Man Shot in London

[cumhail]

Originally posted by: Aegeon

Originally posted by: Drift3r
Read the freaking story. It is the same story everywhere. They chased the guy and he fell down and then the plain clothed cops pinned him to the ground and shot him 5 times in the chest and head. I don't think they even identified themselves though I ain't sure on that piece of item yet. Of course they did lie about him having wires coming out of his coat so who knows what else they lied about in their report.

You might want to read the news story more closely next time. The report about the wires was from an eyewitness who want not with the police. They fired after bringing him to the ground because they believed he was suicide bomber, and just the flick of a switch on his body could detonate any bomb he was carrying into crowd of people in the area. They needed to make immediately sure he couldn't flick any switches and they had to use lethal force to do so.

So now anyone deemed a "suspect" is presumed guilty until proven... dead?

cumhail

 

[Aegeon]

Originally posted by: cumhail
So now anyone deemed a "suspect" is presumed guilty until proven... dead?

cumhail

When its a matter of immediate life and death, you can't wait a few weeks for a definative determination of whether the suspect is a suicide bomber or not.:roll: Under these circumstances, police can be forced to make a snap judgement. The same thing happens if some suspect draws a gun and points it at a police officer. The police officer usually simply has to shoot because not doing so means he is likely to get shot first, even though its possible that the gun could just be a realistic looking water gun or a toy gun.

 

[Proletariat]

Originally posted by: Aegeon

Originally posted by: cumhail
So now anyone deemed a "suspect" is presumed guilty until proven... dead?

cumhail

When its a matter of immediate life and death, you can't wait a few weeks for a definative determination of whether the suspect is a suicide bomber or not.:roll: Under these circumstances, police can be forced to make a snap judgement. The same thing happens if some suspect draws a gun and points it at a police officer. The police officer usually simply has to shoot because not doing so means he is likely to get shot first, even though its possible that the gun could just be a realistic looking water gun or a toy gun.

This is a bad comparision. There was no imagined or real threat to these officers. They had followed the suspect for a long time - why didn't they just stop him. Now - these officers may not have been acting maliciously but they definitely were VERY sloppy.

 

[arsbanned]

Idiots. Nice work being complete failures! Soon you'll be a stupid as the FBI!

 

[colonel]

what a shame, the way they kill it, like a pig, Britos are terrible killers..

http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/crime/article301234.ece

 

[cumhail]

Originally posted by: Aegeon

Originally posted by: cumhail
So now anyone deemed a "suspect" is presumed guilty until proven... dead?

cumhail

When its a matter of immediate life and death, you can't wait a few weeks for a definative determination of whether the suspect is a suicide bomber or not.:roll: Under these circumstances, police can be forced to make a snap judgement. The same thing happens if some suspect draws a gun and points it at a police officer. The police officer usually simply has to shoot because not doing so means he is likely to get shot first, even though its possible that the gun could just be a realistic looking water gun or a toy gun.

Holding a man down and shooting him directly in the head, five times, is not a "snap judgement." And as they've modified the information they, themselves, have been releasing, it's become clearer and clearer that the most threatening things he did were to wear the coat on a summer day and to run from plain clothes officers chasing him with guns who, by their own rules, may or may not have made any attempt to identify themselves as law enforcement agents.

Look, I think it's stupid to run from the cops... almost always. But people run for a lot of reasons, from having shoplifted to being illegal aliens (as this guy was), to being guilty of crimes as serious as murder or even being suicide bombers. But I'd like to think that after apprehending someone, some attempt would made to evaluate the imminent threat and to ascertain the likely reason why a suspect had been running (especially in cases where he/she may not have even know it was law enforcement chasing him/her) before holding them down on the ground and taking five shots, point-blank, into his/her head. Otherwise, we're one step away from a scenario where all anyone has to do is make vague accusations about someone else and get them killed before they can so much as blink.

Sorry if you disagree, but I find it frightening that we now live in a time where law enforcement officers can execute people on the scantest of information and wars can be waged on unconfirmed/imagined threats, without these things so much as upsetting some/many/enough people.

