Link me Affordable healthcare.

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: SirStev0
I just want all these "Reformers" to show me this great affordable health care they keep talking about.

They can't. Or at least they haven't.

Fixed.

The government healthcare bill that is on the table now does NOTHING about the cost or affordability of heathcare in this country. Absolutely NOTHING!!!

So, again, your problem isn't the cost of healthcare, it is the fact that you have to pay for it instead having the government pay for it by taxing other people.

 

[CPA]

Start here. I found over 100 plans in Houston starting at $30/month. The best ones were in the $100/month range. The question however is what do you consider "affordable". I think if you ask many people they would consider a car payment of $400/month affordable, but not insurance. Apparently, they are more concerned with their car than their health.

 

[fallout man]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

So it seems your problem isn't the fact that healthcare is expensive, but the fact that YOU have to pay for it yourself. Instead you want the other people to pay for your insurance instead of paying for it yourself.

Insurance is a form of wealth distribution! I'm calling my senator tomorrow, because auto insurance is just a first step to a communist/marxist/socialist/fascist/calvinist/reductionist/behaviorist/scientologist take over of AMERICA!!!

WHAT IS HAPPENING?!?!?!?!!!1

We need to put a stop to this before it's TOO LATE!!!1

 

[ProfJohn]

BTW you say that you are in medical school now.

I assume, based on what I read in this thread, that you plan to graduate and take a low paying job in the healthcare field in order to help keep healthcare costs low for other who can't afford insurance, right?

I have a friend who went to Emory for 6+ years and after graduation took a job making $100k. How inconsiderate of her!!!

If only she and all her other high paid friends would agree to a 50% pay cut think of how much cheaper our healthcare would then be??

 

[SirStev0]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Steve, what is the point of this thread??

1. No one that I know is going around and claiming that healthcare is cheap.

2. As the CBO has stated the current healthcare bill does NOTHING to reduce the costs of healthcare. All it does is shift the cost from one group to another and nothing else.

So it seems your problem isn't the fact that healthcare is expensive, but the fact that YOU have to pay for it yourself. Instead you want the other people to pay for your insurance instead of paying for it yourself.

There has ben many that claimed there is affordable care. I could go into quite a few threads and link them, but I am not going to waste my time.

I am a firm believer that we can manage the huge cost of healthcare in the US. We just need to knock off these unfounded preconceived notions and be willing to actually try. I am sick of hearing people say things are fine and that a public option is unnecessary. I completely disagree with this.

We can do better. But we are stuck in debate mode.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: SirStev0

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: SirStev0

Originally posted by: boomerang

Originally posted by: alchemize
There is no such thing as affordable healthcare. Healthcare is expensive. Everywhere.

In other words, somebody's got to pay.

Who do you want to pay SirStevO? Who would you like to see pay for your health insurance? The policy where you will be "fully covered and that you will not be denied for "preventative" tests".

Somebody's got to foot the bill. Who do you think it should be?

I would just love to ignore your attempt to hijack my thread. I said, I don't want debates, I want proof of affordable private care options, since so many people are strictly against having an affordable public option.

But just to be a good sport, I will answer your silly talking point. I want you to pay for it, just like you ALREADY HAVE BEEN. The thing you can't seem to get through your thick skull is that the current system already pushes the cost of people who can't afford it on to people who can, they just do it in the most mismanaged and illogical way possible.

If I choose not to pay my bills, the next time you go in, your procedure is going to cost just a little bit more. The cost won't be well managed or fair or anything you pretend it to be.

At least with a public option, there is potential that someone might actually develop a good affordable system to spread the cost around. Currently we are just winging it, though magically the insurance companies and hospitals still make their profits.

For a young fellow in your position your first consideration, of course, is affordablility and that is not so easy to produce. The HR3200 would give you help financially and enable you to carry insurance but with some cost paid by you.
My Grandson is 25 and going into the service over what he sees is the only viable alternative to address his issues. He has a degree in... I forget now.. A BBA. Has Wife and Kid no insurance and a job that pays him pennies as an assistant manager.
Health care for him is his highest priority and he can get covered for 680.00$ a month. But he can't afford that nor the deductable nor co pay...
Another grandkid is Med School. I hope they have some physicians there cuz he's not covered either.
Ah well... let me know when you get that affordable care.

