Mac Pro & More

[ViRGE]

Glorious Leader has annouced the Mac Pro today, and as expected it's using Woodcrest(Xeon), not Conroe. The specs based on the keynote are(this will be updated with final specs later):

[*]2x Woodcrest Processors in all configurations(up to 3ghz)
[*]Looks like they're using indepedant busses for the CPUs, so no FSB-sharing problems
[*]Up to 16GB of memory
[*]Video options include Radeon x1900-series cards and Quadros(high-end options it seems); double-wide card slot
[*]New case design; roomier due to lower cooling needs, so there's now space for 4 HDs
[*]Superdrive is standard(duh)

The base configuration is as follows:

[*]2x2.66ghz Xeon
[*]1 GB RAM
[*]GeForce 7300 GT (256 MB VRAM)
[*]250GB SATA HD
[*]SuperDrive
$2499

Tech specs
[*]Processor: Only 3 configurations: 2x2ghz, 2x2.66ghz, or 2x3.0ghz Woodcrest
[*]RAM: DDR-2 Fully-Buffered DIMMs(DDR2 FB-DIMM). $270 per GB at Apple prices. 8 DIMM slots(4 per FSB) on 2 risders.
[*]Expasion slots: 4 PCI-E x16 slots, 1 is double-wide for the video card. 4 hard drive bays.
[*]Graphics: 7300GT, X1900XT, or Quadro FX 4500. Since all the PCI-E slots are x16, you can go up to 4 7300GT's(since they're single-wide).

 

[ViRGE]

Glorious Leader has also annouced new Xserves, also based on Woodcrest. It looks to be completely redesigned, as it finally gets a redundant power supply. Total drive capacity is now 5TB.

 

[Zinthar]

That's awesome for professional users who need insane power for their graphics editing apps, but I was hoping Apple would also include a low-end Mac Pro (or some other desktop tower) with a Conroe (E6400 or E6600) and multiple graphics card options. I'm a gamer with a mainstream (<$1500) budget who wants to support Apple and used OSX for my main programs and XP for gaming, and this would be perfect -- but alas I suppose it doesn't fit in with their business model.

 

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: Zinthar
That's awesome for professional users who need insane power for their graphics editing apps, but I was hoping Apple would also include a low-end Mac Pro (or some other desktop tower) with a Conroe (E6400 or E6600) and multiple graphics card options. I'm a gamer with a mainstream (<$1500) budget who wants to support Apple and used OSX for my main programs and XP for gaming, and this would be perfect -- but alas I suppose it doesn't fit in with their business model.

This is only gleaned off of the keynote speech, I'm sure there's a low-end option(though still using 2 CPUs), but I won't know what it is until the Apple Store is back up.

PS Glorious Leader has also annouced he has built a Time Machine(now the RDF encompasses time and space; Dr. Who watch out!)

 

[AmigaMan]

I'm reading a couple other blogs too. That Time Machine feature sounds awesome. Automated backup/journaling/restoration in one.

 

[ViRGE]

Time Machine logo

 

[ViRGE]

Finally the shiny - Core Animation(Part of the Core Video/Core Audio technology suite).

 

[ViRGE]

Bah, Leopard won't be released until the Spring.

 

[CU]

Vista has already anouced their verions of Time Machine, so now who is photocoping Jobs. I wish they annouced new Desktops/Labtops based on Core 2. I was really looking forward to a new Mac Book Pro with a Core 2 chip. It also looks like the next version of OSX will not be out until Spring. Vista may beat them yet. Maybe!

 

[ViRGE]

The Mac Pro page is up. And yes, I'm a bit disappointed they didn't annouce a Core 2 refresh either.

 

[Pantoot]

Yeah, I was hoping for the core 2 as well. It will be interesting to see how that time machine works in real life.
They also showed off a website clipper that will create widgits from the site's content. Seems to be a good way for websites to lose ad revenue. Getting dilbert without all the other stuff on the page would be nice for me, but probably not so nice for the host.

