Looks like Mt. Gox is dead...

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Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,414
1,574
126
What would be more interesting is MtGox's internal databases. These should hold the support tickets where people requested repeat withdrawrals, and a list of all the transactions on their accounts.

Allegedly there is a Russian hacking group who appears to have stolen this MySQL database (complete with embedded scans of passports, etc.) who are claiming to be preparing a torrent release....

O_O

caps
 

ImpulsE69

Lifer
Jan 8, 2010
14,946
1,077
126
The loss is a giant setback to the currency's image because its backers have promoted Bitcoin as safe from counterfeit and theft.



Spoken like people who don't understand technology.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
no, I believe that money is printed using machines and paper that is not easily attainable by most mortals, of which authenticity can be verified using a $5 pen.

In secret factories run by elves, right.

If it's attainable by some, it's attainable by others. Why do you think they keep changing bills every few years? It's not for fun, it's because somebody figured out how to counterfeit the last style well enough to pass them as real.
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,414
1,574
126
In secret factories run by elves, right.

If it's attainable by some, it's attainable by others. Why do you think they keep changing bills every few years? It's not for fun, it's because somebody figured out how to counterfeit the last style well enough to pass them as real.

So, are you telling me those pens don't work on new counterfeit bills?
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
So, are you telling me those pens don't work on new counterfeit bills?

Are you telling me the US Treasury keeps redesigning new bills with additional security features like holograms and woven metallic strips even though the pen test is foolproof?
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,414
1,574
126
Are you telling me the US Treasury keeps redesigning new bills with additional security features like holograms and woven metallic strips even though the pen test is foolproof?

Gotta keep the homies employed.
 

Mark R

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
8,513
14
81
So, are you telling me those pens don't work on new counterfeit bills?
They're certainly not reliable.

They only detect starch, which is present in normal office paper, and can easily contaminate real currency by accidentally putting money through the laundry, or contamination with starchy foods (e.g. fries or bread), giving a false counterfeit result.

There are also a number of household chemicals that can treat paper so as to pass the pen test. Premium part linen paper feels surprisingly close to real currency paper, and a quick wipe over with a common household chemical will have it pass the pen test too.
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,414
1,574
126
They're certainly not reliable.

They only detect starch, which is present in normal office paper, and can easily contaminate real currency by accidentally putting money through the laundry, or contamination with starchy foods (e.g. fries or bread), giving a false counterfeit result.

There are also a number of household chemicals that can treat paper so as to pass the pen test. Premium part linen paper feels surprisingly close to real currency paper, and a quick wipe over with a common household chemical will have it pass the pen test too.



(i stand corrected)

I had to a do a double-take of the article. Apparently, their database developer didn't know what transactions were (at least in the db context) and that they might be somehow applicable to real-world transactions.

Wow.

sounds like a place i wanna dump my life savings into.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
I had to a do a double-take of the article. Apparently, their database developer didn't know what transactions were (at least in the db context) and that they might be somehow applicable to real-world transactions.

Wow.

As I said before, amateur hour.

"Hmmm, the cash was moved but the bitcoin balance doesn't match. Wonder what we do now?"

 

jagec

Lifer
Apr 30, 2004
24,442
6
81
Allegedly there is a Russian hacking group who appears to have stolen this MySQL database (complete with embedded scans of passports, etc.) who are claiming to be preparing a torrent release....

LOL, that's got to freak out the paranoid types who would be gravitating to Bitcoin in the first place.
 

Soundmanred

Lifer
Oct 26, 2006
10,784
6
81
On December 21, 1954, a woman named Dorothy Martin thought the world was going to end. Martin, a Chicago housewife, claimed to have received a message from aliens, warning her of an impending flood that would kill everyone on earth except for true believers, who would be carried away to safety on a flying saucer. For months, Martin had been gathering a band of followers who called themselves the Seekers and quietly prepared for their alien abduction. The Seekers left behind family and friends, sold their possessions, and on December 20, they waited. When midnight came, they waited some more.

