LCD Buyer's Guide

[shilatoe]

I have been following this topic for some time and decided I needed to throw in my 2 cents for xtknight. THG just posted their review of the latest 19" LCD monitors today. They review the 970P amoungst others and report that it has an 8 bit color panel, not 6 bit. I watched the claims of the middle European guy who claimed the 970P was 6 bit based on his looking at the screen. He has posted his opinion in a number of places. I am messaging THG to verify that the assertion of the 970P being 8 bit is valid. In the meantime since you seem to be the touchstone of LCD facts on this forum you might want to reconsider your assertion of the 970P being 6 bit.

 

[EviL AnGeL]

Originally posted by: shilatoe
I have been following this topic for some time and decided I needed to throw in my 2 cents for xtknight. THG just posted their review of the latest 19" LCD monitors today. They review the 970P amoungst others and report that it has an 8 bit color panel, not 6 bit. I watched the claims of the middle European guy who claimed the 970P was 6 bit based on his looking at the screen. He has posted his opinion in a number of places. I am messaging THG to verify that the assertion of the 970P being 8 bit is valid. In the meantime since you seem to be the touchstone of LCD facts on this forum you might want to reconsider your assertion of the 970P being 6 bit.

Nice article by THG. I was wondering when they would get round to updating it. Glad to see the VP930 came out pretty much on top for a good all rounder seeing as I just ordered 1 today!

 

[pcmodem]

Ordered a ViewSonic VX924 last week from NewEgg.

UPS delivered a mangled box today to my office, I refused the delivery.

Looks like I'm back in the market for an LCD.



Cheers,
PCM

 

[Vazkor]

How deep is the VP930 with stand? I can't find a monitor that's slim enough for my desk ... I have a wall right behind my desk, maybe a wallmount is the only viable solution?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: spectra9
However, I get the feeling that what we're experiencing is not exactly the same, since I can see this defect clearly, in any brightness settings, and only with certain color (red ones mostly)

Anyway, I hope your fifth time is the charm

I believe this is happening with the VP930b as a side effect of overdrive (it overshoots the dither). Though the pixels are moving like they have ants in their pants even when there is nothing in motion so I'm not sure.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: shilatoe
I have been following this topic for some time and decided I needed to throw in my 2 cents for xtknight. THG just posted their review of the latest 19" LCD monitors today. They review the 970P amoungst others and report that it has an 8 bit color panel, not 6 bit. I watched the claims of the middle European guy who claimed the 970P was 6 bit based on his looking at the screen. He has posted his opinion in a number of places. I am messaging THG to verify that the assertion of the 970P being 8 bit is valid. In the meantime since you seem to be the touchstone of LCD facts on this forum you might want to reconsider your assertion of the 970P being 6 bit.

Thanks for making me aware of the new review. But sorry, I'm not seeing where they call the 970P an 8-bit panel. They do list 16.7m colors, but so does Samsung, and they suffix that by saying (with A/D board) which probably means dithering. On other 16.7m panels they list "true 8-bit" but not on the 970P's. Why some are 16.2m and some are 16.7m yet both are dithering is anyone's guess. 253^3 equates to ~16.2m and 256^3 is ~16.7m. I assume it's 253^3 (missing 3 from 256) because all three subpixel cells in their active state (black) are unditherable but I'm not sure about that. When I think about it again it really makes little sense since black is still a displayable color and it should be within the 16.2m colors. They are probably using inconsistencies in their specifications. The A/D board takes 16.7m and makes it 16.2m I guess.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Vazkor
How deep is the VP930 with stand? I can't find a monitor that's slim enough for my desk ... I have a wall right behind my desk, maybe a wallmount is the only viable solution?

ViewSonic VP930b specifications:

PRODUCT DIMENSIONS W/STAND
16.2in x 14.0in x 11.4in
412mm x 356mm x 289mm

Judging from their other Dimensions spec that's in WxHxD format. The stand on my VP930b measures ~11.8 in. from one side's end to its other end (not diagonal).

