Kitguru : Nvidia to release three GeForce GTX 800 graphics cards this October

[Cookie Monster]

Performance rumours have left me abit disappointed since its been awhile since we've had a huge jump in the performance department..

But then again, if it performs around a GTX780Ti, while providing 4GB of vram, MSRP of $499 (vs $699 of the Ti) and perhaps other goodies like extra features/low power figures it won't be a failure either. For those with 680/670s, it could be a good upgrade.

Im more interested if the GM204 has had any attention on high res performance..

 

[Deders]

Im more interested if the GM204 has had any attention on high res performance..

I assumed Nvidia would be doing something for 4k sooner or later, hard to see with only a 256bit memory bus. I wonder if they have implemented any kind of compression like with the 285.

 

[poohbear]

What about those of us with gtx 670 sli? Will there be anything from highend maxwell series that'll provide better performance while being reaspnably priced? I'd want something a little faster than gtx 670 sli with lower wattage, 4gb VRAM, & @ $450 price point in a single card... or is that too unreasonable?

 

[3DVagabond]

It's got to be very difficult for both nVidia and AMD being stuck so long on 28nm. When these chips were conceived 4-5 years ago, I'm sure TSMC was promising 20nm or even 14nm by now. I think this more than anything is what the performance bottleneck is.

 

[Wild Thing]

I believe its more of an "economies of scale" thing.
Both companies spend vast sums on developing new architectures on new lithography.
Updating an existing chip and benefiting from such production economies is probably a very high priority for them.

 

[tviceman]

Ok got it, also good read for me on your post and the newer predictions vs. your older 30% prediction. Do you know or have any predictions in your opinion on the core count along with the 400mm^2 GPU size.

I think it will have 4x as many cores as GM107, just like GK104 had over G107 and GF114 had over GF107.

 

[dangerman1337]

I assumed Nvidia would be doing something for 4k sooner or later, hard to see with only a 256bit memory bus. I wonder if they have implemented any kind of compression like with the 285.

I think they'll have a Titan 2 GM200 at least in Q1/Q2 2015 but not sure a 780ti/780 Maxwell equivalent (maybe a 985/990?) with a 384-bit bus on 28nm (Eyrines on Beyond3d has just said it'll be 560mm squared: http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1871396&postcount=1931 and I trust him over anyone else since he was the one who said GM20x was going to be on 28nm).

Though for anything remotely not a Titan brand I don't think we'll see anything capable pull 60 frames on current-generation/upcoming games at higher settings on 4k until Pascal and AMD equivalent on a single card/affordable-ish setup.

 

[tviceman]

Yikes! Not sure why so hostile. Titans were a lot faster than 680s, big upgrade, but way overpriced. I made money selling them and buying 780 Classifieds and then used an EVGA stepup to go to 780tis at not cost.

Now that we have the history lesson out of the way...

I don't think you'll see many people running high end rigs with 780tis, Titans, 780s dropping them for a card that isn't faster - and if so - probably will be slower at high resolutions because of a 256bit bus and with the hassle of the actual upgrade with switching hardware... all just to save a $2 a month on their power bill.

It is what it is. Hopefully it doesn't pan out this way, but gtx 980=gtx 780ti=epic fail.

Didn't mean to sound hostile. You just can't resist upgrading, even if not immediately, when there is something better out. Even if 980 is a wash performance wise, you could run 3 980's for better performance and equal power consumption... plus you'd have new toys to tweak and play with.

 

[FatherMurphy]

I'd like the 980 to be faster than the 780ti, but even if it simply matches it, at $500, Nvidia is at least moving the performance/$ metric forward. Not to mention it would likely achieve that performance more efficiently (giving us quieter cards). I don't think that would be a failure, if we keep in mind that GM204 is ultimately going to be the mid-range Maxwell chip and followed up (hopefully within 6 months or so) by GM200/210.

 

[tviceman]

It might be a great chip with nothing else on the market that can compare to it on a technical level, but it will be a disappointment in name if it can't outperform a gtx 780 TI.

 

[BrightCandle]

The genuine performance improvements aren't going to come until there is sufficient improvements in the silicon process to allow vastly more transistors. This stop gap card of the new architecture on the old process is just that, a temporary solution while they await a better silicon process from TSMC. The cards might end up better value or whatever but its still just another refresh card.

