Kingdom Come: Deliverance

[Ranulf]

That's just a dealbreaker in any modern game. This isn't console land. Sounds like an artificial way to pad the length of the game. I'll wait for a deep cut in price unless they change it.

Especially since like with a PS4 you can just put the console in rest mode and pick up where you left off later. There are mods out already aparently adding in unlimited saves/save anywhere. One streamer I saw last night apparently lost 2 hours of play due to a quest bug.

I can see where the devs were going with by stopping people quicksaving and reloading to try different options. Choices matter more and have consequences. Problem becomes when you have bugs or people need to stop immediately and deal with real life.

 

[GoodRevrnd]

Part of the problem is that the game starts you off as a peasant who's literally only handled a sword a couple of times. You barely have any idea what you're doing especially against bandits or trained soldiers who have experience. I've watched several streamers get really frustrated when they couldn't take on two or three enemies at once like a typical hack and slash action RPG. You have to level up your combat skills and do more training later in the game before your character is actually a good fighter.

I already have the game from kickstarter and am really looking forward to it, but I'm gonna hold off for now since I just started a modded Witcher 3 play through. Hopefully a few patches will drop while I'm finishing it.

I was watching a prerelease video where the player was with a raiding party attacking a bandit camp, not a newbie streamer.

 

[BSim500]

That's the problem with limited-saves nonsense. They (and single-slot checkpoint-only games in general) rely on the game being technically infallibly perfect. Or gamers all having the lifestyle of school-children during summer vacation with nice 12hr continuous gaming stretches. Meanwhile, back in the real world...

I'll never understand the obsessive need for devs to try and control single-player game save flexibility to try and force some arbitrary "choice". The fear of "save-scumming" in general is wildly over-exaggerated. It's not like people can't ALT-TAB out and lookup the outcomes of "choices" in quests in walkthroughs / game-specific forums & wiki's, etc, in advance of making that choice in-game. Or watch different ending sequences derived from those different choices on Youtube...

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

That's the problem with limited-saves nonsense. They (and single-slot checkpoint-only games in general) rely on the game being technically infallibly perfect. Or gamers all having the lifestyle of school-children during summer vacation with nice 12hr continuous gaming stretches. Meanwhile, back in the real world...

Yep, toss limited-saves up there with non-skippable cutscenes, non-pausable cutscenes, and non-pausable 'always on' single player games (looking at you, D3).

 

[EXCellR8]

Might give it a shot even though I (beyond) suck at these types of games. I bought Witcher 3 GOTY on steam sale a few months ago and I haven't even installed it yet. A few years ago when I first played it I just couldn't get a bead on the combat model.

 

[sandorski]

Looks alright, but the control scheme looks a little Turok(90's version) to me.

 

[PrincessFrosty]

I don't have the game but Macks review for WorthABuy on youtube explained that saving can be done for free when you sleep in a bed but a lot can happen between a save and the long quest chains before you save again. You also get items you can save with, as someone said I think 3 free ones and then you can buy them later for gold.

I suspect the reason they did that is because the game has real consequences for your choices and actions and they probably dont want you quicksave/loading yourself out of that. From what I've heard it's a more realistic RPG than even TW3, you can't wander into peoples homes for example, they'll call the guards on you or fight you. You can steal stuff if you're not caught but you can't fence it in the same area otherwise people recognize it's stolen. And apparantly story choices are quite meaningful.

I think you probably have to be a really hardcore RPG gamer to properly appreciate this game, you start off as basically a peasant who has never fought with a sword or ridden a horse, so to get good enough at those things to be of use in game you have to practice those skills to get good at them. It sounds really good, honestly.

The only thing that's stopping me from buying it right now is the bugs, apparently there's quite a few immersion breaking ones, but those can be patched out so with any luck given a month or so we'll see a much more enjoyable experience. So I'll wait.

 

[Rifter]

I can safely say unless they fix the broken save system ill never buy this. I dont have as much time to game as i used to and sometimes i just need to save and do some real life stuff. These devs are idiots if they think this is a valid save system in 2018.

