Kingston SSDNow V SSD

[Fallingwater]

I'm thinking of buying a SSD for my netbook - not because I need superfast performance, but because I dislike having moving mechanical parts in an ultraportable machine that gets tossed around, used in vibration-rich environments and possibly dropped (though I try to avoid the last). I tried running Linux off of a SD card, but it was way too slow even for my relaxed standards (system updates were an overnight operation...), so that's out of the question.

I've found an interesting offer for the Kingston 64GB SSDNow V notebook bundle (with an external 2.5" drive caddie in which I'd put the HD the netbook currently has) for $125 shipped.

I've read a few reviews of it and all seem to agree that for an entry-level SSD it has an excellent price, but many lament the lack of TRIM support. However, the Kingston website disagrees and says the SSDNow V does in fact support TRIM.

Who's right? And, is TRIM as big a deal as some reviews seem to make it, or are they obsessing over a secondary feature?

Thanks.

 

[razel]

I am unsure of the prices that are available to you but $1.5 USD per GIG is a typical sale price in the U.S. For that Kingston, because it's entry level, I wouldn't pay more than that. The Kingston, if you are getting the current model does have TRIM, but reviewers have noticed that it's garbage collection is so immediate, it probably doesn't need it.

Yes, TRIM should not be a primary buying point. SSDs are maturing GC and TRIM are becoming lessons learned. Price should be your primary focus. As long as you get a current model at $1.5 per GIG, you'll be happy.

 

[trungma]

The new Kingston SSDs are decent. I threw a 40GB one in my netbook and it's literally feels like a new computer. Worlds of difference especially when opening up things like iTunes. And like you mentioned, it's really nice not having to worry about it being tossed around.

 

[alexruiz]

I'm thinking of buying a SSD for my netbook - not because I need superfast performance, but because I dislike having moving mechanical parts in an ultraportable machine that gets tossed around, used in vibration-rich environments and possibly dropped (though I try to avoid the last). I tried running Linux off of a SD card, but it was way too slow even for my relaxed standards (system updates were an overnight operation...), so that's out of the question.

I've found an interesting offer for the Kingston 64GB SSDNow V notebook bundle (with an external 2.5" drive caddie in which I'd put the HD the netbook currently has) for $125 shipped.

I've read a few reviews of it and all seem to agree that for an entry-level SSD it has an excellent price, but many lament the lack of TRIM support. However, the Kingston website disagrees and says the SSDNow V does in fact support TRIM.

Who's right? And, is TRIM as big a deal as some reviews seem to make it, or are they obsessing over a secondary feature?

Thanks.

I have that exact SSD. A lot of the reviews are confusing drives, as the Kingston SSD 1st gen (125 series) is the one uses the infamous "sttutering" JMcron controller and doesn't support trim. The 425 series (this one) uses the JMicron JMB612, a polished controller AND supports TRIM. The V+ is 325 series, and uses a Toshiba controller.

It is an entry level SSD, so if you come from another faster sSD you will feel the machine slightly slower. However, even this entry level SSD is much much faster than a VR300 for desktop usage, and if you move from a mechanical drive, you will feel the difference in favor of the SSD.

There should be a rebate on the 64GB making it close to $89. On the other hand, microcenter has its own brand 64GB witha SF-1200 for $99. Unless you cna get the Kingston for $80 or lower, I say get the microcenter.

 

[Fallingwater]

I'm in Italy - information about US-centric stores with rebates and such is of no use here, sadly. I found the $125 offer on DealExtreme, who ship straight from Hong Kong. Stuff takes about 3-5 weeks to get here, but at least they don't overcharge for shipping like US stores tend to do, and most packages sneak past customs - which for some reason never happens to those coming from the US.

The alternative is to buy stuff from European stores, but they tend to have a direct dollar-to-euro conversion, which is a 20% ripoff factor or thereabouts... we do get a 2-year warranty for that, but from what I know about SSDs it's hardly necessary. For instance, I can't find the 64GB SSDNow V for less than 110 euro shipped around here...

