LCD Buyer's Guide

[JETninja]

You can not go by what you "see" at Bestbuy. THey run a canned low rez picture. It's crap and doesnt come close to showing what a monitor can do. Plus, each one is a the whim of whatever bozo last messed with the controls. The only well to really tell is to have some good test patterns and images.

All I can say is I'm very pleased with it. You can take anything back to Bestbuy real easy if your not happy with it. I was a little pissed they didn't take any of my coupons, but after actually using this monitor I'm very happy I went ahead and bought it.

Question, Are you going to hook up whatever you get per DVI? Or D-Sub? Makes a big difference picture wise.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: ChuckUFarley
So you now consider the LG L1970HR to be a better choice than the NEC 90gx2?

Comparing the two side by side the NEC seemed more vibrant (at least in a bright Best Buy).

I'm just not sure at the moment but I think the LG has better dynamic contrast abilities. Sounds like it's faster as well.

 

[Akari]

nah im not a heavy gamer,i dont play quake or unreal or bf2, fragging continuously for 5hrs and above
its just some occasional warcraft,WOW and cs source.thats all the games i have in my hdd for now...
mostly its just for watching anime and tv series

 

[DoctorM]

Ok just so you know I'm ChuckUFarley... it's just that my original account has now been repaired.

I wish you updated that list a bit sooner. I'm typing to you in front of an NEC 90gx2 and I'm hating it.

Out of the box it's way too bright. I feel like the bottom of my screen is washed out, although it feels like there's a real inconsistency to the brightness all around.

I calibrated (sort of) using a DVD in THX optimode which had me cut the brightness in half! That's much better and in fact very similar to the text mode.

I'm find it all really hard on the eyes especially anything involving text/web browsing, etc. The refresh rate feels low, but at 75hz it seems to strain the eyes harder.

In short, I'm getting a headache just typing this message.

I think I'll take this back to Best Buy and try the LG. Nothing is ever easy.

 

[JETninja]

PS, on the LG right now I'm at:

Brightness - 35
Contrast - 49
Gamma - 0

It was WAY too bright out of the box. Way......

 

[DoctorM]

Weird.
I playing around with the modes (which I find generally strange in how they work) but:

With brightness cut 50%
Standard Mode = Text Mode = Best for Movies and Gaming(?)
Movie Mode = Better for text, not bad for games
Photo Mode = ? Compresses black levels, I can't imagine that good for anything. Ok doesn't look bad on some games too.
Gaming Mode = Probably good for darker games (eg Doom3)


I do like the glossy coating though.
What software is good for calibration?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: DoctorM
Weird.
I playing around with the modes (which I find generally strange in how they work) but:

With brightness cut 50%
Standard Mode = Text Mode = Best for Movies and Gaming(?)
Movie Mode = Better for text
Photo Mode = ? Compresses black levels, I can't imagine that good for anything.
Gaming Mode = Probably good for darker games (eg Doom3)

I do like the glossy coating though.
What software is good for calibration?

Sorry to hear about your experience with the NEC. Did you try adjusting R,G,B components in the OSD? What about using native? Maybe the dynamic contrast stuff is just bothering you.

You can try my LCD-specific calibration stuff here. With the gradient tool (I recommend the CMYK windowed one for calibration), make sure every step of color is distinct and has the same difference in brightness as other steps do to one another.

 

[DoctorM]

Sigh, ok I'm coming around a bit to this thing.
Tweaking the mode to taste rather than what they name it has helped a LOT. Games look beautiful (so do movies) though I can detect SOME ghosting. But it really is minor and I have to stare intently to find it. At that point I'm not playing the game, I'm playing find the artifact.

I still feel the extreme top and bottom are a bit washed out. Like horizontal bands that are lighter.

I think the default is Native. I'm a bit confused over the rest of what you suggested. I'll take a look at your downloads another day, it's getting a bit late.
I don't think it's a color issue though, but I won't swear to it.

I may try buying the LG and then return the one I like least.

 

[JETninja]

I do need to do a shooter soon to verify the speed I'm seeing in my Racing Sim, just I have a 2 hour online race coming up next weekend and have not practiced much! The track surface is still a tad sparkly...just barely. Need to tweak a tad more. Tree's etc are looking great.

