League of Legends - F2P MOBA (like DOTA) part 2

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HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
You will defintely lag with 300-400 ms. The game is not even acceptable at 100ms. There's too much precise timing required that any significant amount of lag will cause the game to be virtually unplayable. You will die because you won't be able to react in time to do anything and you will be impossible to last hit creeps for gold.

Moba's are worse than FPS's when it comes to lag and how it affects your play.

I can certainly feel a difference when there is even a tiny lag spike. Summoner Abilities are also bugged a bit to not be as "fast" as they should be. You can watch this happen with streamers. I've seen both HotshotGG and BigfatLP having problems with abilities not going off while they are wailing on their keyboards to use the ability. It's easy to record and see them hitting the key repeatedly and not getting a corresponding action occurring in the game. I get this sometimes as well. This issue is only compounded more with higher pings and lag.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
Side note, had a good duo ranked game with Zebano last night. Hadn't played tristana in a long while. She is still not my favorite AD range, but I can use her. I ended up just farming like a madman that game until I had 350+ CS and way out farmed everyone else.
 

krnmastersgt

Platinum Member
Jan 10, 2008
2,873
0
0
What'd you run as your support bot lane? Tristana does extremely well in some kind of kill combo as her early damage output is decent with the 60% slow from Rocket Jump, not really a fan of just sitting and farming her early game away with a sustain heavy champ like Soraka since she's pretty weak in the mid-game compared to all the more popular AD carries.

On another note I looked up that match of yours, what possessed you to build a T-force and Aegis on Tristana?
 

zebano

Diamond Member
Jun 15, 2005
4,042
0
0
What'd you run as your support bot lane? Tristana does extremely well in some kind of kill combo as her early damage output is decent with the 60% slow from Rocket Jump, not really a fan of just sitting and farming her early game away with a sustain heavy champ like Soraka since she's pretty weak in the mid-game compared to all the more popular AD carries.

On another note I looked up that match of yours, what possessed you to build a T-force and Aegis on Tristana?

I was first pick and went Swain mid and fourth pick went Soraka which really isn't ideal with Tristana. I personally love Alistar or Leona with Tristana (I think J4 could work but Ali is the best due to having a heal). No idea why he built those items but I will note that our opponents had a single armor item among the 5 of them so last whisperer wasn't needed but I personally like the usual IE/LW/PD/FM on Tristana
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
What'd you run as your support bot lane? Tristana does extremely well in some kind of kill combo as her early damage output is decent with the 60% slow from Rocket Jump, not really a fan of just sitting and farming her early game away with a sustain heavy champ like Soraka since she's pretty weak in the mid-game compared to all the more popular AD carries.

On another note I looked up that match of yours, what possessed you to build a T-force and Aegis on Tristana?

I went aegis and Tforce for several reasons.

One they didn't get armor much armor at all. Only one person on the entire other team had any armor items at all.

I was heavily focused with flash + stun attacks by them. The other team's Casseopia was damn near doing this every time. The aegis gives me some health + MR to withstand a bit of burst. Same with the tri force. I'm personally not a fan of Phantom dancer on most champs. You get FAR more out of tri force than you do a phantom dancer for only 1K more gold.

Also, I was going to build for my last item an Atmas. I was over 2500 health. Atmas would have put me at 70% crit chance, 160 armor, and quite a bit of AD based off my health.

Personally as an AD carry I prefer TriForce + atmas combo unless the other team is seriously AP heavy.

I usually get a LW if the other team is stacking lots of armor on multiple champs. If it's just one champ being tanky then I focus them last. If I'm not being focused at all or my team is doing a good job of keeping people off me then I'll build a bit more heavily into DPS. If I the other team is just going to bum rush at me with everything they got in every 5v5 team fight, I need to get SOME tanky items. Otherwise I'll go down without doing anything. I've had that happen several times. By being a little tanky and sacrificing just a tiny bit of top end DPS, I am able to put out more DPS in the long run and allot my team to finish off the other team. Especially if the other team is going to burn all flashes + gap closer + ults to come at me every time. Which is exactly what was happening in that match. I didn't mind because the last 3 team fights I was usually the only single death for my team while we scored an Ace. I'll gladly take that death trade any day.
 

krnmastersgt

Platinum Member
Jan 10, 2008
2,873
0
0
I went aegis and Tforce for several reasons.

