Man calls 911, then shoots burglars while on the phone with 911

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.

Look, it's a TV (or whatever inanimate object they might have had). How did this cowboy (and I mean that in the GWB sense of the word) know without a single doubt that his neighbor didn't just sell whatever they might have had on Craigslist?

If he didn't know with absolute certainty, then he shouldn't have shot. If the argument is that his neighbor wasn't home so he couldn't have sold them, then someone with so little regard for human life (even petty thieves like these are still human) obviously never intended to attempt to get them to stop.

This is almost to the point of premeditated murder. It sounds to me like the only reason for the 911 call was for an alibi.

Down boy. You just shot that vigilante in the back with that alibi crap. You need to be mindful that when something sounds like something to you it can very likely sound like that because you unconsciously want it to. You are attributing evil to somebody about whom you really don't know much and especially about his motivations, no? I think you should be more modest.

 

[JD50]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.
<snip>

Why are you fearful? Are you a burglar?

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: beyoku
WOW, you can even hear the gunshots on the audio. I wouldnt want my neighbor to kill anyone stealing from my home if i was not there. I on the other hand would shoot and possibly kill someone if they were breaking into my home. Its really about safety. Anything stolen from a home is not worth killing someone over. I think the guy should have stayed in his home.

What if they stole your wife or daughter or sons life.. would it be ok then if your neighbor shot them running away from a FAMILY DWELLING?

Don't break into HOMES and you won't get shot

That neighbor was protecting his whole neighborhood and was in the right.. why are the criminals so brave there?

I think shopowners should have special devices that kill instantly anyone who robs them and their store.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: RaiderJ
Well, if I saw someone breaking into my neighbor's house, I'd probably call the cops and get out my shotgun (maybe they'll come to my place next). However, I don't think I'd actually go over there... increases the chance that I might get shot. Still, I don't really have a problem with what the guy did. You break into someone's home, you deserve to get shot. Does it matter who did it?

I think that's the tricky part. I'm not sure I buy the idea that stealing someone's TV warrants a death sentence. Don't get me wrong, I don't want anyone stealing my TV, but there's a point at which we ridiculously devalue human life. I don't think the death penalty for burglary would be an appropriate punishment, why would it be OK for a private citizen to do what the state shouldn't be allowed to do?

It's a little too easy to get wrapped up in righteous anger over criminals, but it follows a little too closely with the logic that I can shoot the guy who cuts me off in traffic. Not comparing the offenses, mind you, just the idea that how pissed off I am over something should dictate the other guy's punishment.

Married?
Ailing parent live with you?

Are you using the perspective that the only thing of value in your home are material possessions?

What is they are the same people responsible for killing a homeowner who tried to defend their property.. you know that happens.. right?

Don't go into a family/residential dwelling to commit crimes.. steal from stockholders like rich people do

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.

Why? Are you committing residential burglaries?

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.

Look, it's a TV (or whatever inanimate object they might have had). How did this cowboy (and I mean that in the GWB sense of the word) know without a single doubt that his neighbor didn't just sell whatever they might have had on Craigslist?

If he didn't know with absolute certainty, then he shouldn't have shot. If the argument is that his neighbor wasn't home so he couldn't have sold them, then someone with so little regard for human life (even petty thieves like these are still human) obviously never intended to attempt to get them to stop.

This is almost to the point of premeditated murder. It sounds to me like the only reason for the 911 call was for an alibi.

Edit: I have been the victim of theft on four different occasions, I have had a motorcycle of mine stolen twice and my car stereo was jacked once and my car was broken into and cds and other things ripped off. Never once have I wanted, wished or thought that someone so desperate that they would need to steal something of so little value needed to be put to death. I suggest some of you actually look into finding a nice counselor that can help you regain your ability to realize that theft of property is nothing in the grand scheme of things and that you learn that insurance can replace your stuff but will never return you from the dark side of human nature that you have entered.

Quick question for you all drooling over, applauding and clamoring for this type of reaction...

Are you Christian (or religious in general) and/or do you support abortion?

OK, now you got my dander up and off come the gloves. I think you have confused your own righteous indignation with me drooling. One of the reasons that crime is bad for a society is that it does exactly what you fear. It makes people crazy for revenge and they have the moral superiority to hide that lust behind. When you come along and poke them in the ass it makes them even madder. When you've had your house broken into a few times and everything of monetary value taken come back and see me.

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
This is a crime that causes seething rage in me and demoralization in faith in me.

You, of all people, should know who the true object of your hate is.

 

[RightIsWrong]

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.
<snip>

Why are you fearful? Are you a burglar?

I'm fearful because idiots like this may hit someone that they are not intending to hit which could be me or someone in my family. Who knows when they will be robbed and have their neighbor be some goober like this that believes they are doing you a favor by causing grief for one family and guilt for another.

