[kitguru] Return rate of GeForce GTX 970 after memory scandal is below 5%

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Shehriazad

Senior member
Nov 3, 2014
555
2
46
Most gamers simply don't care enough. 3.5Gigs at full speed still is massive...something that the majority of games even in 4K will not yet fill up. (Before you get all angry at me..I said majority, not "all"..some terribly optimized game might reach that value)

By the time a bigger portion of the games reaches this value in 4K...the 970 will likely be so outdated that it no longer matters.

And let's not forget that 1080P is still (quite obviously) the most used resolution....sure Nvidia "lied" to us with their Vram...but in the real world this doesn't even matter.


And as long as Nvidia doesn't pull an ultra troll and does the same to their 2GB cards....all is well for now. The people returning the card seem just like a bunch of people that complain for the sake of complaining. You actually got the PERFORMANCE that you paid for so the ROP issue is not an issue. And the Vram? Like I said...until the majority of games reach that value the card is gonna be too weak, anyway.
 
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garagisti

Senior member
Aug 7, 2007
592
7
81
Most gamers simply don't care enough. 3.5Gigs at full speed still is massive...something that the majority of games even in 4K will not yet fill up. (Before you get all angry at me..I said majority, not "all"..some terribly optimized game might reach that value)

By the time a bigger portion of the games reaches this value in 4K...the 970 will likely be so outdated that it no longer matters.

And let's not forget that 1080P is still (quite obviously) the most used resolution....sure Nvidia "lied" to us with their Vram...but in the real world this doesn't even matter.


And as long as Nvidia doesn't pull an ultra troll and does the same to their 2GB cards....all is well for now. The people returning the card seem just like a bunch of people that complain for the sake of complaining. You actually got the PERFORMANCE that you paid for so the ROP issue is not an issue. And the Vram? Like I said...until the majority of games reach that value the card is gonna be too weak, anyway.
Well, most people do use their cards for 2 years or more. May be you're not in that category, but most of the people who buy discrete cards, buy them to play more than the few games being reviewed, a lot of them like having a card that can play some future games too and without issues. Sure 970 will play some games, but behaviour isn't very predictable, and i'm sure that knowing as much makes a lot of people grit their teeth.

I will suggest that your tone against people returning their cards is unnecessarily harsh.
 

guskline

Diamond Member
Apr 17, 2006
5,338
476
126
I received my FULL refund from Newegg today for my GTX 970.

I sent it back because at the time of purchase, I did not receive the card that was advertised.
 
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Elixer

Lifer
May 7, 2002
10,376
762
126
What's amazing is that NV is doing absolutely nothing which suggests they feel no remorse to their customers whatsoever and no responsibility as a corporation. That to me will be remembered by a lot of gamers who follow the industry. This is almost blatant arrogance by NV and that type of thinking that "well we don't care since you'll only buy our cards anyway" will hurt NV's brand far more than the adverse performance and marketing spec errors of the 970. Even when GM200 releases and even if it performs well, the fact that NV did absolutely nothing to show their fault will still be remembered.

Not really amazing, when you see such tepid statements about what went on, and how basically people shouldn't worry about it.
The $$$ of advertising and sending sites cards is just too big of a prize to get on nvidia's bad side.

Some people don't like getting lied to, whether it was intentional or not.
Other people don't care.

Highly doubt it is possible to change either person's mind on this subject.

I received my FULL refund from Newegg today for my GTX 970.

I sent it back because at the time of purchase, I did not receive the card that was advertised.

Congrats!
 
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Spanners

Senior member
Mar 16, 2014
325
1
0
Most gamers simply don't care enough. 3.5Gigs at full speed still is massive...something that the majority of games even in 4K will not yet fill up. (Before you get all angry at me..I said majority, not "all"..some terribly optimized game might reach that value)

By the time a bigger portion of the games reaches this value in 4K...the 970 will likely be so outdated that it no longer matters.

And let's not forget that 1080P is still (quite obviously) the most used resolution....sure Nvidia "lied" to us with their Vram...but in the real world this doesn't even matter.


And as long as Nvidia doesn't pull an ultra troll and does the same to their 2GB cards....all is well for now. The people returning the card seem just like a bunch of people that complain for the sake of complaining. You actually got the PERFORMANCE that you paid for so the ROP issue is not an issue. And the Vram? Like I said...until the majority of games reach that value the card is gonna be too weak, anyway.

