LCD Buyer's Guide

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: valkyriex
I'm looking to get a 20.1" WS LCD. A couple of my friends suggested the Dell 2007FWP, since it's a good balance of performance and affordability. Plus I like LCDs with the USB ports on the side. So is this a good buy for $360? Or is there a better 20.1" WS LCD out in the market right now?

Given the current state of the 2007WFP's varying components I would not recommend it. Try the LG L204WT which is cheaper and should provide superior image quality to the lowest-common-denominator of what you'd get with the 2007WFP. It doesn't have any USB ports though. The main reason I like built-in USB ports on the monitor is so I can use my USB mouse without the cord pulling around my desk, but you could always get an external USB hub for that purpose.

 

[valkyriex]

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: valkyriex
I'm looking to get a 20.1" WS LCD. A couple of my friends suggested the Dell 2007FWP, since it's a good balance of performance and affordability. Plus I like LCDs with the USB ports on the side. So is this a good buy for $360? Or is there a better 20.1" WS LCD out in the market right now?

Given the current state of the 2007WFP's varying components I would not recommend it. Try the LG L204WT which is cheaper and should provide superior image quality to the lowest-common-denominator of what you'd get with the 2007WFP. It doesn't have any USB ports though. The main reason I like built-in USB ports on the monitor is so I can use my USB mouse without the cord pulling around my desk, but you could always get an external USB hub for that purpose.

Thanks. The LG does seem better. Do you know another good one that does have build-in USB ports?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: valkyriex

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: valkyriex
I'm looking to get a 20.1" WS LCD. A couple of my friends suggested the Dell 2007FWP, since it's a good balance of performance and affordability. Plus I like LCDs with the USB ports on the side. So is this a good buy for $360? Or is there a better 20.1" WS LCD out in the market right now?

Given the current state of the 2007WFP's varying components I would not recommend it. Try the LG L204WT which is cheaper and should provide superior image quality to the lowest-common-denominator of what you'd get with the 2007WFP. It doesn't have any USB ports though. The main reason I like built-in USB ports on the monitor is so I can use my USB mouse without the cord pulling around my desk, but you could always get an external USB hub for that purpose.

Thanks. The LG does seem better. Do you know another good one that does have build-in USB ports?

Sorry, not for under $550 (at which point you'd be getting the NEC 20WMGX2).

 

[xboxist]

xtknight -- after weeks of random questions (and weeks of responses from you), I've ordered the 20WMGX2. I know you've posted your personal settings for the monitor, and I'll try to go back and find them. But I was wondering if there was anything more specific that I should make sure to do, or not do as far as settings go. This will be my first calibration of an LCD, and it would be good to know of some tips before I start. I guess what I'm asking is if there's anything in the settings that you'd say, "Oh god, whatever you do, do NOT turn that on..." or something like that. heh

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: xboxist
xtknight -- after weeks of random questions (and weeks of responses from you), I've ordered the 20WMGX2. I know you've posted your personal settings for the monitor, and I'll try to go back and find them. But I was wondering if there was anything more specific that I should make sure to do, or not do as far as settings go. This will be my first calibration of an LCD, and it would be good to know of some tips before I start. I guess what I'm asking is if there's anything in the settings that you'd say, "Oh god, whatever you do, do NOT turn that on..." or something like that. heh

Hm...not really. But for any photo editing you would not want to use a DV mode other than Standard (not Text, Movie, Gaming, Photo). Really, I think Movie is a decent setting for some usage, but Standard with calibration is still the best all around. Advanced DVM is suitable for some situations but it doesn't look that good for general usage.

 

[zavar]

Hello all!

I have a few questions.

First, do you think displays with higher pixel pitch are less tiring for web surfing and reading text? Is the 0.256 pixel pitch of 20" Wide displays too small? Are there any disadvantages to higher pixel pitch? What is the optimal range?

Second, what about games that don't support wide resolutions? Are they displayed stretched out on screen, or are they displayed with black sidebars? Are some Wide LCDs better for these games than others?

Third, what about old DOS games that don't support resolutions higher than 320x200 or so. Are they playable on LCDs in general? Are some LCD monitors better for DOS games than other LCDs?


Thanks for your time.

 

[LocutusX]

Has anyone seen any decent reviews of the Samsung 931BW? It's the one with the glossy screen and claimed 2ms response...

I've spent some time combing Google results but to no avail. I could not find a damned review on the thing!

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: zavar
Hello all!

Welcome to the forums.

I have a few questions.

First, do you think displays with higher pixel pitch are less tiring for web surfing and reading text? Is the 0.256 pixel pitch of 20" Wide displays too small? Are there any disadvantages to higher pixel pitch? What is the optimal range?

