Lightweight browser recommendations?

desidude

Member
Oct 16, 2010
82
0
66
Hi friends,

I hope everyone is doing well. I am using an older model Lenovo T61 thinkpad (2008). It is operating MS Windows Home 7 premium 32-bit. It has an Intel Core2 Duo CPU T8100 and 2GB Ram.

I tend to have 4-5 browser windows open, each with 4-5 tabs. I am not doing any streaming, audio, video, just day to day browsing, mostly academic related.

I notice that my browser tends to slow down when I have a couple of browser windows open.

I am looking for a lightweight browser to use....any suggestions please?

Thanks!
desidude
 

Chiefcrowe

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2008
5,044
184
116
IMO your RAM is probably limiting you more than the browser...so keeping that in mind -

Opera may work for you, or I also heard Midori is light.
 

stockwiz

Senior member
Sep 8, 2013
403
15
81
opera 20 is a clone of chrome... just installed them both.

Suck it up and live with it perhaps.... when you use older technology it's gonna happen. Some people still try using these ancient laptops with XP on them.... it's funny to watch them take 10 minutes to just boot up... ya get what ya pay for...
 

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
57,991
8,226
126
I'd use Firefox, and instead of opening windows, use tab groups. That's an under appreciated feature of Firefox. Block ads, and anything else you don't need. Midori is probably the lightest I'm aware of that resembles a modern browser, but it's more the content that uses resources, rather than the browser itself.
 

Virgorising

Diamond Member
Apr 9, 2013
4,470
0
0
IMO your RAM is probably limiting you more than the browser...so keeping that in mind -

Opera may work for you, or I also heard Midori is light.

I was JUST ABOUT TO say the same.

Also, is what you allow to start with Windows cut to the bone?

If not, cut it. To the bone.
 

Ketchup

Elite Member
Sep 1, 2002
14,553
248
106
Chrome and Opera are RAM HOGS. And you are using about half the amount of RAM that will allow 7 to run decent.

If you can't upgrade the amount of RAM, using Firefox or IE with minimal add-ons should help. For example, ABP and is a great add-on, but can be quite a RAM hog as well.
 

code65536

Golden Member
Mar 7, 2006
1,006
0
76
Chrome and IE are very wasteful of RAM; Firefox is the most RAM-efficient browser.

The bigger problem is that the modern web has gotten heavier and heavier in terms of resource footprint. Ever taken a look at the gigantic JavaScript libraries that lazy web developers use these days to do even simple things?

There was one time when my Firefox was using 6GB of RAM (I had hundreds of tabs, and this was the 64-bit version), and then I opened about:config and flipped the option to disable JavaScript. Within a minute, that RAM usage had fallen to just 3GB. (As a programmer who knows how, in general, these sorts of things are implemented, it doesn't surprise me one bit that this is the case.)

So, you want a light-weight browser? Use Firefox with the NoScript add-on. You don't have to disable all JavaScript--I even turned on the option in NoScript to automatically enable same-site JS. But once you have NoScript, you'll see just how bad the JS pollution problem had gotten because NS shows you what it's blocking.

For example, at forums.anandtech.com, there's JS from *11* different domains. I enabled the JS from anandtech.com (the only one I needed for this site) and left the rest disabled. I do this with all other sites: enable just the JS needed for the functionality that I want and care about, and it makes a HUGE difference in the resource footprint.

And this is another reason why Chrome sucks. Not only is is more RAM-hungry to begin with, it lacks the kind of extensibility to give you this kind of fine-grained control.
 
Last edited:

stockwiz

Senior member
Sep 8, 2013
403
15
81
Chrome and IE are very wasteful of RAM; Firefox is the most RAM-efficient browser.

The bigger problem is that the modern web has gotten heavier and heavier in terms of resource footprint. Ever taken a look at the gigantic JavaScript libraries that lazy web developers use these days to do even simple things?

There was one time when my Firefox was using 6GB of RAM (I had hundreds of tabs, and this was the 64-bit version), and then I opened about:config and flipped the option to disable JavaScript. Within a minute, that RAM usage had fallen to just 3GB. (As a programmer who knows how, in general, these sorts of things are implemented, it doesn't surprise me one bit that this is the case.)

So, you want a light-weight browser? Use Firefox with the NoScript add-on. You don't have to disable all JavaScript--I even turned on the option in NoScript to automatically enable same-site JS. But once you have NoScript, you'll see just how bad the JS pollution problem had gotten because NS shows you what it's blocking.