 

[Talcite]

Good news guys. I found the NEC 70GX2 for 198 CDN on NCIX. LOL! That's 120 off the regular price atleast. I ordered 2 of them. I'll tell you guys how they are.

 

[DoctorM]

Hmm, I'm surprised that you can't post pics here, so here are 2 links.
I used different modes, I think it was movie and standard.
Either way, complete black screen screens on the 90GX2.

There are definite black lines at the top and bottom, and other inconsistencies in brightness.
Is this common or do I have a bad panel?

Screenie 1
Screenie 2

Btw, I'm also starting to see the dithering. Sigh, why did CRTs have to die.

 

[StevenNevets]

Could anyone suggest one of these for gaming?
When the numbers are the specs are the same, the ratings are the same, the reviews are the same... well I'm damn clueless

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16824009092
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16824254001
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16824163130

 

[pencilcase]

Hello again, I was wondering if anyone here has seen/used the Philips 1907ES/00. I haven't been able to find any professional reviews of this monitor, only a couple of user reports from an Italian forum.

 

[CP5670]

Originally posted by: DoctorM
Hmm, I'm surprised that you can't post pics here, so here are 2 links.
I used different modes, I think it was movie and standard.
Either way, complete black screen screens on the 90GX2.

There are definite black lines at the top and bottom, and other inconsistencies in brightness.
Is this common or do I have a bad panel?

Screenie 1
Screenie 2

Btw, I'm also starting to see the dithering. Sigh, why did CRTs have to die.

It sounds like you have a defective one. Mine is also quite bright (not too bad at the 10% brightness setting I have it) but the brightness distribution is very uniform. Ignore the mode names. I use the photo mode for text viewing and the text mode for games.

I can notice the dithering too in certain games. It actually looks like a milder version of the AF shimmering you get with current video cards, but it occurs even with AF turned off so I'm guessing it's related to the 6-bit panel.

 

[DoctorM]

CP5670 have you tried putting up a plain black screen in a darkish room and flipping through the Modes?

I rechecked the "misleading" review by Toms Hardware again and I gotta say I agree with 90% of what they say now that I have this thing in front of me.

They do complain of really poor brightness uniformity and as you can see that is very much the case in the one I got.

I'm really lost and confused as to what to buy now. I want a fast panel, but I'm fairly disappointed with this one. I might try the LG but in the absence of any serious techincal review I might end up with a viewsonic VP930.
I would hate the ghosting but if this is the best of the fast ones I'm going to have to sacrifice speed for quality. Grrrr.

Edit: How is the VP2030 for speed? I notice it's an 8-bit panel unlike the VP930.
I don't see any links to reviews on that model.

LCDs suck.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: DoctorM
I'm really lost and confused as to what to buy now. I want a fast panel, but I'm fairly disappointed with this one. I might try the LG but in the absence of any serious techincal review I might end up with a viewsonic VP930.
I would hate the ghosting but if this is the best of the fast ones I'm going to have to sacrifice speed for quality. Grrrr.

Couldn't you tell in the store that they were too bright? Anyhow you can try the VP930 but it'll be slower in a few dark transitions. As an owner of one, in the bright colors, it is very fast. It is higher contrast, and you can turn the brightness down. You've tried 3? TNs and weren't happy, so it's probably time to try an P-MVA instead.

Edit: How is the VP2030 for speed? I notice it's an 8-bit panel unlike the VP930.
I don't see any links to reviews on that model.

The VP2030b looks equal to the VP930b in speed. The VX2025WM is a P-MVA too that you may want to try, and it's cheaper than the VP2030b. It is also 8-bit. It is slow in dark transitions like the VP930b. This has never been bothersome to me in gaming. Noticeable? Yes but not bothersome.

LCDs suck.

Nobody's making you get one: http://www.newegg.com/ProductSort/SubCategory.asp?SubCategory=19

No LCD out there is as dark as a CRT so they may all seem bright.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: StevenNevets
Could anyone suggest one of these for gaming?
When the numbers are the specs are the same, the ratings are the same, the reviews are the same... well I'm damn clueless

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16824009092
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16824254001
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16824163130

I would go for the Hanns G for a 19" widescreen. I've heard the most about that one, and with that I mean mostly great.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: pencilcase
Hello again, I was wondering if anyone here has seen/used the Philips 1907ES/00. I haven't been able to find any professional reviews of this monitor, only a couple of user reports from an Italian forum.