 

[zinfamous]

^ I get the reasoning for the save system, but the real problem is that this needs to be a game, fist and foremost. Striving for realism and real consequences is great and all, but when I buy a game, I'm not look for a "real-life misery simulator"

No one wants a super authetic Feudal RPG: that means 100hours+ week digging through cow shit and eating gruel. Death by cholera before you learn to swing that sword. Even if you are a Vassal...days riding your horse from region to region, begging the king to do something. traveling from hamlet to hamlet to extort money from your peasants, etc. It means, maybe, you actually engage in 4 or 5 fights in your lifetime.

I do like that the fights, at least early on, are sparse (one would think that sword fights really are a rarity), and that they are hard. They should be hard and the system should have a learning curve. Timing can be adjusted to make many of these things tolerable--I assume they are, here?--but I can't abide this decision to remove my ability to save whenever I want, so that I can get on with my real life when I need to. We don't live in these worlds, we play these games to escape the real world, and hopefully have fun; not hope that the game makes our experience frustrating and miserable. If people are going to break the consequences by constantly quicksaving..so what? I bought the game, let me break it however I want, right?

It's not like any "hardcore RPGers" that this game is apparently designed for are going to break that system anyway. And even so, I'm sure they would have issues of losing 2 or 3 hours of progress because they couldn't save when they wanted to but had to log out.

....at least it seems there are already community mods that fix this terrible design choice.

 

[AdamK47]

I'll get it... in my usual manner. Wait until it's on sale and patched up.

 

[rstrohkirch]

I find this interesting as well. Will wait a couple of months to see what they do for patches. The save thing doesn't bother me in terms of needing to walk away from my computer. I usually only play one game at a time so I often alt-tab out of games and leave them running. I've nearly finished Nioh and only closed the game once since I've started early last week. Not being able to save before difficult encounters may be a deal breaker though.

 

[AdamK47]

What's wrong with closing and opening games between sessions?

Seems like it would increase the possibility for problems while also needlessly using resources/electricity.

 

[rstrohkirch]

What's wrong with closing and opening games between sessions?

That was mentioned in response to having to leave your game in between long chains without saving. If you alt-tab out then it doesn't matter.

Seems like it would increase the possibility for problems while also needlessly using resources/electricity.

Could it cause problems with a game? Maybe but I it's been a long time since I've had any games that had issues with being minimized. Most of the time I play in windowed full screen anyway. It would have a negligible impact on electricity because there is nearly no hit to your gpu/cpu while you're sitting at your desktop. It would eat up ram but I guess that depends on your system.

 

[aigomorla]

combat is meh... seriously meh...
its not something you button mash to get by... you need to time stuff, but what i hate is that its mouse sensitive... for example.. if u want to head bash someone, you need to raise your mouse up and then attack.. the same goes for an understrike.. you move your mouse back a a little and strike.

saving is ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHH.....
However nexusmods has a unlimited save mod which makes things better.
You also save each time you goto sleep.
However if you want to play vanilla, saving can be a PITFA.

Overall the cutscenes... omg am i playing a RPG or watching a cryengine movie?
It has a lot of cutscenes and the skill tree is quite tideous...

Is it worth full price?
I dont think so... its already gotten 2 patches... launched at 1.2, and as of today its 1.2.2
Ive had some occasions where the game froze... it didnt crash, it just froze.... wouldnt go onto the next scene...
I also have had my horse stuck in the rock and in the river....

So unless ur really bored and want to pay the full price id suggest you wait for it to go on sale...

Possibly a good game worth 29.99 maybe even 34.99, however at full price of 59.99, i feel thats not worth its value.

 

[Stg-Flame]

combat is meh... seriously meh...
its not something you button mash to get by... you need to time stuff, but what i hate is that its mouse sensitive... for example.. if u want to head bash someone, you need to raise your mouse up and then attack.. the same goes for an understrike.. you move your mouse back a a little and strike.

saving is ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHH.....
However nexusmods has a unlimited save mod which makes things better.
You also save each time you goto sleep.
However if you want to play vanilla, saving can be a PITFA.