 

[alexruiz]

I'm in Italy - information about US-centric stores with rebates and such is of no use here, sadly. I found the $125 offer on DealExtreme, who ship straight from Hong Kong. Stuff takes about 3-5 weeks to get here, but at least they don't overcharge for shipping like US stores tend to do, and most packages sneak past customs - which for some reason never happens to those coming from the US.

The alternative is to buy stuff from European stores, but they tend to have a direct dollar-to-euro conversion, which is a 20% ripoff factor or thereabouts... we do get a 2-year warranty for that, but from what I know about SSDs it's hardly necessary. For instance, I can't find the 64GB SSDNow V for less than 110 euro shipped around here...

Oh, sorry, didn't see the location.
Amazon in the USA ships internationally and doesn't overcharge. Meritline is based is China also, you might also check them.

 

[OS]

any word if the power consumption on these is still crappy?

 

[OS]

nm here is a review;

http://www.storagereview.com/kingston_ssdnow_v_review_snv425s2

 

[taltamir]

The new Kingston SSDs are decent. I threw a 40GB one in my netbook and it's literally feels like a new computer. Worlds of difference especially when opening up things like iTunes. And like you mentioned, it's really nice not having to worry about it being tossed around.

kingston doesn't make SSDs, it rebrands SSDs. the kingston 40GB is an intel X-25M 40GB (value edition) with a different sticker.
the 64GB kingstons are NOT intel drives, look up the actual drive info to determine what it is (the most important bit of info is the controller)
EDIT: I looked it up for you, the Kingston SSD Now V is a Jmicron http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=736&type=expert&pid=3
Its crap, don't get it. besides, 125$ is not even a good price for a 64GB SSD

Yes, TRIM should not be a primary buying point. SSDs are maturing GC and TRIM are becoming lessons learned. Price should be your primary focus. As long as you get a current model at $1.5 per GIG, you'll be happy.

Newer SSDs take TRIM for granted and bother less and less with GC.
The intel G1 for example, doesn't support trim, and suffers less than a G2 without trim, since the G2 is optimized to work with TRIM at the expense of performance without it.

 

[RU482]

SSD's make netbooks bearable. At $125, I'd either pay a little more for a crucial 64GB or a little less for a 40GB intel

 

[taltamir]

SSD's make netbooks bearable. At $125, I'd either pay a little more for a crucial 64GB or a little less for a 40GB intel

You should really make the stipulation that it has to be a GOOD SSD. A crap SSD will just disappoint.

 

[OS]

i have a quick review for the kingston 128GB SNV425-S2, i got this drive from amazon last week for $155, IMO it's actually not particularly good.


i installed it in an acer 5534 notebook, which i upgraded to turion x2 TL60 2.0 GHZ, and it feels only a little faster than the stock 320GB 5400 rpm WD scorpio in casual use.

the power consumption for this model seems high even in use, my battery life has no improvement and may even be a touch worse.


my desktop with an original OCZ agility 60 GB feels faster than my laptop, of course the rest of the system faster athlon II x4 2.9 GHZ, but even the review linked below overall ranks the original agility faster than this kingston.


I guess my summary would be, this drive is not really a worthwhile upgrade in most cases

it maybe ok if you are building a system from scratch and need a drive anyways, but if you are sitting on the fence i would not recommend it



here is more info i found on it;

http://www.harddrivebenchmark.net/high_end_drives.html

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/samsung-470-sandforce-best-ssd,2783-13.html

 

[taltamir]

i have a quick review for the kingston 128GB SNV425-S2, i got this drive from amazon last week for $155, IMO it's actually not particularly good.

According to SSD decoder ring here http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=736&type=expert&pid=3
it is a JMicron 618 (no USB) controller SSD... the only worse SSDs on the market at the Micron 612 and 602... with the 602 being slower than a spindle drive.

my desktop with an original OCZ agility 60 GB feels faster than my laptop

it is. http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=736&type=expert
It is an Indilinx bigfoot coupled with slower (budget) flash chips, making it slightly slower than other Indilinx SSDs, but still a pretty strong SSD because the indilinx controller is rather good, and it is much faster and better than a spindle disk.

