Mainland China hacked Google?

bwanaaa

Senior member
Dec 26, 2002
739
1
81
Why isnt the evidence presented? I would like to know how something can be tracked backed to Taiwan and from there to China. I would like to know the particulars. Time and again it has been shown that the intelligence of the net exceeds anything the 'experts' possess. That is the foundation of the open source movement. Why isnt that intelligence being put to good use. Are they afraid the net will figure out the truth?
 

Fizzorin

Member
Jan 11, 2010
90
0
0
From what I've read the hack was tracked to Taiwan and then China by way of IP tracing.

From there, the hack attempt itself lent evidence of China. Allegedly, the hack was performed by way of exploiting .pdf files. The code used was broken down by forensic programmers who determined that the coding "style" was that of the Chinese military.

The specifics of the attack have been kept quiet because of international relations issues and because the methodology was in the wild while a fix had (has?) not been offered.

Google, State Dept, Yahoo!, etc didn't want any petty-ante domestic hackers to use it if they could prevent it.
 

brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
6,334
1,210
126
Again, why the F are we wasting our time and money on a bunch of camel humpers while China and India butt sex us?
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,134
38
91
Again, why the F are we wasting our time and money on a bunch of camel humpers while China and India butt sex us?

It's the same reason Washington D.C. is determined to legalize all these illegal citizens: it's good for big business.
 

DesiPower

Lifer
Nov 22, 2008
15,366
740
126
What good would any evidence do? I mean even if they confess what will US do? they pretty much have US by the balls. I mean when the news initially came out and Hillary said something, she was pretty much told - "stay down and stay wet slut" and we did nothing...
 

ayabe

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2005
7,449
0
0
Not really sure who they're fooling at this point, "We don't censor the internet" sounds an awful lot like Baghdad Bob.
 

Fizzorin

Member
Jan 11, 2010
90
0
0
Well, technically the Chinese government doesn't censor the internet.

Government censorship is traditionally thought of as active blocking of content. In China the government has a policy of "Internet Self-Discipline" which basically gives ISPs vicarious liability for users' actions. Since the ISPs can be fined if citizens access 'inappropriate' material, it's the ISPs who are censoring the internet "voluntarily".

Effectuates the same result, but slightly different mechanic.
 

Fizzorin

Member
Jan 11, 2010
90
0
0
I was going to say that Bangladesh was a big Indian tech center, blah, blah but then I found out Bangladesh is a separate country. Why did I think it was part of India?

Then I remembered that I was thinking of Bangalore. Never been there, never seen it, but I've heard that Bangalore is just like the US (which I guess means it still could be a shithole).
 

bwanaaa

Senior member
Dec 26, 2002
739
1
81
I'll settle for evidence of the in trusion. Now that the IE hole was patched, why not reveal it? Consider this crazy far out alternative hypothesis(I know you people will think I am a pinko Commie but really I am not-even though I am from MA. I am just thinking about the money-=strictly who will benefit) :

1) Google needs content. Content is what drives clicks - and they are the masters at deriving profits from clicks. The censoring of Tianamen plus other juicy human rights issues limits the traffic that Google can drum up. Google needs growth to maintain its crazy stock price valuation.

2)How can Google get to use this censored content? How can Google find an excuse to drop the censorship-easy- claim they have been 'wronged' and position their action as a response. This way Google maintains the moral high ground AND opens up traffic.

Without any proof either way, we are victims of smoke blowers.

Aside from the particulars of this case, consider the following analogy- suppose you come across this intelligent population that has until now not seen the internet. The world is intensely curious about this new tribe living on an isolated island that has learned to do things without technology and whose members live to be 200 years old. (For argument's sake, let's call these people the Na'Vi). Google wants to put these people on the net so that the world's insatiatiable curiosity can be quenched (and google can derive billions of clicks on their ads in the process). Should Google be allowed to invade the space of the Na'Vi?
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
0
I was going to say that Bangladesh was a big Indian tech center, blah, blah but then I found out Bangladesh is a separate country. Why did I think it was part of India?

Then I remembered that I was thinking of Bangalore. Never been there, never seen it, but I've heard that Bangalore is just like the US (which I guess means it still could be a shithole).

The problem is cultural, not economic and it runs so deep that they carry it with them to whatever nation they end up in, the caste system and family honor.

You don't have much to worry about as a white man though, they'll all look up to you and if you say "boo" they will run, they are only really tough against their women, children, sick and old.