I don't think it's fair to say any game that uses 4GB is terribly optimised. People seem to equate bad optimisation with any game that doesn't perform to a specific expectation they have.

I have zero problem if people are still happy with their 970 after this undisclosed information came to light. Why do you want to paint people as complainers for complainers sake if they aren't happy with their cards or just on principle want to return them? I don't feel the need to imply that people who are still happy need not be, why the opposite? Also as many people have said who knows the impact this will have in future titles.
 

rgallant

Golden Member
Apr 14, 2007
1,361
11
81
Most gamers simply don't care enough. 3.5Gigs at full speed still is massive...something that the majority of games even in 4K will not yet fill up. (Before you get all angry at me..I said majority, not "all"..some terribly optimized game might reach that value)

By the time a bigger portion of the games reaches this value in 4K...the 970 will likely be so outdated that it no longer matters.

And let's not forget that 1080P is still (quite obviously) the most used resolution....sure Nvidia "lied" to us with their Vram...but in the real world this doesn't even matter.


And as long as Nvidia doesn't pull an ultra troll and does the same to their 2GB cards....all is well for now. The people returning the card seem just like a bunch of people that complain for the sake of complaining. You actually got the PERFORMANCE that you paid for so the ROP issue is not an issue. And the Vram? Like I said...until the majority of games reach that value the card is gonna be too weak, anyway.[/QUOTE]

you have proof for any of that nonsense?

but in the real world this doesn't even matter.
yea 970 sli stuttering in games is not real world or maybe not your small one.
 

Shehriazad

Senior member
Nov 3, 2014
555
2
46
Most gamers simply don't care enough. 3.5Gigs at full speed still is massive...something that the majority of games even in 4K will not yet fill up. (Before you get all angry at me..I said majority, not "all"..some terribly optimized game might reach that value)

By the time a bigger portion of the games reaches this value in 4K...the 970 will likely be so outdated that it no longer matters.

And let's not forget that 1080P is still (quite obviously) the most used resolution....sure Nvidia "lied" to us with their Vram...but in the real world this doesn't even matter.


And as long as Nvidia doesn't pull an ultra troll and does the same to their 2GB cards....all is well for now. The people returning the card seem just like a bunch of people that complain for the sake of complaining. You actually got the PERFORMANCE that you paid for so the ROP issue is not an issue. And the Vram? Like I said...until the majority of games reach that value the card is gonna be too weak, anyway.[/QUOTE]

you have proof for any of that nonsense?

but in the real world this doesn't even matter.
yea 970 sli stuttering in games is not real world or maybe not your small one.

You're honestly questioning if FullHD is still the most used PC gamer resolution or not? Look at the most used GPUs and you know that most people are definitely not running stuff in 1440 or 2160P.

On stat sites (just google for used resolutions) the usage for 1080P Monitors is between 9-13%...but those sites count in all kinds of displays including TVs, Laptops and Tablets...but that value makes it pretty clear that its clearly the most used resolution by PC gamers. (Obviously excluding laptops since y'now...they're laptops)

As for the ram usage...games like Crysis 3 and BF4 use around 3gig Vram WITH 4xAA enabled...that said the 970 only runs 4K games like that with such settings at 30-40 fps with it sometimes even dropping below 30. (And SLI doesn't double the framerate either)
So my argument stands...by the time a MAJORITY of the games visibly push through the 3.5G mark on a regular basis...the 970 WILL be far too weak to handle those games. Because if you buy a 4K Monitor...you are not going to be a person that will accept playing games at 20 fps quite clearly.



And stuttering is an entirely different issue...an issue that SLI and Crossfire always had to fight with on an on and off basis...which is why I avoid multi GPU setups in general if I can.
 
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raghu78

Diamond Member
Aug 23, 2012
4,093
1,475
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So if you are a champion of ethics, then morally you should never recommend NVIDIA to anyone. Secondly, that 10-15% figure is misleading because you selectively cherry pick results. It's not hard to find benchmarks out there that show the 980 blowing away the 290x.

misleading. thats about as accurate as RS or anybody can be. the perf gap is approximately 10% at 1440p and 15% at 1080p. its you who is cherrypicking. did you see the latest reviews.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Gigabyte/GTX_960_G1_Gaming/28.html
http://www.sweclockers.com/recension/19925-geforce-gtx-960-fran-asus-gigabyte-och-msi/17#pagehead
http://gamegpu.ru/test-video-cards/igry-2014-goda-protiv-sovremennykh-videokart.html
 
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rgallant

Golden Member
Apr 14, 2007
1,361
11
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http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technology/dsr/technology
you know the 970 can use DSR so what res is a 1080 at now for any 970 user?

see post 81
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/nvidia-gtx-970-problems-this-isnt-acceptable.209416/page-4

"The problem isn't just that the framerates go down more than they should, but primarily the huge stuttering and frametime inconsistencies additionally. DSR is both a standard feature on these cards, and a 100% accurate way to test this issue."


