Logic

[Moonbeam]

Well JohnnyReb, if I may say so it's good that you make no claims to being logical because, I think, you have made a mistake in logic or reasoning or assumption or whatever. In the first place say you do not mock and then mock yourself:

"I make no claim to being logical. As with beauty, I know it when I see it but do not possess it myself."

Do they not say that beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Have you ever really tried to take that in, not that standards of beauty vary from eye to eye, but that beauty itself is right there in your own eye. Are you not the beauty you see. Where else but in your own self does it come alive. Where does the experience of luvly's beauty dwell were you not there to bring it into existance. You are the universe. So from whence comes the feeling of separation?



"He was besides himself with joy." People say the damnedest things.

 

[deadtree]

Logic? There's no such thing as a Logic. Our thoughts on logic itself isn't logical. Logic is tear drops in the rain. Logic is death in your life.
All you people trying to define logic only proves how you're not logical.
BTW, logic is hiding under your toe.

 

[Moonbeam]

Logic is the policeman's beard half constructed, or perhaps the olive in the meat loaf. I think I get it, deadtree.

 

[JohnnyReb]

JohnnyReb ? I didn?t realize earlier that you credited Christians with the idea of the equality of man. Have you, by chance, ever read the bible or studied any world history?

Andaval,
Yes, to both. It is sad how those who claim the name of Christ are blind in certain areas to His teachings. It was my own dear South who was the last stronghold of Christian slavery. However we paid the price for that sin (as did our Yankee brothers operating as God's hammer). 600,000 dead. Lincoln doesn't get all the blame for ALL that shed blood.

Equality of man before God is one of the characteristics of the Christian Faith. This was the driving force against slavery worldwide, originating in the church's of Great Britain. Similarly the Christian worldview of the British founded the idea of individual liberty.

We have much to thank Christ for, outside of his dreadful sacrifice.

John

 

[JohnnyReb]

Well JohnnyReb, if I may say so it's good that you make no claims to being logical because, I think, you have made a mistake in logic or reasoning or assumption or whatever. In the first place say you do not mock and then mock yourself:

"I make no claim to being logical. As with beauty, I know it when I see it but do not possess it myself."

Do they not say that beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Have you ever really tried to take that in, not that standards of beauty vary from eye to eye, but that beauty itself is right there in your own eye. Are you not the beauty you see. Where else but in your own self does it come alive. Where does the experience of luvly's beauty dwell were you not there to bring it into existance. You are the universe. So from whence comes the feeling of separation?

Moonbeam,
I didn't say I never mock, but that when I do I name names. As I did about myself.

As far as me, when I look at myself all is see is the wretched man whose best is as dirty rags before Holy God. The only thing good about JohnnyReb is Jesus. It is His blood that has washed me white as snow. I do give credit where credit is due.

I bring luvly's beauty into existence? I am the universe? I don't think so. The universe was created ages ago by the hand of God. He did restructure at least a part of it so that I could live, and in that sense part of the universe is FOR me, but not actually me.

I get the feeling, once again, of missing the first half of the movie.

Please tell me from what basis your observations stem? What is the name of this philosophy/religion?

John "the Baptist" (Southern Baptist, that is)

 

[Moonbeam]

JohnnyReb, I knew that by mocking yourself you named names, but I didn't care. I overlooked my own illogic to give what I hoped was a complement. I respect you and your beliefs. I would love to sit sometime on some southern porch with you, have a drink or two, talk about life and watch the sun go down. 'In you I feel the heat.' I don't know what religion or philosophy I'm talking about. The best I can say is that when I went looking for truth I found nothing. Instead I lost every single resource that sustained my life, my happiness, my feeling of purpose. I fell into a pit of blackness from which I knew I would never escape. There, trapped like a rat, I came to my wits end (what a wonderful expression). I just completely gave up. I surrendered, I got beat. A gust of wind hit the side of the house and bang, my consciousness did some sort of flip flop, and there I was, at peace. About the best I can say is that I went down as far as you can go and discovered that everything that makes life worth living, the capacity to feel, to love, is just there inside of us. It's what we are when everything is subtracted. You might call it God, but to me it's what is when I'm not. There is a paradox at the center of everything, I think. It is a paradox that, to use words, can be compared to a perfect mirror. If there is a perfect mirror, what is the universe and what is the image? Maybe that perfect mirror is the soul. Maybe we are all one.

 

[skylark]

JohnnyREb:


<< Intuition - immediate apprehension or cognition b : knowledge or conviction gained by intuition c : the power or faculty of attaining to direct knowledge or cognition without evident rational thought and inference

Logic - a science that deals with the principles and criteria of validity of inference and demonstration : the science of the formal principles of reasoning

I think we call the above "logic" instead of "intuition" because for some reason intuition seems to have a bad connotation while logic has a good connotation, when they both are neutral.