Women should watch out for flying acid baths and men should never ever even try to date one of their women unless he takes her away from the family directly and forever, the honor killings are only surpassed by the normal slaughter of their weak.

It's a fucked up nation filled with fucked up people following a fucked up religion.
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
0
I'll settle for evidence of the in trusion. Now that the IE hole was patched, why not reveal it? Consider this crazy far out alternative hypothesis(I know you people will think I am a pinko Commie but really I am not-even though I am from MA. I am just thinking about the money-=strictly who will benefit) :

1) Google needs content. Content is what drives clicks - and they are the masters at deriving profits from clicks. The censoring of Tianamen plus other juicy human rights issues limits the traffic that Google can drum up. Google needs growth to maintain its crazy stock price valuation.

2)How can Google get to use this censored content? How can Google find an excuse to drop the censorship-easy- claim they have been 'wronged' and position their action as a response. This way Google maintains the moral high ground AND opens up traffic.

Without any proof either way, we are victims of smoke blowers.

Aside from the particulars of this case, consider the following analogy- suppose you come across this intelligent population that has until now not seen the internet. The world is intensely curious about this new tribe living on an isolated island that has learned to do things without technology and whose members live to be 200 years old. (For argument's sake, let's call these people the Na'Vi). Google wants to put these people on the net so that the world's insatiatiable curiosity can be quenched (and google can derive billions of clicks on their ads in the process). Should Google be allowed to invade the space of the Na'Vi?

Fuck China, let's just get together and exclude them until they are willing to play on an open market and by open i do mean just that, open.

The highlight of all of this is Chinas government saying "we've been wrongfully accused!" ... the IRONY!

Fuck China, let their leaders rot in hell and take away the peoples newfound wealth until they do something about their government to free themselves of the slavery they are in.
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
2,359
126
Maybe Larry and Sergey will go to war with China since the government doesnt have the balls to
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,530
3
0
What good would any evidence do? I mean even if they confess what will US do? they pretty much have US by the balls. I mean when the news initially came out and Hillary said something, she was pretty much told - "stay down and stay wet slut" and we did nothing...
No, America isn't your immediate family and we don't treat our women, especially ones of prominence like Hillary that way.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,530
3
0
Not to defend the ChiComs but I'm sure if we could we'd hack into all their computers. It'd be a waste if we could and we didn't. Of course most of the info we'd get would be about the size of their neighbors wives vag, whose son is going to college and how much they make and how much they hate anybody that isn't Chinese..
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
0
Not to defend the ChiComs but I'm sure if we could we'd hack into all their computers. It'd be a waste if we could and we didn't. Of course most of the info we'd get would be about the size of their neighbors wives vag, whose son is going to college and how much they make and how much they hate anybody that isn't Chinese..

This is more like if the Dems would hack the Repubs computers but x10000000000.2 since both parties are allowed and the effects of a successful hack doesn't entail that they find out their names and torture them to death over a few months of time while finding out more and more.

I understand google perfectly, if i had been involved i would have demanded that it'd stop since the participation does indead mean that some people will get tortured, some imprisoned and some killed and as a finale all three for one in one googly deal.

Universal spying has always been done but this one involves a private company that has to decide if they want to take part and be ok with what has happened.

If they do, well ***bing**** that is the bell ending the fight..
 

rchiu

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2002
3,846
0
0
I'll settle for evidence of the in trusion. Now that the IE hole was patched, why not reveal it? Consider this crazy far out alternative hypothesis(I know you people will think I am a pinko Commie but really I am not-even though I am from MA. I am just thinking about the money-=strictly who will benefit) :

1) Google needs content. Content is what drives clicks - and they are the masters at deriving profits from clicks. The censoring of Tianamen plus other juicy human rights issues limits the traffic that Google can drum up. Google needs growth to maintain its crazy stock price valuation.

2)How can Google get to use this censored content? How can Google find an excuse to drop the censorship-easy- claim they have been 'wronged' and position their action as a response. This way Google maintains the moral high ground AND opens up traffic.

Without any proof either way, we are victims of smoke blowers.

Aside from the particulars of this case, consider the following analogy- suppose you come across this intelligent population that has until now not seen the internet. The world is intensely curious about this new tribe living on an isolated island that has learned to do things without technology and whose members live to be 200 years old. (For argument's sake, let's call these people the Na'Vi). Google wants to put these people on the net so that the world's insatiatiable curiosity can be quenched (and google can derive billions of clicks on their ads in the process). Should Google be allowed to invade the space of the Na'Vi?