546x437.


This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 544x264.



looks like 780sli 3 gb were not even working in the last bench
970sli drops off petty good

yea so any time nv neffs vram it gets my attention
 

ChuckFx

Member
Nov 12, 2013
162
0
76
Because most educated people know its a non-issue.

It is a troubling issue, lying like that then not even making a statement, you are deeply wrong. True, it will not affect much in performance but it is a dangerous zone, permitting a company to get away with such lies..
 

Eymar

Golden Member
Aug 30, 2001
1,646
14
91
False advertising? The education system must be teaching differently these days.

Yeah, the false advertising thing is no big deal /sarcasm. I really hope we don't leave it to the UK to fight all our consumer battles.
 

ocre

Golden Member
Dec 26, 2008
1,594
7
81
What about Geforce forums where people are complaining that they're beyond return dates? What about hardforums? What about forums at guru3d where people are complaining the same? For what it is worth, i've seen more people wanting to return the card, than to keep it. Yes, there are undeniably some of those who want to keep it, but if you go to each forum, it is clear that a good number of people who're aware want to return/ get a free or paid upgrade.

By the way, a lot of those posts where people are mulling to keep it, were before the price reduction on 290x. At one time, i was still recommending 970. Now though, one would have to be mostly playing Gameworks titles, rather flush with funds and not care about future games, or ahem, of questionable levels of intelligence to buy a 970 over a custom 290x which you can find cheaper. I recommended a card yesterday in another thread, and it was $310 before $20 discount and $30 mail in rebate (for a total of $260, great gaming card really).

Those nvidia threads were full of mostly the same people posting over and over and over..
You can also find some of these same people posting the same stuff on tech forums.

As a person who owned the gtx970 and used DSR, played games at over 3500mb, I will tell people that the performance of a 970 is very strong and going thru the hassle of sending back may not be worth it. Even the 980 isn't that much better.

I have used DSR and modern games, I know where my gtx970 would become overwhelmed but better still, I now know that these settings were just too much because they cause the 980 to struggle to.

I cannot speak about SLI but I know first hand all about the 970. Had it for a couple months and am addicted to DSR.

I think people that never had a 970 have little say in the matter. But you will find them complaining the loudest.

If anyone is upset, they have every right to. But suggesting they all should send their cards back for relatively little to no gain? Makes little sense to go without your graphics card and go thru a hassle just to get a card that performs similar in the end.

If you have hard feelings, just vote with your wallet next round. The 970 is still very powerful and currently there isn't anything that much better. So going thru the hassle of a return isn't gonna get u a much better card. I took my 970 back because I am not one to sit around and whine over things. If I have a problem, I take care of it and move on. Bestbuy only offered me an in store exchange for my going on two month old 970. My only option was a 980, but I was sure this memory issue was causing me to not be able to use 4x DSR. WRONG

Those settings that cause my 970 to struggle also cause the 980 to struggle. Of course the 980 has more power. But playing on it, I have to use a fps overlay to tell. Those extreme settings unplayable on the 970 just aren't smooth on a 980 either. So there is really not much chance a 290x will be a world of difference here.

Look. It takes some time to find a case where the 970 is unplayable because of its VRAM and a 980 will be perfectly fine. For the most part, like the real everyday world, the performance isn't the big deal that is being made over it. When I took back my 970, money really wasnt an issue to me. I had no problem paying the extra money for a 980 but I don't expect there are many 970 owners who would have ever been willing spend that much more for a 980. They made the choice and wasnt in the market for any other card.

But now here they are, feeling lied to. But sending your card back and doing without until you can finally buy another card that performs similar to the one sent back, no wonder not many are jumping on the returns. If it really upsets people, vote with your wallet when there is a lot more to gain. When there actually are GPUs that are worth upgrading to. Sending cards back now is a lot of hassle, wasted time, and possibly money.......just for a side grade.
 