 

[Kippa]

I think they'll have a Titan 2 GM200 at least in Q1/Q2 2015 but not sure a 780ti/780 Maxwell equivalent (maybe a 985/990?) with a 384-bit bus on 28nm (Eyrines on Beyond3d has just said it'll be 560mm squared: http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1871396&postcount=1931 and I trust him over anyone else since he was the one who said GM20x was going to be on 28nm).

Though for anything remotely not a Titan brand I don't think we'll see anything capable pull 60 frames on current-generation/upcoming games at higher settings on 4k until Pascal and AMD equivalent on a single card/affordable-ish setup.

Do you think that it is a possibility that if there is a Titan II that it might be 28nm based, or do you think they will wait for 20nm for doing that beast? Personally I'd expect a significant performance upgrade for a Titan II being more than at least 30% increase in performance over a Titan I to warrant an upgrade.

 

[JDG1980]

Here are my predictions based on what's been leaked and speculated so far. All of this, of course, could prove to be completely wrong.

GTX 980: $499. TDP of 200 watts. Fully enabled GM204. Performance on most applications will be better than the GTX 780, but not as good as the GTX 780 Ti. Much lower power consumption, though. A few outliers will show worse performance than GTX 780 due to the reduced memory bus width.
GTX 970: $399. TDP of 160-185 watts. Cut-down GM204. In terms of performance, not quite up to snuff with the GTX 780, but much more energy-efficient.
GTX 960: $299. TDP of 100-150 watts (hard to predict with any more specificity than that). Fully enabled GM206. Will beat AMD's R9 280X (and its Tonga successor) in at least half the benchmarks, while using as little as 50% as much power. (If you don't believe that is possible on 28nm, compare the power consumption of the GTX 750 Ti to that of the R7 265 - the latter has about a 10% edge in performance, but uses twice as much juice.) Nvidia is saving this one for later because it's going to be the sweet spot for most people once it arrives. By the end of the year it will be widely considered the best deal overall (taking into account performance, cost, and efficiency) for most gamers.

 

[dangerman1337]

Do you think that it is a possibility that if there is a Titan II that it might be 28nm based, or do you think they will wait for 20nm for doing that beast? Personally I'd expect a significant performance upgrade for a Titan II being more than at least 30% increase in performance over a Titan I to warrant an upgrade.

I don't think Nvidia or AMD will ever do TSMC 20nmSoC, I think Nvidia will skip to 16nmFF and bring out a 16nmFF Pascals in 2016 (with a big Pascal/GP100 as leaked in that research paper though not in Q1/2016 as a GeForce card like some sites and people interpret) but that is just my perspective, not a leaker at all (Eyrines is the one and he's been 100% legit on Maxwell unlike WccfTech which keeps banging on 20nm for some reason.

Here are my predictions based on what's been leaked and speculated so far. All of this, of course, could prove to be completely wrong.

GTX 980: $499. TDP of 200 watts. Fully enabled GM204. Performance on most applications will be better than the GTX 780, but not as good as the GTX 780 Ti. Much lower power consumption, though. A few outliers will show worse performance than GTX 780 due to the reduced memory bus width.
GTX 970: $399. TDP of 160-185 watts. Cut-down GM204. In terms of performance, not quite up to snuff with the GTX 780, but much more energy-efficient.
GTX 960: $299. TDP of 100-150 watts (hard to predict with any more specificity than that). Fully enabled GM206. Will beat AMD's R9 280X (and its Tonga successor) in at least half the benchmarks, while using as little as 50% as much power. (If you don't believe that is possible on 28nm, compare the power consumption of the GTX 750 Ti to that of the R7 265 - the latter has about a 10% edge in performance, but uses twice as much juice.) Nvidia is saving this one for later because it's going to be the sweet spot for most people once it arrives. By the end of the year it will be widely considered the best deal overall (taking into account performance, cost, and efficiency) for most gamers.

Reasonable but I think you are pesstimistic a bit with the 970 and 980, I think the 970 will beat the 780 and the 980 the 780ti by a bit but high resolutions (4k at least but maybe start showing at 2560x1440) will be very close or equal IMO. I'll bet the 980 will be an excellent 1080p card that'll play games max settings with SMAA at 60FPS for the near future hopefully. But not enough to push things at a higher resolution or something like the Oculus Rift CV1 where it'll start to falter, Nvidia will release a GM200 Titan 2 or maybe a 985 or 990 (if latter Dual GPU could be 995?) at least but will be more of a 8TFlop card thing rather than a 20nm monster that we hopped for (too bad TSMC screwed up their 20nm HP process).