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - oft attributed to Benjamin Franklin

 

[CaptnKirk]

Originally posted by: colonel
what a shame, the way they kill it, like a pig, Britos are terrible killers..

http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/crime/article301234.ece

So then, paranoia and over zealous activity by the Fed's to handle 'what if' situations pre-empts your life, liberty, and freedoms if they panic.

Not a good or thoughtful policy.

Overkill ? What's the chance of surviving even a single point blank shot th the head from a Glock 9mm, let alone the 'extra 4'.

Plains clothes Police with a vigalante streak is not what I want sneaking around in my town.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

This whole incident stinks.

The guy wasn't even wearing a coat, much less a heavy winter coat with wires sticking out. If he really was a suicide bomber, it had to be one tiny bomb, since he had no coat on, let alone a rucksack.

Even if he were a terrorist, there's no reason to presume that the bomb wasn't keyed to a "dead-man" switch that would trigger the bomb when he let go of it, and if it had been, the cops' action would have led directly to the bomb blowing up. They elected to kill this man in spite of the fact their actions might well have made matters worse, not better.

Let's put the shoe on the other foot here. You're in Brazil on vacation. You don't speak Portuguese. You are entering a train station, just minding your own business, when a pack of Brazilian men in civilian clothes start yelling at you in Portuguese, and possibly pointing guns at you. If you saw an escape route, you'd take it if you had a brain.

I don't think these cops are evil, but they used poor judgment and lost their composure, leading directly to a man's death. I'd find this a bit more forgivable if they'd shot him as he ran, but to charge up and execute him when he was already pinned is a real problem IMO.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: DonVito
This whole incident stinks.

The guy wasn't even wearing a coat, much less a heavy winter coat with wires sticking out. If he really was a suicide bomber, it had to be one tiny bomb, since he had no coat on, let alone a rucksack.

Even if he were a terrorist, there's no reason to presume that the bomb wasn't keyed to a "dead-man" switch that would trigger the bomb when he let go of it, and if it had been, the cops' action would have led directly to the bomb blowing up. They elected to kill this man in spite of the fact their actions might well have made matters worse, not better.

Let's put the shoe on the other foot here. You're in Brazil on vacation. You don't speak Portuguese. You are entering a train station, just minding your own business, when a pack of Brazilian men in civilian clothes start yelling at you in Portuguese, and possibly pointing guns at you. If you saw an escape route, you'd take it if you had a brain.

I don't think these cops are evil, but they used poor judgment and lost their composure, leading directly to a man's death. I'd find this a bit more forgivable if they'd shot him as he ran, but to charge up and execute him when he was already pinned is a real problem IMO.

DV. That picture is not of the guy that was shot. That's a picture of one of the suspected bombers.

Also, his family members admitted the guy spoke very good English. He had been in London for 3 years already and knew the ropes.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken


DV. That picture is not of the guy that was shot. That's a picture of one of the suspected bombers.

Also, his family members admitted the guy spoke very good English. He had been in London for 3 years already and knew the ropes.

Ah - my mistake.

Having now read the entire account of what happened, it seems to me the cops really screwed up by letting him get into the subway station in the first place, and I still question the validity of a lethal-force protocol that calls for the execution of an already-subdued, empty-handed suspect.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken


DV. That picture is not of the guy that was shot. That's a picture of one of the suspected bombers.

Also, his family members admitted the guy spoke very good English. He had been in London for 3 years already and knew the ropes.

Ah - my mistake.

Having now read the entire account of what happened, it seems to me the cops really screwed up by letting him get into the subway station in the first place, and I still question the validity of a lethal-force protocol that calls for the execution of an already-subdued, empty-handed suspect.

I have the same question. Why did they even allow him to get into the subway in the first place ?

 

[BarneyFife]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken


DV. That picture is not of the guy that was shot. That's a picture of one of the suspected bombers.

Also, his family members admitted the guy spoke very good English. He had been in London for 3 years already and knew the ropes.

Ah - my mistake.

Having now read the entire account of what happened, it seems to me the cops really screwed up by letting him get into the subway station in the first place, and I still question the validity of a lethal-force protocol that calls for the execution of an already-subdued, empty-handed suspect.