 

[OS]

i ran HD tune quick and dirty on both drives/computers

laptop-turion x2 TL-60, 2.0GHZ, 780G, Kingston 128GB SNV425-S2
desktop-athlon II x4, 2.9 GHZ, 785G, OCZ Agility 60GB

laptop-min 155, max 179, avg 172, burst 53, access time .3
desktop-min 150, max 218, avg 199, burst 187, access time .1


the kingston had a crappy burst number, i read a blurb somewhere hd tune may not measure burst correctly, but it seems like the kingston drive is the only one that has this issue;

http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/kingston_ssdnow_128gb/5.htm

 

[OS]

yeah that's kind of sad the older AND smaller ocz original agility is faster than the kingston

 

[GullyFoyle]

You should really make the stipulation that it has to be a GOOD SSD. A crap SSD will just disappoint.

Opinions are like ...

Loving my crap Kingston 64GB SSD! I either boot Win 7 from my SSD, or dual-boot to Win XP on an HD.
The SSD is at least three times faster (1/3 less time), and you can start running apps as soon as the desktop appears.

I am not disappointed at all.

 

[taltamir]

Opinions are like ...

Loving my crap Kingston 64GB SSD! I either boot Win 7 from my SSD, or dual-boot to Win XP on an HD.
The SSD is at least three times faster (1/3 less time), and you can start running apps as soon as the desktop appears.

I am not disappointed at all.

1. if its so good why are YOU calling it crap?
2. Are you under the mistaken assumption that I think all kingston SSDs are crap? because kingston does not make SSDs, they rebrand them, and they rebrand both good AND bad SSDs. Care to share your model number?

 

[loimlo]

I am now using kingston 64GB SSD, SNV425-S2, which is a lot faster than my older WD 6400AAKS. For example, my Win7 boot-up time reduced from 35sec to 20~22sec. And notorious application such as Firefox 3.6 have had cut its launch time from 5~6sec to 2~3sec. I'm satisfied with Kingston SSD given its cost/capacity/performance. Just my two cents.

Maybe it is not the best SSD performer on the platform, but it is still a capable performer compared to old-school HDDs.

 

[Hacp]

kingston doesn't make SSDs, it rebrands SSDs. the kingston 40GB is an intel X-25M 40GB (value edition) with a different sticker.
the 64GB kingstons are NOT intel drives, look up the actual drive info to determine what it is (the most important bit of info is the controller)
EDIT: I looked it up for you, the Kingston SSD Now V is a Jmicron http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=736&type=expert&pid=3
Its crap, don't get it. besides, 125$ is not even a good price for a 64GB SSD



Newer SSDs take TRIM for granted and bother less and less with GC.
The intel G1 for example, doesn't support trim, and suffers less than a G2 without trim, since the G2 is optimized to work with TRIM at the expense of performance without it.

You need garbage collection in order for trim to work. All trim does is let windows tell the ssd which sectors to mark as deleted. GC is the thing that actually cleans the ssd of blocks marked for deletion.

 

[taltamir]

delete

 

[taltamir]

You need garbage collection in order for trim to work. All trim does is let windows tell the ssd which sectors to mark as deleted. GC is the thing that actually cleans the ssd of blocks marked for deletion.

there is no government board that decides how to use words, so there is often disagreement about what they mean, that being said:

GC is normally used to mean that the drive's firmware will scan known FS (typically FAT and NTFS), find out which files have been deleted (by looking at the file system data), and then mark their sectors as free.

I have never seen it used by anyone before you just now to refer to the internal management of free/used blocks and sectors (that has no official name)

I am now using kingston 64GB SSD, SNV425-S2, which is a lot faster than my older WD 6400AAKS.

The SNV425 uses the Jmicron 618, which, while much much slower than other SSDs, is still faster than spindle drives.
The older Jmicron 602 are actually SLOWER than spindle drives, and are what I was referring to when I said "crappy"... yours is just merely "sub-par"...
there are much better SSDs out there and there is no reason not to buy them instead since their price is so similar. But indeed the 618 will be faster than a spindle drive.

 

[Hacp]

there is no government board that decides how to use words, so there is often disagreement about what they mean, that being said:

GC is normally used to mean that the drive's firmware will scan known FS (typically FAT and NTFS), find out which files have been deleted (by looking at the file system data), and then mark their sectors as free.