A bigger dot pitch does provide text that's easier on the eyes. I wouldn't say that 0.255 mm is too small though. Most CRTs have smaller dot pitches than that. LCDs are completely sharp so blurriness is not a problem. With a bigger dot pitch you get less picture detail and pictures won't appear as pure. Also, there are advantages to font rendering (though not currently realized) with a lower dot pitch, such as using higher-precision AA. Like I said though, very few apps take advantage of it and a bigger dot pitch is 9 times out of 10 easier on the eyes. I love my 20" widescreen @ 0.255 mm, personally. I do wear glasses.

Second, what about games that don't support wide resolutions? Are they displayed stretched out on screen, or are they displayed with black sidebars? Are some Wide LCDs better for these games than others?

This question is asked a lot. It is described in the first post to this thread.

Third, what about old DOS games that don't support resolutions higher than 320x200 or so. Are they playable on LCDs in general? Are some LCD monitors better for DOS games than other LCDs?

Thanks for your time.

I'm not sure as I haven't dealt with such games myself, but the scaling probably wouldn't even be that bad for primitive DOS graphics. Some LCDs are better at scaling than others.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: LocutusX
Has anyone seen any decent reviews of the Samsung 931BW? It's the one with the glossy screen and claimed 2ms response...

I've spent some time combing Google results but to no avail. I could not find a damned review on the thing!

Not really. I saw on on a Chinese site (lcd.zol.com.cn) but I don't read Chinese so it wasn't much use. Are you sure it has a glossy screen or is the bezel just glossy?

 

[LocutusX]

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: LocutusX
Has anyone seen any decent reviews of the Samsung 931BW? It's the one with the glossy screen and claimed 2ms response...

I've spent some time combing Google results but to no avail. I could not find a damned review on the thing!

Not really. I saw on on a Chinese site (lcd.zol.com.cn) but I don't read Chinese so it wasn't much use. Are you sure it has a glossy screen or is the bezel just glossy?

i was considering one from this store in canada: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.ph...owProduct&cmd=pd&pid=012286&cid=MT.983

i found a spec sheet here: http://www.samsung.com/ph/products/monitor/lcdmonitor/931bw.asp

What do you think? Notice on the spec sheet it says "Color: High Glossy Black"... but I think you're right, it's referring to the bezel and not the screen. D'oh!

The 2ms response time is impressive, considering this will be my Xbox360 screen for a few months until I move to my own place and buy a proper TV. Any guesses as to which particular panel they're using for this one?

 

[Engel]

Originally posted by: LocutusX
i was considering one from this store in canada: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.ph...owProduct&cmd=pd&pid=012286&cid=MT.983

i found a spec sheet here: http://www.samsung.com/ph/products/monitor/lcdmonitor/931bw.asp

The 931BW appears to be an older model: I cannot find it in any major US stores or even on Newegg. And it seems there are two newer versions of this: the 940BW and 941BW.

For the price that Canadian site is asking for, I would suggest looking at the other ones. Newegg, for example, has the 941BW for much less and even with a 40$ rebate. And just to clarify, it is still a bit less, even with the current exchange rate: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16824001088

Some stores, such as CompUSA, have the 940BW: http://www.compusa.com/products/product...=1&D=940BW&Ntk=All&product_code=340151

I did see the 940BW live (with their silly screensaver thing), and it did seem nice, albeit a bit small. (Of course, this is coming from a non-widescreen user who uses normal 19" monitors.) Specifications wise, there seems to be no difference between the 940BW & 941BW. The 931BW appears to have a lower advertised response time and uses Dynamic Contrast, but both of those things make me a bit skeptical as to its actual performance.

Anyway, good luck!

 

[Pugnate]

Hey I am considering replacing my VX922 with the LG Flatron L204WT. Is that a good idea? I am just worried about ghosting? Will I notice a difference?

 

[Apocalypse23]

I'd just like to add the following imo for HTPC's:

Sharp AQUOS 46" 1080p LCD TELEVISION LC46D62U
Panel Type 46'' Active Matrix (a-si TFT) Advanced Super View LCD1
Pixel Resolution Wide XGA (1920 x 1080)
Tuner Type NTSC/ATSC/QAM
Brightness 450 cd/m
Lamp Life 60,000 hours3
Viewing Angles 176º H / 176º V
Audio System 15W + 15W
Contrast Ratio 2000:1 Native / 10,000:1 Dynamic Contrast Ratio with Enhanced Picture Contrast Technology
Aspect Ratio 16:9
View Modes Sidebar, Smart Stretch, Stretch, Zoom
HDMI Input HDMI vers 1.2a x 2
HD Component Input Y/Pr/Pb x 2
S-Video Input 4-pin DIN x 1
Composite Video Input RCA x 3
Table Stand Included
Audio Outputs Output: RCA L/R x 1
Digital Audio Out 1 (optical)
Dimensions (w x h x d) Including table stand and speakers: 1127 x 790 x 309 mm
Without table stand and with speakers: 1127 x 728 x 124 mm
Weight Including table stand and speakers: 35 kg
Without table stand and with speakers: 32 kg
Limited Warranty 1 year parts and labour
Response Time: 4ms