Overall the cutscenes... omg am i playing a RPG or watching a cryengine movie?
It has a lot of cutscenes and the skill tree is quite tideous...

Is it worth full price?
I dont think so... its already gotten 2 patches... launched at 1.2, and as of today its 1.2.2
Ive had some occasions where the game froze... it didnt crash, it just froze.... wouldnt go onto the next scene...
I also have had my horse stuck in the rock and in the river....

So unless ur really bored and want to pay the full price id suggest you wait for it to go on sale...

Possibly a good game worth 29.99 maybe even 34.99, however at full price of 59.99, i feel thats not worth its value.

This is exactly why I don't pay full price or buy games on launch. This is also exactly why people need to stop pre-ordering games so maybe we won't be left with a game that requires day one patches.

 

[Stuka87]

combat is meh... seriously meh...
its not something you button mash to get by... you need to time stuff, but what i hate is that its mouse sensitive... for example.. if u want to head bash someone, you need to raise your mouse up and then attack.. the same goes for an understrike.. you move your mouse back a a little and strike.

saving is ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHH.....
However nexusmods has a unlimited save mod which makes things better.
You also save each time you goto sleep.
However if you want to play vanilla, saving can be a PITFA.

Overall the cutscenes... omg am i playing a RPG or watching a cryengine movie?
It has a lot of cutscenes and the skill tree is quite tideous...

Is it worth full price?
I dont think so... its already gotten 2 patches... launched at 1.2, and as of today its 1.2.2
Ive had some occasions where the game froze... it didnt crash, it just froze.... wouldnt go onto the next scene...
I also have had my horse stuck in the rock and in the river....

So unless ur really bored and want to pay the full price id suggest you wait for it to go on sale...

Possibly a good game worth 29.99 maybe even 34.99, however at full price of 59.99, i feel thats not worth its value.

Thanks for the mini review!

 

[zinfamous]

combat is meh... seriously meh...
its not something you button mash to get by... you need to time stuff, but what i hate is that its mouse sensitive... for example.. if u want to head bash someone, you need to raise your mouse up and then attack.. the same goes for an understrike.. you move your mouse back a a little and strike.

saving is ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHH.....
However nexusmods has a unlimited save mod which makes things better.
You also save each time you goto sleep.
However if you want to play vanilla, saving can be a PITFA.

Overall the cutscenes... omg am i playing a RPG or watching a cryengine movie?
It has a lot of cutscenes and the skill tree is quite tideous...

Is it worth full price?
I dont think so... its already gotten 2 patches... launched at 1.2, and as of today its 1.2.2
Ive had some occasions where the game froze... it didnt crash, it just froze.... wouldnt go onto the next scene...
I also have had my horse stuck in the rock and in the river....

So unless ur really bored and want to pay the full price id suggest you wait for it to go on sale...

Possibly a good game worth 29.99 maybe even 34.99, however at full price of 59.99, i feel thats not worth its value.

Aside from the clearly tedious/frustrating mechanics, how is the questing/story/rpg stuff? Is there a decent sense of progression with leveling, or skills...and do you actually want to keep going on because the story and side quests are actually compelling? Tedious fetch quests mostly, or some real consequential stuff?

 

[Hoober]

Aside from the clearly tedious/frustrating mechanics, how is the questing/story/rpg stuff? Is there a decent sense of progression with leveling, or skills...and do you actually want to keep going on because the story and side quests are actually compelling? Tedious fetch quests mostly, or some real consequential stuff?

I like the story and quests so far. However, if you haven't yet bought the game, I would hold off. There are a number of game-breaking bugs, including one preventing your character from sleeping (required).

 

[Grooveriding]

Bought it, regret it. It seems really good, lots of dialogue options, decent story etc. But, it is a bug-ridden POS right now. CTDs, loss of progress, quests that stop completing. Unplayable in this state imo.

