LCD Buyer's Guide

[darXoul]

No idea why this thing is so expensive in the US. Usually, you have way better prices than Europe, and this particular NEC is very affordable here.

 

[xtknight]

Regardless, given how new the technology is, I do not think it's overpriced. It even has component inputs (among S-Video, composite, DVI, VGA, 4xUSB 2.0), Picture-in-picture, and that contrast-adjusting thing. Viewing angles and response time are almost flawless. I'd pay a hefty premium for it given the great user reviews it's gotten. A couple users though have reported backlight buzzing, while one other has not. One downside is (it looks like) it only goes up to 60 Hz maximum vertical sync. But I'm sure we'll see more AS-IPS-based panels. Certainly other manufacturers will want to cash in on this. But that, my friend, is one hell of a monitor. Give it some time to come down in price. 7800GTXs were expensive on release too. As soon as they sell some they can afford to cut back on the hefty price tag.

 

[tm101]

Originally posted by: xtknightHmm...I have not noticed this in anything yet. Have you noticed the overdrive causing red text labels of players in Battlefield 2 when panning across the screen? Do you think your third model has worse dithering (or noise from bad electronics) problems then? Do you have a test pic where this happens the most, or just take a screenshot where it happens and I'll move it around for a long time and see if I can reproduce it.

I don't recognize any red text labels in BF2 as long as they don't mark enemies, hehe. All others are just white and blue.

This model is absolutely the best I got yet with the least noise from the electronics.

The checkboard-like patterns I recognize for moving colors can be seen in just any picture, especially with dark colors or low contrast. I noticed them in your darker test pic. But now I saw that you can also see them on the screenshot made by Lesnumeriques on both the VP930 and VP191. So in the end those should not be dithering patterns since the VP191 is a pure 8 bit display as far as I can tell.

I also noticed that those patterns don't only show up on moving colors, but also on background colors when something is moving on the background (see blue background around the moving car on the fotoshots by Lesnumerique), even in those areas where nothing is moving at all. This also happens with the background of this reply window when I use the scrollbar. So maybe not the display is to blame for those patterns but the windows routines used to draw the moving parts of the screen, some other monitors on Lesnumeriques also show this patterns but far less obvious. Concerning my perception with games it may just be that those games have always looked like that but my formers models just didn't show it to me that clearly. Issues are quite hard to tackle with the VP930 since every model seems to behave slightly different.

Here are the fotoshots by Lesnumerique for the VP191 and VP930: Comparison VP930 vs VP191

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: tm101
Here are the fotoshots by Lesnumerique for the VP191 and VP930: Comparison VP930 vs VP191

Well in that pic the VP191's looks a lot worse? Sorry, still confused here. You have the VP930 right?

 

[tm101]

I do have a VP930 now (actually the third model, the first two were exchanged by Viewsonic). Before that I had a VP191 which I sold to buy the VP930.

Yes, both pictures look a bit strange concerning those patterns. I also had a look on several other shots of Eizo and Samsung, they also show these patterns, but often considerably less obvious. I do not have any idea what the origin of this patterns are, only thing is they only occur when something is moving along some area. Actually it really seems as if it's just drawn by Windows like that, but I have to look at a CRT for comparison first. Maybe I can do that tomorrow, if so, I will post the results.

For now I'll have to call Viewsonic again to get things straight. How can it be that they "know about the issue" and keep sending me defect models?

 

[tm101]

Here is something very positive about the VP930. My old VP191 and as far as I know other monitors like the Samsung P970 have quite some difficulties to display soft scrolling text in browsers, they tend to make the text flicker like hell. Only way to circumvent this was to switch off all soft-scrolling and not to use the scrollbars. With the VP930 that flickering is only very subtle to non-existent.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: tm101
For now I'll have to call Viewsonic again to get things straight. How can it be that they "know about the issue" and keep sending me defect models?

Companies don't care about their customers, only their customers' money. I wonder when they will realize they drive people away just by crap like that. Look at eVGA (GPU board maker). They have excellent support, and a great warranty, and the word is passed on everywhere about how great they are. When you crap on one customer, it propagates like a disease (like XFX). I think only maybe five people had trouble with XFX, but everybody and their mother here basically associates them with deep trouble. Do I want to buy from ViewSonic ever again? No. Unfortunately I'll just have to leave the ViewSonics in the recommendations until something better comes along. Or I'll recommend something a little inferior but with much less problems.

 

[darXoul]

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/610-1/nec-2080gx-ips-niveau-tn-2-ms.html

The first "professional" NEC LCD20WGX2 review - the 6 ms IPS panel delivers, I can tell you that!

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: darXoul
http://www.hardware.fr/articles/610-1/nec-2080gx-ips-niveau-tn-2-ms.html

The first "professional" NEC LCD20WGX2 review - the 6 ms IPS panel delivers, I can tell you that!