Gikaseixas

Platinum Member
Jul 1, 2004
2,836
218
106
I think people that never had a 970 have little say in the matter. But you will find them complaining the loudest.

Happens all the time. You can find the same behavior when the discussion is FX, APU, 970, Pentium, ARM, Broadwell, AMD, Nvidia, etc... don't you agree?
 

Gikaseixas

Platinum Member
Jul 1, 2004
2,836
218
106
False advertising

That's the only issue i have because the card itself is still a beast. I wouldn't return it because in my case i don't play at settings that would push the vram to it's limits, but i understand people who returned it because of various reasons.
 

amenx

Diamond Member
Dec 17, 2004
4,012
2,284
136
For the $350 I paid for the 970, couldnt care less. It serves me beyond my needs for now and I believe for next 2 years (no 4k for me). However I would be upset if something like this happened in a $30,000 purchase, like a car. But pretty sure I would get over it pretty quick if it still runs well within the scope of my needs, as long as its resale value is not damaged by the issue. Personal well being to me is more important to me than wasting my energies over trivial stuff, and a sub-500 clams GPU as far as I'm concerned belongs in that category.
 

Leyawiin

Diamond Member
Nov 11, 2008
3,204
52
91
I don't think a 5% return rate is out of line for any retail product of any kind. If you haunt hardware forums you're going to get a skewed view of how much concern there is about the misleading specs.
 
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ocre

Golden Member
Dec 26, 2008
1,594
7
81
Happens all the time. You can find the same behavior when the discussion is FX, APU, 970, Pentium, ARM, Broadwell, AMD, Nvidia, etc... don't you agree?

I am guilty of posting and having an opinion on things that don't directly effect me. But that's not really what I am mean. Everyone should have an opinion and are entitled to speak of it. But I am talking about these same people who to on and on about it, posting in thread after thread, post after post, throwing up charts and their interpretations of them to no end.

These people that have no stake it the matter but want to make the biggest stink. The worse part is that there might be some people who are really upset with all this. They are lost in the middle of the mud slinging.

I just want to say first hand, the hassle of returning your GPU may not be worth it. I was able to pull out the 970 and install the 980 the very same day. My downtime was a few hours tops. An inconvenience, sure. But I learned something out of all this. Those few extra fps on the charts that the 980 has over the 970, it amounts to a small real world difference. So this means that all these gpus, from the 290(x),970, to 980......they all perform really really similar. 10-15% is as small of a difference as it seems.

Of course there are people out there who want to make a move out of pure principle, just to satisfy their frustration with nvidia. They may want to move to AMD straight away out of spite. I totally support that. Sure there are those people like me, who are not strapped for cash and just want a card with the specs they thought they bought. These are not the people that my msg is to. Do what you want to do. That's how I alway feel.

I just want to let those unsure that just be mindful. Through all that effort, the only options right now basically ending up with a side grade. If you just want to return the card out of principle, I fully support that decision. That's why I returned mine. But now I have a unique perspective that I think is worth sharing. There are those that have no other cards to play on when they send off their 970, they may be unsure what they should do. This is why I am sharing my experience.

When I see that Jon peddle reports less than 5% returned their 970s, I totally understand why. Most people who pull their cards out, have nothing to put back in their PC. Most people that are using their 970s, aren't pushing their cards to the very limit just to watch it stutter and complain about it. Surely the ones that think they have been duped are upset and angry. They have every darn right to be. But as a person who went from the 979 to the 980, I found these ultra high settings and over 2x DSR to be too demanding in general. That the 970 stutters, but the 980 struggles at these settings too. That is very very important to realize.

I now know for sure that the 980 isn't even powerful enough for the settings I want to play. It's these new games and new features like DSR, they take a lot of horsepower. It is just unrealistic with even my 980. And this is the case. There are sites trying to exploit the memory issue and pushing these cards to the extreme edge. And just about everyone that test with other cards show clearly that even the 980 struggles with those settings too. Even if it is not as bad, its still not pleasant. Surely people know this: anything causing the 980 to struggle will cause the 970 to struggle that much worse. The 980 is on paper, at least 25% more powerful than a 970. But in the real world, they usually perform 10-15% apart. But the fact is, the 980 has 123% more cuda cores and a higher clock speed. That's undeniable.

The 970 is still a great performer and a lot of the time the 980 is only 10-12% faster while having 125% the specs. This is the real world. This is why going thru all the hassle of return/refund may not be worth it to many people. Because there just isn't that much better right now.

