The Gentoo forums are really good you don't have to be using gentoo to ask questions there. Pretty much everything is well documented and you get fairly quick responses to anything you might ask and you won't get a condescending answer
Originally posted by: 43st
I tried installing a basic Ubuntu on an old Dell laptop... It didn't work out well, though it claimed to be installed properly. The Ubuntu forums were also a mess, no one has an answer that's not laced with condescending nerd ego.
It made me realize why I use computers... not really to tweak or fuss with the OS but to use applications. I'd never recommend anyone, aside from Operating System lovers and tinkerers, install Linux. Maybe the installer will work in the future though. I'll give it another look when it can be installed correctly and be completely functional in under an hours time.
Originally posted by: 43st
Originally posted by: nweaver
Ubuntu 6.06 and 6.10 install on my modern Dell D810 with all drivers, but no 3d Accel (ATI's fault)
XP is missing the NIC, Wireless NIC, Display driver (stretched to do widescreen), and sound.
Yeah, maybe read my post again. This was a 500Mhz Dell Latitude and I believe the Warty release.
Originally posted by: The Boston Dangler
Any kubuntu users here? I was told kubuntu was the way to go for an XP user to get into linux with the least pain. I tried the Suse 10 bootable iso. The gui was a close copy of XP (good for familiarity, bad for lack of improvement). Firefox, Openoffice etc were preinstalled and worked with no battles at all. The vid driver was by no means great, but I was expecting much worse.
Originally posted by: nweaver
Originally posted by: 43st
Originally posted by: nweaver
Ubuntu 6.06 and 6.10 install on my modern Dell D810 with all drivers, but no 3d Accel (ATI's fault)
XP is missing the NIC, Wireless NIC, Display driver (stretched to do widescreen), and sound.
Yeah, maybe read my post again. This was a 500Mhz Dell Latitude and I believe the Warty release.
fine...
it also worked fine (6.06) on my old Compaq P2 500
Originally posted by: nweaver
Originally posted by: 43st
Originally posted by: nweaver
Ubuntu 6.06 and 6.10 install on my modern Dell D810 with all drivers, but no 3d Accel (ATI's fault)
XP is missing the NIC, Wireless NIC, Display driver (stretched to do widescreen), and sound.
Yeah, maybe read my post again. This was a 500Mhz Dell Latitude and I believe the Warty release.
fine...
it also worked fine (6.06) on my old Compaq P2 500
You're complaining about Ubuntu which has gone through 3-4 generations of upgrades over that period. That's sort of like complaining about Win98 being a POS.Originally posted by: 43st
This was two years ago, which ever version they were on at that time... I was looking for a stripped down and basic install, nothing fancy and something for an old 500mhz laptop. Half the hardware wasn't found during the install, the display was a tiny square on the LCD panel. The screen also developed some weird horizontal lines, like the brightness was off in certain areas. The network worked, as did the keyboard. The mouse touchpad didn't install properly.
After reading up more on the subject it seemed that (then) Ubuntu and Linux had issues with laptops and proprietary hardware drivers. Maybe that's resolved? I tried for about a week to get more information on the system, as well as the Ubuntu forums. I never really progressed beyond the botched install phase, even the tutorials assumed everything works perfect the first time. The information gathering and learning phase was the most frustrating part by far. We've all worked through twitchy gear and weird hardware configs, just doing it blindly in a foreign environment makes it nearly impossible I found.
Originally posted by: 43st
I'll give it another try at some point with the latest version. Thanks for your input.
Do you Linux experts have a recommendation for a slim and fast version? Something that would be fitting on an old machine to make it internet worthy and usable? Is Ubuntu the best bet for simplicity sake?
Originally posted by: Robor
You're complaining about Ubuntu which has gone through 3-4 generations of upgrades over that period. That's sort of like complaining about Win98 being a POS.Originally posted by: 43st
This was two years ago, which ever version they were on at that time... I was looking for a stripped down and basic install, nothing fancy and something for an old 500mhz laptop. Half the hardware wasn't found during the install, the display was a tiny square on the LCD panel. The screen also developed some weird horizontal lines, like the brightness was off in certain areas. The network worked, as did the keyboard. The mouse touchpad didn't install properly.
After reading up more on the subject it seemed that (then) Ubuntu and Linux had issues with laptops and proprietary hardware drivers. Maybe that's resolved? I tried for about a week to get more information on the system, as well as the Ubuntu forums. I never really progressed beyond the botched install phase, even the tutorials assumed everything works perfect the first time. The information gathering and learning phase was the most frustrating part by far. We've all worked through twitchy gear and weird hardware configs, just doing it blindly in a foreign environment makes it nearly impossible I found.
I've been a member of UbuntuForums.org for about a year and I've found the people to be extremely helpful and friendly - same as the *nix and *BSD crowd here in the OS forum.
Originally posted by: 43st
Win98 worked when it was installed, and that was 6 years before Ubuntu was even released.
I'll give Xubuntu a look, thanks.
Originally posted by: Brazen
So I'm setting up an XP computer, with SP2 already slipstreamed onto the disc. It's been 1 1/2 hours, all I've done is install the base system and update the base system, and I am on reboot number 6! 6!!?!?! And I'm not done yet. And that 1 1/2 hours doesn't even include downloading updates since I have a local WSUS server. Even a Debian Sarge install can be installed, fully updated (even without a local update server), and configured in less time with only 2 reboots.
