LCD big screens make no sense

[RockinZ28]

I've already explained why I rated the Elite a better display than the VT50 (or any 50 series Panasonic plasma). If you chose to ignore those points, that's up to you. As for black levels, let's just say I wouldn't want to take a step backwards with the Panasonic. That's why I'd consider the Elite for my replacement set. Panasonic isn't even an option.



The 732 is NOT an Elite.

What about the bloom/halo around lighter objects transitioning into a black? Read several user reviews complaining of it. Know the CNET review says its hardly noticeable, but that just drives me nuts. Motion crap too.

I primarily use the plasma for pc gaming though. Watch a lot of tv on the Sony LED, but it's not local dimming and the bloom is very apparent. Motion is no problem, but I'm not playing FPS or racing games on it.

 

[Tegeril]

Likely troll aside,

I still can't think of a TV I'd prefer in my living room than the LCD I got (Toshiba 55SV670U). Local dimming/backlit (not edge) LCDs are a thing of beauty.

 

[alkemyst]

This is a biblical debate in today's markets assuming one is buying above average sets.

There are pros and cons to each and most will never see the minor issues in anything but screen benchmarks.

 

[gar655]

732 has a poor picture compared the 734/735. I can't honestly say much one way or the other about plasma vs lcd though. I've never seen the hype over plasma. A properly calibrated LCD on a decent set can be pretty good. I love my 735.

Funny since the 732/734/735 are identical other than 3d and a pseudo 240hz refresh rate of the latter two.

I guess everyone needs to justify spending more for the same. Oh well.

 

[gar655]

I've already explained why I rated the Elite a better display than the VT50 (or any 50 series Panasonic plasma). If you chose to ignore those points, that's up to you. As for black levels, let's just say I wouldn't want to take a step backwards with the Panasonic. That's why I'd consider the Elite for my replacement set. Panasonic isn't even an option.



The 732 is NOT an Elite.

Strange that you seem to be the only "reviewer" that places the Elite ahead of the new VT series plasmas in overall picture quality let alone value.

Yes the 732 is not an Elite but it does show that in 4 years LCD technology still hasn't bettered 4 year old plasma at low and mid range prices and still does not totally equal current plasma at ANY price.

Enjoy your $7000 TV.

 

[ImpulsE69]

Funny since the 732/734/735 are identical other than 3d and a pseudo 240hz refresh rate of the latter two.

I guess everyone needs to justify spending more for the same. Oh well.

Wrong. On all counts. I researched those 3 TV's for a great while before deciding. I don't on top of my head remember ALL of the specifics, but the 734/735 have more pinpointed picture control for color range ect and better (don't remember what) in terms of electronics than the 732 and iirc the 732 is edge lit vs back lit. They do NOT have 240hz that I'm aware of only 120hz, but I don't have any of that on anyway. The 734 and 735 are essentially the exact same tv except the 735 has 3D (whether or not that is a selling point is a matter of choice but when I bought mine it was only $100 more and included BD player and 2 pairs of glasses so why not).

It's hard to debate anything with LCD vs Plasma because anytime someone says "this tv looked better" you get all kinds of "well they adjusted them differently" blah blah statements. You can only look as far as what you have available, I've yet to see a good plasma that made me go "wow" any more than good LCD (with backlit LED of course.) The difference is so non point these days that it's just a dumb argument. Everyones "idea" of a good picture is slightly different.

I couldn't say if the difference is enough to justify the price difference between them and the 732, but I looked at enough of them in person to know I hated the 732's picture. I also saw the elites and did not think the price justified them compared to the 734/735. Matter of opinion really, but again no, the 732 is not the same as the 734/735 and they are not the same as the Elites.

On a side note, the 80" from last year WAS the same as the 732, only bigger.

 

[JackBurton]

Strange that you seem to be the only "reviewer" that places the Elite ahead of the new VT series plasmas in overall picture quality let alone value.

I don't care about "value," I care about overall picture quality and performance, and like I said, weighing the positives and negative of each display, I put the Elite ahead.

Yes the 732 is not an Elite but it does show that in 4 years LCD technology still hasn't bettered 4 year old plasma at low and mid range prices and still does not totally equal current plasma at ANY price.

