Lawsuit help

[Beanie46]

I'm wondering about your description of the Savana.....is it a windowless van or is it a box on a van frame?

Windowless Savana van: http://www.gm.ca/images/vehicl..._sava_mode_05_main.jpg

Box on Savana van frame: http://www.equipmentready.com/.../large/THUMB_56215.jpg


If his van matches the former, I'd think the HOA has little to stand on as the van is simply a Savana without windows.

If it's the latter, though, I'd think the HOA is in a better position to win as that IS a commercial vehicle.

 

[Safeway]

It is a commercial vehicle. It is the latter, a box van, WITH LETTERING on the side!

 

[Titan]

gotta love community rules.

Communists reap what they sow.

 

[alkemyst]

how did he get a mortgage without signing an HOA Rider?

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: The Godfather

my dad's truck is the same as the neighbors, except the back of it is in a boxed shape while the neighbor is in a van shape. It is the same truck though.

That's a pretty significant difference in the eyes of people who care about such things.

And the regulations above, my dad's truck is below the weight, and passenger size of a "commercial vehicle"

That federal government definition is irrelevant. It is not the definition of commercial vehicle that trumps all others. The HOA may specify in their rules what they consider to be a commercial vehicle. Pretty much anyone who saw your dad's truck would identify it as a commercial vehicle.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Beanie46
I'm wondering about your description of the Savana.....is it a windowless van or is it a box on a van frame?

Windowless Savana van: http://www.gm.ca/images/vehicl..._sava_mode_05_main.jpg

Box on Savana van frame: http://www.equipmentready.com/.../large/THUMB_56215.jpg


If his van matches the former, I'd think the HOA has little to stand on as the van is simply a Savana without windows.

If it's the latter, though, I'd think the HOA is in a better position to win as that IS a commercial vehicle.

First one is wha this neighbor has, second one is what the OP's dad has.

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
CliffsNotes are quick, concise notes that act as a summary for a long post or article.

Short cuts for the short of mind?

Edit; OP lawyer up, it will do you a lot more good then the bad advice give to you by the posters here.

 

[jtvang125]

Dude, you're the Godfather. Just make them an offer they can't refuse.

 

[The Godfather]

Originally posted by: tk149
1. Get a lawyer, your dad is being sued.

2. Check the house sales contract. There's likely a clause in there about agreeing to comply with the HOA rules. If so, it's irrelevant that your dad didn't get the HOA rules until after he bought the house. That's his own fault for not reading everything and making sure he had all the papers. The Title Company should have warned him, if nothing else. If there's nothing in there about an HOA, then you may have a case for ignoring their rules.

3. Just guessing on this one, but it sounds like you have an HOA that contracts out parking enforcement to a company, and the HOA switched to a different enforcement company, which is when your troubles started. If so, deal directly with the HOA, not the enforcement company. The HOA is the boss here. If the HOA tells the enforcement company to stop, the company will stop. The HOA should be made up of HOMEOWNERS in the neighborhood. It's not a faceless corporation. Maybe if you invited the HOA president over for a beer, you could get this resolved easily.

4. The FMCSA definition you keep quoting might be irrelevant. It depends on the wording of the HOA rules. Have you read them yet? If not, you might want to reconsider the part about helping represent your dad in court.

5. Sounds like your dad just ignored the parking tickets. He should have used the grievance/dispute clause in the HOA rules to dispute the tickets. He can still try, and the petition signed by the neighbors can be used to help his case. Note that at this point, depending on the asnwer to point #3, you may have two different legal issues. One is with the HOA, and the other is with the enforcement company (or it's assignee).