Sharp Aquos AQUOS 52" 1080p LCD TELEVISION LC52D62U
Panel Type 52'' Active Matrix (a-si TFT) Advanced Super View LCD1
Pixel Resolution Wide XGA (1920 x 1080)
Tuner Type NTSC/ATSC/QAM
Brightness 450 cd/m
Lamp Life 60,000 hours3
Viewing Angles 176º H / 176º V
Audio System 15W + 15W
Contrast Ratio 2000:1 Native / 10,000:1 Dynamic Contrast Ratio with Enhanced Picture Contrast Technology
Aspect Ratio 16:9
View Modes Sidebar, Smart Stretch, Stretch, Zoom
HDMI Input HDMI vers 1.2a x 2
HD Component Input Y/Pr/Pb x 2
S-Video Input 4-pin DIN x 1
Composite Video Input RCA x 3
Table Stand Included
Audio Outputs Output: RCA L/R x 1
Digital Audio Out 1 (optical)
Dimensions (w x h x d) Including table stand and speakers: 1263 x 869 x 309 mm
Without table stand and with speakers: 1263 x 807 x 125 mm
Weight Including table stand and speakers: 40.5 kg
Without table stand and with speakers: 37.5 kg
Limited Warranty 1 year parts and labour
Response Time: 4ms

Westinghouse 42" 1080p Monitor LVM-42w2
1920x1080 resolution
Response Time: 8ms
Contrast Ratio: 1000:1

Westinghouse 47" 1080p Monitor LVM-47w1
1920x1080 resolution
Response Time: 6.5ms
Contrast Ratio: 1200:1

 

[xboxist]

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: xboxist
xtknight -- after weeks of random questions (and weeks of responses from you), I've ordered the 20WMGX2. I know you've posted your personal settings for the monitor, and I'll try to go back and find them. But I was wondering if there was anything more specific that I should make sure to do, or not do as far as settings go. This will be my first calibration of an LCD, and it would be good to know of some tips before I start. I guess what I'm asking is if there's anything in the settings that you'd say, "Oh god, whatever you do, do NOT turn that on..." or something like that. heh

Hm...not really. But for any photo editing you would not want to use a DV mode other than Standard (not Text, Movie, Gaming, Photo). Really, I think Movie is a decent setting for some usage, but Standard with calibration is still the best all around. Advanced DVM is suitable for some situations but it doesn't look that good for general usage.

Thank you. One more thing... should I bother installing any of the software that would come with the monitor? Or should I just depend on being able to calibrate it using nothing but the monitor's control panel? Does the software include anything vital?

 

[rxblitzrx]

ViewSonic VP930b or NEC 90GX2

Which would you choose for internet browsing and reading text?

 

[rxblitzrx]

Sorry. No Post.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: LocutusX

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: LocutusX
Has anyone seen any decent reviews of the Samsung 931BW? It's the one with the glossy screen and claimed 2ms response...

I've spent some time combing Google results but to no avail. I could not find a damned review on the thing!

Not really. I saw on on a Chinese site (lcd.zol.com.cn) but I don't read Chinese so it wasn't much use. Are you sure it has a glossy screen or is the bezel just glossy?

i was considering one from this store in canada: http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.ph...owProduct&cmd=pd&pid=012286&cid=MT.983

i found a spec sheet here: http://www.samsung.com/ph/products/monitor/lcdmonitor/931bw.asp

What do you think? Notice on the spec sheet it says "Color: High Glossy Black"... but I think you're right, it's referring to the bezel and not the screen. D'oh!

The 2ms response time is impressive, considering this will be my Xbox360 screen for a few months until I move to my own place and buy a proper TV. Any guesses as to which particular panel they're using for this one?

I know it'd be a 6-bit TN panel. Like you said though, there are little to no reviews of these 19" widescreen panels so I've no idea of the quality.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Pugnate
Hey I am considering replacing my VX922 with the LG Flatron L204WT. Is that a good idea? I am just worried about ghosting? Will I notice a difference?

