Low budget PC card?

[DKlein]

I'm trying to build a computer for my sister, after she messed up the last one I handed down to her (well, I probably messed it up first). Anyway, I'm wondering what my video options are. All she really wants to do is download music, play music, and also DVDs.

I know onboard sound is bad for gaming, but is it adequate for this application or should I get a budget video card? Maybe a 9600pro or something. This computer is by no means high tech (AGP, Socket A, etc), and I'm hoping to keep it under $400-450, sans monitor.

Any advice?

 

[Matthias99]

Onboard video should be fine as long as you aren't running 3D games.

If you insist on a discrete card, I'd look at something like a RADEON 9200[SE], or a GeForce FX5200.

 

[DKlein]

So it would make no difference for winamp visualizations or DVD playback then?

 

[DanielHerrmann]

I had a geforce 4 mx420 and it played DVD's pretty well. I think they're like $20 on ebay or something. I still have that one actually......

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: DKlein
So it would make no difference for winamp visualizations or DVD playback then?

I think Winamp is pretty much all done in software, so no.

DVD playback may have lower CPU usage on a discrete card, but a SocketA system would have no problems playing it back in software. This was an issue with really old CPUs (like Pentium 2-class), but not anymore.

 

[DKlein]

Okay. I've actually decided to go 754 anyway, and the processor will definately be good enough (well, 2800+ or so. My sis complains a lot). I'll skip on the card, then. Thanks.

 

[Piuc2020]

get a cheapass 9600SE or so for like 50 bucks.

 

[Powermoloch]

you could build a kick @ss system for 450 bucks oh yeah. GL !

 

[DKlein]

Couldn't find a board with a card on it.?

Would this work: FX5200

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: DKlein
So it would make no difference for winamp visualizations or DVD playback then?

You don't want onboard video. Scrolling in something as simple as acrobat is painful and graphics are blurry. Check of ATI 9200.

Incidently I have one new I can sell you for $25 shipped if interested. I actually have lots of videocards laying around but that would suit your needs great for everything but 3d games.

 

[WhoBeDaPlaya]

Heck, I have a GF4 Ti4200 64MB in pristine condition that you can have for $30 shipped
It's going into my 3rd gen FS/FT thread (as soon as I get work outta the way).
Please e-mail if you're interested. I've yet to find the time to tackle the nightmare I
call my PM inbox

 

[L00PY]

Modern onboard video is very, very good. I think I've may have only now hit the 2D limitation of my onboard video this night. That was while watching 1080i HDTV on my LCD running at 1920x1200 over DVI while web browsing fullscreen on my CRT at 1600x1200. My HD viewing on my LCD was fine when I was running 1024x768 on my "old" CRT.

 

[impemonk]

ATi 9550

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: WhoBeDaPlaya
Valar

3700 is 2200Mhz default not 2400.

 

[hans007]

yeah get a board with a good onboard chipset.

a 754 board with nvidia 6100 or a radeon xpress 200 would be good.

i am not sure the sis based 760gx or via km800 type chipsets are quite as good, but they may also be adequate.

 

[Sc4freak]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: DKlein
So it would make no difference for winamp visualizations or DVD playback then?

You don't want onboard video. Scrolling in something as simple as acrobat is painful and graphics are blurry. Check of ATI 9200.

Incidently I have one new I can sell you for $25 shipped if interested. I actually have lots of videocards laying around but that would suit your needs great for everything but 3d games.

Uh... Isn't Adobe Acrobat done entirely on the CPU?

A discrete graphics card is almost useless for anything but games and anything 3D. For regular 2D usage, modern onboard is completely fine.

 

[Peter]

As perverse as it might sound at first, CPU-driven 2D is actually FASTER on integrated video than on discrete cards. This is because the CPU writes into system RAM much, much faster than to any kind of AGP or PCIE card.

Today's integrated graphics solutions, even the most basic ones in bottom end SiS or VIA chipsets, have DVD acceleration hardware.

 

[Cooler]

9800 for $80 last her few years at least

 

[selfbuilt]

Modern integrated is fine. Only thing to watch out for is the cheaper chipsets (e.g. Via's unichrome, which is a rebadged savage pro - can be little blurry at higher resolution/refresh rates on CRT). Of course, cheapo stand alone cards can have similar problems (i.e. budget card makers tend to skimp on RAMDAC quality). I wouldn't bother with stand-alone card for your sister's needs - decent quality integrated is fine.

 

[Peter]

Analog signal quality isn't the chip's fault - neither on the card nor on the mainboard. It's all in how much care the board/card designer put into their circuit design. As such, you can't make any generalizing statements about what chips give what quality.

Pssst ... you seem to have missed the fact that modern graphics solutions have long had the RAMDAC integrated into the main chip - there ain't no such thing as "skimping on RAMDAC quality" anymore. It's all in the circuit design.

 

[DKlein]

Well, she's also telling me now that she likes to game. I don't know if that means just Flash stuff or if she's actually playing the copy of Splinter Cell I gave her. I will find out whenever she gets back to me. Either way a 6100 or 5200 will be an improvement over the GF3Ti200 she had before, no?

 

[hans007]

fx5200 probably wouldnt be faster than a gf3 ti200.

6100 integrated would be but only if you were on a socket 939 board as it has dual channel (the 754 sempron boards, would be single channel and lack memory bandwidth so it may or may not be faster than a ti200)

 

[DKlein]

Would the 6100/754 at least be equivalent? She never really had issues with it before.

(Do you play AA, btw?)

 

[selfbuilt]

Originally posted by: Peter
Analog signal quality isn't the chip's fault - neither on the card nor on the mainboard. It's all in how much care the board/card designer put into their circuit design. As such, you can't make any generalizing statements about what chips give what quality.

Excellent point - I agree that a lot of the problem (in general) is likely to lie with the circuitry, and that can affect both integrated & cards. But integrateds are also likely to find themselves in a worse environment than cards do in this regard - i.e. I imagine there is extra noise, interference, etc., involved in being so close to all the other functional blocks of the chipset.

In any case, in the specific example I used (Via Unichrome) the chipset uses a 230Mhz ramdac. I think you have to agree that is rather substandard? This is the other "hidden" problem with integrateds - the cheaper chipsets often use slower integrated ramdacs. Most decent chipsets use 333-350Mhz ramdacs, it seems to me. Now, while I admit that a higher ramdac doesn't guarantee quality ("my 400mhz wins!"), a lower one is certainly asking for trouble at higher refesh/resolutions.

So I think I am justified in making the generalization that cheaper integrated chipsets are a problem, irrespective of board maker/circuitry issues. Of course, cheapo board makers tend to have poor circuitry designs AND tend to use cheapo chipsets - a double whammy for sure.

Pssst ... you seem to have missed the fact that modern graphics solutions have long had the RAMDAC integrated into the main chip - there ain't no such thing as "skimping on RAMDAC quality" anymore. It's all in the circuit design.

Oops, mental slip on my part when I wrote that (ah, the good old days when I used to look at external ramdacs when choosing cards). I know they're integrated today - I meant to refer here to those very same circuitry issues you pointed out in your post (i.e. cheapo card makers skimp here in circuitry design, leading to signal quality issues).

And now back to our regularly-scheduled program - the OP's question:

If your sis means 2D games (which is likely), I maintain a good quality integrated chipset will suit her needs fine.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Maybe get one of those integrated NV chipset (C51). The geforce 6150 to be exact.