I have never seen it used by anyone before you just now to refer to the internal management of free/used blocks and sectors (that has no official name)



The SNV425 uses the Jmicron 618, which, while much much slower than other SSDs, is still faster than spindle drives.
The older Jmicron 602 are actually SLOWER than spindle drives, and are what I was referring to when I said "crappy"... yours is just merely "sub-par"...
there are much better SSDs out there and there is no reason not to buy them instead since their price is so similar. But indeed the 618 will be faster than a spindle drive.

Look at the literature. SSD firmware knows that a file has been deleted if the OS overwrites a 'deleted' file. That is not garbage collection. TRIM lets the OS tell the firmware that the files you marked as deleted are actually deleted(without the OS having to overwrite the file). Garbage collection is cleaning "deleted" blocks.

Here is the link to a paper Anand used in one of his first ssd articles. It defined "garbage collection" and went on to explain various algorithms for garbage collection.

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.154.8668&rep=rep1&type=pdf

 

[loimlo]

The SNV425 uses the Jmicron 618, which, while much much slower than other SSDs, is still faster than spindle drives.
The older Jmicron 602 are actually SLOWER than spindle drives, and are what I was referring to when I said "crappy"... yours is just merely "sub-par"...
there are much better SSDs out there and there is no reason not to buy them instead since their price is so similar. But indeed the 618 will be faster than a spindle drive.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2968/...30gb-ssdnow-v-series-battle-of-the-125-ssds/1

Judging by Anandtech's review of Toshiba's variant of JMF618, I kind of doubt your opinion about "much much slower than other SSDs." At least, it was competent enough in its class. Besides, I bought this Kingston much much cheaper than C300/Sandforce way back half a year ago in my country. Frankly, Kingston should be more of an upgarde from a HDD than a Sandforce would be an upgrade from this Kingston.

If price is low enough, this SSD is a very good foothold for people wanting SSD-like performance without going huge mark-up or utterly small capacity. From my experience, I'm hard pressed to notice the Firefox launch time difference between Intel G2 SSD and Kingston SSD. That said, I'd purchase a C300/Sandforce if their price/capacity is more or less the same as Kingston, but I'm afraid it's not in my country.......

 

[taltamir]

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2968/...30gb-ssdnow-v-series-battle-of-the-125-ssds/1

Judging by Anandtech's review of Toshiba's variant of JMF618, I kind of doubt your opinion about "much much slower than other SSDs."

go to page 6 of same review: http://www.anandtech.com/show/2968/...30gb-ssdnow-v-series-battle-of-the-125-ssds/6

Look at random reads and writes, look at the JMF618 on those charts, see where it falls compared to intel, sandforce, and the C300.

Besides, I bought this Kingston much much cheaper than C300/Sandforce way back half a year ago in my country

good for you, then you got a good deal. normally they are not much cheaper.

but I'm afraid it's not in my country.......

And this explains it, price varies greatly from one country to another. It is entirely possible that in your country that JMF618 based SSD is much cheaper than sandforce/C300, to the point of being a better deal.

Frankly, Kingston should be more of an upgarde from a HDD than a Sandforce would be an upgrade from this Kingston.

Kingston rebrands a variety of SSDs, please refer to it as the JMF618 or at least jmicron for clarity. Kingston sells Jmicron, Toshiba, Samsung, and Intel SSDs.
And yes, it is a bigger difference going from spindle disk to JMF618 than it is going from JMF618 to sandforce... but the price difference is much smaller for the latter, you are already paying a bundle, and as I said "sub-par" not "crappy"

 

[loimlo]

You can turn a few pages to Anandtech Storage Bench for more real-world like performance. Over there, Intel wasn't a solid win over Kingston. They seemed to favor different usage patterns. Frankly speaking, I think you've put too many emphases on synthetic benchmark rather than real-world application. After all, we bought SSD for use rather than bench! As I said before, I'm hard pressed to notice the difference of Firefox launch time between Intel G2 SSD and Kingston SSD.

Intel is an overall better SSD product compared to Kingston-Jmicron, but Intel doesn't best Kingston-Jmicron in every aspect!