I don't think you will notice much of a difference. They are both reasonably fast TN panels and the L204WT has some great merits in other areas.

 

[Suetonius]

Great thread!

But I don't see much about grayscale viewing - so here goes . . .

I request guidance in regards to 19" SXGA (not widescreen) LCD monitors that would be good for grayscale viewing.

I understand that the best my poor old video card (a PCI ATI Radeon 7500) can put out is 8-bit grayscale, so an 8-bit LCD monitor (256 shades of gray) should be a good match. A 6-bit LCD monitor, which is what I have now, only gives 64 shades of gray - this is insufficient for what I would like to be able to do.

My intention with the new LCD monitor is to view conventional grayscale x-ray images at home for educational purposes. Teaching files and the like.

Not for actual diagnostic work - 10-bit (1024 shades of gray) to 16-bit (65,536 shades of gray) monitors are used for serious grayscale imaging, but they tend to run a little bit higher in price than what I have in mind for a modest home computer setup.

Other than that, the monitor will be used for nothing more demanding than web-surfing, email and word processing. No gaming, no photographic work, no DVD watching - so the monitor can be slower than cold molasses (by gamers' standards, anyway). I much prefer the 5:4 aspect ratio of the basic 19" 1280 X 1024 SXGA LCD monitor over a widescreen aspect ratio. The larger pixels of a 19" 1280 X 1024 monitor are also a plus for me - I need glasses to read print well and I tend to view a monitor at a distance of about 21". Glare-resistant screens are a plus - I find the reflections in glossy screens to be distracting.

I have already learned a considerable amount about LCD monitors from this thread. I would greatly appreciate further guidance in regard to my own situation.


Thank you,

Suetonius

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Apocalypse23
I'd just like to add the following imo for HTPC's:

Thanks, I'll look into it.

I was quite impressed by Sharp's Aquos series after a brief look in the store, but for the LCD TVs to meet the HTPC section they must be fully PC compatible (VESA standards+native resolution input over DVI). Do you know if they are? I will browse around avsforum and see what I can find for the best LCD TVs/HTPC LCDs.

Sharp AQUOS 46" 1080p LCD TELEVISION LC46D62U
Panel Type 46'' Active Matrix (a-si TFT) Advanced Super View LCD1
Pixel Resolution Wide XGA (1920 x 1080)
Tuner Type NTSC/ATSC/QAM
Brightness 450 cd/m
Lamp Life 60,000 hours3
Viewing Angles 176º H / 176º V
Audio System 15W + 15W
Contrast Ratio 2000:1 Native / 10,000:1 Dynamic Contrast Ratio with Enhanced Picture Contrast Technology
Aspect Ratio 16:9
View Modes Sidebar, Smart Stretch, Stretch, Zoom
HDMI Input HDMI vers 1.2a x 2
HD Component Input Y/Pr/Pb x 2
S-Video Input 4-pin DIN x 1
Composite Video Input RCA x 3
Table Stand Included
Audio Outputs Output: RCA L/R x 1
Digital Audio Out 1 (optical)
Dimensions (w x h x d) Including table stand and speakers: 1127 x 790 x 309 mm
Without table stand and with speakers: 1127 x 728 x 124 mm
Weight Including table stand and speakers: 35 kg
Without table stand and with speakers: 32 kg
Limited Warranty 1 year parts and labour
Response Time: 4ms

Sharp Aquos AQUOS 52" 1080p LCD TELEVISION LC52D62U
Panel Type 52'' Active Matrix (a-si TFT) Advanced Super View LCD1
Pixel Resolution Wide XGA (1920 x 1080)
Tuner Type NTSC/ATSC/QAM
Brightness 450 cd/m
Lamp Life 60,000 hours3
Viewing Angles 176º H / 176º V
Audio System 15W + 15W
Contrast Ratio 2000:1 Native / 10,000:1 Dynamic Contrast Ratio with Enhanced Picture Contrast Technology
Aspect Ratio 16:9
View Modes Sidebar, Smart Stretch, Stretch, Zoom
HDMI Input HDMI vers 1.2a x 2
HD Component Input Y/Pr/Pb x 2
S-Video Input 4-pin DIN x 1
Composite Video Input RCA x 3
Table Stand Included
Audio Outputs Output: RCA L/R x 1
Digital Audio Out 1 (optical)
Dimensions (w x h x d) Including table stand and speakers: 1263 x 869 x 309 mm
Without table stand and with speakers: 1263 x 807 x 125 mm
Weight Including table stand and speakers: 40.5 kg
Without table stand and with speakers: 37.5 kg
Limited Warranty 1 year parts and labour
Response Time: 4ms

Westinghouse 42" 1080p Monitor LVM-42w2
1920x1080 resolution
Response Time: 8ms
Contrast Ratio: 1000:1

Westinghouse 47" 1080p Monitor LVM-47w1
1920x1080 resolution
Response Time: 6.5ms
Contrast Ratio: 1200:1

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: xboxist
Thank you. One more thing... should I bother installing any of the software that would come with the monitor? Or should I just depend on being able to calibrate it using nothing but the monitor's control panel? Does the software include anything vital?