I can speak for myself, my wife and my children when I say that we would feel violated but would never ever expect, want or ask for the person to be put to death for something so petty.

I could easily kill to protect my family but would never even consider it to protect my belongings.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.
<snip>

Why are you fearful? Are you a burglar?

I'm fearful because idiots like this may hit someone that they are not intending to hit which could be me or someone in my family. Who knows when they will be robbed and have their neighbor be some goober like this that believes they are doing you a favor by causing grief for one family and guilt for another.

I can speak for myself, my wife and my children when I say that we would feel violated but would never ever expect, want or ask for the person to be put to death for something so petty.

I could easily kill to protect my family but would never even consider it to protect my belongings.

I guess you are with your family in the home 24 HOURS A DAY eh?

If my GF was home and you burglarized my home I would hope my neighbor shot you before you ever made it 5 feet into the home

 

[RightIsWrong]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.
<snip>

Why are you fearful? Are you a burglar?

I'm fearful because idiots like this may hit someone that they are not intending to hit which could be me or someone in my family. Who knows when they will be robbed and have their neighbor be some goober like this that believes they are doing you a favor by causing grief for one family and guilt for another.

I can speak for myself, my wife and my children when I say that we would feel violated but would never ever expect, want or ask for the person to be put to death for something so petty.

I could easily kill to protect my family but would never even consider it to protect my belongings.

I guess you are with your family in the home 24 HOURS A DAY eh?

If my GF was home and you burglarized my home I would hope my neighbor shot you before you ever made it 5 feet into the home

I'm shocked that Bush's support has dwindled to ~30% with all the idiocy present in this thread. I think that we should be invading Iran next week and then schedule North Korea for after the holidays. Maybe if we rush, we could close out the year with a bang and take out Canada too. After all, I'm sure that you are all so fearful that they have armies that MIGHT, COULD or WANT to attack you.

Quit living in fear. If my wife or family were home alone, they are smart enough to lock the doors and windows. They are also well versed in escape routes for any emergency that might come up and which path to take. I'm sorry that you would rather live in fear and not address these situations prior to them occurring and hoping that your neighbor might be Barney Fife enough to cover for your shortcomings.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.
<snip>

Why are you fearful? Are you a burglar?

I'm fearful because idiots like this may hit someone that they are not intending to hit which could be me or someone in my family. Who knows when they will be robbed and have their neighbor be some goober like this that believes they are doing you a favor by causing grief for one family and guilt for another.

I can speak for myself, my wife and my children when I say that we would feel violated but would never ever expect, want or ask for the person to be put to death for something so petty.

I could easily kill to protect my family but would never even consider it to protect my belongings.

I guess you are with your family in the home 24 HOURS A DAY eh?

If my GF was home and you burglarized my home I would hope my neighbor shot you before you ever made it 5 feet into the home

I'm shocked that Bush's support has dwindled to ~30% with all the idiocy present in this thread. I think that we should be invading Iran next week and then schedule North Korea for after the holidays. Maybe if we rush, we could close out the year with a bang and take out Canada too. After all, I'm sure that you are all so fearful that they have armies that MIGHT, COULD or WANT to attack you.

Quit living in fear. If my wife or family were home alone, they are smart enough to lock the doors and windows. They are also well versed in escape routes for any emergency that might come up and which path to take. I'm sorry that you would rather live in fear and not address these situations prior to them occurring and hoping that your neighbor might be Barney Fife enough to cover for your shortcomings.

Blah Blah Blah.. You said a bunch of BS.. If two home invaders snuck into your home WTF are they gonna do about it..

OK.. remove your family from the equation since you are all so brilliant and could defend yourself from a whole Russian Army

People who break into Residential Dwellings should never be taken lightly.. ever..

Go ahead and mail some flowers and commissary money to some home burglars in your local jail

 

[JD50]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.
<snip>

Why are you fearful? Are you a burglar?

I'm fearful because idiots like this may hit someone that they are not intending to hit which could be me or someone in my family. Who knows when they will be robbed and have their neighbor be some goober like this that believes they are doing you a favor by causing grief for one family and guilt for another.

I can speak for myself, my wife and my children when I say that we would feel violated but would never ever expect, want or ask for the person to be put to death for something so petty.

I could easily kill to protect my family but would never even consider it to protect my belongings.

I guess you are with your family in the home 24 HOURS A DAY eh?

If my GF was home and you burglarized my home I would hope my neighbor shot you before you ever made it 5 feet into the home

I'm shocked that Bush's support has dwindled to ~30% with all the idiocy present in this thread. I think that we should be invading Iran next week and then schedule North Korea for after the holidays. Maybe if we rush, we could close out the year with a bang and take out Canada too. After all, I'm sure that you are all so fearful that they have armies that MIGHT, COULD or WANT to attack you.