I support anyone sending their cards back but I also want people to know what I found out. Anything that caused my 970 to be unplayable, those settings aren't practical on the 980 either. For 95% of people out there, this is exactly the case.

People upset with being misled, you might be better off voting with your wallet when cards that are a real upgrade come out. Cards like the 390(x) or whatever it may be called.
 

Jhatfie

Senior member
Jan 20, 2004
749
2
81
I personally do not have a problem with the GTX 970 and it's performance. As a single card solution, it is solid. However I do have a problem with the misrepresented specs that DID impact my gaming when I purchased them for SLI. Then when Nvidia had the audacity to be nonchalant about their deception really reminds me what a douchebag company they are. I buy only about 25-30 graphics cards a year for myself and builds I do for others, so in the grand scheme of things they will not miss my business, but that being said they have lost it for now. I am sure there are others that feel as I do that may not feel compelled to return their 970 due to the effort involved, but this next gpu purchase cycle will really illustrate to what extent people are fed up as long as AMD brings a compelling product.
 

flexy

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
8,464
155
106
An inconvenience, sure. But I learned something out of all this. Those few extra fps on the charts that the 980 has over the 970, it amounts to a small real world difference. So this means that all these gpus, from the 290(x),970, to 980......they all perform really really similar. 10-15% is as small of a difference as it seems.
You are of those people who seem to think that the only issue is that the 970 is about 15%-20% slower than the 980...or so large parts of your reply sound.

However, we KNOW that the 970 is on avg. somewhat slower than the 980, and this is not at all the issue at hand here.

The issue is a "sudden" sharp performance drop which happens only on the 970 when it hits this 3.5GB barrier, a problem the 980 doesn't have. It isn't a linear disadvantage of performance compared to the 980 but a limit for settings/resolutions etc. which for the 970 *CAN* be reached already in today's game. (DSR, ultra settings, 4K resolutions, 8xAA) etc.etc..

This makes the 970 a card with far less future than the 980, it also makes it unsuitable for SLI, multi-monitor etc. since all those things use even more memory and push this treshold down, in some cases as far as 3GB, 3.2GB where the stutters start. It also means that for every game that comes out now you would have to look at your settings and video memory usage just not to hit this barrier.

It means that things like DSR from 4K (which at first look great and are one criterion for buying such a card) look absurd IN PRACTICE when you realize that DSR from 4K and, say, some ultra_textures etc. are already hitting the video memory limit.

Just from looking at the specs of the 970 one sees "4GB" and the general understanding was that the card is "on avg. 20% slower" than the 980 and it wouldn't matter whether your game requires 3GB of memory, 3.5GB or 3.9GB. One would *think* the performance difference there more being "linear" and the alleged 4GB *suggest* there shouldn't be problems with 4K resolutions or 4K downsampling and ultra textures. (WHY ELSE would you even get such a card? DSR is advertised by Nvidia as a feature of this card and supposedly better and faster on Maxwell than on the previous cards and you would also not think that high resolutions would cause a problem since it has "4GB" right there on the box!)

And by the way...you have a lengthy post here saying in essence "the difference is not too big" YET you returned your 970..and worse...replaced it with a 980??? Sorry that your reply is...puzzling.

Again: It's not about a 15% or so performance difference, it is about a "barrier" for settings, resolutions etc, which is lower on the 970 due to less performant video memory.
 
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2is

Diamond Member
Apr 8, 2012
4,281
131
106
I'm shocked that many people actually DID return it. What do they get, pay extra for a 980? That's a damn win for NV.

If I had bought a 970, I'd be pissed at being lied to, but I wouldn't return it since its wasted time waiting for RMAs.

They have other options besides buying another NVidia card.
 

skipsneeky2

Diamond Member
May 21, 2011
5,035
1
71
By the time a bigger portion of the games reaches this value in 4K...the 970 will likely be so outdated that it no longer matters.

Maybe a horrible example but one none the less is Titanfall,i got that game to stutter,lock up then crash on my 970 when i ran Insane Textures and 2x MSAA at 1080p. I was using over 3.5gb when that happened.Some maps load less then that but others well you know.

iv'e already reverted back to Very High+4 MSAA,it's insane when you see how horrible that game looks too.Can't get pass the fact we may have other piss poor console ports even worst off coming up.