 

[realibrad]

This is incorrect. Take a look at this

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/1127?vs=1130

and this even

http://www.techspot.com/review/783-geforce-gtx-750-ti-vs-radeon-r7-265/page11.html

The 750 Ti is more efficient no doubt, but double is wrong, as it is usually 20-50% more efficient when compared to a 265.

 

[Silverforce11]

Those prices are a bit low given that NV got away with selling GK104 for $500+, expecting GM104 to be $499 is a bit optimistic.

As for performance, not sure why some people expect it to beat 780ti, it's a midrange Maxwell on the same node. IF it could outright beat the 780ti, then its GG for AMD since the perf/mm2 and perf/w leap would be massive for the same node, it would stomp all over AMD on 20nm.

 

[sontin]

It depends on the die size. With around 400mm^2 they will easily beat a GTX780TI.
With around 300mm^2 they will only catch it.

 

[96Firebird]

MSRP at launch was $499 for the 680, and I don't remember it going any higher than that. However, that was a 294mm^2 chip with 2GB GDDR5.

Edit - But then again, that was when 28nm was fairly new. They are now selling the same chip for $300, less if you include the cut down version.

 

[exar333]

Really hoping we see some reliable leaks or specs soon. This is killing me. Trying to decide to buy now or wait...

 

[Mand]

Really hoping we see some reliable leaks or specs soon. This is killing me. Trying to decide to buy now or wait...

At least wait a couple weeks for their big event.

 

[xpea]

http://www.guru3d.com/news-story/geforce-gtx-980-starts-listing-in-pricewatch-engines.html

Chip: GM104 "Maxwell"
Memory: 4 GB GDDR5, 256bit
Shader units / TMU / ROP: 2560/160/64
Fab: 28nm

if (and it's a big IF) these specs are true, and knowing that Maxwell shader units are ~30% faster than Kepler, GTX980 may finally be easily beat 780Ti

fingers crossed...

 

[tviceman]

http://www.guru3d.com/news-story/geforce-gtx-980-starts-listing-in-pricewatch-engines.html


if (and it's a big IF) these specs are true, and knowing that Maxwell shader units are ~30% faster than Kepler, GTX980 may finally be easily beat 780Ti

fingers crossed...

Depends on how much that L2 cache benefits GM204. GM107 was ~70-75% faster at the same TDP and bandwidth over GK107 (GTX 750 TI vs. GTX 650). If Nvidia achieves that same perf/watt, and GM204 has roughly the same average power consumption as GK104, then it should end up ~15% faster. I think that's reasonable. I think 1440p+ is going to end up with GM204 being 10% faster than 780 TI, making it roughly ~25% faster than the r9 290x with a smaller die size and much, much smaller power envelope.

EDIT: Btw, those specs are the most likely specs, except for the ROP's, so that leak could be just guessing based on the most common and logical spec guess available.

 

[AtenRa]

Chip: GM104 "Maxwell"
Memory: 4 GB GDDR5, 256bit
Shader units / TMU / ROP: 2560/160/64
Fab: 28nm

Decoupled ROPs from Memory Channels at 2 to 1 ?? Very interesting if true, Tahiti had the opposite.

Tahiti
32ROPs, 384-bit memory

 

[raghu78]

Decoupled ROPs from Memory Channels at 2 to 1 ?? Very interesting if true, Tahiti had the opposite.

Tahiti
32ROPs, 384-bit memory

Or 16 ROPs in each ROP partition attached to a 64 bit memory controller for a total of 64 ROPs on a 256 bit memory controller. GM204 could still sport a coupled ROP design. GK104 proved that a coupled design works very well. Nvidia would not mess with that.

 

[Fastx]

Date 9-5-2014

Geforce GTX 980 Alleged Benchmark and TDP Surfaces – Just 170W for ~110% 780 Ti Performance

http://wccftech.com/geforce-gtx-980-alleged-benchmark-tdp-170w/#ixzz3CXlnf766