Pop?
My brother actually just finished Boot Camp (never went to college), but has a wife and kid. One of his major reasons for enlisting was coverage for his son. I am in my second year of Med School and technically I am suppose to be covered.

Is that you Kyle?

How about cleaning up your room sometime soon. It is a freakin mess! heheheheehe.
Kyle isn't at all concerned about Health Insurance Issues because the only thing that drives him he can accomplish, he simply hates disease. He'll not likely drive a snazzy car or have a home overlooking a golf course. All he cares about is helping people. He has a gift like an artist or musician and intends to share that with the people. I like that attitude. I raised my grandkids to find what you CAN do to affect something and pursue that while leaving what you can't affect to those who can.
Maybe HR 676 or HR3200 or what ever combination gets produced into law will be universal, but I doubt it... not with the insanity the reality of many demand.

 

[SirStev0]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: SirStev0
I just want all these "Reformers" to show me this great affordable health care they keep talking about.

They can't. Or at least they haven't.

Fixed.

The government healthcare bill that is on the table now does NOTHING about the cost or affordability of heathcare in this country. Absolutely NOTHING!!!

So, again, your problem isn't the cost of healthcare, it is the fact that you have to pay for it instead having the government pay for it by taxing other people.

I do agree with you. In fact I am insulted that steroids had every baseball player ever marched in front of congress yet not one doctor was asked to come in.

I personally think the problem is that Congress is too willing to compromise on this. What we will end up with is a garbage plan that does nothing, costs a ton, and we will be forever stuck with.

Again, I don't know how many different ways I can say this, but I do not want a debate thread. I want someone to prove an affordable plan that actually covers me, a healthy young person.

 

[SirStev0]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
BTW you say that you are in medical school now.

I assume, based on what I read in this thread, that you plan to graduate and take a low paying job in the healthcare field in order to help keep healthcare costs low for other who can't afford insurance, right?

I have a friend who went to Emory for 6+ years and after graduation took a job making $100k. How inconsiderate of her!!!

If only she and all her other high paid friends would agree to a 50% pay cut think of how much cheaper our healthcare would then be??

Blah blah blah, turn this on doctors again. It has been proven many times that doctor salary play extremely little in the cost of health care in the US.

I didn't go into medicine to make money. I went in because I love the field, I enjoy the challenge and the risk, I like working towards helping people, and of course, because at the end of the day, I want to know I am a better person than everyone else.

 

[SirStev0]

BTW, Congrats to everyone for hijacking the thread and turning it into just another worthless debate. You have just done exactly the republican plan for healthcare reform. Keep changing the subject to block reform of any sort.

 

[ProfJohn]

Steve, is the government option going to provide you with affordable healthcare?

If we added up the total cost of the government option and then divided by the number of people covered by the plan would we end up with a number that is smaller than what it will cost you to get insurance on your own?? Probably not.

Medicare currently covers 43 million Americans and cost the government $413 billion in FY 2009 that is a cost of nearly $10,000 for every person covered.

Can you go out and buy individual insurance for less than $10,000 per year?

 

[SirStev0]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Steve, is the government option going to provide you with affordable healthcare?

If we added up the total cost of the government option and then divided by the number of people covered by the plan would we end up with a number that is smaller than what it will cost you to get insurance on your own?? Probably not.

Medicare currently covers 43 million Americans and cost the government $413 billion in FY 2009 that is a cost of nearly $10,000 for every person covered.

Can you go out and buy individual insurance for less than $10,000 per year?

Greater than 2/3 of the civilized world has found a way. WHY CAN'T WE?

 

[boomerang]

Originally posted by: SirStev0
Edit: Also I love the irony of you saying I am all over the place. It actually made me chuckle.

Whatever. It's obvious to me that you need more than physical health care. Each successive post proves it more. I tried to reach out some, but it didn't work. I'll lose no sleep over it.

You've been given several links to options, you've ignored them. You said you wanted me to pay. I'm not going to pay for yours. You can develop whatever symptoms you want whether real or imagined. You're on your own. Survival of the fittest. Law of the jungle and all that. The strong survive and the weak shall perish. You're weak.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Steve, is the government option going to provide you with affordable healthcare?

If we added up the total cost of the government option and then divided by the number of people covered by the plan would we end up with a number that is smaller than what it will cost you to get insurance on your own?? Probably not.