6. The HOA Rules might give some way to appeal if he loses his case in HOA "court." Have you read the rules yet?

How do you appeal, what exactly do you do and what are the outcomes if successful? I'm not familiar with that term.

community documents:
community documents:

Boats, trailers, buses, panel trucks, trucks with a load capacity of one ton or more, vans
(excluding vans used by handicapped persons, mini-vans, or utility vehicles used as passenger
vehicles and receiving a "car" or "passenger vehicle" classification by the Georgia Department of
Motor Vehicles), recreational vehicles (RV1s and motor homes), vehicles used primarily for
commercial purposes, and vehicles with commercial writings on the exteriors other than
Sheriffs, Marshal's, or police officer's vehicles marked as such, are also prohibited from being
parked on a Lot or on the Community, except in garages or other areas approved by the Board as
parking areas for particular types of vehicles. Notwithstanding the foregoing, trucks, vans,
commercial vehicles, and vehicles with commercial writings on their exteriors shall be allowed
temporarily on the Community during normal business hours for the purpose of serving any Lot
or the Common Property; provided, however, no such vehicle shall remain on the Lot or the
Common Property overnight for any purpose unless prior written consent of the Board is first
obtained.
If any vehicle is parked on any portion of the Community in violation of this Section 9.6 i
or in violation of the Association's rules and regulations, the Board may place a notice on the
vehicle specifying the nature of the violation and stating that after 24 hours the vehicle may be
towed. The notice shall include the name and telephone number of a person to contact regarding
the alleged violation. A notice also shall be conspicuousIy placed at the Community stating the
name and telephone number of the person or entity which will do the towing. If 24 hours after
such notice is placed on the vehicle, the violation continues or thereafter occurs again within six
months of such notice, the vehicle may be towed in accordance with the notice, without further
notice to the vehicle owner or user.

 

[Vette73]

So you just posted that "panel trucks", "Vans", "vehicles used primarily for
commercial purposes", etc... are not allowed. Seems he is guility if this below is what his truck looks like...

http://www.equipmentready.com/.../large/THUMB_56215.jpg

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
Cliffs?

Cliff`s are for people who just want to be lazy!

 

[tk149]

Originally posted by: The Godfather

Originally posted by: tk149
1. Get a lawyer, your dad is being sued.

2. Check the house sales contract. There's likely a clause in there about agreeing to comply with the HOA rules. If so, it's irrelevant that your dad didn't get the HOA rules until after he bought the house. That's his own fault for not reading everything and making sure he had all the papers. The Title Company should have warned him, if nothing else. If there's nothing in there about an HOA, then you may have a case for ignoring their rules.

3. Just guessing on this one, but it sounds like you have an HOA that contracts out parking enforcement to a company, and the HOA switched to a different enforcement company, which is when your troubles started. If so, deal directly with the HOA, not the enforcement company. The HOA is the boss here. If the HOA tells the enforcement company to stop, the company will stop. The HOA should be made up of HOMEOWNERS in the neighborhood. It's not a faceless corporation. Maybe if you invited the HOA president over for a beer, you could get this resolved easily.

4. The FMCSA definition you keep quoting might be irrelevant. It depends on the wording of the HOA rules. Have you read them yet? If not, you might want to reconsider the part about helping represent your dad in court.

5. Sounds like your dad just ignored the parking tickets. He should have used the grievance/dispute clause in the HOA rules to dispute the tickets. He can still try, and the petition signed by the neighbors can be used to help his case. Note that at this point, depending on the asnwer to point #3, you may have two different legal issues. One is with the HOA, and the other is with the enforcement company (or it's assignee).

6. The HOA Rules might give some way to appeal if he loses his case in HOA "court." Have you read the rules yet?

How do you appeal, what exactly do you do and what are the outcomes if successful? I'm not familiar with that term.

<snip>

You have two ways to fight this:

1. Talk to the HOA directly. The HOA can probably get the plaintiff (either the HOA itself or the parking enforcement business) to drop the lawsuit. If it's gone to a collection agency, you're screwed. The HOA possibly has a formal procedure to follow to dispute fines. Again, becoming friends with the HOA president (or any board member) will probably fix your problem. Just because it's written in the rules, doesn't mean that the HOA has to enforce it.

2. Fight the court case. I think this is your worst option, because it's clear that you do not have a good understanding of the HOA rules. You'll need a lawyer if you want a chance of success, and lawyers ain't cheap.