When they realized the flying saucer wasn't going to come, and that Martin's prophecy had been wrong, something odd happened: Rather than giving up, the Seekers began furiously calling up newspapers and trying to spread their message as widely as possible. In order to overcome the cognitive dissonance of their situation and convince themselves their sacrifices had been worthwhile, they needed to proselytize.

This is, we now know, a psychologically normal response for prophetic groups whose central predictions fail to come true. And today, you can see something similar going on with another group of failing zealots. I'm talking about the cult of Bitcoin.

For months now, Bitcoin soothsayers have proclaimed that the virtual currency is going to Change Everything. The mass adoption of Bitcoin, they told us, would utterly transform the way the world stores and exchanges value. Government-backed currency would become obsolete. Farmers in Kenya would use the same Bitcoin-based payment systems as cafés in the Mission. With the future of money in the hands of Satoshi Nakamoto's brilliant protocol, inexact central planning would be replaced by algorithmic decentralization.

Of course, none of that has happened. And it's exceedingly likely that none of it will.
You've probably heard about the bankruptcy of Mt. Gox, a former Magic: The Gathering card exchange that morphed into Bitcoin’s largest trading floor before being wiped out by a nearly $500 million heist. But even before that, new knocks to Bitcoin were coming fast and furious: the arrest of Bitcoin prodigy Charlie Shrem; the consolidation of Bitcoin mining operations in a way that threatened to undermine the rules of the currency itself; the successive (and utterly predictable) shutdowns of Silk Road and Utopia. Today, another nail hit the coffin courtesy of Flexcoin, a so-called "Bitcoin bank" that announced that all its users' accounts had simply vanished.

These may seem like isolated incidents, but together, they add up to a massive, damning breach of trust. I don't doubt, as Nobel laureate Robert Shiller put it last week, that "something good can arise from [Bitcoin's] innovations." But Bitcoin itself will never recover from these initial pratfalls. Partly this is because lawmakers and regulators, spooked by early hype and the Mt. Gox disaster, are never going to afford Bitcoin services the kind of autonomy they'd need in order to flourish. Partly it's because there are conceptual problems with the Bitcoin architecture itself. And partly it's because Bitcoin's anarchic roots are too fringe to draw in the masses. In the mind of the average American, the currency is now synonymous with theft, drugs, and techno-wizardry. These impressions do not a global currency make.

As Bitcoin stumbles, the community growing up around it has only become more fervent. Their beliefs are barely falsifiable. Their leaders give lengthy sermons and call fellow adherents "brothers." It has never been enough for this group to have supported the rise of a nifty new experimental currency – what they want, and what they believe is coming, is the dawn of an entirely new age.

You can find many of the loonier Bitcoin proclamations on the r/bitcoin subreddit. (One recent call-to-arms, written by Bitcoin entrepreneur Erik Voorhees, included lines like "We are building a new financial order, and those of us building it, investing in it, and growing it, will pay the price of bringing it to the world.") But they appear in more mainstream places as well. Investor Marc Andreessen's Bitcoin manifesto (in which he said that "the consequences of [Bitcoin] are hard to overstate") appeared on the New York Times's DealBook. Bitcoin Investment Trust founder Barry Silbert
is quoted in places like The Wall Street Journal extolling the virtues of the virtual currency. ("2014 will be the year of bitcoin on Wall Street," he said.)

Ask any of these Bitcoin believers about any of the recent incidents, and they will defend the currency with religious fervor. It's good when black-market drug peddlers and money launderers are taken out of the system, they say, because it makes room for more legitimate Bitcoin operations. Charlie Shrem was a naïf who got ahead of himself. Mt. Gox was taken down by "transaction malleability." The problem is with the immature Bitcoin architecture, not with Bitcoin itself.

