Logitech "Z-640" "Z-680" deals/pricing discussion

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Danzilla

Platinum Member
Dec 30, 2000
2,747
0
76
I have a set of the 560s, but that new control system looks nice. I'd like to see an upgrade option for us 560 owners. Just the control center, remote, and extra satellite. I wonder if they could make that work.

D.

EDIT: On consideration, I guess it wouldn't be possible. The satellite's amplifier is built into the SUB so there would have to be a different version of the center speaker with it's own amplifier if it were to work as an upgrade. Oh well, I can dream.
 

JameyF

Senior member
Oct 5, 2001
845
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76
A lot of people are commenting on the amount of watts each system has and comparing these numbers without much else. I'll give my two cents which is worth little more. The difference between 450 vs. 500 watts isn't audible. Don't bother trying to hear it, 3db is gained by doubling the wattage. That would make this about 1/3 of a db increase. Three db is generally what it takes to be easily noticable. 450 to 500 watts is meaningless other than marketing. Next, different companies rate products differently. There is no agency that makes sure manufacturers don't fib on the numbers. The difference between 450 and 500 may not be the case if both tested by the same equipment. Sony is a good example of a company that rates there products differently than even themselves. The high end Sony stuff is loads more powerful than the cheaper stuff even though they may rate the same or so close that it shouldn't matter. Also, there is an issue of what is the dynamic range of a set of speakers or the amplifier powering them. Some amplifiers may put out more wattage but not across an entire frequency range as disired. Some speakers may not have a balanced sound (flat frequency curve) as evidenced by comments that some of the speakers may have little midrange ability. There is also an issue of speaker sensitivity. Larger speakers often produce much louder levels with the same wattage. All of this is supported by the fact that this set claiming to be 450 watts can in no way compare in dynamic range and sound level as my years old stereo amp and my sub which total about the same watts.

The value of these type products will be in their inclusivness of some of the most current technologies without having to buy seperate components to get reasonably good quality DTS/DD support for your computer. In the end, all the numbers about wattage is MUCH less important than actual reviews or individual testimonials. I'm happy to see companies making products like these for those of us who might appreciate a smaller scale HT setup for our computer systems. Top that with a nice little gadget on the side to control your setup, and it could be magical. I'd love to ditch my current moderately powered 4 channel home stereo setup I use for my computer system if this setup can give me similar performance with surround processing.
 
Oct 15, 2000
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Too bad the z560's aren't 400 watts. I wonder if Logitech is lying about the new ones as well.

Check This Out 160 Watts total by his figuring

The second piece of marketese in the Z-560 specifications has to do with the abovementioned power output issue. Logitech make a big deal about the Z-560 system having 400 Absolutely Genuine Federal Trade Commission Authorised Totally Real RMS American Watts Baby. 188 watts for the sub, 53 watts for each satellite.

This is not true.

Well, OK, it could be true. If it is, though, the speakers should all blow up.

Point one - not enough amp power. No way is that a 400VA toroidal in the corner of the box. It'd have to be a bit beefier even than that, of course, because the amp isn't 100 per cent efficient. If it were, it wouldn't need a heat sink.

Point two - insufficiently chunky drivers, with embarrassingly low power ratings printed on them.

Such things as almost-200-watt eight inch drivers exist. If you want to cheat then you can make a zillion watt speaker by putting a crowbar across its input wires; now you can pump vast amounts of power through that speaker (if you define the crowbar as being part of the speaker...), and it won't make any more noise than it would from far less power without the crowbar. In other words, its efficiency is now astoundingly poor.

That's not what Logitech are doing; it's not what any sane speaker builder does. The drivers in these speakers have perfectly OK efficiency for their size. If the eight inch bass driver had an ultra-humungous magnet around a similarly huge voice coil and a unit retail price up around $AUD200, then it'd be plausible for it to have better than 150 watt power handling.



That's not the kind of driver that's in there, though. The back of the sub driver hides behind the huge bent port, but you can peer through the gap to see the mere hundred watt rating.

Similarly, I suppose it's possible to make a three inch mid/treble driver, like the ones in the Z-560 satellites, which can handle 53 watts. I don't know whether any such product actually exists on the retail market, but I'd be happy to learn otherwise.



Once again, though, that's not what Logitech have actually used. 15 watts, people. A Tangband Speakers W3-665SC, to be exact. Which isn't listed on the Tangband site; I just linked to that site out of malice.

Exceed the rated power handling by a significant margin for a significant period and you'll kill the driver. Unless the sticker ratings are very conservative, therefore, one 100 watt sub plus four 15 watt sats is 160 watts. QED.

The driver-peering also revealed that none of the Z-560 speakers contain any resonance-reducing damping material at all.
 

tazdevl

Golden Member
Mar 1, 2000
1,651
0
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I think one thing most folks seem to be forgetting is that speaker selection is totally subjective. You buy what sounds good to you. What sounds like strong mid-range for one person might be weak for another.,

Yes the Z560's had some issues, as do the Klipsch's. I've had both. The cracking issue has to do with the amplifier/audio card gain... simple solution, turn down the volume on the system tray a bit. Or . if you own Klipsch speakers, you can buy a new preamp unit for about $40 which cleans things up.

I also think that some people are under the impression that it's ok to max the volume out on a speakerset. Not true.

I'd imagine the Z680's will be a solid speakerset and compare quite nicely to the Klipsch 5.1s. I'm a big fan of Klipsch, but the 680's are priced @ $295... tough to beat especially when the 5.1's are going for over $350.
 

Creig

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
5,171
13
81
Best Buy currently has a $15 Gift Card offer on the Z-640 which ends on 10-26. Would be a good deal if you can find a decent pricematch that they will accept.
 

tazdevl

Golden Member
Mar 1, 2000
1,651
0
0
FYI Mwave has the 680s for $295+$35 shipping, Newegg has them listed for $380 with $20 shipping... $70 price difference.
 
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