Kickstarter Is Out Of Control

[mindcycle]

When Kickstarter first came about in 2008, it was a great platform to fund projects that would have otherwise never come to fruition. Even if they would have existed otherwise, it prevented people from resorting to loans to gamble on their ideas, instead turning straight to prospective fans for funding. I helped fund quite a few projects ranging from bands trying to press an album to artists trying to buy supplies for paintings. It was a nice community of real people trying to get their dreams imagined. Then Double Fine Adventures happened.

It’s not as if Double Fine was the first game to ever use Kickstarter as a funding platform. I interviewed Jason Wishnov about his Kickstarter-backed XBLA indie game “Sequence” over two years ago. Double Fine was the first game to raise money in the seven-digits range, however. $3,336,371 to be exact. The industry immediately took notice. After all, why risk money to create your product when you could get it completely funded beforehand by gamers themselves? Kickstarter became littered with established titles such as Leisure Suit Larry, Class of Heroes, Wasteland 2 and Shadowrun.

Suddenly, Kickstarter was no longer a platform for individuals to fund their dreams. It simply became a shortcut for cash. These games aren’t being created by some wunderkind programmer trying to share his vision with his world, but veterans of the industry. Independent, perhaps, but established nonetheless.

Inspiring projects from individuals are being drowned out by proffesional projects or by amateurs who think they can cash in on the trend. Kickstarter has become less of a dream-starter and more of a place for game companies to cut potential losses or simple ego-gloryifing.

Like all bubbles, the Kickstarter one is bound to burst. Gamers are going to develop apathy about future projects when they realize that they aren’t helping a cause for a game that wouldn’t have otherwise existed, but simply doing super early pre-orders. By buying games before they exist, you’re simply letting developers off the hook. There’s not going to be an urgency to create the best possible product when you’ve already made back your entire budget. When you have millions on the line, you’re going to attempt to make the best game possible, but when gamers have pledged to purchase your game regardless of the quality, there won’t be as much effort and passion going into the game.

Hopefully, gamers backlash sooner than later before this ridiculous influx of Kickstarter projects suffocates all the dreamers and ruins the platform.

via: http://www.hardcoregamer.com/2012/04/19/kickstarter-is-out-of-control/

While I definitely agree with the writer that most of the big name titles on kicktarter right now are essentially nothing more that "very early" preorders, I don't necessarily think the quality of a game will suffer just because you make some of your money up front. Yes, in some cases, it can, and probably will, backfire. But, that will likely mean less funding for that developer in the future and not necessarily the end of this trend of funding games before release.

That said, it is concerning to see bigger developers start gravitating toward kickstarter. It makes you ask the question: "Who's next?" Maybe EA, Activision.. lol Honestly, that wouldn't even surprise me. Something to that degree would definitely hamper the little guy just trying to get his indie game/idea out there, which I think is the great part about sites like kickstarter. But like everything else, all great ideas are eventually ruined in some way by big business..

 

[RedBeard]

We can only hope the people who fund the projects will seriously scrutinize them.

But I am certainly glad it is there. I am pretty damn sure that there would be no Wasteland 2 if it were not for Kickstarter. (yes I am a backer)

But honestly I see the service to be of limited use. It was funny because I was really thinking about the original Xcom games before the remake annoucement

Even if Kickstarter dies away, hopefully it will let publishers know that there are still markets for games that they can't "detect". That there are feasible projects even if they don't necessarily have mass appeal but are back by the dollars of hard core fans.

 

[GoodRevrnd]

With the Titans, I see it as paying for the developers to maintain their integrity, free from publisher interference. Whatever DoubleFine does (whether they succeed or fail), I don't think will give us a very good idea of how viable this is for established developers, and if they're deserving of this type of funding. The Wastelands and Shadowruns are the games to really keep an eye on. It will be interesting to see how pure these developers' visions really remain, and how well they manage to synthesize their audience's nostalgic expectations for depth and complexity with the things all gamers (including the hardcore supporters) now expect from modern games. There will be some sort of backlash or bubble burst no matter what, I just hope that if these guys fail it won't have such an overwhelmingly negative long term impact on the little guys on Kickstarter.

 

[DaveSimmons]

Like all bubbles, the Kickstarter one is bound to burst. Gamers are going to develop apathy about future projects when they realize that they aren’t helping a cause for a game that wouldn’t have otherwise existed, but simply doing super early pre-orders

The author is wrong.

