League of Legends - F2P MOBA (like DOTA) part 2

[Firsttime]

Riot just fired back fucking hard at Valve.

http://eune.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=346882

 

[ImpulsE69]

Riot just fired back fucking hard at Valve.

http://eune.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=346882

4th post sums it up perfectly.

8 Hours Ago Sounds sweet, but I'm not gonna get any it

 

[Firsttime]

That's most likely true for all of us haha. Still nice to know that the game that has coerced me into spending grotesque amounts of money on skins isn't just giving up on the hardcore community because of Dota 2. I know a lot of people kinda felt that might happen after the Dominion announcement.

 

[Firsttime]

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=1102898

Supports are getting hit hard. I kinda love it, these changes should shake the meta up a bit. Although the potential side effects are now Janna will be god tier, and Alistar and Taric are both still solid so the pool of viable supports may have just been lowered. That said I really hope these changes will spur some innovation in the bottom lane. I'd like to see some tanky dps or AP down there.

 

[crownjules]

I've been saying for the longest time that Soraka's biggest problem is the amount of mana she gets back from Infuse. That's the whole reason why she's one of the hardest to push out of a duo lane. She never runs out of mana and therefore she can always heal. About time they addressed that. But I don't understand why they're reducing the healing power of Wish so much when they stated they want to cut down on her sustain while still giving her the power to save people when needed.

 

[HumblePie]

can't read the link, can someone post what it contains?

 

[crownjules]

Still subject to change, nor is it the full extent of the changes planned to sustainability.

Soraka
* Starcall
** Cooldown reduced to 2.5 from 3
** Base damage reduced to 60/85/110/135/160 from 60/90/120/150/180
** AP ratio increased to .4 from .25
** Mana cost reduced to 35/40/45/50/55 from 40/50/60/70/80
** Shred increased to 8/9/10/11/12 from 8/8/8/8/8
** Maximum stacks reduced to 10 from 20

* Astral Blessing
** AP Ratio reduced to 0.45 from 0.9
** Cooldown increased to 20 from 10
** Base Heal increased to 65/130/195/260/325 from 60/120/180/240/300
** Armor Buff increased to 25/50/75/100/125 from 20/35/50/65/80
** Armor buff duration increased to 5 from 4
** Cast range increased to 750 from 650

* Infuse
** AP ratio increased to .75 from .6
** Cooldown reduced to 10 from 15
** Silence duration compressed to 1.5/1.75/2/2.25/2.5 from 1/1.5/2/2.5/3
** No longer grants double mana to soraka on selfcast.


* Wish
** Wish AP ratio reduced to 0.7 from 1.3
** Base heal reduced to 200/300/400 from 200/320/440
** Mana cost reduced to 100/175/250 from 200/275/350

Sona
* Aria of Perseverance
** Base heal reduced to 25/50/75/100/125 from 35/70/105/140/175
** AP Ratio reduced to .25 from .35
** Now grants double her passive aura bonus to her heal target and herself for 3 seconds.
* Fixed a bug where Hymn of Valor and Aria of Perseverance caused her to deal 20% reduced damage
* Reduced the lockout time while casting Sona's songs to make them more responsive.

 

[TheUnk]

* Astral Blessing
** AP Ratio reduced to 0.45 from 0.9
** Cooldown increased to 20 from 10

The other stuff isn't bad, but this is overkill..

Half the AP ratio, double the cooldown?

So basically at 40% CDR you can heal every 12 seconds. Pretty much 1 heal a teamfight.

 

[ImpulsE69]

I think it is fine in the grand scheme of things. Am I the only one that thinks there are way too many self healing characters? Practically all new characters in the last 4-5 months self heal. This has made the support healers even more OP to the whole team. They either need to get rid of all self healing characters (or at least make it unique to 1-2 chars) or nerf the support healers.

 

[videogames101]

Riot just fired back fucking hard at Valve.

http://eune.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=346882

That would be true if there were actually a $5 million dollar prize, but there isn't.

 

[Firsttime]

Yes. WAAAAY too much sustain in this game. I feel it's partially needed to make up for the lack of TP scrolls, walking to and from the fountain is boring. But still. There is so much sustain, through life steal, spell vamp and heals. When I played Dota there were only a few heroes with heals and I can only think of Skeleton King off the top of my head with innate lifesteal. Spell vamp didn't exist. Not saying LoL should copy, just that sustain is one of the big differences currently between the two.

 

[Firsttime]

That would be true if there were actually a $5 million dollar prize, but there isn't.

I'll take 5 mil spread out over a season instead of the International hype fest thing. $5 mil will do a lot to grow the competitive community. It's way better for there to be a lot of teams that can support themselves through tourneys and what not rather then one team winning the lottery. I think Dota 2 will have the same kind of winnings in their tourneys eventually, I know when I was into Dota hardcore a few of the top teams were pretty much able to play full time, I'm sure they still are. I'm just saying I like what Riot did here, I think it was the right thing for the game and the competitive community.