 

[Vazkor]

As I already said it's too deep ... I think I'll need a wallmount. Thank you very much, priceless as always.

 

[shilatoe]

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: shilatoe
I have been following this topic for some time and decided I needed to throw in my 2 cents for xtknight. THG just posted their review of the latest 19" LCD monitors today. They review the 970P amoungst others and report that it has an 8 bit color panel, not 6 bit. I watched the claims of the middle European guy who claimed the 970P was 6 bit based on his looking at the screen. He has posted his opinion in a number of places. I am messaging THG to verify that the assertion of the 970P being 8 bit is valid. In the meantime since you seem to be the touchstone of LCD facts on this forum you might want to reconsider your assertion of the 970P being 6 bit.

Thanks for making me aware of the new review. But sorry, I'm not seeing where they call the 970P an 8-bit panel. They do list 16.7m colors, but so does Samsung, and they suffix that by saying (with A/D board) which probably means dithering. On other 16.7m panels they list "true 8-bit" but not on the 970P's. Why some are 16.2m and some are 16.7m yet both are dithering is anyone's guess. 253^3 equates to ~16.2m and 256^3 is ~16.7m. I assume it's 253^3 (missing 3 from 256) because all three subpixel cells in their active state (black) are unditherable but I'm not sure about that. When I think about it again it really makes little sense since black is still a displayable color and it should be within the 16.2m colors. They are probably using inconsistencies in their specifications. The A/D board takes 16.7m and makes it 16.2m I guess.

Yikes, you're right. I saw the 16.7mil and immediately thought 8 bit and believed that we finally had some true test data re the 970P. Sorry about that.
BTW I think you do a great job of maintaining this topic. I have learned alot from it although it has caused me to not buy an LCD monitor yet b/c so many new opinions fly up that I keep feeling I need to wait for the next clarification, eg, the 6 vs 8 bit question on the 970P. Too much information!
Keep up the great work.

 

[tm101]

Well, the VP191 was a true 8 bit monitor. The drawback is that there is only one setting at which you can use the full range of 16.7 mio colors. As soon as you change anything the number of colors decreases, thus banding in color gradients increases.

 

[pcmodem]

Originally posted by: pcmodem
Ordered a ViewSonic VX924 last week from NewEgg.

UPS delivered a mangled box today to my office, I refused the delivery.

Looks like I'm back in the market for an LCD.

LESSONS LEARNED:
For the mangled box, I blame both UPS and NewEgg, since NewEgg shipped the LCD in the naked original ViewSonic box without any additional protection. Or course, with UPS, a kevlar box might be necessary.


SILVER LINING:
Ordered a ViewSonic VP930b from a different vendor and a different shipping company. Hope they do a better packaging and delivery, respectively.

The VP930b looks like the decathalon winner based on the comparison at the website formerly belonging to Dr. Pabst:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/03/27/the_spring_2006_lcd_collection/

Our local video guru xtknight also appears to have given the VP930b his blessing, so ordering seemed the logical thing to do, as Spock would say.




Cheers,
PCM

 

[xtknight]

I ordered the VP930b from Newegg and it came in the original ViewSonic box in 'untouched' condition as far as I can recall. I think I ordered via UPS.

Edit: Yes, I verified from my invoice, it was UPS Ground 3-Day. No dead pixels then, no dead pixels now.

 

[imported_ST]

FYI - A couple of new 42" 1080p (1920x1080 1:1 pixel mapped) LCD TV's have hit US shores. Both the panels are from CMO based on "VAextreme" technology:

http://www.cmo.com.tw/cmo/english/product/showtv.jsp?flag=20050408182850

The Westinghouse LVM-42w2 retails for ~$2499.

The Sceptre X42-GV Naga retails for $2299 and comes with an ATSC tuner. I will have a review of this set in about a week when mine is delivered.