From your "community documents" quote (which I will assume is direct from the HOA rules), it looks like your best legal argument is if the Georgia Department of
Motor Vehicles classes the van as a passenger vehicle. If not, I think you're screwed.

I'd guess that you have one neighbor who doesn't like you, your dad, or just seeing the van on his street. S/he complained, and that's why you've been getting tickets.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: tk149
From your "community documents" quote (which I will assume is direct from the HOA rules), it looks like your best legal argument is if the Georgia Department of
Motor Vehicles classes the van as a passenger vehicle. If not, I think you're screwed.

I don't think there's any way he can squeeze his dad's van into the HOA's rules. Even if it fits their passenger van exception, it's still prohibited as a panel truck, a vehicle used primarily for commercial purposes, and a vehicle with commercial writings on the exterior.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Connect a chain from the frame of the vehicle to the house or garage door. If they try to tow it you sue the shit out of them for damaging the house.

Whatever you do, your dad needs to put the house up for sale and get out. Living with HOA's is like living in 1930's Germany.

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Connect a chain from the frame of the vehicle to the house or garage door. If they try to tow it you sue the shit out of them for damaging the house.

Whatever you do, your dad needs to put the house up for sale and get out. Living with HOA's is like living in 1930's Germany.

Dad can sell if he likes but there will be a lein on the house before it sells from the lawyers/HOA.

He needs to kiss their butt now and hope he is not raped to much in lawyer fees, fines, and late fees.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Connect a chain from the frame of the vehicle to the house or garage door. If they try to tow it you sue the shit out of them for damaging the house.

Whatever you do, your dad needs to put the house up for sale and get out. Living with HOA's is like living in 1930's Germany.

Dad can sell if he likes but there will be a lein on the house before it sells from the lawyers/HOA.

He needs to kiss their butt now and hope he is not raped to much in lawyer fees, fines, and late fees.

Or just burn it to the ground.

BTW with a username like The Godfather, the OP isn't very God Fatherly. You should just send Vinnie and Louie to take care of the situation.

 

[MrDudeMan]

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Connect a chain from the frame of the vehicle to the house or garage door. If they try to tow it you sue the shit out of them for damaging the house.

Whatever you do, your dad needs to put the house up for sale and get out. Living with HOA's is like living in 1930's Germany.

I prefer living in HOAs. It keeps idiots from trashing up the neighborhood. The rules in my HOA are very reasonable and easy to follow. You don't have to live in one if you can't handle it.

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: MrDudeMan

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Connect a chain from the frame of the vehicle to the house or garage door. If they try to tow it you sue the shit out of them for damaging the house.

Whatever you do, your dad needs to put the house up for sale and get out. Living with HOA's is like living in 1930's Germany.

I prefer living in HOAs. It keeps idiots from trashing up the neighborhood. The rules in my HOA are very reasonable and easy to follow. You don't have to live in one if you can't handle it.

And that can change in a heart beat. Get a couple new people on the board or piss off some and your nice HOA turns to hell.


that and you do nto have to live in a HOA to keep it from getting trashed up. My house is not in a HOA and is fine.

 

[DannyLove]

GET A LAWYER, ATOT is the last place to get suggestions

 

[Gunslinger08]

HOAs are awful. Dissolve them all and use binding covenants instead.

 

[Yossarian]

We've known each other many years, The Godfather, but this is the first time you came to ATOT for counsel, for help. I can't remember the last time that you invited us to your house for a cup of coffee. But let's be frank here: you never wanted our friendship. And you were afraid to be in our debt. You and your father found paradise in America, had a good trade, made a good living. The police protected you; and there were courts of law. And you didn't need a friend of us. But uh, now you come to us and you say -- "ATOT give me justice." -- But you don't ask with respect. You don't offer friendship. Instead, you come into our forum on the day our daughter is to be married, and you ask us to provide free legal counseling.

What have we ever done to make you treat us so disrespectfully? Had you come to us in friendship, then this scum that runs your father's HOA would be suffering this very day. And that by chance if an honest man such as yourself should make enemies, then they would become our enemies. And then they would fear you.

