Latest deadlift competition

[Spamela]

attempt 1: 440 lbs. - easy
attempt 2: 507 lbs. - tired & didn't think i had a 3rd one left
attempt 3: 518 lbs. - form broke down. afterward my face and eyes were full of broken blood vessels (not visible in the video, though).

results: 3 for 3 and qualified for world powerlifting championships.

link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tlQQbZRu5g

stats: age 55, bodyweight 249 lbs.
for various reasons, i hadn't lifted in a meet in nearly 4 years.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I understand powerlifters sacrifice form a bit, but it hurts to watch you deadlift with your back like that on each rep. Those are impressive weights to lift overall. If your back can handle it, then kudos to you for knowing your body. I would just hate to see you blow out your intervertebral discs.

 

[brikis98]

First, congrats on some big lifts and qualifying for the powerlifting championships. Second, I gotta agree with SC: I've seen many powerlifters round their back on deadlifts - the good ones, just the thoracic vertebrae - but watching your video was a bit painful. I was just waiting for your spine to bust through the skin halfway through the lift. Of course, you're clearly a strong dude and hopefully know what your back can handle, but personally, that much rounding seems like a bad tradeoff of risk vs reward.

 

[surfsatwerk]

Killer lifts man, great job.

 

[Eric62]

Congrats.

Welcome back to the sport!

 

[coreyb]

I love the fact you're still strong as fuck in your 50's. something to look forward to as someone who's recently gotten into strength training in their 20's.

 

[Koing]

Congrats Keith!

The difference with Keith's form is his back is never straight at the start to begin with, it stays fairly rounded at the start and stays pretty much like that throughout the ROM. I was expecting a lot worse form.

Is his back was straight and then rounded that would have arguebly been worse.

Also, no points for STYLE in competition. There is no artistic intepretation. Only weight and see who can lift the most.

Koing

 

[Deeko]

Nice lifting.

I've seen a lot worse form on a lot stronger guys. Plus since its WABDL, I'm assuming that's a suit you're wearing, not a singlet. They don't make it easy to have textbook form. Looked fine to me.

Then again I'm the guy with the injured back.

 

[Spamela]

Nice lifting.

I've seen a lot worse form on a lot stronger guys. Plus since its WABDL, I'm assuming that's a suit you're wearing, not a singlet. They don't make it easy to have textbook form. Looked fine to me.

Then again I'm the guy with the injured back.

it's a suit, but it doesn't do much except crush my abdomen when i'm in the hole (i'm not saying the form would be great in a singlet). i don't get back injuries very often (& mainly while squatting).

I love the fact you're still strong as fuck in your 50's. something to look forward to as someone who's recently gotten into strength training in their 20's.

you have to adjust training & expectations as you get older. i get inspired by the guys in their 70's and 80's & there are some incredibly strong dudes in their 60's.

 

[brikis98]

The difference with Keith's form is his back is never straight at the start to begin with, it stays fairly rounded at the start and stays pretty much like that throughout the ROM. I was expecting a lot worse form.

Is his back was straight and then rounded that would have arguebly been worse.

I don't think this is accurate. As discussed in Spine Mechanics for Lifters, it is not the way the spine moves that causes problems (although it may add to them), but merely the fact that it is rounded is a problem in and of itself. "A fully flexed spine inactivates back extensors, loads the posterior passive tissues (ligaments), and results in high shearing forces." The sheer force in particular tends to be the biggest problem as the spine has a lower tolerance for it and this force increases dramatically (5x) for rounded spine. Of course, everyone's spine will have a different threshold for just how much sheer force it can withstand - I suspect Spamela's is rather high - so it's not as black and white as "rounded back = injury". Still, it ultimately comes down to a risk vs. reward tradeoff. My personal take is that I only get one spine and the amount of back rounding he's exhibiting increases the risk of serious injury far beyond what I'd consider acceptable in the name of sport. Obviously, each person will need to decide for themselves.

 

[Koing]

I don't think this is accurate. As discussed in Spine Mechanics for Lifters, it is not the way the spine moves that causes problems (although it may add to them), but merely the fact that it is rounded is a problem in and of itself. "A fully flexed spine inactivates back extensors, loads the posterior passive tissues (ligaments), and results in high shearing forces." The sheer force in particular tends to be the biggest problem as the spine has a lower tolerance for it and this force increases dramatically (5x) for rounded spine. Of course, everyone's spine will have a different threshold for just how much sheer force it can withstand - I suspect Spamela's is rather high - so it's not as black and white as "rounded back = injury". Still, it ultimately comes down to a risk vs. reward tradeoff. My personal take is that I only get one spine and the amount of back rounding he's exhibiting increases the risk of serious injury far beyond what I'd consider acceptable in the name of sport. Obviously, each person will need to decide for themselves.