Only game so far with a issue but Very Insane and Very High look so similar i'm not exactly crying over it,its simply a observation.
 

psolord

Platinum Member
Sep 16, 2009
2,015
1,225
136
I ordered my 970 two weeks after the memory issue was known.

Didn't affect me one bit.

I have already benchmarked quite a few games and I am very happy with the performance. I have seen it beating 7950 crossfire and couldn't believe my eyes. That, coupled with the cpu overhead I have saved, is more than enough for me.

Sure it's not the most honest thing in the world, but the card performs admirably. The settings I have seen being used to make it choke, do not apply to me, so I am fine.

I sure would like a free little game though. I received like 8-10 games with my 7950cfx and these Nvidia cheap ass marketeers do not offer even one, lol.
 

Leyawiin

Diamond Member
Nov 11, 2008
3,204
52
91
I sure would like a free little game though. I received like 8-10 games with my 7950cfx and these Nvidia cheap ass marketeers do not offer even one, lol.

They don't have to sweeten the deal/bribe people quite as much to sell their cards (for whatever reason). Economics! /shrug
 

ocre

Golden Member
Dec 26, 2008
1,594
7
81
You are of those people who seem to think that the only issue is that the 970 is about 15%-20% slower than the 980...or so large parts of your reply sound.

However, we KNOW that the 970 is on avg. somewhat slower than the 980, and this is not at all the issue at hand here.

The issue is a "sudden" sharp performance drop which happens only on the 970 when it hits this 3.5GB barrier, a problem the 980 doesn't have. It isn't a linear disadvantage of performance compared to the 980 but a limit for settings/resolutions etc. which for the 970 *CAN* be reached already in today's game. (DSR, ultra settings, 4K resolutions, 8xAA) etc.etc..

This makes the 970 a card with far less future than the 980, it also makes it unsuitable for SLI, multi-monitor etc. since all those things use even more memory and push this treshold down, in some cases as far as 3GB, 3.2GB where the stutters start. It also means that for every game that comes out now you would have to look at your settings and video memory usage just not to hit this barrier.

It means that things like DSR from 4K (which at first look great and are one criterion for buying such a card) look absurd IN PRACTICE when you realize that DSR from 4K and, say, some ultra_textures etc. are already hitting the video memory limit.

Just from looking at the specs of the 970 one sees "4GB" and the general understanding was that the card is "on avg. 20% slower" than the 980 and it wouldn't matter whether your game requires 3GB of memory, 3.5GB or 3.9GB. One would *think* the performance difference there more being "linear" and the alleged 4GB *suggest* there shouldn't be problems with 4K resolutions or 4K downsampling and ultra textures. (WHY ELSE would you even get such a card? DSR is advertised by Nvidia as a feature of this card and supposedly better and faster on Maxwell than on the previous cards and you would also not think that high resolutions would cause a problem since it has "4GB" right there on the box!)

And by the way...you have a lengthy post here saying in essence "the difference is not too big" YET you returned your 970..and worse...replaced it with a 980??? Sorry that your reply is...puzzling.

Again: It's not about a 15% or so performance difference, it is about a "barrier" for settings, resolutions etc, which is lower on the 970 due to less performant video memory.

Yeah, you seem to ignore the fact that I had a gtx970 for going on 2 months. I have first hand experience with it. With DSR, with games at over 3500mb.

And if you find my situation puzzling, perhaps you should read what a wrote again, maybe even take your time with it.

I have cranked up settings that caused my 970 to crawl. I was told that the reason it was struggling is because the VRAM , ROP, cache issue. I felt misled and really wanted the specs that I thought I was buying. Bestbuy would only let me swap my 970 for something else on the shelf. The only AMD option was a 270x, that really makes sense right? No.....

So if your still not following, the reason I am in bestbuy swapping is because I am under this impression that this ram issue is causing my games to become unplayable with 4x DSR. I am being told its this huge deal. My only option at bestbuy is to get a 980 or stick with the 970. Because I am not strapped for cash and ultimately I just want to play games, I swap for a 980 and pay the difference, take the card home and install it. And guess what......

Those settings that caused my issues, those unplayable settings with the 970, the hitching and struggling.........

It's not so much better even with a 980. Those settings were just too much for my 970 to handle cause the 980 isn't able to push out a pleasant experience either.

So maybe you want to share your 970 experience here or just act like you know so much about it. I actually have first hand experiences to share and if you don't own a 970, its not meant for you anyway.
 
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