Y'all are hilarious. This has absolutely zero nothing to do with Trump or Putin. Russia has been pulling these stunts for decades, and as long as they see the United States as their chief geopolitical rival, they will continue to do so.

Well with clowns like you to keep us entertained its easy for us to be funny by comparison. Maybe you could bother to get an update on what is different? Republicans used to call this behavior out and say we need to do something about Russia's aggression. Not a peep about it from them any more though (well McCain used to although he was a blowhard about it and just made things worse because he didn't take Russia seriously at all, but then he's kinda not around to even do that since he's dead). Plus, maybe you heard about our President being investigated for seeking the aid of Russia to win the election? And I'm sure you've kept up on how its interesting how many Republicans have pictures of themselves with various Russians that were arrested for being agents of the Russian government.

Also, I'm sure the people of Ukraine would be pleased with your commentary. You should let them know they have nothing to worry about, Russia's just posturing, they've been doing that for decades they wouldn't actually do anything more.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,805
29,556
146
Ok, first of all, you linked CNN as a source. Which just shows you as an AntiRussian troll. Your goal is to incite the public against the Russians, so you fabricate fake info and put up links to fake news to make Russia look bad. How original.

Everybody knows CNN lies. EVERYBODY. CNN is pure garbage. No one with half a brain should believe anything CNN says.


There have been plenty of dangerous maneuvers throughout history, on BOTH sides. Not just Russians but Americans as well. Nothing new under the sun, and no reason to treat this minor, insignificant occurrence as anything special.

How do you get off saying the Russians are attacking your democracy? It's a ridiculous claim. Russians have better things to do than to attack YOUR democracy, which is actually not yours. Democracy, as a "system of government " does not "belong" to United States. It exists since ancient Rome and used by many countries. The Russians, especially the general public, (since you choose to blame Russians a whole) do not aim to take down the American government system any more than the Americans aim to topple the Russian government.

And most importantly, I see a picture showing two ships. Neither one of these ships is ramming each other, there's no shots fired, nothing at all. Just a picture of two ships. It is not clear from the picture which ships these are. They might as well be African or Estonian ships for all I know. I do not see an American or Russian flag on either of these ships. If I show you a picture of two people with one looking like he is walking toward another, are you also going to scream that the person walking toward the other one acted aggressively or in a dangerous manner?! Give me a break!

we get it: you're Russian and you have a specific agenda to shit on the US in your posts. I mean you've admitted it over and over again. Why should we listen to you?
 

ibex333

Diamond Member
Mar 26, 2005
4,092
123
106
we get it: you're Russian and you have a specific agenda to shit on the US in your posts. I mean you've admitted it over and over again. Why should we listen to you?


Ahhh.... Look what the cat dragged in! zinfamous in the flesh!

Anyways, I NEVER admitted anything, and FYI, I am most definitely, positively NOT Russian. I DO speak Russian however, so the difference between you and me, is that I have access to online sources you do not due to your lack of knowledge of other languages. I have the privilege to read and watch things you cannot possibly understand.

I do not have an agenda to shit on US. I have an agenda against those who fabricate false claims on Russia or give in to anti-Russian hysteria. There's a difference. See?
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,534
13,107
136
Ok, first of all, you linked CNN as a source. Which just shows you as an AntiRussian troll. Your goal is to incite the public against the Russians, so you fabricate fake info and put up links to fake news to make Russia look bad. How original.

Everybody knows CNN lies. EVERYBODY. CNN is pure garbage. No one with half a brain should believe anything CNN says.


There have been plenty of dangerous maneuvers throughout history, on BOTH sides. Not just Russians but Americans as well. Nothing new under the sun, and no reason to treat this minor, insignificant occurrence as anything special.

How do you get off saying the Russians are attacking your democracy? It's a ridiculous claim. Russians have better things to do than to attack YOUR democracy, which is actually not yours. Democracy, as a "system of government " does not "belong" to United States. It exists since ancient Rome and used by many countries. The Russians, especially the general public, (since you choose to blame Russians a whole) do not aim to take down the American government system any more than the Americans aim to topple the Russian government.

And most importantly, I see a picture showing two ships. Neither one of these ships is ramming each other, there's no shots fired, nothing at all. Just a picture of two ships. It is not clear from the picture which ships these are. They might as well be African or Estonian ships for all I know. I do not see an American or Russian flag on either of these ships. If I show you a picture of two people with one looking like he is walking toward another, are you also going to scream that the person walking toward the other one acted aggressively or in a dangerous manner?! Give me a break!

Adult onset Zika? Is that a thing? Guess it is.
1. "Everybody knows" ... you actually went there, jfc.
2. Speak motherfucker, you read it? Noone has claimed to own the concept of democracy ffs. You need comprehension aide.
3. Fox showed you a picture. Must be nice for you, finally something you can relate to. Pictures.

Is ibex a ruskie?
Ukrainian traitor?
Polish sympathizer?
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,534
13,107
136
Ahhh.... Look what the cat dragged in! zinfamous in the flesh!

Anyways, I NEVER admitted anything, and FYI, I am most definitely, positively NOT Russian. I DO speak Russian however, so the difference between you and me, is that I have access to online sources you do not due to your lack of knowledge of other languages. I have the privilege to read and watch things you cannot possibly understand.

I do not have an agenda to shit on US. I have an agenda against those who fabricate false claims on Russia or give in to anti-Russian hysteria. There's a difference. See?

You know, RT, has an english speaking edition... its just we know its tainted propaganda much like Fox.
 
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