InXile tried to line up a publisher for Wasteland 2 for years and could not get funding. The game would not have happened without KS.

The same for Grim Dawn, the Titan Quest sequel. Two years of unpaid work without being able to line up a publisher. I'm guessing the Shadowrun project couldn't get traditional funding either.

This sounds like "only unsigned bands are worth hearing" snobbery.

 

[irishScott]

Sounds like an alarmist contrarion article begging for views to me.

Being a backer of Wasteland 2, Shadowrun Returns and The Banner Saga, I fail to see how these projects are "drowning out" anything. If anything they're drawing more attention to Kickstarter, and indirectly more attention to all Kickstarter projects.

As for the profit motive, the author has it ass backwards. Many big games nowadays are hamstrung by publishers who want minimal risk on their multimillion dollar investment. With kickstarter, the publishers are completely cut out and the devs can do whatever they like. There is no risk, the funding is there from the start. Yes this may produce some crappy games, but that's what the free market's for. If a kickstarter game fails to produce a satisfying product, the developer will gain a corresponding reputation and their next project will fail big time.

This will be aided in many cases by the fact that backers will obtain one or multiple copies of the game, and will expect to be satisfied. If there's an ME3 style backlash for whatever reason, it won't just affect profits, it will affect future kickstarter-based funding for that company quite directly and severely.


So bottom line that author is full of it.

 

[DaveSimmons]

> If anything they're drawing more attention to Kickstarter, and indirectly more attention to all Kickstarter projects.

Good point, there was an ArsTechnica article about that recently, how the big name projects drew in people (like me!) who then funded other projects, increasing the overall funding of the smaller projects not hurting them.

 

[irishScott]

> If anything they're drawing more attention to Kickstarter, and indirectly more attention to all Kickstarter projects.

Good point, there was an ArsTechnica article about that recently, how the big name projects drew in people (like me!) who then funded other projects, increasing the overall funding of the smaller projects not hurting them.

Indeed. I only sponsored Shadowrun Returns and The Banner Saga because I was sucked in by Wasteland 2. If it hadn't been for InXile "drowning out the little guys" (according to the author) I wouldn't have known either of the other two existed.

 

[GoodRevrnd]

I started w/ DoubleFine, and then jumped to FTL and Wasteland 2. I'll probably just cave and hit Shadowrun in a few days as well.

 

[CPA]

how is this any different than people putting down huge deposits for the Chevy Volt a year before it came out?

 

[StrangerGuy]

When you have millions on the line, you’re going to attempt to make the best game possible, but when gamers have pledged to purchase your game regardless of the quality, there won’t be as much effort and passion going into the game.

This is the most hilarious thing I saw today; the logic is wrong at so many levels. If that was true every single game from EA would have been masterpieces instead of the shit we see despite their massive funding.

Obvious paid corporate shill is obvious. Look people, this is one of the worst examples of gaming "journalism bribery".

 

[LumbergTech]

I'd like to see a different idea. People come up with an idea for a game they ACTUALLY WANT and then toss in their cash and a dev can take it on.

 

[Fenixgoon]

This is the most hilarious thing I saw today; the logic is wrong at so many levels. If that was true every single game from EA would have been masterpieces instead of the shit we see despite their massive funding.

Obvious paid corporate shill is obvious. Look people, this is one of the worst examples of gaming "journalism bribery".

while i didn't consider your alternative scenario (which is quite true),

i see kickstarter as a great means for small devs who can't necessarily secure large amounts of funding. i personally haven't made any pledges, but i don't have an issue with the way it works.

if anything, in fact, i'd think the dev would be more likely to produce a quality game because a) they are small and not driven by corporate pursuits, b) they are funded by gamers who will want to see good work. screw up once, and i doubt you'd be able to get another kickstarter project.

 

[GoodRevrnd]

So you want a bunch of people kicking in cash for an idea, who will undoubtedly all have their own interpretations of said idea, and then have it picked up by a dev with no personal investment in the idea? That sounds like a winning formula.

 

[thilanliyan]

I commend all you who have supported these kickstarter projects. I have never actually played any of the games they are remaking so I wouldn't know what to support anyway. More importantly though I really don't have much time for games anymore.

 

[spittledip]

I wondered about this issue myself. Undoubtedly, kickstarter will be "abused" and people will become more cautious about what to invest in. I think what will ultimately happen is that kickstarter will live on, but people will more closely scrutinize the projects they are interested in supporting rather than being so very free with their cash as they seem to be right now.