 

[ViRGE]

On the RAM, to put things in perspective, Crucial is charging $107 for 512MB FB-DIMMs.

 

[AmigaMan]

The MacPro is a nice, workstation-class machine, but I still think it's a bit overpriced. Having 2GB and more than 250GB HD should be standard for $2499. Throw in a wireless keyboard and mighty mouse and it'd be a killer machine for the price. OS X 10.5 seems ok, nothing that was a "killer app". I wish Apple would target the gamer-market and release a MacProLite or something. But I guess that's what the iMac is for.

 

[CU]

Apple has the chicken before the egg problem with a gaming Mac. Most games are not OSX native, so there is no real gaming Mac. Mac Pro is priced to high, and the iMac only comes with a ati 1600 and no upgradeablity. But why offer a gaming Mac with a limited number of games.

 

[mosco]

Originally posted by: CU
Vista has already anouced their verions of Time Machine, so now who is photocoping Jobs. I wish they annouced new Desktops/Labtops based on Core 2. I was really looking forward to a new Mac Book Pro with a Core 2 chip. It also looks like the next version of OSX will not be out until Spring. Vista may beat them yet. Maybe!

Apple copying? You act like vista has already been released. its not like apple woke up this morning and decided they wanted to put in backups. this has probably been in the planning/coding stages for years.

Originally posted by: AmigaMan
The MacPro is a nice, workstation-class machine, but I still think it's a bit overpriced. Having 2GB and more than 250GB HD should be standard for $2499. Throw in a wireless keyboard and mighty mouse and it'd be a killer machine for the price. OS X 10.5 seems ok, nothing that was a "killer app". I wish Apple would target the gamer-market and release a MacProLite or something. But I guess that's what the iMac is for.

I haven't done any price/spec comparisons with any other vendors but by looking at newegg, 2 2.6 GHz Xeons costs 760 each OEM. If you tried to build your own, you would have about a grand to spend on a dual proc motherboard, ram, heatsink, fans, case, dvd drive, hard drive, graphics card, keyboard, mouse and software. You can probably squeeze all of this out for under 1000, but its probably pretty close.

 

[CU]

Originally posted by: mosco

Originally posted by: CU
Vista has already anouced their verions of Time Machine, so now who is photocoping Jobs. I wish they annouced new Desktops/Labtops based on Core 2. I was really looking forward to a new Mac Book Pro with a Core 2 chip. It also looks like the next version of OSX will not be out until Spring. Vista may beat them yet. Maybe!

Apple copying? You act like vista has already been released. its not like apple woke up this morning and decided they wanted to put in backups. this has probably been in the planning/coding stages for years.

But Leopard is not released yet either and Vista should, big should, be out first. And yes I know the backups stuff has probly been planned for a while on both sides, but Jobs was picking on MS pretty bad for photocopying, so I though it was funny when he annouced Time Machine. Also the backup system is already in Windows 2003 Server but only for system files.

 

[Zinthar]

Originally posted by: CU
Apple has the chicken before the egg problem with a gaming Mac. Most games are not OSX native, so there is no real gaming Mac. Mac Pro is priced to high, and the iMac only comes with a ati 1600 and no upgradeablity. But why offer a gaming Mac with a limited number of games.

Because some people would buy a gaming Mac in order to use OS X for daily apps and then boot camp to XP just for gaming. Apple aims its products at mid to high-end users. A gaming conroe-based tower in the mid-range that offered upgradable graphics options would be excellent for those of us who don't need the outrageous CPU computational power of the Woodcrest x2 in Mac Pro.

 

[KeithP]

From Apple's web page...

Four independent 3Gb/s Serial ATA cable-free, direct attach hard drive bays; four internal hard drive carriers included

So apparently a HD simply snaps into place? I am sure they worked out the engineering on that but I would be concerned that any slight deviation in HD design which wouldn't be a problem with cables would cause issues with such a setup.