 

[crownjules]

I think it is fine in the grand scheme of things. Am I the only one that thinks there are way too many self healing characters? Practically all new characters in the last 4-5 months self heal. This has made the support healers even more OP to the whole team. They either need to get rid of all self healing characters (or at least make it unique to 1-2 chars) or nerf the support healers.

It's not that many. Of the non-support champs released this year, Renekton, Maokai, Nocturne, Yorick, and Skarner have heals. That's 5 out of 14 champs. You also have Karma, who's very meh, and Orianna if you count her shield as a heal. Outside of maybe Noc, none of them are really must have champs on a team if you're playing to win. But I agree, it gets compounded when they have a strong Soraka or Sona to back up their minor healing.

I've been trying my hand at HoN since it went F2P and the noticeable lack of sustain in the early games is a huge adjustment. But it's a tradeoff. It means less harass and the only way to "deny" is to kill your own minions. I don't think you could zone in HoN anywhere near as effectively as you can in LoL. But then the problem in LoL is that there's not really that much space to zone effectively between the towers before you push the creeps into the tower (inevitable, you're last hitting and they are not) and then you overextend and risk a jungle gank.

 

[Malak]

AD Janna is the only Janna.

 

[crownjules]

Changes to Nidalee and Taric:

Taric - (The comprehensive Taric changes will be out the following patch)
* Base attack speed increased to .625 from .613
* Imbue
** Ability power ratio reduced to 0.6 from 1.1
** Cooldown increased to 24/23/22/21/20 seconds from 16/15/14/13/12
** Basic attacks against enemy champions now reduce Imbue’s cooldown by 4 seconds (still 2 seconds against other targets)

Nidalee
* Javelin Toss
** Mana Cost reduced to 50/60/70/80/90 from 60/70/80/90/100
** Cooldown reduced to 6 from 7
* Pounce
** May now be affected by cooldown reduction
** Cooldown increased to 3.5 from 3
* Primal Surge
** Mana cost changed to 60/80/100/120/140
** Base heal changed to 50/85/120/155/190 from 60/90/120/150/180
** AP ratio reduced to 0.7 from 1.25
* Swipe AP ratio increased to 0.4 from 0.2
* Aspect of the Cougar now grants 10/15/20 Armor and Magic Resist instead of 10% Dodge
* General
** Cleaned up a lot of Nidalee's tooltips, especially Cougar form

They also increased Soraka's Starfall range by 30 and decided to keep Wish's base heal amount the same (rather than the reduction they were planning).

 

[Chiropteran]

I wish they would just re-implement the original version of executioner's calling, or add a similar item, perhaps designed to work on AP champions as well.

Ignite is nice, but the couple champions that have healing reduction abilities are the wrong solutions. Blind pick is so annoying because you can't predict a full-support healer team so when you do get one and you only have 1 ignite you are just out of luck.

Generally nerfing support champions seems dumb as well, here is why:

(I'm using "DPS" interchangeably between carry style dps and tank dps) If you only have 1 champion, dps > support. If you have 2 and support is strong enough, support + dps > 2 dps. But then you run into the problem of 3 support + 2 dps being >>>>> any normal team comp without support. So basically if they nerf support down to where a support stacked team is outright bad, there will never be any reason to play any support. While if support is sorta good in a 2 champion lane, it'll be OP in a 5v5 with multiple support. That is why I suggest a counter-heal item. You can then make support somewhat stronger in a team fight by default, but risky in that the enemy who builds the counter item erases that advantage.

That, and I wish they would bring back wit's end, and while they are at it return all champions to use mana. Maybe I should just quit LoL and play dota 2.

 

[HumblePie]

I wish they would just re-implement the original version of executioner's calling, or add a similar item, perhaps designed to work on AP champions as well.

Ignite is nice, but the couple champions that have healing reduction abilities are the wrong solutions. Blind pick is so annoying because you can't predict a full-support healer team so when you do get one and you only have 1 ignite you are just out of luck.

Generally nerfing support champions seems dumb as well, here is why:

(I'm using "DPS" interchangeably between carry style dps and tank dps) If you only have 1 champion, dps > support. If you have 2 and support is strong enough, support + dps > 2 dps. But then you run into the problem of 3 support + 2 dps being >>>>> any normal team comp without support. So basically if they nerf support down to where a support stacked team is outright bad, there will never be any reason to play any support. While if support is sorta good in a 2 champion lane, it'll be OP in a 5v5 with multiple support. That is why I suggest a counter-heal item. You can then make support somewhat stronger in a team fight by default, but risky in that the enemy who builds the counter item erases that advantage.

That, and I wish they would bring back wit's end, and while they are at it return all champions to use mana. Maybe I should just quit LoL and play dota 2.