But these are head-fakes, meant to distract from Bitcoin's disastrous move to the mainstream while consoling believers about the current state of affairs. There are already horror stories from those who have entrusted their life savings to Bitcoin, only to lose most or all of it when an exchange collapsed. Emin Gün Sirer, a computer science professor at Cornell who has studied the crypto-currency, sums up the state of Bitcoin in a way that almost makes you feel sorry for the remaining faithful:
Bitcoin, at the moment, is in a slump, with a community that has become its own parody … The Bitcoin masses, judging by their behavior on forums, have no actual interest in science, technology or even objective reality when it interferes with their market position. They believe that holding a Bitcoin somehow makes them an active participant in a bold new future, even as they passively get fleeced in the bolder current present.
Watching some of my friends and colleagues fall under the Bitcoin spell has been dispiriting. It's one thing for Andreessen, whose venture-capital firm has millions of dollars invested in Bitcoin projects like Coinbase, to spend his time talking his book. It's another for right-thinking people to conclude that Bitcoin has some kind of real-world potential, based solely on the wide-eyed, group-think-y opinions of the people around them.

The uncomfortable fact for Bitcoin believers is that every major prediction they've made has yet to come true. And as time passes and the inevitable fizzle-out of Bitcoin becomes visible, those believers will splinter. More will drop out of the cult. And the ones who remain will only grow more convinced, more zealous, more eager to share the good news.

After all, the difference between the Seekers' apocalyptic prediction and the Bitcoin dream is that the latter can self-fulfill. The nature of a speculative commodity like Bitcoin is that it essentially runs on hope – the more people who buy the hype, the higher the value goes, and the more firms like Andreessen Horowitz are willing to pump money into strengthening the Bitcoin ecosystem. Wish for the UFO hard enough, and it might actually arrive.

But the Bitcoin dream is all but dead. Now the true believers are trying to cope with their setbacks by increasing their numbers. And if history is any guide, they’ll keep telling you the bright future of Bitcoin is just ahead, long after they've ceased to believe it themselves.
 

AViking

Platinum Member
Sep 12, 2013
2,264
1
0
Really all we're left with is reality: People who believe in bitcoin are stupid and there are enough stupid people in this world to allow people to steal from them using whatever the current fad of the day. Bitcoins, penny stocks, tech stocks with zero earnings, dreams of riches buying houses out in Arizona, Nevada, and Florida, and so on.

Stupid people.
 

rockyct

Diamond Member
Jun 23, 2001
6,656
32
91
Really all we're left with is reality: People who believe in bitcoin are stupid and there are enough stupid people in this world to allow people to steal from them using whatever the current fad of the day. Bitcoins, penny stocks, tech stocks with zero earnings, dreams of riches buying houses out in Arizona, Nevada, and Florida, and so on.

Stupid people.

Yeah, tech bubble 2.0 is inflating quite nicely now. I mean, seriously...$19 billion for Whatsapp? No wonder Snapchat turned down a $3 billion offer. $1 billion for Instagram is now looking like a "bargain."
 

dawheat

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2000
3,132
93
91
They're certainly not reliable.

They only detect starch, which is present in normal office paper, and can easily contaminate real currency by accidentally putting money through the laundry, or contamination with starchy foods (e.g. fries or bread), giving a false counterfeit result.

There are also a number of household chemicals that can treat paper so as to pass the pen test. Premium part linen paper feels surprisingly close to real currency paper, and a quick wipe over with a common household chemical will have it pass the pen test too.

Any counterfeiter above a kid in their room at minimum use starch free paper which is readily available so yes, those pens are basically useless.

Even things like the hologram and security stripe can be visibly copied (though the glowing aspect is harder to fake). Folks I know who handle a ton of cash really say the best way is always feel. The machines that banks use to make the hologram and security stripe visible and glow simultaneously are effective but expensive.

People wash bills these days too so they pass all the tests, though the security items are in the wrong place. So tellers just looking for them in general without really knowing where they should be per bill can get fooled.
 
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