One they didn't get armor much armor at all. Only one person on the entire other team had any armor items at all.

I was heavily focused with flash + stun attacks by them. The other team's Casseopia was damn near doing this every time. The aegis gives me some health + MR to withstand a bit of burst. Same with the tri force. I'm personally not a fan of Phantom dancer on most champs. You get FAR more out of tri force than you do a phantom dancer for only 1K more gold.

Also, I was going to build for my last item an Atmas. I was over 2500 health. Atmas would have put me at 70% crit chance, 160 armor, and quite a bit of AD based off my health.

Personally as an AD carry I prefer TriForce + atmas combo unless the other team is seriously AP heavy.

I usually get a LW if the other team is stacking lots of armor on multiple champs. If it's just one champ being tanky then I focus them last. If I'm not being focused at all or my team is doing a good job of keeping people off me then I'll build a bit more heavily into DPS. If I the other team is just going to bum rush at me with everything they got in every 5v5 team fight, I need to get SOME tanky items. Otherwise I'll go down without doing anything. I've had that happen several times. By being a little tanky and sacrificing just a tiny bit of top end DPS, I am able to put out more DPS in the long run and allot my team to finish off the other team. Especially if the other team is going to burn all flashes + gap closer + ults to come at me every time. Which is exactly what was happening in that match. I didn't mind because the last 3 team fights I was usually the only single death for my team while we scored an Ace. I'll gladly take that death trade any day.

I understand somewhat why you chose those items now, but I still have to question the Aegis at least. It's an extremely cost effective item for the whole team but as an individual it's not all that great for the stats it gives you. If you were having trouble with magic damage I would have suggested a Hexdrinker. Doesn't give you hp but gives you more damage, almost the same MR and the 300 magic damage shield will make you deceptively tankier than you seem, at least the first time it goes off.

And yes T-Force has a great bunch of stats but I still wouldn't grab it on Tristana. The reason I love Tristana so much is that even if she is squishy as all hell she has 2 escapes, and is roughly tied for the longest auto attack range in the game with Kog'Maw, so while someone like Graves may get stuck in the thick of the fight Tristana should usually keep to the outskirts of a battle pecking off people that are unable to retaliate without substantial effort.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
I understand somewhat why you chose those items now, but I still have to question the Aegis at least. It's an extremely cost effective item for the whole team but as an individual it's not all that great for the stats it gives you. If you were having trouble with magic damage I would have suggested a Hexdrinker. Doesn't give you hp but gives you more damage, almost the same MR and the 300 magic damage shield will make you deceptively tankier than you seem, at least the first time it goes off.

And yes T-Force has a great bunch of stats but I still wouldn't grab it on Tristana. The reason I love Tristana so much is that even if she is squishy as all hell she has 2 escapes, and is roughly tied for the longest auto attack range in the game with Kog'Maw, so while someone like Graves may get stuck in the thick of the fight Tristana should usually keep to the outskirts of a battle pecking off people that are unable to retaliate without substantial effort.

Hex drinker was an option, but they weren't AP heavy. They had a balanced team with Renekton, Cass, Graves, Taric, and I'm having a hard time remembering the 5th. But they all had gap closers and/or CC (much of which was long range). They all burned everything they could to come from me. Almost every team fight one would wait to flank me to get the kill.

The Aegis gives me a decent amount of health, which stacks with Atmas for more dps eventually, Mr and armor. It is nice to have in a team fight as well considering the AoE damage the other team was still causing despite focusing on me as they were all capable of good AoE output damage.

I was trying to decide upon the most cost effective, and efficient tankish item at the time when the team fights were occurring while I was being focused by CC with gap closers and the other team was dishing out AoE dps. Aegis seemed the most logical choice at the time. It helped me out on all fronts as well as my team.
 
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The Green Bean

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2003
6,506
7
81
You will defintely lag with 300-400 ms. The game is not even acceptable at 100ms. There's too much precise timing required that any significant amount of lag will cause the game to be virtually unplayable. You will die because you won't be able to react in time to do anything and you will be impossible to last hit creeps for gold.