For example, at forums.anandtech.com, there's JS from *11* different domains. I enabled the JS from anandtech.com (the only one I needed for this site) and left the rest disabled. I do this with all other sites: enable just the JS needed for the functionality that I want and care about, and it makes a HUGE difference in the resource footprint.

And this is another reason why Chrome sucks. Not only is is more RAM-hungry to begin with, it lacks the kind of extensibility to give you this kind of fine-grained control.


nice post (most useful so far) , thanks. Maybe I'll put noscript on my firefox installation.
 

Insert_Nickname

Diamond Member
May 6, 2012
4,971
1,693
136
So, you want a light-weight browser? Use Firefox with the NoScript add-on. You don't have to disable all JavaScript--I even turned on the option in NoScript to automatically enable same-site JS. But once you have NoScript, you'll see just how bad the JS pollution problem had gotten because NS shows you what it's blocking.

This^^

I'll also recommend flashblock or equivalent, that saves an awful lot of ad rendering...
 

Rayb

Member
Dec 31, 2008
122
1
76
Chrome and IE are very wasteful of RAM; Firefox is the most RAM-efficient browser.

The bigger problem is that the modern web has gotten heavier and heavier in terms of resource footprint. Ever taken a look at the gigantic JavaScript libraries that lazy web developers use these days to do even simple things?

There was one time when my Firefox was using 6GB of RAM (I had hundreds of tabs, and this was the 64-bit version), and then I opened about:config and flipped the option to disable JavaScript. Within a minute, that RAM usage had fallen to just 3GB. (As a programmer who knows how, in general, these sorts of things are implemented, it doesn't surprise me one bit that this is the case.)

So, you want a light-weight browser? Use Firefox with the NoScript add-on. You don't have to disable all JavaScript--I even turned on the option in NoScript to automatically enable same-site JS. But once you have NoScript, you'll see just how bad the JS pollution problem had gotten because NS shows you what it's blocking.

For example, at forums.anandtech.com, there's JS from *11* different domains. I enabled the JS from anandtech.com (the only one I needed for this site) and left the rest disabled. I do this with all other sites: enable just the JS needed for the functionality that I want and care about, and it makes a HUGE difference in the resource footprint.

And this is another reason why Chrome sucks. Not only is is more RAM-hungry to begin with, it lacks the kind of extensibility to give you this kind of fine-grained control.

Amen to that! There's a reason why Firefox with ABP and NoScript should be in everybody's top priority list for a better browsing experience. When you're unable to have the latest hardware, every little bit helps.
 

bunnyfubbles

Lifer
Sep 3, 2001
12,248
3
0
Amen to that! There's a reason why Firefox with ABP and NoScript should be in everybody's top priority list for a better browsing experience. When you're unable to have the latest hardware, every little bit helps.

even on my high end rigs its a night and day better experience to be able to trim all that fat

sure, it can be annoying at times to manually white-list, but I find once I get a solid base going there's just no going back, and browsing the internet on any other setup just feels awful
 

code65536

Golden Member
Mar 7, 2006
1,006
0
76
I don't think people fully appreciate just how bloated and inefficient the modern web has become, so let me give you a concrete example.

Let's say a site wants to include a Facebook "Like" button. So loads a script from Facebook that spawns the button. But it's not that simple.

The script to power the "Like" button (which has to retrieve the current number of likes and then also submit an authenticated user's like) can't run on the site hosting the Like button. First, there are the security concerns--a user's Facebook authentication cookies are restricted to facebook.com, so the site hosting the button has no access to them. And there are other security and privacy implications of having that user's Facebook data transit through that site, so we want to avoid that. And there are technical concerns, too, with having Facebook's script run directly on that site--what if there are compatibility issues with other scripts on that site?

Because of these reasons, the Like button spawning script is actually very simple and very basic: It just spawns an IFRAME (inline frame). Remember those good old Web 1.0 days when sites had frames? It's like that, except these frames can be tiny and exist in the flow, right in the middle of the page. This IFRAME contains the Like button. This way, the button itself and all the scripts associated with powering the button are still on facebook.com, and they run in the context of facebook.com--they're just inserted into the host page like picture-in-picture TV.

On the browser side of things, each IFRAME is treated like a separate webpage that the browser has to open. It has to be since that's the whole point of the IFRAME. This means that each IFRAME has its own DOM. Its own presentation context. Its own security context. Its own private JavaScript sandbox. And you know what? These things are not cheap! And each IFRAME loads and executes its own JavaScript, and if the function of a Like button involves a hefty JavaScript library, then each IFRAME gets its own copy of that hefty JavaScript library.