Quit living in fear. If my wife or family were home alone, they are smart enough to lock the doors and windows. They are also well versed in escape routes for any emergency that might come up and which path to take. I'm sorry that you would rather live in fear and not address these situations prior to them occurring and hoping that your neighbor might be Barney Fife enough to cover for your shortcomings.

We aren't the ones living in fear. Actually, by your own admission, YOU are the one thats living in fear....

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: RaiderJ
Well, if I saw someone breaking into my neighbor's house, I'd probably call the cops and get out my shotgun (maybe they'll come to my place next). However, I don't think I'd actually go over there... increases the chance that I might get shot. Still, I don't really have a problem with what the guy did. You break into someone's home, you deserve to get shot. Does it matter who did it?

I think that's the tricky part. I'm not sure I buy the idea that stealing someone's TV warrants a death sentence. Don't get me wrong, I don't want anyone stealing my TV, but there's a point at which we ridiculously devalue human life. I don't think the death penalty for burglary would be an appropriate punishment, why would it be OK for a private citizen to do what the state shouldn't be allowed to do?

It's a little too easy to get wrapped up in righteous anger over criminals, but it follows a little too closely with the logic that I can shoot the guy who cuts me off in traffic. Not comparing the offenses, mind you, just the idea that how pissed off I am over something should dictate the other guy's punishment.

Married?
Ailing parent live with you?

Are you using the perspective that the only thing of value in your home are material possessions?

What is they are the same people responsible for killing a homeowner who tried to defend their property.. you know that happens.. right?

Don't go into a family/residential dwelling to commit crimes.. steal from stockholders like rich people do

Neither, but I'm not talking about shooting someone who's breaking down my door, I'm talking about someone who HAS broken into my house and is running away with my laptop (or whatever). Because that's what this story is about, save the noise about protecting myself and my girlfriend, you don't have to sell me on that idea. But that is not what this thread is about, this is about the idea of shooting someone who is NOT an immediate danger to you just because they broke the law in some way. In other words, is it justifiable to use deadly force in a case other than self defense or defending someone else?

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.

Why? Are you committing residential burglaries?

Don't be silly, I see exactly what his point is. The average person isn't Walker Texas Ranger, trusting some random guy to have the judgement to only shoot burglers is a tall order when you consider the intelligence of the average person out there. Now in cases of self-defense, it's a little more clear cut...some guy coming after you with a knife or trying to break down your door looks pretty much like a threat to anyone with a brain. But when you're talking about a crime being committed against a third party where there is no immediate danger to anybody is a whole different story. Depending on the situation, there could be quite a bit of judgement involved. Even if you are in favor of shooting everyone who jaywalks, laws like they have in Texas also force you to rely on the average gun owner to know the difference.

Edit: To take your logic farther...should we just abolish the police and give everyone a concealed carry permit and give them the authority to enforce the law? If not, why not?

 

[dahunan]

If a burglar was in a getwaway car I think using deadly force is justified.. I know these guys weren't but they would have been.. Car chases endanger too many innocent citizens and the criminals life is not worth the risk to the innocents

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: dahunan
If a burglar was in a getwaway car I think using deadly force is justified.. I know these guys weren't but they would have been.. Car chases endanger too many innocent citizens and the criminals life is not worth the risk to the innocents

Look, I see what you're saying, but reality is rarely so clear cut...and honestly, I don't like a system where I have to trust some random asshole with a gun to figure out the right thing to do. If he's defending himself, that's one thing, but I don't trust the local lifetime member of the NRA to go around my neighborhood enforcing the law. Yeah, maybe he's a good guy who will make us safer...and maybe he'll shoot me in the head as he's standing in the street blasting away at the fleeing burglars. Given that the only barrier to gun ownership is having a few hundred dollars on hand, you're essentially asking me to put MY life in the hands of whatever random Joe happens to take it upon himself to defend the neighborhood. That seems counterintuitive to the idea of "self-defense" if you ask me.

 

[FoBoT]

its Texas
i say don't charge him

 

[WHAMPOM]

The prime deterrent of crime is the armed citizen. Necessary homocide? Culling the gene pool?

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: WHAMPOM
The prime deterrent of crime is the armed citizen.

Yes! Yes! Like Iraq, or the Pakistani tribal areas! :thumbsup:

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: WHAMPOM
The prime deterrent of crime is the armed citizen. Necessary homocide? Culling the gene pool?

There are considerations other than the deterrent factor. Otherwise cops would have the authority to shoot anyone on the spot for any crime at all, from murder to jaywalking. But they don't, and I don't think a reasonable person would argue that they should. Why is it suddenly a different story when we're talking about private citizens? It's like everyone has this huge blindspot for crime, and saying "well, he was a criminal" is justification for anything.