 

[roisin]

whats hardware.fr/behardware.com doing? i want that NEC 2090 review, now!!!

also does the european version of LCD20WGX2 have S-Video input? if not, i cant even buy that, aaaaaah....

 

[xtknight]

I would not recommend the Dell UltraSharp 1907FP in place of the 1905FP. The 1907FP has a TN panel versus the former 1905FP's MVA/PVA panels. Inferior color and viewing angles. But better response time. It likely uses the AUO M190EG02 V0.

 

[darXoul]

Originally posted by: roisin
also does the european version of LCD20WGX2 have S-Video input? if not, i cant even buy that, aaaaaah....

Nope.

 

[yacoub]

Originally posted by: ST
FYI - A couple of new 42" 1080p (1920x1080 1:1 pixel mapped) LCD TV's have hit US shores. Both the panels are from CMO based on "VAextreme" technology:

http://www.cmo.com.tw/cmo/english/product/showtv.jsp?flag=20050408182850

The Westinghouse LVM-42w2 retails for ~$2499.

The Sceptre X42-GV Naga retails for $2299 and comes with an ATSC tuner. I will have a review of this set in about a week when mine is delivered.

Might as well wait for the rest of the new Sharp line to come out in the next ~three weeks. The D90Us have DVI-I input, are 1080i, and are pretty highly anticipated. There are 37" and 45" and a 54" is already out I believe. A 65" will follow later in the year.
Latest updates here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=627263&page=1&pp=30

 

[samduhman]

Any good panels for gaming that are 8bit that don't cost $500+? I really want that NEC thats rated the highest on the gaming recommendations but its going to take me forever to save up that much money.

How important is 8bit over 6bit? Are the graphics differences that obvious?

 

[roisin]

benq FP91V is usually recommended, if you want to go for a fast TN panel, is the newer better looking FP93V coming with the same fast TN panel or not?

 

[Tetraboy]

My 21" CRT died, and I'm now stuck on 800x600 15" CRT. Can someone recommend a good replacement? I would like something with 1920x1200 resolution. I think it's between the Philips 230WP7NS and the HP L2335.

Thanks very much!

 

[roisin]

230WP7NS has the newer philips panel, but nobody reviewed it yet.

Has anyone here actually bought the LG L2000C yet? if so, can you take couple pixperan shots? so we could see if there are any improvements? thanks

EDIT: seems like Arkelna bought it, now if he could only provide us with an image like this: http://www.baddass.dsl.pipex.com/images/nec_20wgx2/pix1.jpg

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: samduhman
Any good panels for gaming that are 8bit that don't cost $500+? I really want that NEC thats rated the highest on the gaming recommendations but its going to take me forever to save up that much money.

How important is 8bit over 6bit? Are the graphics differences that obvious?

The main difference I'd say is high contrast, not 8-bit. I'm not sure, but you might find the Dell 2001FP and 2005FPW suitable for gaming, and both are 8-bit. The LG L2000C is 8-bit and ~$550 at cheapest and it should be great for gaming, but I haven't heard any confirmations of that. If you can't afford $550 (it's worth the extra IMO) then you can step down to the TN panels which are lower contrast/viewing angles and always 6-bit but are less expensive and have faster response time than most of the 8-bit panels. Or in the middle, there's the VP930b which I think is great for gaming, but it's 6-bit as far as I'm aware. Still, it's much higher contrast than the TN panels and a wider viewing angle.

 

[kgraeme]

Originally posted by: xtknight
The LG L2000C is 8-bit and ~$550 at cheapest and it should be great for gaming, but I haven't heard any confirmations of that.

It's $498.82US at ewiz. I opted for the 2001fp though since I've used it for gaming and liked it and the reports of some banding or other oddities in the black-reds on the L2000C worried me.

 

[davidos]

anything on the new Samsung 215TW? Looks nice with a lot of features...

 

[xtknight]

I think there is some vague information about the Philips 230 in this Dutch review:

http://tweakers.net/reviews/568/1