So if you load a page that has a dozen of these social-media doodads (everyone does it like this, not just Facebook; I don't really want to single them out), then it may look like you have just one tab open, but behind the scenes, it's a lot more like having a dozen tabs open.

And this is part of the reason why some sites are now shying away from these IFRAME-based things. For example, in the latest iteration of the New York Times website, the Facebook button isn't an inline Like button, but is instead something simpler that just pops up a separate window for you to do your social media thing. To the end-user, it doesn't look all that different, but there is a HUGE difference in the underlying footprint of the implementation.

There are other types of bloat on the modern web, some similar, some different. This is just one example of how something seemingly mundane that everyone has encountered at some point is actually quite monstrous under the hood.


Also, when I use NoScript, I check the option to "temporarily allow top-level sites by default" and select the most permissive suboption ("base 2nd level domains"). This makes NoScript a lot easier to use since, most of the time, the abusive and excessive JS are third-party, so it's a nice way to reduce the amount of manual whitelisting that I need to do. And this also lets me keep site like facebook.com out of my whitelist--this way, Facebook's JS works when I'm browsing Facebook, but it won't work when I'm on some other site, which prevents the Like-button-bloat detailed above.
 

Chiefcrowe

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2008
5,044
184
116
Thank you for that example, it makes things a lot clearer for sure!

I don't think people fully appreciate just how bloated and inefficient the modern web has become, so let me give you a concrete example.

Let's say a site wants to include a Facebook "Like" button. So loads a script from Facebook that spawns the button. But it's not that simple.

The script to power the "Like" button (which has to retrieve the current number of likes and then also submit an authenticated user's like) can't run on the site hosting the Like button. First, there are the security concerns--a user's Facebook authentication cookies are restricted to facebook.com, so the site hosting the button has no access to them. And there are other security and privacy implications of having that user's Facebook data transit through that site, so we want to avoid that. And there are technical concerns, too, with having Facebook's script run directly on that site--what if there are compatibility issues with other scripts on that site?

Because of these reasons, the Like button spawning script is actually very simple and very basic: It just spawns an IFRAME (inline frame). Remember those good old Web 1.0 days when sites had frames? It's like that, except these frames can be tiny and exist in the flow, right in the middle of the page. This IFRAME contains the Like button. This way, the button itself and all the scripts associated with powering the button are still on facebook.com, and they run in the context of facebook.com--they're just inserted into the host page like picture-in-picture TV.

On the browser side of things, each IFRAME is treated like a separate webpage that the browser has to open. It has to be since that's the whole point of the IFRAME. This means that each IFRAME has its own DOM. Its own presentation context. Its own security context. Its own private JavaScript sandbox. And you know what? These things are not cheap! And each IFRAME loads and executes its own JavaScript, and if the function of a Like button involves a hefty JavaScript library, then each IFRAME gets its own copy of that hefty JavaScript library.

So if you load a page that has a dozen of these social-media doodads (everyone does it like this, not just Facebook; I don't really want to single them out), then it may look like you have just one tab open, but behind the scenes, it's a lot more like having a dozen tabs open.

And this is part of the reason why some sites are now shying away from these IFRAME-based things. For example, in the latest iteration of the New York Times website, the Facebook button isn't an inline Like button, but is instead something simpler that just pops up a separate window for you to do your social media thing. To the end-user, it doesn't look all that different, but there is a HUGE difference in the underlying footprint of the implementation.

There are other types of bloat on the modern web, some similar, some different. This is just one example of how something seemingly mundane that everyone has encountered at some point is actually quite monstrous under the hood.


Also, when I use NoScript, I check the option to "temporarily allow top-level sites by default" and select the most permissive suboption ("base 2nd level domains"). This makes NoScript a lot easier to use since, most of the time, the abusive and excessive JS are third-party, so it's a nice way to reduce the amount of manual whitelisting that I need to do. And this also lets me keep site like facebook.com out of my whitelist--this way, Facebook's JS works when I'm browsing Facebook, but it won't work when I'm on some other site, which prevents the Like-button-bloat detailed above.
 

Slickone

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 1999
6,120
0
0
Also, when I use NoScript, I check the option to "temporarily allow top-level sites by default" and select the most permissive suboption ("base 2nd level domains"). This makes NoScript a lot easier to use since, most of the time, the abusive and excessive JS are third-party, so it's a nice way to reduce the amount of manual whitelisting that I need to do. And this also lets me keep site like facebook.com out of my whitelist--this way, Facebook's JS works when I'm browsing Facebook, but it won't work when I'm on some other site, which prevents the Like-button-bloat detailed above.
The social blocking list for ABP blocks or hides those like buttons too.
It seems like allowing top-level sites by default could be dangerous.
 

code65536

Golden Member
Mar 7, 2006
1,006
0
76
The social blocking list for ABP blocks or hides those like buttons too.
It seems like allowing top-level sites by default could be dangerous.