See I don't know if you simply didn't read the news or you have some problem with your reading comprehension. Google made 2 very simple claim.
1) China hacked into Chinese human right's activists gmail account.
2) Censorship on Google.cn and filtered search engine.

on Claim #1, companies including Yahoo have stepped forward and made the similar claim
Claim #2, unless you live in a cave, you'd know that common knowledge. So I don't know what kind of "evidence" and "proof" you are looking for.

And you have to be ignorant to think Google is doing this for profit. 1) Google will never get China to do what it wanted going public like this. China is all about face and complying with Google after this very public thing means losing face which Chinese government will never do. So with their very public putting salt on Chinese's wound accusation, Google can forget about China lifting the censorship, and they will be looking at more attacks and hacking. 2) This will hurt Google's other business initiatives. If you keep up with business news, you'd know Google is putting lots of money and effort on mobile OS and phone with it's Android. Guess which country has the biggest mobile market with subscribers twice the entire US population? Guess which country has the biggest presence in mobile technology and manufacturing.

So I don't know what exactly you are getting at. You are trying to find proof where the claim is common knowledge and you have a theory that totally ignores the political and business reality.

Oh and by the way, both Gmail and Google.cn and google search engine is the property of Google, so I don't get what your Na'Vi analogy is trying to get at and what Google is trying to invade.
 
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Caesar

Golden Member
Nov 5, 1999
1,684
171
106
The problem is cultural, not economic and it runs so deep that they carry it with them to whatever nation they end up in, the caste system and family honor.

You don't have much to worry about as a white man though, they'll all look up to you and if you say "boo" they will run, they are only really tough against their women, children, sick and old.

Women should watch out for flying acid baths and men should never ever even try to date one of their women unless he takes her away from the family directly and forever, the honor killings are only surpassed by the normal slaughter of their weak.

It's a fucked up nation filled with fucked up people following a fucked up religion.

Wow you know alot about India, don't you? Dipshit!!!
 

llee

Golden Member
Oct 27, 2009
1,152
0
76
I think people need to stop for a second and look at their own prejudices. Why are you making the assumptions that you make? Do you have an inherent bias against/for China, Google, or the US? This sort of banter is why these countries fight in the real world. We need to cooperate on this issue and make understand each other's goals. Since China is unwilling to budge on this issue it simply won't, end of story. Since Google has already provided an alternative to the dilemma, you will either see it chicken out and stay abiding by rules or see the company stay true to its words. The US hasn't really committed itself to this argument so it is most likely that it will follow Google's lead and capitulate if google backs down. See guys, that wasn't so hard...
 

bwanaaa

Senior member
Dec 26, 2002
739
1
81
And you have to be ignorant to think Google is doing this for profit. 1) Google will never get China to do what it wanted going public like this. China is all about face and complying with Google after this very public thing means losing face which Chinese government will never do. So with their very public putting salt on Chinese's wound accusation, Google can forget about China lifting the censorship, and they will be looking at more attacks and hacking. 2) This will hurt Google's other business initiatives. If you keep up with business news, you'd know Google is putting lots of money and effort on mobile OS and phone with it's Android. Guess which country has the biggest mobile market with subscribers twice the entire US population? Guess which country has the biggest presence in mobile technology and manufacturing.

If Google was hacked through an IE flaw (which is now patched) why hasnt that flaw been described? I am ignorant of these details and want to learn. The argument that publishing it is only helpful to hackers is a straw man. Every hack should be open sourced the minute it is patched. The collective intelligence of the net far exceeds any company or government. There are a LOT of smart people out there.

Increased exposure will only help google. If they were truly hacked, then why didnt they place a 2 week moratorium on China while the flaw was patched? Instead they want to do LESS filtering. That's like speeding up when you find yourself on a more dangerous road. Rather, that reply fits with Google's need to grow, (and make more money) not with any futile response to alleged hacking attempts.

And if the Chinese govt were hacking google, why would they only be looking at Chinese dissidents? That is such a narrow and small sector that is a remote threat. I would think business/financial/bank intelligence would have far more value. But if I had to make a story up to embarrass China into lifting its censorship, I would pick Chinese dissidents as the target. What group could garner more sympathy from the international community than a downtrodden underdog?

And please refrain from ad hominem arguments like 'you are living under a rock' etc. I am simply taking the opposite point of view. Answer my questions if you can or present data to refute them.

And why are the founders of google selling their shares NOW? Something bad is happening at google.....something evil....
 
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