Medicare currently covers 43 million Americans and cost the government $413 billion in FY 2009 that is a cost of nearly $10,000 for every person covered.

Can you go out and buy individual insurance for less than $10,000 per year?

Why on earth would you take the total cost of Medicare (including all procedures), and compare it to the premium cost for a personal plan? Not only that, but you are comparing a health care system that is designed exclusively for people over 65, and trying to extrapolate the costs to someone who is in their early 20's, despite the fact that health costs for the over 65 crowd are orders of magnitude larger.

How much more dishonest a comparison can you get?

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
BTW you say that you are in medical school now.

I assume, based on what I read in this thread, that you plan to graduate and take a low paying job in the healthcare field in order to help keep healthcare costs low for other who can't afford insurance, right?

I have a friend who went to Emory for 6+ years and after graduation took a job making $100k. How inconsiderate of her!!!

If only she and all her other high paid friends would agree to a 50% pay cut think of how much cheaper our healthcare would then be??

Not that much cheaper, doctor salaries are a relatively small percentage of overall health care costs.

Do you have any idea what you're talking about?

 

[SirStev0]

Originally posted by: boomerang

Originally posted by: SirStev0
Edit: Also I love the irony of you saying I am all over the place. It actually made me chuckle.

Whatever. It's obvious to me that you need more than physical health care. Each successive post proves it more. I tried to reach out some, but it didn't work. I'll lose no sleep over it.

You've been given several links to options, you've ignored them. You said you wanted me to pay. I'm not going to pay for yours. You can develop whatever symptoms you want whether real or imagined. You're on your own. Survival of the fittest. Law of the jungle and all that. The strong survive and the weak shall perish. You're weak.

Thanks Captain Passive Aggressive. I know you are just trying to troll me here and piss me off, but I don't really care. Your silliness doesn't bother me. Also, there was one link, I have tried the ehealthinsurance look up before. They are shit plans where you are better saving your money to pay for your own care. Any serious problem you are going to pay for it anwya. Why waste the time?

 

[ProfJohn]

Eskimo, I did it because medicare is the easiest government program to get numbers for.
Find me another large program and find me numbers like that and we can use your example instead of mine.

Additionally, and something you seem to forget, the government option will not just be providing healthcare coverage to healthy 20 year olds. Instead it will end up providing coverage to all comers which will more than likely end up including the sickest people in this country.

Have an expensive genetic disorder? Government option.
Have pre-existing conditions that employer won't cover? Government option.

In the end the per-person cost of the government option may not be as high as medicare, but it will certainly be a LOT higher than a personalized plan crafted for a healthy 20 something.

 

[spittledip]

Originally posted by: SirStev0

Originally posted by: boomerang

I usually don't respond to name calling posts but stick with me for a bit. You're all over the map tonight. You want a link to affordable health care and then you go on telling us that you feel that there is the potential for better coverage for you under a public option. You essentially make a call out thread and then get upset when you get called out. Can you deny you weren't itching for a fight? Since you think I have a thick skull I won't go on in this regard.

You're upset tonight. You've given some reasons why a few posts up. My suggestion (thick skulled though it may be) is to try to chill some. You're putting the cart before the horse. Health care reform is not dead by any means. I believe there will be some form of it passed. But be aware that it may not all be implemented at once. The greatest obstacle right now for those that are voicing opposition is how to pay for it. As someone who is concerned about education costs, you should be able to understand this.

Act as passive aggressive as you want. I am not angry. I just want all these "Non-Reformers" to show me this great affordable health care they keep talking about. I have tons of Gov't loans ready to dump on a good product. Just show me.

They can't. Or at least they haven't.

Also, I would love to see this name calling. I guess the "thick skull" thing, maybe, but if that is name calling to you, then you are either really new here or your skin doesn't match your skull.

I am more than willing to get called out, but no one has yet. Also, thanks for completely ignoring my answer to your question. I am one hundred percent serious. I want the cost to be spread, but I want it managed. Private insurance has been completely unwilling to do this because it messes with their profit margins. The only way a public option would work is if managed care is a hallmark of their option.

Again, thanks for hijacking this and trying to turn it into another pointless debate.

Edit: Also I love the irony of you saying I am all over the place. It actually made me chuckle.[/quote]

I think you are over-reacting to Boomerangs post. Anyone can post here you know. And I thought he made a very civil response to your insulting post.