LOL, and Panasonic hasn't bettered a 4 year old plasma (Pioneer 9G Kuro's), which is absolutely pathetic. Panasonic is actually working BACKWARDS since last year's models seemed to handle IR better.

Enjoy your $7000 TV.

Oh, you mean the 60" Pioneer Elite 141FD I bought in late 2008? Yeah, thanks. It's been great enjoying a plasma that was engineered the way a plasma was supposed to be engineered. Back then the best "value" was the 65" Panasonic V10 which people bought and tried to lie to themselves saying the Pioneer wasn't worth the extra money ($4K vs $7K). I wonder if they still feel the same way about their set when they look at their grey "blacks" and crappy 1080p/24 reproduction.

I actually MUCH prefer plasma. But I'm not about to take a step backwards with the Panasonic. If Pioneer was still making plasmas, you can best bet I'd be looking at a 70 or 80" Pioneer Elite with infinite black levels. That's where we SHOULD be now. But since all we are left with is Panasonic, we have to settle for some mediocre plasmas that reviewers hype because that's all that's available.

And to be honest, I'm not totally thrilled about the Elite. But if I had to replace my set, it would be with the Elite. Like I said, the Panasonic would be a step backwards for me. And the funny thing is, it seems most of the people replacing their Pioneer Kuro's are doing so with the new Sharp Elite's. That should tell you something right there. The only people I see going from a Kuro to a Panasonic are the ones that want something bigger (50" > 65") and apparently will give up some picture quality and performance for size.

 

[soulcougher73]

I'd take a Sharp Elite over any plasma on the market today.

This, and im a plasma fan in general.

 

[Matt1970]

While I initially liked I grew to hate, the damned thing was a giant heater. The amount of heat it put out was ridiculous. I then moved that to the bedroom and go a medium quality Sony LCD HDTV. It has a fantastic picture and didn't put out the heat the plasma did and I'm sure power usage was a lot lower. It still serves as my bedroom TV today.

Heat is energy and should be considered when getting a Plasma.

 

[Railgun]

Why? If you're interested in IQ, then this is secondary. If its first in the list, then you probably watch too much TV.

 

[Zivic]

The only people I see going from a Kuro to a Panasonic are the ones that want something bigger (50" > 65") and apparently will give up some picture quality and performance for size.

I own two 60" 9g kuros -KRP 600m isf unlocked and a 151 both isf calibrated. I bought them about a year a part. I have lived with them for a few yrs now. . they are great displays. I would give up at least one of them for a 70"+ panny VT series plasma.

screen size goes a long way; and makes up for a lot in PQ. My brother has a 65" VT panny. I can tell it isn't up to par with the 9G's, but I could make the sacrifice if I could get it in a 70"+ size in the $4000 ball park.

I have seen the shap elites. one of the nicest displays available, but I won't ditch a pioneer for it.

 

[JackBurton]

I own two 60" 9g kuros -KRP 600m isf unlocked and a 151 both isf calibrated. I bought them about a year a part. I have lived with them for a few yrs now. . they are great displays. I would give up at least one of them for a 70"+ panny VT series plasma.

screen size goes a long way; and makes up for a lot in PQ. My brother has a 65" VT panny. I can tell it isn't up to par with the 9G's, but I could make the sacrifice if I could get it in a 70"+ size in the $4000 ball park.

I have seen the shap elites. one of the nicest displays available, but I won't ditch a pioneer for it.

I wouldn't ditch either one of my Elite's for a Sharp Elite either, but if something were to happen to one of my sets, I'd replace it with the Elite.

As for future Panasonic plasmas, that future doesn't look too bright. Panasonic looks to be working on a PDP exit strategy and will be shifting their efforts on the OLED joint venture they have with Sony. I'm actually much more interested in this than seeing Panasonic release another half ass attempt at a PDP.

 

[donfm]

I really hate these stupid Plasma vs LCD discussions. Picture quality is subjective and even though the specs of one may win over the other that doesn't mean the viewer will like it better. Picture quality is an individual acquired taste. Nobody can tell you otherwise although in this forum there are many self proclaimed techno blowhards who try..... Just my opinion.