 

[bctbct]

I wonder if there is any correlation between Bush killing all those inmates 10-15 years ago and Texas becoming a blood hungry state?

 

[umbrella39]

Sounds like a lot of people posting here can't wait until someone tries to steal something from them so they can get their chance to make an easy kill.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.

Look, it's a TV (or whatever inanimate object they might have had). How did this cowboy (and I mean that in the GWB sense of the word) know without a single doubt that his neighbor didn't just sell whatever they might have had on Craigslist?

If he didn't know with absolute certainty, then he shouldn't have shot. If the argument is that his neighbor wasn't home so he couldn't have sold them, then someone with so little regard for human life (even petty thieves like these are still human) obviously never intended to attempt to get them to stop.

This is almost to the point of premeditated murder. It sounds to me like the only reason for the 911 call was for an alibi.

Edit: I have been the victim of theft on four different occasions, I have had a motorcycle of mine stolen twice and my car stereo was jacked once and my car was broken into and cds and other things ripped off. Never once have I wanted, wished or thought that someone so desperate that they would need to steal something of so little value needed to be put to death. I suggest some of you actually look into finding a nice counselor that can help you regain your ability to realize that theft of property is nothing in the grand scheme of things and that you learn that insurance can replace your stuff but will never return you from the dark side of human nature that you have entered.

Quick question for you all drooling over, applauding and clamoring for this type of reaction...

Are you Christian (or religious in general) and/or do you support abortion?

100% support his actions as far as we know...this is qualified because we don't know exactly what happened when he confronted the enemy. The absolute right to confront said enemy should not be in question however. If it turns out he shot them in the back with NO provocation then I will rescind my support of the shooting only, while still totally applauding his actions up to that point.

I am not a Christian, I support a woman's reproductive control over her own body.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: RaiderJ
Well, if I saw someone breaking into my neighbor's house, I'd probably call the cops and get out my shotgun (maybe they'll come to my place next). However, I don't think I'd actually go over there... increases the chance that I might get shot. Still, I don't really have a problem with what the guy did. You break into someone's home, you deserve to get shot. Does it matter who did it?

I think that's the tricky part. I'm not sure I buy the idea that stealing someone's TV warrants a death sentence. Don't get me wrong, I don't want anyone stealing my TV, but there's a point at which we ridiculously devalue human life. I don't think the death penalty for burglary would be an appropriate punishment, why would it be OK for a private citizen to do what the state shouldn't be allowed to do?

It's a little too easy to get wrapped up in righteous anger over criminals, but it follows a little too closely with the logic that I can shoot the guy who cuts me off in traffic. Not comparing the offenses, mind you, just the idea that how pissed off I am over something should dictate the other guy's punishment.

Married?
Ailing parent live with you?

Are you using the perspective that the only thing of value in your home are material possessions?

What is they are the same people responsible for killing a homeowner who tried to defend their property.. you know that happens.. right?

Don't go into a family/residential dwelling to commit crimes.. steal from stockholders like rich people do

Neither, but I'm not talking about shooting someone who's breaking down my door, I'm talking about someone who HAS broken into my house and is running away with my laptop (or whatever). Because that's what this story is about, save the noise about protecting myself and my girlfriend, you don't have to sell me on that idea. But that is not what this thread is about, this is about the idea of shooting someone who is NOT an immediate danger to you just because they broke the law in some way. In other words, is it justifiable to use deadly force in a case other than self defense or defending someone else?

In my opinion, absolutely. A criminal surrenders their right to safety, and even to life itself, when they choose to commit a crime. While I don't suggest needlessly taking life, I'm 100% for a strong front against any and all criminal activity...this means confronting criminals in the act and stopping them cold...if they refuse to comply once caught then they've chosen death. At that point it's suicide, not murder.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
It's threads & responses like the ones in this thread that make me glad I live in Texas.

The guy was within his rights to do exactly what he did.

:thumbsup:

And it's idiots like the jackass in the OP story and you that make me fearful that I live in Texas.

Why? Are you committing residential burglaries?

Don't be silly, I see exactly what his point is. The average person isn't Walker Texas Ranger, trusting some random guy to have the judgement to only shoot burglers is a tall order when you consider the intelligence of the average person out there. Now in cases of self-defense, it's a little more clear cut...some guy coming after you with a knife or trying to break down your door looks pretty much like a threat to anyone with a brain. But when you're talking about a crime being committed against a third party where there is no immediate danger to anybody is a whole different story. Depending on the situation, there could be quite a bit of judgement involved. Even if you are in favor of shooting everyone who jaywalks, laws like they have in Texas also force you to rely on the average gun owner to know the difference.

Edit: To take your logic farther...should we just abolish the police and give everyone a concealed carry permit and give them the authority to enforce the law? If not, why not?

For the most part we all already have that right.