 

[CPA]

I'd like to see a different idea. People come up with an idea for a game they ACTUALLY WANT and then toss in their cash and a dev can take it on.

And how much would that cost? Or is the Dev supposed to work for free?

 

[gonvik]

Weak article. I don't mind giving over a few bucks to the professional and very talented developers who are using Kickstarter for their projects that would otherwise be ignored or tainted by the giant publishers.

 

[Sulaco]

I'd like to see a different idea. People come up with an idea for a game they ACTUALLY WANT and then toss in their cash and a dev can take it on.

Uh, no. A big part of the kickstarter appeal is KNOWING who is going to be making the game I'm interested.

Just throwing it open to the highest bidder would result in basically what we have now.

I'm going to be a lot more interested in, say, a Rainbow Six sequel that I know has several of the same guys on board that made the first game, rather than whatever hacks EA currently wants to bullwhip towards the project.

 

[greenhawk]

while I agree it would seem KS is going a bit pre ordery with things, it is also getting a lot more coverage drawing in more people that are putting up money. The core group of people are still present and they can keep doing what they want and that is give their money to deserving ideas.

Personally, the only way that I can see the issue you have from being addressed if KS limits the money cap to something like $500,000, but as KS gets a cut of the raised money, it means the site can keep working for other people as it's original intent was.

The advice to regular supporters is to ask for a filtering option when looking at requests that is sorted from "least amount needed" so that those after $10,000 are displayed well in advance to the $1,000,000 asking people.

I have been tempted to offer money, but then the ones I want to go well, are the ones that pretty much look to be going well without it.

 

[Lonyo]

> If anything they're drawing more attention to Kickstarter, and indirectly more attention to all Kickstarter projects.

Good point, there was an ArsTechnica article about that recently, how the big name projects drew in people (like me!) who then funded other projects, increasing the overall funding of the smaller projects not hurting them.

http://arstechnica.com/business/new...oats-explosive-kickstart-growth-helps-all.ars

EXCLUDING DoubleFine

The original article linked is just some idiot doing zero research and going off on his own ideas without having a clue about what's actually happening. Better not to give him the page hits, unless you're going to register and request he takes the article down until there's some actual evidence to back it up.

 

[Baptismbyfire]

If the writer of the article would actually bother to spend the time to look at a few of the projects, he would see that with projects people are passionate about, the pledgers themselves actually make the effort to advertise on the behalf of the developers by contacting gaming websites, twitting, and etc.

 

[xboxist]

Super pumped for Shadowrun Returns. $125 backer here.

To me... based on that and that alone, Kickstarter is amazing.

 

[Baptismbyfire]

How do they plan to release Shadowrun in time for January, 2013 deadline they have written there? They don't even show any gameplay videos, or at least are very mumb about providing details about the game. I canceled my pledge because I don't see how they could provide a deep, rich experience in such a short time. (Not even a year!)

 

[xboxist]

How do they plan to release Shadowrun in time for January, 2013 deadline they have written there? They don't even show any gameplay videos, or at least are very mumb about providing details about the game. I canceled my pledge because I don't see how they could provide a deep, rich experience in such a short time. (Not even a year!)

Valid thoughts.

Shadowrun is in my top 2 or 3 gaming brands of all-time, so I personally couldn't throw enough money at Shadowrun-anything. I think at the very least, you probably can't go terribly wrong with a $15 preorder. I have no idea what kind of final product they can pump out in less than a years time. But keep in mind this is not going to be a $60 mainstream blockbuster. This will probably sell for $20-25 at launch. I'm just hoping there's enough great substance there to make it worth it. Which is why I pledged, to help make it happen. And I'm a sucker for boxed sets of gaming crap that I won't look at beyond day 1. =P

 

[PrincessFrosty]

It's absolutely not a "bubble", and these products wouldn't exist without it.

Why?

Because publishers are putting their money into all the "safe" titles like the next CoD game which can give almost guaranteed returns based on insane amounts of advertising, hype and buying out reviews.

Old school gamers such as myself who were here during the periods where gaming was niche and not mainstream and enjoyed well made games are basically sick to death of the casual titles being crammed out today, turned to Indy games for our fix of decent gameplay but would like to see something more. Kick starter allows those amongst us who are fed up of the direction of the industry right now, to vote with our wallets by not just denying activision money by ignoring the next CoD game but also by being proactive and putting that cash towards developers willing to make the games we actually want.

Kickstarter is amazing and I hope to see more gaming projects started there, I will back all of the good ones.