 

[Vdubchaos]

LED LCD > LCD > Plasma

 

[Zivic]

LED LCD > LCD > Plasma

might actually be true in 6 years or so

 

[Zivic]

I really hate these stupid Plasma vs LCD discussions. Picture quality is subjective and even though the specs of one may win over the other that doesn't mean the viewer will like it better. Picture quality is an individual acquired taste. Nobody can tell you otherwise although in this forum there are many self proclaimed techno blowhards who try..... Just my opinion.

It can be objectively measured... though you may have subjective preference to one tech of the other

 

[donfm]

It can be objectively measured... though you may have subjective preference to one tech of the other

You miss the point entirely. People will choose what they like best based on their own SUBJECTIVE preferences not based on any quantitative measurements. Thus why the pointless argument of "which is best" is forever ongoing in this forum. If you say which is the best based on specifications then perhaps there is some validity to the question.

 

[Zivic]

You miss the point entirely. People will choose what they like best based on their own SUBJECTIVE preferences not based on any quantitative measurements. Thus why the pointless argument of "which is best" is forever ongoing in this forum. If you say which is the best based on specifications then perhaps there is some validity to the question.

actually people will choose what they "think" they like best... just like they "think" LED means some new display technology and it is somehow different from LCD displays.

if there wasn't so much BS out there about plasmas can't be watched in bright rooms, or LCD means you are saving the polar bears, and we actually evaluated each specific model with some sort of objectiveness, we might not need to have these types of debates.

as a monitor, LCD displays are the winner hands down. as a TV, sports, movies, plasma is the winner. simple as that

 

[Railgun]

You miss the point entirely. People will choose what they like best based on their own SUBJECTIVE preferences not based on any quantitative measurements.

Speak for yourself. I'm all about real results. I will read review results and their measurements as the basis for my decision.

 

[Zivic]

Speak for yourself. I'm all about real results. I will read review results and their measurements as the basis for my decision.

unfortunately the masses head off to a retail store, see which display catches their eye... ie, is set to the brightest/vivid settings with a blue tint to everything. they then go online and look for the cheapest display that has all the same "features" and buy some crap 'LED' display for the $350 they have open on their CC. This is all followed by them patting them selves on the back and then going online and saying LED displays are the best

 

[ImpulsE69]

unfortunately the masses head off to a retail store, see which display catches their eye... ie, is set to the brightest/vivid settings with a blue tint to everything. they then go online and look for the cheapest display that has all the same "features" and buy some crap 'LED' display for the $350 they have open on their CC. This is all followed by them patting them selves on the back and then going online and saying LED displays are the best

LOL wat? You realize the people you are talking about aren't going to spend $1-8k on a tv set right? I think the people of this thread realize that Walmart doesnt sell top of the line sets. Either way it's still up to the viewer. My in laws LCD looks horrible, but they love it, and paid a hell of a lot less than I did. It's all subjective. The important thing is they like it.

 

[Zivic]

LOL wat? You realize the people you are talking about aren't going to spend $1-8k on a tv set right? I think the people of this thread realize that Walmart doesnt sell top of the line sets. Either way it's still up to the viewer. My in laws LCD looks horrible, but they love it, and paid a hell of a lot less than I did. It's all subjective. The important thing is they like it.

They love it because it is probably double the size and 2/3 the price of the display it replaced. ignorance is bliss when it comes to displays

 

[donfm]

Speak for yourself. I'm all about real results. I will read review results and their measurements as the basis for my decision.

So even if you don't like the picture on a particular highly rated television you would buy it simply because it has good reviews and good specifications? That is your choice but common sense dictates you buy what you like not what somebody else tells you that you should like.

 

[donfm]

actually people will choose what they "think" they like best...

Ok what's the diff between what a person likes and what they think they like??.....lmao.....you either like it or you don't....muahahaha I don't think the average person is that complicated or able to come up with that high a level of thought process...... No offense that just sounded funny.

 

[Zivic]

Ok what's the diff between what a person likes and what they think they like??.....lmao.....you either like it or you don't....muahahaha I don't think the average person is that complicated or able to come up with that high a level of thought process...... No offense that just sounded funny.

ignorance is bliss.... if you never saw/drove another car, you would think that kia rio was the best. if you never knew you could eat anything but boiled beets, they would taste just delightful. If you never had your knob polished, you would think 1st base was just dandy....