At any rate, I agree that it is next to impossible to find a cheap option if you don't have much income and one's workplace does not supply insurance. I think it is a good question b/c there are people out there who make less than 20,000 a year. People who make minimum wage will not break 16000$ if they work a 40 hour week. So for those who make minimum wage or less than 20,000 a year before taxes, is there actually an option for them?

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Steve, is the government option going to provide you with affordable healthcare?

If we added up the total cost of the government option and then divided by the number of people covered by the plan would we end up with a number that is smaller than what it will cost you to get insurance on your own?? Probably not.

Medicare currently covers 43 million Americans and cost the government $413 billion in FY 2009 that is a cost of nearly $10,000 for every person covered.

Can you go out and buy individual insurance for less than $10,000 per year?

wow.....pointless math ftw.

an averaged cost would prove nothing...

Medicare is a specific pot of money with specific parameters for qualification and use....its numbers do not extrapolate to any nationwide data that could be useful for forecasting or comparison especially to UFC.

Tell me, where did you come up with these formulas for your argument?

edit: nvm I see eskimo has already asked these questions. I just find it curious how you managed to use funny math to formulate your argument....surely not trying to pull one over on us eh PJ?

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Eskimo, I did it because medicare is the easiest government program to get numbers for.
Find me another large program and find me numbers like that and we can use your example instead of mine.

Additionally, and something you seem to forget, the government option will not just be providing healthcare coverage to healthy 20 year olds. Instead it will end up providing coverage to all comers which will more than likely end up including the sickest people in this country.

Have an expensive genetic disorder? Government option.
Have pre-existing conditions that employer won't cover? Government option.

In the end the per-person cost of the government option may not be as high as medicare, but it will certainly be a LOT higher than a personalized plan crafted for a healthy 20 something.

You're doing it again, stop it. Stop trying to use the cost of care for people 65+ as a comparison with the cost of care for a 23 year old. I don't have to supply you any numbers, you are the one responsible for attempting to make a dishonest point. Find your own, honest numbers that support your point, or retract your previous post.

As for the government option caring for the sickest people, no plan in America public or private will be able to discriminate on 'expensive genetic disorders' or 'pre-existing conditions' after this bill passes either, so the point is irrelevant.

I have to ask again, do you have any idea what you are talking about?

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

In the end the per-person cost of the government option may not be as high as medicare, but it will certainly be a LOT higher than a personalized plan crafted for a healthy 20 something.

You can't say something like that and expect people to just take your word for it.

proof? perhaps some more of your formulas?

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: SirStev0
BTW, Congrats to everyone for hijacking the thread and turning it into just another worthless debate. You have just done exactly the republican plan for healthcare reform. Keep changing the subject to block reform of any sort.

LOL - why don't you answer the question - what is "affordable"?

 

[SirStev0]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: SirStev0
BTW, Congrats to everyone for hijacking the thread and turning it into just another worthless debate. You have just done exactly the republican plan for healthcare reform. Keep changing the subject to block reform of any sort.

LOL - why don't you answer the question - what is "affordable"?

Go back, I already said.

 

[ProfJohn]

Here....
http://www.anthem.com/

Rate quotes for someone living in Chesapeake Va.
Highest rate is $194
Lowest is $73

The plans most people would pick ranges from $89 - $126 a month.

Is that affordable enough?

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: SirStev0

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: SirStev0
BTW, Congrats to everyone for hijacking the thread and turning it into just another worthless debate. You have just done exactly the republican plan for healthcare reform. Keep changing the subject to block reform of any sort.

LOL - why don't you answer the question - what is "affordable"?

Go back, I already said.

I went back. I saw nothing that defined affordable. You just explained what your expenses were. What's that have to do with affordable? I spend all my money on hookers and blow, I want affordable health care.

 

[spittledip]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Here....
http://www.anthem.com/

Rate quotes for someone living in Chesapeake Va.
Highest rate is $194
Lowest is $73

The plans most people would pick ranges from $89 - $126 a month.

Is that affordable enough?

Wow, not bad. I checked out Hartford CT and got a quote of 211 per month with decent deductibles. There is the 1500$ hospital deductible but that is not too bad. Are these new options? If these are not new, what is the problem with finding affordable insurance/Health care?