Moba's are worse than FPS's when it comes to lag and how it affects your play.

In that case, how easy is it to switch servers? Will I have to maintain a separate character for EU servers or will I be able to play with the same hero regardless of there I play most of the time? EU servers give me 150-200ms which should be much better--I often play RTS games, and even some FPS and end up doing just fine.

Where exactly are the LOL servers? I seem to get closer to 300ms on the East coast and 400 towards the west. I ditched DSL for Wimax and my new connection is pretty stable; I don't really get spikes but about a 1% packet loss on average. Good enough?

I just played a game. We lost and I was a newbie. Got to level 14 (while everyone else was about 18). Did not really notice any lag but that might be because I really don't know how to play.
 
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krnmastersgt

Platinum Member
Jan 10, 2008
2,873
0
0
In that case, how easy is it to switch servers? Will I have to maintain a separate character for EU servers or will I be able to play with the same hero regardless of there I play most of the time? EU servers give me 150-200ms which should be much better--I often play RTS games, and even some FPS and end up doing just fine.

Where exactly are the LOL servers? I seem to get closer to 300ms on the East coast and 400 towards the west. I ditched DSL for Wimax and my new connection is pretty stable; I don't really get spikes but about a 1% packet loss on average. Good enough?

I just played a game. We lost and I was a newbie. Got to level 14 (while everyone else was about 18). Did not really notice any lag but that might be because I really don't know how to play.

You can change servers in the launch/patch client, not sure about now but in the past the EU servers were usually behind on the patches that the NA servers were running so people switching between both essentially re-patched the same files quite a lot.

You will need a new account for the EU servers as they are in no way tied to the NA server, which btw is located in Southern California. Even among the EU servers depending on which you play (East or West servers) you'll need a different account as they are independent of each other.
 

Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
31,966
10,649
136
jesus delusion and i got trolled so hard last night. i dont want to even talk about it, lol.

had 2 games won, and blew both thanks to lack of team coordination and/or crappy teammates. (snowball build = ffffffuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu)
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
jesus delusion and i got trolled so hard last night. i dont want to even talk about it, lol.

had 2 games won, and blew both thanks to lack of team coordination and/or crappy teammates. (snowball build = ffffffuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu)

Did you lose 3v5? I did. That's how hard I got trolled one game with an 0/14 nocturne on my team. Worst part was I think the other 4 people on my team were all pre-made. Which means I was on a pre-made troll team that lost to only a team of 3.
 

xSkyDrAx

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2003
7,706
1
0
In that case, how easy is it to switch servers? Will I have to maintain a separate character for EU servers or will I be able to play with the same hero regardless of there I play most of the time? EU servers give me 150-200ms which should be much better--I often play RTS games, and even some FPS and end up doing just fine.

Where exactly are the LOL servers? I seem to get closer to 300ms on the East coast and 400 towards the west. I ditched DSL for Wimax and my new connection is pretty stable; I don't really get spikes but about a 1% packet loss on average. Good enough?

I just played a game. We lost and I was a newbie. Got to level 14 (while everyone else was about 18). Did not really notice any lag but that might be because I really don't know how to play.


If you did not notice any lag then you should be okay. If you lag in this game you will definitely notice as character commands will be very delayed and animations will be totally screwy in general.
 

Firsttime

Platinum Member
Mar 31, 2005
2,517
0
71
Did you lose 3v5? I did. That's how hard I got trolled one game with an 0/14 nocturne on my team. Worst part was I think the other 4 people on my team were all pre-made. Which means I was on a pre-made troll team that lost to only a team of 3.

We got stuck in some retarded high elo normal where our mixture of gold/plat players thought they would just go snowball items and win. Some useless shit. It felt way heavier then playing with 2k elo players should feel.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
We got stuck in some retarded high elo normal where our mixture of gold/plat players thought they would just go snowball items and win. Some useless shit. It felt way heavier then playing with 2k elo players should feel.

Wait.. your team had gold/plat players on it and they all decided to go with snowball items but failed? Or the other team was all gold/plat players that went all snowball items and won? I'm confused.
 