Can't believe I just spend $700 on a twenty incher.:roll: Rossman's gonna shoot me.

 

[TecHNooB]

Is the NEC 20" HDCP compliant?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
Is the NEC 20" HDCP compliant?

I have heard that it is. One forum user reported it as being HDCP compliant from a phone call with a representative. I have also fired off an e-mail to them.

 

[Zebo]

The perfect 4:3 LCD?

This is new..Check out the specs S-IPS and 8ms ~ $550 USD.

 

[tw33ter]

What's the best 19'' (1280x1024 res) 8 bit panel for gaming? Is it still the Dell UltraSync 1905FP?

 

[TecHNooB]

I guess it's time to contemplate again. New NEC or the Gateway...

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
I guess it's time to contemplate again. New NEC or the Gateway...

Versus Gateway 21" widescreen? New NEC by a mile. The Gateway isn't really anything amazing. Don't take the HDCP support on the NEC as gospel. I'm not sure, and I've heard it's nowhere to be seen in the specifications.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: tw33ter
What's the best 19'' (1280x1024 res) 8 bit panel for gaming? Is it still the Dell UltraSync 1905FP?

I'd go for the Samsung 970P. I'm not sure if the 1905FP is fast enough.

Edit: see below.

 

[tw33ter]

Originally posted by: xtknight
I'd go for the Samsung 970P. I'm not sure if the 1905FP is fast enough.

That one looks great, I think I'll start looking for local stores that have it in stock Thanks very much Mr. Knight:thumbsup:

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: tw33ter

Originally posted by: xtknight
I'd go for the Samsung 970P. I'm not sure if the 1905FP is fast enough.

That one looks great, I think I'll start looking for local stores that have it in stock Thanks very much Mr. Knight:thumbsup:

Hmm..one thing though. I think it's a 6-bit (sorry, missed that part), but you don't have much (any?) choice in the 19" range for 8-bit and good response time. You still get the high contrast over conventional TN panels though and I think you'll like it anyway. The dithering is not very noticeable. VP930b (which I own) has same problem, or possibly a problem in the electronics and in general isn't as good as the 970P. But I hardly ever notice it in practical scenarios, and even then it's extremely subtle unless you look very close. I'm not aware of any 19" true 8-bit gaming panels. VP930b might be, but like I said, it has a known electronics issue that causes noise in colors. And the Samsung 970P has been shown to dither. But the 970P is still your best possible choice for 19" gaming at this point if you want higher contrast (yields better colors) and better viewing angles than TNs. 8-bit or not, my VP930b still displays much superior colors to my definite 6-bit TN so I don't think you'll be disappointed. Do be aware there are a couple slow color transitions on the VA+Overdrive LCDs (VP930b and 970P) that TN LCDs don't have problems with, but these transitions do not pop up very often (professional reviews have started omitting measurements in that range).

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: tw33ter
What's the best 19'' (1280x1024 res) 8 bit panel for gaming? Is it still the Dell UltraSync 1905FP?

I'd give some serious consideration to this one:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp...66426&type=product&skuId=7453356&tab=6

It's fast IPS 8ms new this Jan from LG/philips
http://www.lgsuperseller.com/product/in...at_id=1000000213&umod_id=192806&flag=1

You won't find too many 8 bits that fast that's why it's so darn expensive. 1905FP is horrible for gaming I have one and you literally would get seasickness playing.

I can't imagine anyone *ever* recommended that for gaming so I'm not sure what you mean by "still best"

Best of luck in your hunt.

 

[junkyardDawg]

saw this at newegg but I can't find any info on it, it's not even on Acer's website.

if those specs are right it might be a good budget VA screen

 

[RossMAN]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: darXoul
http://www.hardware.fr/articles/610-1/nec-2080gx-ips-niveau-tn-2-ms.html

The first "professional" NEC LCD20WGX2 review - the 6 ms IPS panel delivers, I can tell you that!

Can't believe I just spend $700 on a twenty incher.:roll: Rossman's gonna shoot me.

WTF!

 

[Zebo]

With deals and good WS twenties out there for only $400 and me, paying a $300 premium above that I thought you'd take at least take away any ferengi price/performance badge I may have.

 

[tw33ter]

How are those compared to the vx924? That's the one I was originally gonna get before I found this thread.

 

[darXoul]

Ask Zebo, he claims the VX924 sucks.

As for the NEC, according to my info, it's not HDCP.

Zebo, the 4:3 LG looks pretty pwn I might wait for the 23" 6 ms wide panels though.

 

[Zebo]

Zebo, the 4:3 LG looks pretty pwn I might wait for the 23" 6 ms wide panels though.

That's great to wait but I think one can write off same price 204b TN with that LG out there. Can't wait a for a review. Almost ordered that too just to see.