 

[Stg-Flame]

Bought it, regret it. It seems really good, lots of dialogue options, decent story etc. But, it is a bug-ridden POS right now. CTDs, loss of progress, quests that stop completing. Unplayable in this state imo.

Then why wouldn't you wait until the game was patched and put on sale?

 

[aigomorla]

Aside from the clearly tedious/frustrating mechanics, how is the questing/story/rpg stuff? Is there a decent sense of progression with leveling, or skills...and do you actually want to keep going on because the story and side quests are actually compelling? Tedious fetch quests mostly, or some real consequential stuff?

OK where do i start...
Lets see if you find this enjoyable.

To level up swordplay, you need to use your sword to either fight bandits / cumens / training.
And it doesnt go up fast, its a grind.

The same with bow, and just about everything else in the game.

Alchemy is the WORST.
Its not like typical RPG's where you have the ingredients, you push a nice button called craft and POOF it comes out.
You need to ACTUALLY CRAFT the potion.
Here is an example of what i mean...

That means if u mess up in a process you basically make a random potion which you have no idea what it is, and can kill you if you RNG hard enough.

I am also getting quite annoyed at some of the dialogs and progression.
I miss the Skyrim mechanics of being OP, where..

1. Someone piss you off?
2. You go on a murderous rampage
3. You cleanse the Town of filth and free to do what you want.

In this game, it has an endless amount of soldiers, so you piss off the town, you have 2 options, die, or goto jail.
You cant fight your way out, even with cheats, because a new cop will spawn and pull you over and then you go though that entire stupid dialog about having to goto jail, or fleeing.

I am still not done with the story... although i have almost gotten fully bored of the game.

Then why wouldn't you wait until the game was patched and put on sale?

Maybe he wanted someone to play during presidents weekend?
Personally i feel bad for him if he paid full price for the game.
I got away with paying 39.59 :T

 

[Grooveriding]

Just was not aware what a bad state it is in. Games that really interest me I will buy at release pricing and this one did. I expect some issues, but not for the game to be this broken. One of those times I wish I bought directly from Steam so I could have refunded it.

 

[Stg-Flame]

Just was not aware what a bad state it is in. Games that really interest me I will buy at release pricing and this one did. I expect some issues, but not for the game to be this broken. One of those times I wish I bought directly from Steam so I could have refunded it.

I hate to say it, but people who buy games on release day at full price are the reason why we continually receive broken buggy messes. Just like people who continually threw money at EA for loot crates and DLC are the reason why Battlefront 2 came out the way it did. Developers see how profitable mobile games are with people talking about their "weekly budget" to spend on gems or whatever in-game currency is required to expedite the process of playing the game and EA tried to pull the same crap with a AAA PC release. On top of that nonsense, we have the whole Early Access garbage that basically gives developers a huge chunk of their profits before half the game is even released and people are more than happy to play the same 40% of the actual game for years until one day they finally decide to do a 1.0 release and claim they never promised any of the content that was cut from the final release (looking at you Chucklefish).

I remember the midnight release of Dead Island. Extremely anticipated game and they gave us a developer version. Just the fact that everyone got to play around with a half-finished developer copy of the game made a huge impact on the reviews and overall sales. It took Deep Silver a long time to recover from that little mix-up on top of the myriad of bugs and glitches that were littered all over the 1.0 release.

 

[zinfamous]

...do I have to go through that brewing process every single time I want to create one schnapps that creates a single save instance? lol...ffs.

He said all the ingredients can only be added individually (not sure if that was a bug issue or just part of the seriousness of the recipe), but say I have to do that every time for each potion...rather than a stack of 20 or 30 potions or something like that?

FFS... Dr McGillicuddy can go eff himself!

 

[ImpulsE69]

This is why I only play games 10-15 years after the fact . By then if the devs didn't fix it, the modders do.

Also...I really wanted this game to be good, but glad I passed. Even without the bugs, it sounds like a real sludge to get through.