I don't use ABP because I don't want to strip the sites that I visit of their income; that's just a personal preference on my part. As for allowing top-level sites by default, I personally think it's a good trade-off. I don't like having to do a lot of manual whitelisting, and this saves me that hassle. Every now and then, I come across a site with first-party JS that annoys me, in which case I do a quick "Forbid" on that site (or just avoid it all together).

I use NoScript to clamp down on annoyances and reduce the resource footprint, not for security. I know that there are people who use NS because they think it'll make the browsing experience more secure, but I trust in the soundness of Mozilla's JavaScript implementation and am not particularly worried about JavaScript security. Again, it's all personal preference. *shrugs*
 

veafled

Junior Member
Feb 13, 2014
4
0
0
And this is another reason why Chrome sucks. Not only is is more RAM-hungry to begin with, it lacks the kind of extensibility to give you this kind of fine-grained control.

Actually, it is an amusing statement, given that chrome has an extension that gives far superior fine-grained control than anything firefox currently offers, *even* if you installed all the necessary addons to try and mimic it.

See: HTTP Switchboard @ Github https://github.com/gorhill/httpswitchboard#http-switchboard-for-chromium

It's a comprehensive merge of Request Policy, NoScript, Adblock Plus, + a bunch of privacy related features (referer stripping, user-agent spoofing, cookie blocking, etc.)

I've never seen an easier way to manage whitelisting/blacklisting. Completely configurable. One can even disable completely filtering and it still acts as a detailed reporting tool to show all the stuff a web page does.

Filtering is easily done on a per-site/per-domain basis. So powerful.
 
Last edited:

TheRyuu

Diamond Member
Dec 3, 2005
5,479
14
81
For lots and lots of open tabs Firefox is more than likely lighter on memory simply because of it's single process model. Chrome (and IE) use multiple processes for both security and stability purposes (crash one tab, whole thing doesn't crash), Firefox does use a separate process for plugins (and flash will launch it's own sandboxed process as well).

I see it as a trade off where you're trading increased memory usage for increased security. If ram usage is indeed the problem then as someone else suggested Firefox with tab groups may be the answer.

Also Adblock Plus, for seemingly no reason, is pretty heavy on the ram usage regardless of what browser you're using. And as veafled pointed out http switchboard is basically noscript for Chrome with a more intuitive interface (IMO) but that's kind of getting on a tangent.
 

inf1nity

Golden Member
Mar 12, 2013
1,181
3
0
I have a desktop thats even more under powered, Core 2 Duo 2.2 GHz and just 1 GB of RAM. I am also running W7 Ultimate 32 bit. I use Plae Moon, have been using it for the past year, it works very well.

Go to www.palemoon.org and get the 32 bit version(careful you don't get the 64 bit version!), install it, and install AdBlock Plus and FlashBlock, throw in NoScript if you feel like, and you're set.
 

VivienM

Senior member
Jun 26, 2001
486
45
91
I hope everyone is doing well. I am using an older model Lenovo T61 thinkpad (2008). It is operating MS Windows Home 7 premium 32-bit. It has an Intel Core2 Duo CPU T8100 and 2GB Ram.

I have a T61 as well, a T7500 given away by my ex-employer and that I nursed back to health with a Phillips screwdriver and an eBay account. And I put in 4GB of RAM, running x64 Windows 7.

Frankly, what you need is RAM. That T8100 you've got is going to be faster than a whole number of crap netbook-grade CPUs that are sold in new low-end desktops/laptops today, but 2GB of RAM just doesn't cut it.

Upgrading the RAM in a T61 is very easy: 4 screws underneath the palm rest, then you can remove the palm rest and the 2 SODIMM slots are right there. Put in two 2GB DDR2 SODIMMs (or if you are crazy, 4GB ones, I believe they are supported, but 4GB DDR2 SODIMMs are expensive). Then run 64-bit Windows (the 32-bit version will only do 3.x GB, the 64-bit should do the full 4GB...).
 

FalseChristian

Diamond Member
Jan 7, 2002
3,322
0
71
I'd give Pale Moon a try. It's the only browser I use now. It's the fastest, leanest and uses the least amount of RAM. It's based on open-sourced Fire Fox but is just better.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Just upgrade the ram and maybe install 64 bit windows. I have a T60 with a T7200 and 4GB radeon 1400. It's snappy.
 
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