LCD Buyer's Guide

[rhaath]

Thanks xtknight, you've been a great help.

 

[a123456]

Another report of a PVA panel for the 2007FPW, this time definitely from the US. Not sure how reliable, but it looks like there are 2 panel codes for the A03s, RT803 and PM330.

 

[niall]

Most specific subforums here at AT have at least one obsessively knowledgeable person who takes it upon themselves to help those of us who find ourselves against the wall of tech changes. Three cheers for xtknight!

eeric, I've only seen that icon when booting up, but I haven't had a chance to really explore all possibilities yet. But the colours are sooooo much more nice and vibrant than on my Philips TN panel at work, looking at the same websites.

My next challenge will be to try and see if I can use the dual-monitor feature of my video card (GeForce4Ti4800SE in Win2k) and use the CRT as second monitor for certain things, at a different resolution. Time to learn more stuff!

 

[eeric]

hey niall, about the purple tinge at wide angles, when you have a dark background, do you notice the purple tinge at the corners (not backlight bleeding) when your eyes are aligned with the centre of the screen? if you move align your eyes with each of the corners it appears more black, is this noticable by you too? gotta use it more tonight to see.

 

[DustyNL]

besides the input lag story I'm still keen bout the samsung 215TW.
I checked some reviews of this screen (xbitlabs/tomshardware/etc) and I see no comment at all about input lag or slow responstime.

Apparently the reviewers didn't notice input lag, they even say the panel is quite fast (not as fast as TN of course). So my guess would be that the input lag is only noticed by people who really focus on it and also play constantly fast games.
However this is still an assumption, so I will give it some more thought and check out more reviews when possible. In the mean time, any comment will be welcome of course

greetz from the Netherlands

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: eeric
First of all, I'm not sure if I'm having that uniformity problem, after looking real close (centimeters away from LCD) I can see what you mean by "splotchy"... when I sit normally though, it seems as if I can see a colourful "shimmering" effect if I can call it that with my S-IPS panel, like it seems I can see sort of the RGB of each pixel sort of when I'm looking at this website with its grey background.

If you're talking about my website, the background (on the tables) actually isn't pure gray (there's a pattern in it). If not what website are you speaking of? Just make sure you never conclude something unless you're sure of the source material.

 

[niall]

Originally posted by: eeric
hey niall, about the purple tinge at wide angles, when you have a dark background, do you notice the purple tinge at the corners (not backlight bleeding) when your eyes are aligned with the centre of the screen? if you move align your eyes with each of the corners it appears more black, is this noticable by you too? gotta use it more tonight to see.

It does not seem to move to black when I move my eyes. It does appear to be a blacklight bleed. I took photos that somewhat exaggerate the phenomenon as visible to the naked eye, but still gives an idea; here's how it looks at three different Brightness levels: 0%, 50% and 100%. To my personal eyes, again since I'm not actually a professional, it's in the acceptable range (at least at this point in the game - I may be almost literally blinded by the change from CRT yet).

And yes, I also get this DVI-D connection icon in the upper left when switching to games and back. If you find how to get rid of it, let me know...

 

[eeric]

Originally posted by: niall

Originally posted by: eeric
hey niall, about the purple tinge at wide angles, when you have a dark background, do you notice the purple tinge at the corners (not backlight bleeding) when your eyes are aligned with the centre of the screen? if you move align your eyes with each of the corners it appears more black, is this noticable by you too? gotta use it more tonight to see.

It does not seem to move to black when I move my eyes. It does appear to be a blacklight bleed. I took photos that somewhat exaggerate the phenomenon as visible to the naked eye, but still gives an idea; here's how it looks at three different Brightness levels: 0%, 50% and 100%. To my personal eyes, again since I'm not actually a professional, it's in the acceptable range (at least at this point in the game - I may be almost literally blinded by the change from CRT yet).

And yes, I also get this DVI-D connection icon in the upper left when switching to games and back. If you find how to get rid of it, let me know...

I was taking pictures to say that I DIDN'T have the same backlight bleeding as niall, but with my digital camera, it DOES look identical to niall's bleeding. i cannot see that at all with the naked eye though. Is it really a defect, or are all panels prolly like that?

 

[Vortex22]

Originally posted by: eeric

Originally posted by: niall

Originally posted by: eeric
hey niall, about the purple tinge at wide angles, when you have a dark background, do you notice the purple tinge at the corners (not backlight bleeding) when your eyes are aligned with the centre of the screen? if you move align your eyes with each of the corners it appears more black, is this noticable by you too? gotta use it more tonight to see.