I also wish that instead of forcing everyone to go quad core that they would have put in the option to go with a single, dual core Xeon. I am guessing a lot folks even at the professional level won't see much of an improvement with the extra 2 cores.

-KeithP

 

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: Zinthar

Originally posted by: CU
Apple has the chicken before the egg problem with a gaming Mac. Most games are not OSX native, so there is no real gaming Mac. Mac Pro is priced to high, and the iMac only comes with a ati 1600 and no upgradeablity. But why offer a gaming Mac with a limited number of games.

Because some people would buy a gaming Mac in order to use OS X for daily apps and then boot camp to XP just for gaming. Apple aims its products at mid to high-end users. A gaming conroe-based tower in the mid-range that offered upgradable graphics options would be excellent for those of us who don't need the outrageous CPU computational power of the Woodcrest x2 in Mac Pro.

It also brings up the interesting point of video card compatibility. Now that we have PCI-E slots on an x86 chasis, are there any technical problems from using traditional PC video cards?

 

[ChAoTiCpInOy]

Think about it. Mac Pro, means it is targeted towards professionals. Macbook Pro is targeted towards professionals. Macbooks are targeted towards consumers. "Mac" may become a name for a consumer based desktop. Other than the iMac and Mac Mini.

 

[ChAoTiCpInOy]

It's not like Apple will skip a whole generation of Intel chips. Just be patient. You know what sucks though. There was no "One more thing..."

 

[Zinthar]

Exactly, a single Woodcrest at a more reasonable price would have been great.

But keep in mind that Apple is pretty smart about knowing its own customer base. If they're planning on releasing single Woodcrest, or a Conroe tower, it won't be for at least a month or two...they want their traditional constomer base who has been waiting on this for a while to pay for the Mac Pro (and its higher margins) rather than being given the option of a lower-priced model.

In their laptop line, they released the Macbook Pro about 4 months before the Macbook. If you look at the components in each, the Macbook is clearly a better value buy and is bringing in worse margins than the MB Pro. If they had given the Macbook option to consumers back in January, they'd have sold far fewer MB Pros between January and April.

 

[Zinthar]

Originally posted by: ChAoTiCpInOy
It's not like Apple will skip a whole generation of Intel chips. Just be patient. You know what sucks though. There was no "One more thing..."

hahaha, because Glorious Leader knew everyone was expecting it.

But seriously, this wasn't the place to unveil anything outside of the Leopard/Mac Pro realm. Apple can't announce Merom processors in the Macbook Pro yet with their release still being weeks away as it could cause consumers to hold off purchasing during a period that is a vital back-to-school shopping season for notebook sales.

New ipods and the much-rumored iPhone will get their own conferences.

 

[manly]

Originally posted by: ViRGE

Originally posted by: Zinthar

Originally posted by: CU
Apple has the chicken before the egg problem with a gaming Mac. Most games are not OSX native, so there is no real gaming Mac. Mac Pro is priced to high, and the iMac only comes with a ati 1600 and no upgradeablity. But why offer a gaming Mac with a limited number of games.

Because some people would buy a gaming Mac in order to use OS X for daily apps and then boot camp to XP just for gaming. Apple aims its products at mid to high-end users. A gaming conroe-based tower in the mid-range that offered upgradable graphics options would be excellent for those of us who don't need the outrageous CPU computational power of the Woodcrest x2 in Mac Pro.

It also brings up the interesting point of video card compatibility. Now that we have PCI-E slots on an x86 chasis, are there any technical problems from using traditional PC video cards?

I imagine you still need a Mac BIOS in the video card.

I wonder what RAM configurations work (without any performance hit) because the Apple offerings are rather restrictive.

 

[w00t]

Nice, I've been intrested in this I am a little bummed they did't decide to use have a conroe mac pro :-( speacially since there working on cider you will be able to game on a mac which i find really cool

Imagine having a Mac Pro with a X1900XTX and gaming in mac os x than you can have a dual boot with windows and mac os x. soon to be leopard