Well its a touchy situation. Do you really want to tackle someone that may have a bomb strapped on them? I know I don't. Anyway, he should have stopped in the subway station when they told him too. Their were plenty of police and people around so I don't buy that excuse about strangers with guns. I saw the BBC report BEFORE the shooting and it clearly said that if their are suicide bombers, the protocol is to shoot them in the head to stop the bomb from exploding if possible. The people on this board talking about being held down and shot 5 times are making it up. The police didn't touch him because they thought he might have been strapped with a bomb.

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: BarneyFife

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken


DV. That picture is not of the guy that was shot. That's a picture of one of the suspected bombers.

Also, his family members admitted the guy spoke very good English. He had been in London for 3 years already and knew the ropes.

Ah - my mistake.

Having now read the entire account of what happened, it seems to me the cops really screwed up by letting him get into the subway station in the first place, and I still question the validity of a lethal-force protocol that calls for the execution of an already-subdued, empty-handed suspect.

Well its a touchy situation. Do you really want to tackle someone that may have a bomb strapped on them? I know I don't. Anyway, he should have stopped in the subway station when they told him too. Their were plenty of police and people around so I don't buy that excuse about strangers with guns. I saw the BBC report BEFORE the shooting and it clearly said that if their are suicide bombers, the protocol is to shoot them in the head to stop the bomb from exploding if possible. The people on this board talking about being held down and shot 5 times are making it up. The police didn't touch him because they thought he might have been strapped with a bomb.

Are you serious?
I heard an interview with a guy, he said the police tackled him down, and a person with a automatic pistol in his left hand, standing above him, fired 5 shots point blank.

 

[rustynails]

Originally posted by: Bowfinger

Originally posted by: rustynails

Originally posted by: Bowfinger

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

Originally posted by: Dimkaumd
the guy was wearing a heavy winter jacket....hmm....i wonder what gave him away

Yeah, that and a bomb belt with wires sticking out of it could be considered pretty damning evidence.

If it was truly a bomb belt, and not just some techie nerd with a bunch of gadgets on his belt, e.g., an iPod and cell phone with wired headsets.

Typical jellyfinger, always trolling for ways to make the "good" guys look "bad". Glad to see you have your brethrens back.

Flake off, trollette. (Who were you before you were banned?) Come back when you can read. I supported the police in this instance.

You set precedence as hater and your sarcasm is easily mistaken. Do you still support those same police who apparently shot and killed an innocent man? I do, and if we only had the balls to do that here in the states. But don?t worry Dr. jellyfinger your happiness will soon be fulfilled once the bombings begin here, and are cops are handcuffed because, proctologist, such as yourself, will scream bloody murder, should they make the same mistake. I know your type well, you just assume have hundreds dead?

 

[rustynails]

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

Originally posted by: feelingshorter

Originally posted by: Proletariat
That looks like a f'in sweatshirt. I guess hes from the ghetto :roll:

THESE COPS ARE GARBAGE. ANYONE WHO SUPPORTS THEIR ACTIONS is just.... This is just f'in despicable. UGH. Time to listen to some RATM before a I burst a vein.

after two bombings, and some guy runs from the police...well then you get shot, stupidity = death. WHY would you run if you do not have anything to hide? If you were stopped by the police would you run? Plus im asian and i think the guy should have just followed their directions if he was innocent.

Don't bring up the circumstances around this case. It will be deflected as if it doesn't even matter. The righteous ones will point fingers at the man, because it's clearly obvious that a guy coming from a house suspected to be a residence of one of the bombers who then ran from the cops, jumped a security barrier, and ran onto a train, was completely innocent.

And if he had been a bomber, they didn't shoot him, and he subsequently blew himself, the cops, and other inocent people on that train up up, the very same whiners would have questioned why they didn't just shoot the guy in the first place.

Sucks to be a cop, doesn't it?

Such is true. Very true.

 

[rustynails]

Originally posted by: Proletariat

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

Originally posted by: feelingshorter

Originally posted by: Proletariat
That looks like a f'in sweatshirt. I guess hes from the ghetto :roll:

THESE COPS ARE GARBAGE. ANYONE WHO SUPPORTS THEIR ACTIONS is just.... This is just f'in despicable. UGH. Time to listen to some RATM before a I burst a vein.

after two bombings, and some guy runs from the police...well then you get shot, stupidity = death. WHY would you run if you do not have anything to hide? If you were stopped by the police would you run? Plus im asian and i think the guy should have just followed their directions if he was innocent.