It does not seem to move to black when I move my eyes. It does appear to be a blacklight bleed. I took photos that somewhat exaggerate the phenomenon as visible to the naked eye, but still gives an idea; here's how it looks at three different Brightness levels: 0%, 50% and 100%. To my personal eyes, again since I'm not actually a professional, it's in the acceptable range (at least at this point in the game - I may be almost literally blinded by the change from CRT yet).

And yes, I also get this DVI-D connection icon in the upper left when switching to games and back. If you find how to get rid of it, let me know...

I was taking pictures to say that I DIDN'T have the same backlight bleeding as niall, but with my digital camera, it DOES look identical to niall's bleeding. i cannot see that at all with the naked eye though. Is it really a defect, or are all panels prolly like that?

I see the same brownish-purple color in the corners of my screen when it's compelely black too (Although not nearly as much as the pictures above). I don't really notice it at all during normal usage though, even when I'm doing something with dark images. I think its just a normal effect.

It's definitely not backlight bleeding, my monitor has virtually none... only a little tiny bit on the left corner. I pleasantly surprised at that given all the reports of bad bleeding with this monitor I've read. I can post pictures later of that purple tinge and the backlight on a black screen if anyone cares, but they will probably look very similar to the ones above.

 

[Mustanggt]

I did all the test on my new LCD and everything looks good, my backlight bleeding looks better than picture on website but there is some there, I have never seen a DVD look better on anything else before, but there is black spoting where movie cuts off screen i dont know what would cause this? perhaps playing DVD from cheap DVD burner??

 

[amking]

so, for those of you that have the 20wmgx2, is the glossy really an issue at all? some reviews seem to say it is.. others are "eh w/e". i'm just worried that with a standard desk light off to the side it might cause some issues (or worried that if i dont make SURE that my lighting is behind the lcd, i'll be screwed). i'm on the verge of buying this, but newegg's return policy does not allow refunds for this product at all... so if i get it and it is marginally better than my 2007wfp, i'm stuck with it AND a restocking fee on the dell.

edit: also for anyone that has this monitor, can you measure how high the lcd is off the table without the speakers? (ie the bottom of the lcd bezel (not the buttons)). i'm just trying to see how it would compare height wise to my 2007wfp, which is of course height adjustable. kind of sad that the far superior monitor may end up having to be set on a book or something because they didnt include basic height adjustment :/

 

[condor70]

I have relatively bad eyesight, so I'm looking for a monitor that:

- Has a large dot pitch
- Has a high contrast ratio
- Is suited for office work (web design, programming etc.)
- Has a minimal vertical resolution 1024
- Can handle lighting from the left/right
(any other factors that I should consider?)

The Samsung SyncMaster 971P looks promising, but are there other monitors (e.g. with S-IPS panel) that would also suit my needs?

 

[eeric]

Originally posted by: condor70
I have relatively bad eyesight, so I'm looking for a monitor that:

- Has a large dot pitch
- Has a high contrast ratio
- Is suited for office work (web design, programming etc.)
- Has a minimal vertical resolution 1024
- Can handle lighting from the left/right
(any other factors that I should consider?)

The Samsung SyncMaster 971P looks promising, but are there other monitors (e.g. with S-IPS panel) that would also suit my needs?

Sounds like 19" with 1280x1024 is right for you, the dot pitch is pretty large. So Samsung 971P with a PVA panel should be good for your needs.

 

[alangenh]

Coming across your information here was a stroke of luck -- I'd seen reviews, but they're kind of all over the place. I'm very grateful for you helping us all out, and keeping your guide so up-to-date!

I'm looking for a widescreen 1680x1050 resolution screen to use as additional screen real estate for my laptop. I probably want the smallest size monitor that has this resolution (otherwise I'm afraid it'd get grainy; I have no idea if that's really true.) So I want a 20" widescreen probably. I know I want height adjustment, as well as tilt. I want it to look good for working with text, and for occasional video-watching and (extremely amateur) photo viewing and editing. For text, I tend to work with light text on dark backgrounds, if that makes any difference. I'd prefer to stay around $300-ish, but will spend more if it seems worth it.

I love the glossy screen on my MacBook. If it has flaws, they are apparently flaws I can live with. I like it much better than my Dell 2007FP at work. The blacks on my MacBook are so very black, and I feel like I could reach right into the pictures I view on it.