Chiropteran

Diamond Member
Nov 14, 2003
9,811
110
106
New Skins in the Store

Royal Guard Fiora
Nightraven Fiora
Bladecraft Orianna
PVP.net v1.55

Ranked Teams
Fixed a bug with the background on the Team Invite popup
Fixed a bug where Team status would be missing on the Team Profile
Fixed a bug where Ranked Team specific notifications would not send properly
Fixed several bugs with client side stat calculation and display
League of Legends v1.0.0.135

Fiora, The Grand Duelist

Duelist (passive) - Fiora regenerates health over 6 seconds each time she deals damage. Striking champions will cause this effect to stack up to 4 times.
Lunge - Fiora dashes forward to strike her target, dealing physical damage. Fiora can perform the dash a second time within a couple seconds at no mana cost.
Riposte - Fiora's Attack Damage is increased. When activated, Fiora parries the next basic attack and reflects magic damage back to the attacker. Works against champions, monsters, and large minions.
Burst of Speed - Fiora temporarily gains additional Attack Speed. Each basic attack or Lunge she lands during this time increases her Movement Speed. Killing a champion refreshes the cooldown on Burst of Speed.
Blade Waltz (ultimate) - Fiora dashes around the battlefield to deal physical damage to enemy champions. Successive strikes against the same target deal less damage.
Alistar

Triumphant Roar mana cost increased to 28/41/54/67/80 from 20/35/50/65/80
Unbreakable Will mana cost reduced to 100 from 150
Trample damage increased to 10-27 per second from 10-23
Fizz

Base damage increased to 56 from 54
Armor per level increased to 3.4 from 3.1
Churn the Waters mana cost reduced to 100 from 150
Galio

Idol of Durand damage range increased to 600 from 575
Irelia

Fixed a particle issue with Transcendent Blades (Hotfixed 2/21)
Jax

Fixed a bug where Grandmaster's Might passive attack canceled if the buff ran out during the attack animation
Lee Sin

Sonic Wave base damage increased to 50/80/110/140/170 from 45/75/105/135/165 (Hotfixed 2/21 due to an unintended nerf in the Nautilus patch)
Lux

Lucent Singularity
Now additionally grants vision while in flight to its destination
Now starts its cooldown when cast rather than when detonated
Cooldown increased to 10 seconds from 9
Now displays a buff showing how long Lucent Singularity will last until it automatically detonates
Finales Funkeln
Now grants vision of the affected area during the spell and vision of enemy champions hit for a short duration afterwards
Lux can no longer use Flash while casting Finales Funkeln
Malphite

Granite Shield now shows a cooldown timer
Unstoppable Force
Area of effect radius on impact increased to 325 from 300
Malphite can no longer flash while using Unstoppable Force
Fixed a bug where Malphite would seem to hit the target but would not cause the effect
Miss Fortune

Strut now shows a cooldown timer
Nocturne

Umbra Blades now has a passive cooldown timer like Ziggs and Shen
Olaf

Axe Throw
Damage increased to 80-260 from 50-210
Scaling changed to +1.0 bonus AD from +0.5 total AD
Base cooldown reduced to 8 seconds from 10
Cooldown reduction for picking up the axe reduced to 4.5 seconds from 6
Ragnarok now provides 30/45/60 Armor and Magic Resist instead of 20/30/40 flat damage reduction
Movement Speed increased to 325 from 320
Poppy

Paragon of Demacia now shows you over its icon how many stacks you have
Shen

Fixed a few bugs with ability sounds
The following changes were hotfixed out on 2/21:
Base armor reduced to 19 from 23
Vorpal Blade health scaling lowered to 1.5% from 2%
Feint Energy cost increased to 50 from 40 at all levels
Base shield value reduced to 70/115/160/205/250 from 70/120/170/220/270
Teemo

Health per level increased to 82 from 77
Move Quick's passive component now shows a cooldown timer
Noxious Trap arm time reduced to 1 seconds from 2
Tristana

Explosive Shot cast range increased to 625 from 600
Ziggs

Hexplosive Mines
Mana cost reduced to 70/80/90/100/110 from 80/90/100/110/120
Slow duration reduced to 1.5 seconds from 2
Damage from 2nd and subsequent mines reduced to 40% from 50%
Fixed a bug where Ziggs' Mad Scientist skin was leaving particles on the map (Hotfixed 2/21)
Items