Don't bring up the circumstances around this case. It will be deflected as if it doesn't even matter. The righteous ones will point fingers at the man, because it's clearly obvious that a guy coming from a house suspected to be a residence of one of the bombers who then ran from the cops, jumped a security barrier, and ran onto a train, was completely innocent.

And if he had been a bomber, they didn't shoot him, and he subsequently blew himself, the cops, and other inocent people on that train up up, the very same whiners would have questioned why they didn't just shoot the guy in the first place.

Sucks to be a cop, doesn't it?

I'll stoop to your level. Sucks to be a brown man in the 21st century doesn't it? STFU.

Easy Che, before I eat your hypocritical existence alive. Just a matter of time...

 

[judasmachine]

the new excuse to shoot hippies.

or electricians as the case may be.

 

[colonel]

is this look like Giuliani-Dialo here in New York city, the guy pulled the wallet and got tosted, Giuliani praise the cop action.

http://www.news24.com/News24/World/Londonattacks/0,,2-10-1854_1742665,00.html

 

[tommywishbone]

Just another pig, murdering a human being. But the sheeple have been lied to for so long, they will sit by and do nothing. After all, it was just a guy in the subway.... no ones son.... no ones friend..... heck, not even an american. Just another human being with his brains blown out by our heros.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: tommywishbone
Just another pig, murdering a human being. But the sheeple have been lied to for so long, they will sit by and do nothing. After all, it was just a guy in the subway.... no ones son.... no ones friend..... heck, not even an american. Just another human being with his brains blown out by our heros.

and if he had a bomb and detonated because of an officers hesitation... u'd just shake ur little head and go on...

 

[arsbanned]

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

Originally posted by: Dimkaumd
the guy was wearing a heavy winter jacket....hmm....i wonder what gave him away

Yeah, that and a bomb belt with wires sticking out of it could be considered pretty damning evidence.

Wrong as usual.

 

[Proletariat]

Originally posted by: rustynails

Originally posted by: Proletariat

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

Originally posted by: feelingshorter

Originally posted by: Proletariat
That looks like a f'in sweatshirt. I guess hes from the ghetto :roll:

THESE COPS ARE GARBAGE. ANYONE WHO SUPPORTS THEIR ACTIONS is just.... This is just f'in despicable. UGH. Time to listen to some RATM before a I burst a vein.

after two bombings, and some guy runs from the police...well then you get shot, stupidity = death. WHY would you run if you do not have anything to hide? If you were stopped by the police would you run? Plus im asian and i think the guy should have just followed their directions if he was innocent.

Don't bring up the circumstances around this case. It will be deflected as if it doesn't even matter. The righteous ones will point fingers at the man, because it's clearly obvious that a guy coming from a house suspected to be a residence of one of the bombers who then ran from the cops, jumped a security barrier, and ran onto a train, was completely innocent.

And if he had been a bomber, they didn't shoot him, and he subsequently blew himself, the cops, and other inocent people on that train up up, the very same whiners would have questioned why they didn't just shoot the guy in the first place.

Sucks to be a cop, doesn't it?

I'll stoop to your level. Sucks to be a brown man in the 21st century doesn't it? STFU.

Easy Che, before I eat your hypocritical existence alive. Just a matter of time...

Uh yea...

Why don't we go now little man?

 

[cwjerome]

Originally posted by: tommywishbone
Just another pig, murdering a human being. But the sheeple have been lied to for so long, they will sit by and do nothing. After all, it was just a guy in the subway.... no ones son.... no ones friend..... heck, not even an american. Just another human being with his brains blown out by our heros.

You are the poster child of the Daft Left. If there is such a thing as karma, I hope you're in a situation where you need one of those "pigs" in the worst way, and they are nowhere to be found...

This is exactly why the Libs have a bad name, because 9 times out of 10 their kneejerk reaction is to damn, whine about, and attack those whose job it is to lay their life on the line to deal with criminals and terrorists. P&N as a whole is a shining example of a group of people who can sit back and repeatedly lay tidal waves of accusations and insults to everyone EXCEPT the evil we face.