After looking through your guide and recs, I'm kind of leaning towards the Samsung 205BW. I suppose the Dell 2007WFP would be another choice. Are there any good options I missed, or do you (or anyone) have an opinion on which of those two I'd be happier with? The Samsung 215TW also looks okay, though I have no idea if input lag would bother me. I think I'd like the NEC 20WMGX2 but I really want a display that's height-adjustable, plus the NEC is rather expensive.

I saw information about the ViewSonic VG2030wm on the ViewSonic site. It looked kind of promising, but that monitor doesn't seem to be released yet.

Thanks so much for any advice!

 

[xtknight]

It'll be a little while until I get the next tweaking guide up. I want to make it as good as possible. I'll be doing something rather original and need to test how it performs which could take a while (need to reinstall WinXP due to video problems).

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: alangenh
Coming across your information here was a stroke of luck -- I'd seen reviews, but they're kind of all over the place. I'm very grateful for you helping us all out, and keeping your guide so up-to-date!

I'm looking for a widescreen 1680x1050 resolution screen to use as additional screen real estate for my laptop. I probably want the smallest size monitor that has this resolution (otherwise I'm afraid it'd get grainy; I have no idea if that's really true.) So I want a 20" widescreen probably. I know I want height adjustment, as well as tilt. I want it to look good for working with text, and for occasional video-watching and (extremely amateur) photo viewing and editing. For text, I tend to work with light text on dark backgrounds, if that makes any difference. I'd prefer to stay around $300-ish, but will spend more if it seems worth it.

I love the glossy screen on my MacBook. If it has flaws, they are apparently flaws I can live with. I like it much better than my Dell 2007FP at work. The blacks on my MacBook are so very black, and I feel like I could reach right into the pictures I view on it.

After looking through your guide and recs, I'm kind of leaning towards the Samsung 205BW. I suppose the Dell 2007WFP would be another choice. Are there any good options I missed, or do you (or anyone) have an opinion on which of those two I'd be happier with?

I think you'd be happier with the Dell 2007WFP. It is better in basically every category (including response time, vertical viewing angle, color reproduction, and connectivity).

The Samsung 215TW also looks okay, though I have no idea if input lag would bother me.

Well, it doesn't bother most people so if I had to say yes or no, I'd say no. Between the 2007WFP and 215TW? You'd probably be happier with the 215TW. If you got an S-IPS panel on the Dell it might be a toss-up, but I wouldn't take any chances. Plus I like Samsung better as a brand. Both are good choices for what you're doing.

I think I'd like the NEC 20WMGX2 but I really want a display that's height-adjustable, plus the NEC is rather expensive.

I saw information about the ViewSonic VG2030wm on the ViewSonic site. It looked kind of promising, but that monitor doesn't seem to be released yet.

Thanks so much for any advice!

Interesting, but chances are it'd use an AUO 20" panel. They have some color issues. Not as bad as a TN but not as good as the Dell 2007WFP or Samsung 215TW.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: condor70
I have relatively bad eyesight, so I'm looking for a monitor that:

- Has a large dot pitch
- Has a high contrast ratio
- Is suited for office work (web design, programming etc.)
- Has a minimal vertical resolution 1024
- Can handle lighting from the left/right
(any other factors that I should consider?)

The Samsung SyncMaster 971P looks promising, but are there other monitors (e.g. with S-IPS panel) that would also suit my needs?

Honestly the 971P is great for your needs. You'd be sacrificing more with the S-IPS 19" LCDs on the market. They just aren't that great. You generally get slow response time, certainly poor contrast, and poor color tracking.

 

[Jodiuh]

Curse this board and it's lack of img tags. For those of you that haven't seen what you win in the "lottery" go here.---> http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1030157445&postcount=102 I've found xt's blacktest---> http://lcdresource.com/tools/blacktest.htm to be VERY helpful for adjusting contrast, brightness, and especially gamma. Any good color images? (ati calls it saturation, nv color correction) I'm checking out the "after buying" section now.

 

[fuzzybabybunny]

I'm seriously looking into the NEC MultiSync 20WMGX2 for photo editing. Does anyone have any idea when there may be a price drop in this monitor, perhaps down into the $400 range, or if there have been any recent rebates that they might do again? I'd be buying two of these for a dual monitor setup. Right now I can nearly get two Dell 2001FPs for the price of one of these. If they would drop the price on this buy omitting the TV tuner and cheap speakers it'd probably be a better value. Do you know if there is such a monitor that uses the same panel but doesn't have all the extras, or if there ever will be such a monitor?

edit: Ahhh... there seems to be a NEC 20WGX2 without the multimedia stuff and an NEC 20WMGX2 with the multimedia stuff... but the 20WGX2 is more expensive?