Madred's Bloodrazor attack damage increased to 40 from 30
General

Improved minimap visibility of turrets in Colorblind Mode
Colorblind announcement colors now reference blue (friendly) and purple (enemy) teams
Important items purchased by your team will now be called out in chat (Aura items, Sight and Vision Wards, top tier items, etc)
Champion Kill messages are now more specific
You can now activate a timestamp for game chat in the options menu
When colorblind mode is activated, movement cursor is included with new color scheme (was not before)
Announcer callouts no longer reference blue team/purple team, and instead should reference friendly/enemy team (ie. A friendly inhibitor is respawning soon/the enemy inhibitor has respawned)
Champions will now attempt to run home immediately when disconnecting, rather than attempting to Recall
Small monster camp sigils now restore up to 30 Mana in addition to Health
Small Golem camp
Movement Speed increased to 300 from 180
Medium Golem base damage increased to 59 from 54
Fixed a bug where whisper messages were the wrong color
Co-Op Versus AI

Added Blitzcrank bot to the roster of bots in Co-Op versus AI.
Improved bots' ability to last hit and reduced how much they push their lanes.
Reduced the amount of gold given to bots on Summoner's Rift Intermediate.
Added the ability for bots to call for help from nearby bots.
Improved the precision of skill shots and ground targeted AoE abilities.
Minor bug fixes with Leona, Lux, and Shyvana bots.
Art

Fixed animation bugs on the following skins:
Toy Soldier Gangplank
Jade Dragon Wukong
Superb Villain Veigar
Headhunter Master Yi

New patch. I haven't bought any riot points in a long time, I typically have enough IP to buy the occasional new champion I want to play. However, I haven't been playing as much this last week and I just blew 6k points on Nautilus so I am a bit short... and Fiora sounds like exactly what I'd like to play. So, I am fighting the urge to pull out a credit card.
 
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crownjules

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2005
4,858
0
76
Change to Lux's E is good but will make her even more mana hungry in the early levels. They should make it so that she has vision of anyone with her passive on them.
 

xSkyDrAx

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2003
7,706
1
0
Seen way too many Lux's this week trying to AP carry in mid and getting utterly utterly destroyed. This is on both my team and oppossing. Her buffs aren't even strength buffs but everyone plays her like she just her ratios went through the roof lol
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
LOL, quit for like a month, came back for a day and banned. Bunch of douchebags on opposing team didn't like that I said smoking pot was bad. Leaving games and trolling doesn't do it, but telling people drugs is bad apparently is against the rules. Love that Riot still doesn't care about anything going on in their own game as long as they keep making money. Well, never installing again.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
LOL, quit for like a month, came back for a day and banned. Bunch of douchebags on opposing team didn't like that I said smoking pot was bad. Leaving games and trolling doesn't do it, but telling people drugs is bad apparently is against the rules. Love that Riot still doesn't care about anything going on in their own game as long as they keep making money. Well, never installing again.

Umm, you can't be banned for that. Unfortunately, Riot doesn't list the reason why you were banned so you are only making an assumption as to why. You already stated you have a past of trolling, so methinks it just finally caught up with you.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
Side note, I made a smurf account, and got my GF to actually play one bot game with me. That was interesting to say the least. She could barely figure out how to play and kept running right at the towers for awhile. She basically hates having to right click every where. Oh well, since it was a bot game I wasn't going to lose that one at all

On my main account I did have a couple trollish games. Again it was a case of restarting the game and getting stuck with the same 3 man pre made 3 times in a row. They were just BAD. I finally joined for the fourth time on the opposite team and completely ROLLED them. First three games I was barely able to do anything because they were failing so hard in their lanes early. I would be doing well in my lane, but then the enemy jungler would just camp me where ever I was at. At which point I would start to lose my lane when they could repeatedly tower dive me and live through the tower hits.