 

[Genx87]

Talk to a lawyer. If it isnt a commerical vehicle how can they arbritarily define it as one?

 

[The Godfather]

Originally posted by: tk149

Originally posted by: The Godfather

Originally posted by: tk149
1. Get a lawyer, your dad is being sued.

2. Check the house sales contract. There's likely a clause in there about agreeing to comply with the HOA rules. If so, it's irrelevant that your dad didn't get the HOA rules until after he bought the house. That's his own fault for not reading everything and making sure he had all the papers. The Title Company should have warned him, if nothing else. If there's nothing in there about an HOA, then you may have a case for ignoring their rules.

3. Just guessing on this one, but it sounds like you have an HOA that contracts out parking enforcement to a company, and the HOA switched to a different enforcement company, which is when your troubles started. If so, deal directly with the HOA, not the enforcement company. The HOA is the boss here. If the HOA tells the enforcement company to stop, the company will stop. The HOA should be made up of HOMEOWNERS in the neighborhood. It's not a faceless corporation. Maybe if you invited the HOA president over for a beer, you could get this resolved easily.

4. The FMCSA definition you keep quoting might be irrelevant. It depends on the wording of the HOA rules. Have you read them yet? If not, you might want to reconsider the part about helping represent your dad in court.

5. Sounds like your dad just ignored the parking tickets. He should have used the grievance/dispute clause in the HOA rules to dispute the tickets. He can still try, and the petition signed by the neighbors can be used to help his case. Note that at this point, depending on the asnwer to point #3, you may have two different legal issues. One is with the HOA, and the other is with the enforcement company (or it's assignee).

6. The HOA Rules might give some way to appeal if he loses his case in HOA "court." Have you read the rules yet?

How do you appeal, what exactly do you do and what are the outcomes if successful? I'm not familiar with that term.

<snip>

You have two ways to fight this:

1. Talk to the HOA directly. The HOA can probably get the plaintiff (either the HOA itself or the parking enforcement business) to drop the lawsuit. If it's gone to a collection agency, you're screwed. The HOA possibly has a formal procedure to follow to dispute fines. Again, becoming friends with the HOA president (or any board member) will probably fix your problem. Just because it's written in the rules, doesn't mean that the HOA has to enforce it.

2. Fight the court case. I think this is your worst option, because it's clear that you do not have a good understanding of the HOA rules. You'll need a lawyer if you want a chance of success, and lawyers ain't cheap.

From your "community documents" quote (which I will assume is direct from the HOA rules), it looks like your best legal argument is if the Georgia Department of
Motor Vehicles classes the van as a passenger vehicle. If not, I think you're screwed.

I'd guess that you have one neighbor who doesn't like you, your dad, or just seeing the van on his street. S/he complained, and that's why you've been getting tickets.

So youre saying the Homeowner's Association is composed of people living in this neighborhood? They decide who to sue, who to fine? Its not an outside group of people/managers that preside over the neighborhood?

 

[The Godfather]

Originally posted by: Yossarian
We've known each other many years, The Godfather, but this is the first time you came to ATOT for counsel, for help. I can't remember the last time that you invited us to your house for a cup of coffee. But let's be frank here: you never wanted our friendship. And you were afraid to be in our debt. You and your father found paradise in America, had a good trade, made a good living. The police protected you; and there were courts of law. And you didn't need a friend of us. But uh, now you come to us and you say -- "ATOT give me justice." -- But you don't ask with respect. You don't offer friendship. Instead, you come into our forum on the day our daughter is to be married, and you ask us to provide free legal counseling.

What have we ever done to make you treat us so disrespectfully? Had you come to us in friendship, then this scum that runs your father's HOA would be suffering this very day. And that by chance if an honest man such as yourself should make enemies, then they would become our enemies. And then they would fear you.

i lol'ed

 

[MotionMan]

Get a lawyer.

/thread.

MotionMan, Esq.