I'm a little wary of the resolution though. I'm used to the screen retail space of 1600x1200 monitors (Dell 2001FP). I'm not sure how I would handle a widescreen monitor with less resolution... Editing horizontal photos probably won't be too bad, but editing vertical ones might be painful, as well as playing games that have no widescreen mode... thoughts?

 

[xtknight]

I forgot to add to the "After Buying" guide that you should disable digital vibrance/oversaturation. I'll add that in right now.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: fuzzybabybunny
I'm seriously looking into the NEC MultiSync 20WMGX2 for photo editing. Does anyone have any idea when there may be a price drop in this monitor, perhaps down into the $400 range, or if there have been any recent rebates that they might do again?

I've never seen a rebate on the 20WMGX2, but perhaps it'll reach $400 by next February.

I'd be buying two of these for a dual monitor setup. Right now I can nearly get two Dell 2001FPs for the price of one of these. If they would drop the price on this buy omitting the TV tuner and cheap speakers it'd probably be a better value. Do you know if there is such a monitor that uses the same panel but doesn't have all the extras, or if there ever will be such a monitor?

edit: Ahhh... there seems to be a NEC 20WGX2 without the multimedia stuff and an NEC 20WMGX2 with the multimedia stuff... but the 20WGX2 is more expensive?

The LCD20WGX2 (without the multimedia features) isn't available in the US. The 20WMGX2 isn't available anywhere but the US. I'm unaware of any monitor cheaper than the 20WMGX2 that uses the 20"w AS-IPS panel. I don't think any more expensive ones use it either as a matter of fact.

I'm a little wary of the resolution though. I'm used to the screen retail space of 1600x1200 monitors (Dell 2001FP). I'm not sure how I would handle a widescreen monitor with less resolution... Editing horizontal photos probably won't be too bad, but editing vertical ones might be painful, as well as playing games that have no widescreen mode... thoughts?

Well you lose 150 pixels vertically with the widescreen LCD. Unfortunately the 20WMGX2 can't pivot, or else that would be an option for editing vertically. I think by now every game has some sort of widescreen support, if not a hack: http://www.widescreengamingforum.com/

 

[amking]

Originally posted by: fuzzybabybunny
Does anyone have any idea when there may be a price drop in this monitor, perhaps down into the $400 range, or if there have been any recent rebates that they might do again? I'd be buying two of these for a dual monitor setup. Right now I can nearly get two Dell 2001FPs for the price of one of these. If they would drop the price on this buy omitting the TV tuner and cheap speakers it'd probably be a better value. Do you know if there is such a monitor that uses the same panel but doesn't have all the extras, or if there ever will be such a monitor?

yeah, i'm in a similar position, so i feel you. for the price of one 20WMGX2 i can get 2 dell 2007wfp's. so i can either get one amazing monitor that has the world's worst stand, or get two very well designed monitors that use cheaper panels and just "deal with it".

at this point i'm almost inclined to wait it out (for newer models to be released?), but have to make a decision before my 2007wfp is 21 days old. due to newegg's return policy, once i order the nec, its mine... period. :/

edit: i'm also really interested in a dual setup now, but sort of feel that two widescreens would be too much (too wide). blah i just really dont know what to do now.. seems like the lcd market/technology/prices arent as mature as i thought they were D:

 

[alangenh]

Thank you for the advice! I'm pretty convinced that the 215TW is the way to go. I have some reward points I can put into play if I buy the thing from amazon... I hope they have a decent policy if something's wrong with it when it arrives.

I wonder how much I'll miss the glossiness, now that I've gotten used to it on my laptop.

I went to CompUSA and Best Buy to try and see it in person, but naturally, they had none of the monitors I'm interested in. And none of the ones they did have caught my eye. I was surprised to see so many Westinghouse ones at Best Buy; I hadn't noticed those at all on the monitor sites I've been looking at. I'd always thought of them more as TVs.

One suggestion for your "test your black level" page -- maybe put something about what we should look for on the black page; what we're supposed to see if our monitor is good.

So yeah, now all I have to do is convince myself to pull the trigger.

 

[Jodiuh]

I must say the stand and overall fit/finish of the Dell 2007WFP owns somethin hard. It's the first out of about 5 panels that doesn't shake while I type.

 

[amking]

can someone post that link again that has all the different lcd sizes overlayed with different colors?

thanks.