Come on Microsoft. The rest of the world has moved beyond 1990. It's time for you to do so also.
Originally posted by: Brazen
So I'm setting up an XP computer, with SP2 already slipstreamed onto the disc. It's been 1 1/2 hours, all I've done is install the base system and update the base system, and I am on reboot number 6! 6!!?!?! And I'm not done yet. And that 1 1/2 hours doesn't even include downloading updates since I have a local WSUS server. Even a Debian Sarge install can be installed, fully updated (even without a local update server), and configured in less time with only 2 reboots.
Come on Microsoft. The rest of the world has moved beyond 1990. It's time for you to do so also.
Originally posted by: Robor
Hehe... I just reloaded my home XP system. It's not a quick process for sure. Oh, don't forget the call to Microsoft to get activated before you can use the online WU, MP 11, IE 7, etc. My *totally legit and installed in only 1 place* WinXP Pro SP1 CD requires me to call to activate each time I reinstall my desktop with or without a hardware change. But don't forget before you do that there's the chipset, NIC, video, and audio drivers.
With Ubuntu Edgy everything works on the first boot. No activation and no drivers needed. Updating is as easy as using the built-in updater or (my preferred way) a quick apt-get update then apt-get upgrade. Yes, I know Edgy is from 10/06 and my WinXP Pro CD is from '03 or '04. Just pointing out that it's not all that bad in the Linux world.
Linux fundamentalists can argue until they are blue in the face, but until Linux comes up with a universal installer, it can infuriate even a seasoned user and certainly turns off every single person I ever speak to about when discussing their experiences... its always something like this that sends them back to windows.
Originally posted by: Seeruk
Late to this thread
I think what the OP is getting at is that life aint easy with Linux. As an every day user I agree with him.
Todays example I was setting up a dev environment on Ubuntu... supposedly the best supported and widest array of software out there. However all I wanted was a java dev environment up, and quickly.
I had to set up a windows and a linux environment for testing. In windows installing JRE & JDK (netbeans 5) took less than 10 minutes and maybe a total of 10 clicks of a GUI explaining everything nicely to me, Mr Joe User. Downloaded and installed.... great I am off for a coffee.
Then I came to the ubuntu box. It should be easy right? Fire up synaptic, find JRE and Eclipse, tick the appropriate selections and wait. So far so good. Probably only took 10 minutes too. However on launching eclipse it can't find the path for JRE. OK.... check the bash and find everything is wrong. Paths are wrong, links to bizarre places and so I check to see if this is common. Turns out that the best way to install is to go find the right files manually on the Java & Eclipse websites and then set it all up manually. Taking another 15 or 20 minutes to uninstall the faulty JRE and Eclipse installations and then reinstall using a manual method found on the Ubuntu forums.
So the question is why are those things even in the damn repos if they are not installing in anything like a correct manner, why are they there if that's not the best way to set it up, and what would anyone new to Linux think of all this?? (answer is IT's CRAP!)
Linux fundamentalists can argue until they are blue in the face, but until Linux comes up with a universal installer, it can infuriate even a seasoned user and certainly turns off every single person I ever speak to about when discussing their experiences... its always something like this that sends them back to windows.
Originally posted by: Tick
Come on Linux. The rest of the world has moved beyond 1990. It's time for you to do so also. I'm giving up and installing windows.
Originally posted by: Seeruk
Late to this thread
I think what the OP is getting at is that life aint easy with Linux. As an every day user I agree with him.
Todays example I was setting up a dev environment on Ubuntu... supposedly the best supported and widest array of software out there. However all I wanted was a java dev environment up, and quickly.
I had to set up a windows and a linux environment for testing. In windows installing JRE & JDK (netbeans 5) took less than 10 minutes and maybe a total of 10 clicks of a GUI explaining everything nicely to me, Mr Joe User. Downloaded and installed.... great I am off for a coffee.
Then I came to the ubuntu box. It should be easy right? Fire up synaptic, find JRE and Eclipse, tick the appropriate selections and wait. So far so good. Probably only took 10 minutes too. However on launching eclipse it can't find the path for JRE. OK.... check the bash and find everything is wrong. Paths are wrong, links to bizarre places and so I check to see if this is common. Turns out that the best way to install is to go find the right files manually on the Java & Eclipse websites and then set it all up manually. Taking another 15 or 20 minutes to uninstall the faulty JRE and Eclipse installations and then reinstall using a manual method found on the Ubuntu forums.
So the question is why are those things even in the damn repos if they are not installing in anything like a correct manner, why are they there if that's not the best way to set it up, and what would anyone new to Linux think of all this?? (answer is IT's CRAP!)
Linux fundamentalists can argue until they are blue in the face, but until Linux comes up with a universal installer, it can infuriate even a seasoned user and certainly turns off every single person I ever speak to about when discussing their experiences... its always something like this that sends them back to windows.
Originally posted by: Nothinman
Linux fundamentalists can argue until they are blue in the face, but until Linux comes up with a universal installer, it can infuriate even a seasoned user and certainly turns off every single person I ever speak to about when discussing their experiences... its always something like this that sends them back to windows.
Right, because Windows installers never do anything stupid.