What's worse is that those 3 were originally blaming me. Can't check at work but I think that was my losing streak where I went fiora, ryze, and something else. I had the best scores for my team as well and the scores there were horrible. Suffice it to say, I completely obliterated them right after that when I got on the other team. They weren't just bad, they were ridiculously bad.

Other than that, I had some interesting games where I carried a sub par team to the win. All it takes is getting people to actually follow you around. I'm serious. As long as the other team doesn't have too huge an advantage then your team can still come back even if a little bit behind. The trick is getting people to coordinate, but most of the time getting people to do that is like herding cats.

Also, I ran into an interesting problem one game. I was playing as graves. I was winning my lane bot somewhat. I was grouped up with a Soraka bottom. The other 4 players were a pre-made. They were Rumble at top, Maokai jungle, and Ahri in mid. I was thinking it wasn't a bad team comp at all. I was going against a Sivir and Taric bottom. Top on other team was Riven, can't remember their mid, and their jungle was Udyr.

Both Rumble and Maokai were feeding badly. By 10 minutes they were both 0/4/0 each. Ahri was getting beat in mid too with 1/2/0 score. I was 1/0/0 after making a kill against taric. Udyr basically ended up camping bot against us, but couldn't actually kill me. The Soraka kept getting caught though and was 0/3/1. The soraka was blaming me for not being aggressive enough, although I was harassing like crazy, out CSing Sivir, and got the kill on Taric when I tower dove him without Soraka there.

Still Soraka was basically telling me over and over, you need to go balls deep Graves! Your passive saves you against them. I said yah only when I auto attack does my passive give me a minor Ar/Mr boost that stacks up to 10 times. But at low levels I don't have the attack speed to make great use out of it. In order to get any attack speed I have to dash forward. If I dash forward first then Taric is waiting there to pop me with a stun which nulls out my attack speed boost and any form of stacks I may have started. On top of that, if I Q as I dash in then Sivir can pop her spell shield and block any damage I've done. Which means I have to be sneakier in how I approach my harassment against them since Soraka can't set up a kill for me. Cause trust me I tried dashing forward a few times to harass harder. I only got a Taric stun in the face with a Sivir Boomerang right behind it for my actions. After almost dying a few times to that I said no more and changed tactics to something that worked.

But even though I was doing well, as I said my team mates weren't. So the moment that the 20 minute mark rolled around the 4 from the pre-made surrendered. I didnt even have a chance to see if I could carry that game. Oh well.
 

zebano

Diamond Member
Jun 15, 2005
4,042
0
0
I played like 5 games in a row on Udyr yesterday; The man-bear-bird is so beast. Run into 3 enemies, stun, turtle, run away, never die.

Anyone jungle on TT? ONly my Trundle is up to snuff for that and I can state for a certainty that Shyvana and Lee Sin are simply better junglers. I'm trying to decide if I want to follow the crowd and learn Lee Singah finally but I think Mundo, Cho and Olaf could do a reasonably good job.... not enough time. Any advice?
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
I played like 5 games in a row on Udyr yesterday; The man-bear-bird is so beast. Run into 3 enemies, stun, turtle, run away, never die.

Anyone jungle on TT? ONly my Trundle is up to snuff for that and I can state for a certainty that Shyvana and Lee Sin are simply better junglers. I'm trying to decide if I want to follow the crowd and learn Lee Singah finally but I think Mundo, Cho and Olaf could do a reasonably good job.... not enough time. Any advice?

Trundle is low end of the totem pole for junglers. He's not as bad as say, jungle Soraka, but he's not longer top tier jungler like he once was. Mundo, Cho and Olaf are still good junglers though right now. Good clearing speed, decent ganks, and are useful in team fights late game. That's what makes them good junglers compared to others. Their main problems is lack of 1v1 jungle dueling abilities where a lee sin at level 2 or 3 is going to rock any of those if lee sin comes to counter jungle and a duel starts. That's why they aren't considered as good as lee sin or shyvana.

As far as Udyr goes, he most certainly is a besat. His only downside is late game he falls off a bit, especially against good range AD carries. His nemesis is Ashe as she can kite him all day long. An udyr can't do anything against a good ashe at all 1v1. He has no gap closer unless you have a flash. Still a good ashe wll have a flash and do it as soon as you do.
 
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