I would not say that it is vital, but it can be useful if you don't have a calibrator. It may help you get more accurate colors out of your LCD.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: rxblitzrx
ViewSonic VP930b or NEC 90GX2

Which would you choose for internet browsing and reading text?

The ViewSonic VP930b has my pick. It has higher contrast.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Suetonius
Great thread!

But I don't see much about grayscale viewing - so here goes . . .

I request guidance in regards to 19" SXGA (not widescreen) LCD monitors that would be good for grayscale viewing.

I understand that the best my poor old video card (a PCI ATI Radeon 7500) can put out is 8-bit grayscale, so an 8-bit LCD monitor (256 shades of gray) should be a good match. A 6-bit LCD monitor, which is what I have now, only gives 64 shades of gray - this is insufficient for what I would like to be able to do.

My intention with the new LCD monitor is to view conventional grayscale x-ray images at home for educational purposes. Teaching files and the like.

Not for actual diagnostic work - 10-bit (1024 shades of gray) to 16-bit (65,536 shades of gray) monitors are used for serious grayscale imaging, but they tend to run a little bit higher in price than what I have in mind for a modest home computer setup.

Other than that, the monitor will be used for nothing more demanding than web-surfing, email and word processing. No gaming, no photographic work, no DVD watching - so the monitor can be slower than cold molasses (by gamers standards, anyway). I much prefer the 5:4 aspect ratio of the basic 19" 1280 X 1024 SXGA LCD monitor over a widescreen aspect ratio. The larger pixels of a 19" 1280 X 1024 monitor are also a plus for me - I need glasses to read print well and I tend to view a monitor at a distance of about 21". Glare-resistant screens are a plus - I find the reflections in glossy screens to be distracting.

I have already learned a considerable amount about LCD monitors from this thread. I would greatly appreciate further guidance in regard to my own situation.


Thank you,

Suetonius

For you, the NEC LCD1970NX (avoid the LCD1970VX which is a TN) looks like a good choice. It contains an 8-bit (256 shades per channel) S-IPS panel, albeit a slightly aged one. The LCD itself is of good quality (like all NECs). Street price is $389.99, and this sounds like a good place to order from:

B&H - NEC LCD1970NX

It may use the updated LM190E05 panel from LG Philips LCD. Whatever the case, I am pretty certain it's a true 8-bit panel. Image detail and contrast should be great with an S-IPS panel.

If/when you want to upgrade to 10-bit, I think ATI's 10 series (Xxxxx) graphics cards and NVIDIA's 8 series support 10-bit output. You'll have to decide if it's worth it to invest in a 10-bit setup now or not. If you do, keep in mind 10-bit LCDs are actually 8-bit LCDs with smarter dithering algorithms. There are no true 10-bit LCDs to my knowledge. (Maybe one of those $6000 NECs has it.)

 

[xboxist]

Received the 20WMGX2 today. First impression was that the default brightness exploded my eyeballs. The monitor is aesthetically pleasing, with a thin bezel and a nice polished look to it. I have one dead pixel, and while this super annoyed me for the first few minutes, I'm ok with it. It's near the lower edge, and lies about 1/8" above my taskbar. You don't see it in movies or games, so no big deal. Totally not worth returning it over and dealing with shipping hassles.

Very pleased. No other 20" that I've seen in stores comes close to the picture quality that this thing has. Most people would have reservations about a $600 price tag when you can buy the competition for $200-$300 less. Well, I'm here to say there's a damn fine reason that it costs what it does. It's the best. By far.

 

[raildogg]

Hello, I need a new widescreen monitor. I currently have a 19" CRT so I need at least a monitor in the 20-22" widescreen size range. I'm looking at the Dell 2007WFP, Samsung 225BW, LG L204WT and the Dell E228WFP. They are all in the similar price range except that the Dell and the LG are 20" while the Samsung and Dell are 22".

I am getting greedy and thinking about getting the Samsung 225BW or the Dell E228WFP. What would you suggest? Which one of these is best in terms of image quality and text quality?

Gaming is really not that big of a concern, but a nice image and nice text are the main criteria. I need a monitor to surf the web and read text.