Agreed, just that you will rarely see really big weights lifted with perfect form...my 200kg DL my back is bolt straight...my back is very weak when rounded as I never OLift with a rounded back.

But for DL it's mechanically advantageous to lift with a rounded back as oppose to a bolt straight back. Yes it loads the back much MUCH more though...I rarely ever DL heavy though

It's funny you posted the crossfit link. When they are doing OLifts for reps I've seen p!ss poor form with their back all over the shop. Granted the weight is lighter but they are doing a ridiculous amount of reps and the forms falling to pieces. A season OLifters form wouldn't hold up much after A LOT of reps.

Different horses for courses. Crossfit guys are well rounded though. I beat a bunch of them in a strong man comp

Gymnasts also get a lot of f0cked backs from the amount of time they spend rotating. Very rounded shoulders also...but absolute athletical freaks.

Koing

 

[brikis98]

Agreed, just that you will rarely see really big weights lifted with perfect form...my 200kg DL my back is bolt straight...my back is very weak when rounded as I never OLift with a rounded back.

But for DL it's mechanically advantageous to lift with a rounded back as oppose to a bolt straight back. Yes it loads the back much MUCH more though...I rarely ever DL heavy though

There is no question that some form breakdown is expected when lifting, but the question is to what extent. Again, this is a tradeoff between safety and performance, risk and reward.

It's funny you posted the crossfit link. When they are doing OLifts for reps I've seen p!ss poor form with their back all over the shop. Granted the weight is lighter but they are doing a ridiculous amount of reps and the forms falling to pieces. A season OLifters form wouldn't hold up much after A LOT of reps.

This is a common complaint against Crossfit - that it includes high rep o-lifting - and yet anecdotally, I have seen (and personally experienced) FAR more injuries from low rep & heavy weight workouts (e.g. 1RM) than the very high rep, light weight Crossfit metcons (e.g. 30 C&J for time). In both cases, technique can break down, but it seems to me that form breakdown is much more likely to cause an injury when using 85%+ of your 1RM (as in a heavy workout) than < 60% of your 1RM (as in a CF metcon). My back can usually tolerate much more rounding when I'm doing 135lb cleans (as in CF's "Grace") than when I'm doing 285lb cleans (going for a new 1RM). Of course, all of this is anecdotal, so without proper stats/study, we can only guess which is actually worse.

In the end though, it all comes back to risk vs. reward: in my best estimation, the risk of doing high rep CF workouts is lower than low rep o-lifting workouts, and the risk for both is low enough to be worth the reward of increased performance. On the other hand, I judge the risk of a heavy weight, rounded-back deadlift to not be worth the increased performance, so I avoid it.

 

[Koing]

There is no question that some form breakdown is expected when lifting, but the question is to what extent. Again, this is a tradeoff between safety and performance, risk and reward.


This is a common complaint against Crossfit - that it includes high rep o-lifting - and yet anecdotally, I have seen (and personally experienced) FAR more injuries from low rep & heavy weight workouts (e.g. 1RM) than the very high rep, light weight Crossfit metcons (e.g. 30 C&J for time). In both cases, technique can break down, but it seems to me that form breakdown is much more likely to cause an injury when using 85%+ of your 1RM (as in a heavy workout) than < 60% of your 1RM (as in a CF metcon). My back can usually tolerate much more rounding when I'm doing 135lb cleans (as in CF's "Grace") than when I'm doing 285lb cleans (going for a new 1RM). Of course, all of this is anecdotal, so without proper stats/study, we can only guess which is actually worse.

In the end though, it all comes back to risk vs. reward: in my best estimation, the risk of doing high rep CF workouts is lower than low rep o-lifting workouts, and the risk for both is low enough to be worth the reward of increased performance. On the other hand, I judge the risk of a heavy weight, rounded-back deadlift to not be worth the increased performance, so I avoid it.

Don't get me wrong mate, my back would not hold up to very little rounding due to the way it is. It's VERY weak when rounded. I always lift with a straight back, so when it's rounded it's very weak. I should argueably do a bit of rounded work to make sure it's a bit stronger when form deteriates a bit.

Some people shouldn't be going to a 1RM without adequate form period in the OLifts. I've seen terrible back wincing power/ muscle cleans on youtube by guys that have had little coaching. Looks terrible.

As a sport olifting is only 2nd to swimming in terms of safety. There are very few injuries on the whole in olifting. You get a few disolocations but the injuries are no where nears as bad as other sports.

Koing