John[/b] >>



Funny you mentioned intuition. I did speak about it in Elledan's last thread on "Illogical....", but no one was curious enough to further discussed it as if it signified "a bad connotation." Does anyone have a clue as to where logic is localized in the brain?

Well here it is between two hemispheres broken down by left side and right side:

1. The upper (cerebral) left A analytical, mathematical, technical and problem solving.

2. The lower (limbic) left B controlled, conservative, planned, organised and administrative in nature.

3. The lower (limbic) right C interpersonal, emotional, musical, spiritual and the "talker" modes.

4. Upper (cerebral) right D imaginative, synthesising, artistic, holistic and conceptual modes.

Generally, 1 and 2 is logic while 3 and 4 is intuition. Now, a person can have a dominant side [Logic] and an auxillary side [Intuitive] or vice versa. A person who shows no near-dominance for either is (lack of a better word) an ambidextrous processor.

Now, let's get to the hands cross-linked with the hemispheres: left hand => right brain and right hand => left brain. One's handedness will fall under four principles of cerebral dominance:

1. 97% of Right-Handed people are Left-brained.
2. 3% of Right-Handed people are Right-brained.
3. 60% of Left-Handed people are Left-brained.
4. 40$ of Left-Handed people are Right-brained.

Doesn't look good, does it? But keep in mind this is not exact statistical analysis of all ethnicities. Just a template.



<< If it were my intention to mock, I would have named names. At the most, I was venting a bit about all the people who cry "logic, logic", but don't have a clue.

I make no claim to being logical. As with beauty, I know it when I see it but do not possess it myself.

John
>>



Heheh... Confession as such from a man (I"m assuming you are one ) who studies logic has more wisdom than one who doesn't.. And beauty is everywhere.. In sciences, in mysticism, in people, in your hands, your eyes, your feet... Admiring Luvly's intellect.

Beauty without logic:

So the issue with logic is not the applications per say as a science when it comes to human beings ~ but psychological objectivity? I see that Logic cannot exist without Intuition. Anyone who has studied Tao or eastern mysticism knows the Yin cannot be complete without the Yang. This is the basis of wholistic processing of both mind [logos] and the heart [mala] into everyday life. The moments become infused with the wholeness of awareness. The person no longer conceives or fettered from the intellect, nor iso one consumed by emotional impulses ~ but absorbs the textures of existence. For every word drawn from one's lips is born without any prethought.. One is free from *objectivity*.


As for claims being a logician, Elledan is sure trying very hard to become a Vulcan. He's more obsessed with logic than you, I suppose.

andaval:



<< It doesn?t take Sherlock Holmes to solve this one?
I do owe you somewhat of an apology, though. I would like to point out that the initial reason I thought you were being arrogant was that you told killface ?I guess you have to be a part of the usual Moonbeam-linuxboy-palek-petrek-skylark-Athanasius-Elledan-bunch of other people chain to get more out of it than you did.? I took this to mean that only your special clique of friends was smart enough to understand your story, which is how killface may have interpreted it as well, since they haven?t been back. I now take this to mean that they would understand it more since it was about them. >>



did someone call my name? Oh, right. My name is Skylark of Borg, No. 0000000. Would you like to be assimilated and be one with the Zero? Anyways, whatever you thought was terse was really harmless ~ just like your first response to MB.

 

[linuxboy]

Hi skylark


Cheers !

 

[andaval]

I don't think anyone (including me) is going to change their mind over anything posted here. Sorry if I was rude to anybody here, and the rest of you have fun discussing this, I'm going to try to leave this alone now.

 

[linuxboy]

anyone (including me) is going to change their mind over anything posted here.

I disagree. I changed my mind based on what you posted. Namely, I think that a completely random and nonsensical approach may be funny to me but it is usually deleterious to the understanding of my readers. Thus, I should not do so without explaining what I mean. In effect, we may talk about all this enlightenment stuff but unless we communicate with each other and understand without all the jargon and all the individualized and specialized vocabulary, we are really just spending time to laugh and not everyone does this so some effort should be made to remain mindful of the audience. That's how my mind changed as a result of reading this thread. And this issue was raised/posted here.

Cheers !

 

[skylark]

<< Hi skylark


Cheers ! >>



A belated HI to you

Andaval: There's a difference between arguing and keeping each other on his/her toes at all times. Ever heard of: "I am your friend and your enemy?" Keep following philosophical threads in OT, and you'll know how each of us functions in a group.

Rock the Kazba!