I admire the brave professionals who pursued this questionable idiot thinking that at any second he could detonate a bomb. And from where I stand, they were completely justified in taking him out. Every bit of evidence suggests this character was involved in a terror network, and I support the those Brits involved... people who were put in an incredibly chaotic situation and acted in defense of civilians.

You terrorist apologists favorite game of bashing those actually dealing with evil threats on the front line is a sick reminder to everyone the demented state of your psychology. You'll say nothing impuning the fcked-up bombers and their supporters, yet will unleash endless, revolting tirades about any failures, warts, or efforts by our governments to deal with and respond to the deranged b@stards.

 

[colonel]

Originally posted by: cwjerome

Originally posted by: tommywishbone
Just another pig, murdering a human being. But the sheeple have been lied to for so long, they will sit by and do nothing. After all, it was just a guy in the subway.... no ones son.... no ones friend..... heck, not even an american. Just another human being with his brains blown out by our heros.

You are the poster child of the Daft Left. If there is such a thing as karma, I hope you're in a situation where you need one of those "pigs" in the worst way, and they are nowhere to be found...

This is exactly why the Libs have a bad name, because 9 times out of 10 their kneejerk reaction is to damn, whine about, and attack those whose job it is to lay their life on the line to deal with criminals and terrorists. P&N as a whole is a shining example of a group of people who can sit back and repeatedly lay tidal waves of accusations and insults to everyone EXCEPT the evil we face.

I admire the brave professionals who pursued this questionable idiot thinking that at any second he could detonate a bomb. And from where I stand, they were completely justified in taking him out. Every bit of evidence suggests this character was involved in a terror network, and I support the those Brits involved... people who were put in an incredibly chaotic situation and acted in defense of civilians.

You terrorist apologists favorite game of bashing those actually dealing with evil threats on the front line is a sick reminder to everyone the demented state of your psychology. You'll say nothing impuning the fcked-up bombers and their supporters, yet will unleash endless, revolting tirades about any failures, warts, or efforts by our governments to deal with and respond to the deranged b@stards.

what you know about? Have you been in New York city 9/11 ? No, you guys in the west know s..h about the suffering in the city,the northeast was the target and if it gets worst is because guys like you are taking advantages of the 9/11 tragedy to spread facism, so shut the f..k up and go and shoot ilegals with the bottle, because is the best you can do.

 

[arsbanned]

Originally posted by: cwjerome

Originally posted by: tommywishbone
Just another pig, murdering a human being. But the sheeple have been lied to for so long, they will sit by and do nothing. After all, it was just a guy in the subway.... no ones son.... no ones friend..... heck, not even an american. Just another human being with his brains blown out by our heros.

You are the poster child of the Daft Left. If there is such a thing as karma, I hope you're in a situation where you need one of those "pigs" in the worst way, and they are nowhere to be found...

This is exactly why the Libs have a bad name, because 9 times out of 10 their kneejerk reaction is to damn, whine about, and attack those whose job it is to lay their life on the line to deal with criminals and terrorists. P&N as a whole is a shining example of a group of people who can sit back and repeatedly lay tidal waves of accusations and insults to everyone EXCEPT the evil we face.

I admire the brave professionals who pursued this questionable idiot thinking that at any second he could detonate a bomb. And from where I stand, they were completely justified in taking him out. Every bit of evidence suggests this character was involved in a terror network, and I support the those Brits involved... people who were put in an incredibly chaotic situation and acted in defense of civilians.

You terrorist apologists favorite game of bashing those actually dealing with evil threats on the front line is a sick reminder to everyone the demented state of your psychology. You'll say nothing impuning the fcked-up bombers and their supporters, yet will unleash endless, revolting tirades about any failures, warts, or efforts by our governments to deal with and respond to the deranged b@stards.

And you, Mr. Dumas, are what give the neocons a bad name. As if your rhetoric isn't completely over-the-top.
They were NOT justified in taking him out. He was innocent and had nothing whatsoever to do with those bombings. It was a mistake and they have apologized. They are not saying there was justification for murdering the guy. Only wacknuts like you are.