Yah, I was thinking that as well. Unless you are MF, or Tristana you need ignite to stop healing. Otherwise you might be totally screwed. A team with a WW, Soraka, Taric, Xin, and some other tankish char with life drain/stealing is damn near impossible to take out in team fights without ignites or anti healing chars. I've seen it. Your only hope is to peel one or two of them away to gank them instead of trying full team fights, OR to stomp them so hard early on they never have a chance to come back.

I know as I play support chars that I can keep most teams (that are complete idiots) going through a team fight damn near indefinitely once I am moderately leveled with a few core items.

As was said above me, an item based solution of reducing healing needs to be brought back. Preferably one that is "stacking" but in small amounts and to a small stack limit at least. And add the effect to more than just one item so as not to make only one type of character on a team able to use it either.

 

[Firsttime]

So I just experienced an interesting bug. It wouldn't go away even when I restarted my client. Here's a screen.

The blind monk was really blind all game. Still managed to go 13-4-20 carrying to the win haha. Because that's just how the blind monk rolls.

 

[videogames101]

I'll take 5 mil spread out over a season instead of the International hype fest thing. $5 mil will do a lot to grow the competitive community. It's way better for there to be a lot of teams that can support themselves through tourneys and what not rather then one team winning the lottery. I think Dota 2 will have the same kind of winnings in their tourneys eventually, I know when I was into Dota hardcore a few of the top teams were pretty much able to play full time, I'm sure they still are. I'm just saying I like what Riot did here, I think it was the right thing for the game and the competitive community.

Lol wat? DotA2 isn't even in BETA yet, and they already have a 1.6 million euro tourny, and somehow thats just hype? It's a sign that it's going to be a real e-sport, because I'm not sure if you knew, LoL is not looked upon very well as a competitive game, despite all the "5 million" marketing.

 

[ImpulsE69]

Most non videogame competitors don't consider DOTA or anything of the sort a competitive game either. So, really your point is moot. Me personally..I play games to play games. Now hand me my cheesypoofs.

 

[randay]

Lol wat? DotA2 isn't even in BETA yet, and they already have a 1.6 million euro tourny, and somehow thats just hype? It's a sign that it's going to be a real e-sport, because I'm not sure if you knew, LoL is not looked upon very well as a competitive game, despite all the "5 million" marketing.

the ironing is strong here.

"Dota2 isn't even in BETA yet"

"somehow thats just hype?"

"It's a sign that it's going to be"

uh huh.

 

[nsafreak]

So, I've tried my best in ranked and I'm just not able to carry my entire team to victory. I will be the first to admit that I've had some bad games in ranked but even when I do just about everything right like I did in my most recent game with Vayne (9-6-3) I still can't manage to carry the entire team. I participated in all the teamfights, pushed lanes when I could, etc. just no luck. My elo is now at a horribad 700 something and I just can't seem to pull out of it. In solo normal I do just fine, my w/l ratio typically sits a few games above .500. It fluctuates a bit going to as high as 15 games over to only 2-3 over but I typically have more wins than losses in normal queue. So would anybody be interested in dual queuing ranked with me every now and then? Either that or if somebody wants to play with me in normal queue and let me know what I'm doing wrong that'd be a help.

Just for informational purposes:

Tank: Amumu or Singed (Cho'Gath every now and then)
Carry: Vayne, Ashe or Annie
Support: Morgana or Soraka
Jungle: Udyr

 

[Firsttime]

Lol wat? DotA2 isn't even in BETA yet, and they already have a 1.6 million euro tourny, and somehow thats just hype? It's a sign that it's going to be a real e-sport, because I'm not sure if you knew, LoL is not looked upon very well as a competitive game, despite all the "5 million" marketing.

I'm not sure what you're after here. Dota has never been taken seriously in NA. When I used to play in in house leagues with "pro" players it wasn't even taken sorta seriously by the gaming scene. When we were able to get our own section on gosu gamers there was like an outcry from the WC3 community. People saying "is footies (another custom map) next?" But we took the needed steps to grow our community. Now it is taken infinetly more seriously then it was when I started. As for why the international is a hype fest you summed it up well.

 

[Kabob]

So, I've had 10 buddies sign up for LoL with me as their reference so I get a 975 RP champ, between Vlad, Irelia, Vayne, and Karthus, who should I go for?

 

[Chiropteran]

So, I've had 10 buddies sign up for LoL with me as their reference so I get a 975 RP champ, between Vlad, Irelia, Vayne, and Karthus, who should I go for?

Based on playing against them, irelia seems the most blatantly OP of the champions you list. But I'd go for something you are lacking. If you need a tanky AP, vlad. A more glass-connon style AP, take karthus. An AD (or truedamage) carry, take vayne. If you just want some easy wins, take irelia.