Nope, I haven't personally. But, it looks for sure like it uses an AU Optronics P-MVA (1300:1 contrast) like the VP930b.

 

[DoctorM]

No the 90gx2 is the first I've tried. Frankly in the store it was near on impossible to get a good read on any of the monitors. I knew to look at the 90gx2 and the L1970hr, but under bright lights, with a blurry slide show, there wasn't really much you could compare.

I was just trying to judge the others based on what I'm seeing on that and what the reviews describe on the others.

I worry that I find the dithering (among other things) in the TNs to be to much of a sacrifice for their faster speed. I wonder why they would make a display that's like staring into a spotlight, tweakable or not.

If you think there's another TN that I should try, please tell me because I'm pretty much clueless.

I don't want to spend $600 on a display that doesn't suck but, I don't know what less expensive one doesn't.

I don't THINK I want a CRT, but I can't believe that LCDs are uniformly bad as a display device.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: DoctorM
No the 90gx2 is the first I've tried.

I was just trying to judge the others based on what I'm seeing on that and what the reviews describe on the others.

I worry that I find the dithering (among other things) in the TNs to be to much of a sacrifice for their faster speed. I wonder why they would make a display that's like staring into a spotlight, tweakable or not.

If you think there's another TN that I should try, please tell me because I'm pretty much clueless.

I don't want to spend $600 on a display that doesn't suck but, I don't know what less expensive one doesn't.

I'd advise against trying any more dynamic contrast models then because they tend to have high brightness.

You'd probably be happy with the Samsung 215TW. It's not as fast, but it sounds like you'd rather not have all the other problems just for speed. It is still pretty fast but of course the most picky people may notice stuff. Look at how many people say they notice nothing in games on Newegg though.

 

[Josh7289]

Hey, I just dropped in again, even though I'm not in the market for an LCD right now, but I checked out your new site, xtknight. I didn't really go through it, and this is why: the black background is killing me. The black and green is really difficult to get an idea of what is going on in the site, and doesn't appear very welcoming. I'd recommend lighter colors like what you see right here on Anandtech. Besides that, I'm sure the site is/will be chock full of great information, as this thread is, so I'm hoping you can make it look a little nicer.

Please don't take what I said harshly, though.

 

[DoctorM]

xtknight, are you saying the bright spots are a common occurance too?

 

[CP5670]

CP5670 have you tried putting up a plain black screen in a darkish room and flipping through the Modes?

Yeah, the black level sucks in a pitch dark room (which pretty much applies to all LCDs) but the black still looks the same everywhere across the screen. You may want to try exchanging yours.

Hey, I just dropped in again, even though I'm not in the market for an LCD right now, but I checked out your new site, xtknight. I didn't really go through it, and this is why: the black background is killing me. The black and green is really difficult to get an idea of what is going on in the site, and doesn't appear very welcoming. I'd recommend lighter colors like what you see right here on Anandtech. Besides that, I'm sure the site is/will be chock full of great information, as this thread is, so I'm hoping you can make it look a little nicer.

Please don't take what I said harshly, though.

I actually love that color scheme. I have set up Windows to look similar to that on both of my machines and find it much easier on the eyes in a dark room.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Josh7289
Hey, I just dropped in again, even though I'm not in the market for an LCD right now, but I checked out your new site, xtknight. I didn't really go through it, and this is why: the black background is killing me. The black and green is really difficult to get an idea of what is going on in the site, and doesn't appear very welcoming. I'd recommend lighter colors like what you see right here on Anandtech. Besides that, I'm sure the site is/will be chock full of great information, as this thread is, so I'm hoping you can make it look a little nicer.

Please don't take what I said harshly, though.

Yea, it's hard to choose a good color theme. I wish it could be changed per-user but then everybody would need accounts. Well, you'd need an account if you wanted a different theme. Thanks for the feedback, I wish I got more of it.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: DoctorM
xtknight, are you saying the bright spots are a common occurance too?

Yeah, in LCDs, it's a common defect, like dead pixels. Generally the majority of LCDs are void of them but they do happen.