March 2016 Upgrade: Focusing on Mobo and Case

Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
81
It's time to pull the trigger on an upgrade to my gaming PC. Would greatly appreciate some specific input in the items below. Ideally, I'm moving from an ATX build to an mITX build, so I'd appreciate thoughts with that in mind.

1. Gaming. BF4, GTAV, Civ5 are the most demanding.
2. Budget: ~$800 +-20%.
3. US- Newegg or Amazon
5. No brand preference on everything else, though the CPU will be Intel.
6. This is just an upgrade on: CPU, Mobo, Case, RAM, and accessories (cables, lighting).
7. No overclocking.
8. Gaming currently at 1080p. Monitor and GPU upgrade will be spring 2018, when I plan to jump to 4k (dependent upon game dev support, obviously. At the very least 1440p). So, suggestions keeping this in mind are helpful.
9. Between now and in the next 30 days, though I could be convinced to wait IF I can get a firm release date and MSRP on a particular case.
10. Nope.
11. Re-using cooler (Hyper 212+), GPU (R9-280x), power supply (EVGA fully modular Supernova 850), storage (2 SSDs and 2 HDDs)

So, I've been reading up since it's been awhile since I've last done this (August 2010 probably), so please ask questions to clarify things or make suggestions if I've forgotten something. Let's take it in order of ease:

RAM: Some sort of DDR4, don't care about clock speed, 16GB is fine, though I'd go 32GB if someone finds a sweet deal (thinking ahead to VR, I'm willing to spend the extra $100 now). Will need to go low-profile if I get a horizontal aftermarket heatsink. Suggestions?

CPU: i5-6500 for $200? CPUs usually stick around for me as long as the mobo, and I don't overclock, so typically we're talking 4 years or so. I imagine this will continue to be the case so long as gaming remains primarily GPU-oriented and CPU stays non-essential (up to a certain point, obviously). Is there an argument to be made for the $350 i7-6700 given what I'm going to be using it for? IF not, I'd rather spend that ~$150 elsewhere.

Case: Here's the biggie. Replacing my trusty Antec 902 is totally unnecessary, but the thing I'm most excited about. Priority this time around on premium materials, quality looks, and then functionality (no watercooling or overclocking or multi-GPU setup, so nice and simple). That in mind:

1. I'll go ATX and be happy, but if I can get it into an mITX to use that In Win 901 below I'd love to! Am I correct in assuming mITX will vastly limit my current prospects for 1151 mobos (limited to 2 RAM slots, m.2/u.2 slots sharing the PCI-E lanes, looks like you have to be more careful to make sure the long GPUs will fit?)? This upgrade is being primarily driven by case choice, and so, for instance, I'm willing to pay a bit more for a mobo to bypass the above limitations that aren't inherent in FF (partly because that money gets saved on the case side of things).
2. Looking for a silver/gray aluminum case (would also do black, but vastly prefer first two), and tempered glass window. Not really interested in steel or plastic, flashiness, etc. Minimalist, sleek, etc. Current contenders (a mix of the above form factors). Absolute max budget $300.

ATX:

In Win 904

Phanteks Enthoo Evolv

mITX:

In Win 901 This one's actually my first choice, so if I can do an mITX build that ticks off all the boxes and get this case I'd be stoked. Anyone had experience with a gaming build using this case?

Steel/plastic cases which could make the cut if a compelling enough case is made for them. Give a shout if I missed an aluminum version of these babies.

mITX/mATX:

Corsair Carbide Air240

AeroCool Dead Silence Series

BitFenix Micro


Were there any other cases debuted at CES 2016 that will come out in the next few months that are worth waiting for at the $150-300 price point that tick the boxes above (like the In Win S-box)? Aluminum/tempered glass? Anything from Lian-Li to add to the above list? Really too bad the In Win 909 is four hundred goddamn dollars.

Mobo: Would prefer simple white/black color scheme. Seems like in the last 5 years the biggest addition to motherboards is the m.2/u.2 interface? Anything else I should consider besides # of sata/express ports?

mITX:

ASRock Fatal1ty Z170mITX This motherfucker is ugly, but may be worth it to get the In Win 901.

MSI Gaming Z190I

ATX:
Asus Z170-A seems like the top contender by far at the ~$165 price point at this moment, given AT's most recent review? Solid value, with one m.2 slot, good number of USB (with 3.1 and Type A/C as well). Any suggestions for one with more USB? Also, would love a couple more of those SATA ports to be Express, but not a deal breaker. I'd go up to the $230 price point if someone has a stellar suggestion.

Other options:

Gigabyte GA-Z170X-Gaming 3

MSI Gaming Z170A

Misc: Some DeepCool RGB LEDs or similar, some AeroCool or Noctua or Corsair fans to increase airflow/pressure and decrease noise, braided/lighted SATA cables to make it look all nice, perhaps the Noctua horizontal heatsink, or another. Color scheme this time around I'm thinking will be white LEDs, hence the Asus mobo option. Any other suggestions?

Thanks in advance guys. Anandtech always comes through with solid advice.
 
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UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
That Gigabyte motherboard would be fine, or you could get the next step up in their product line as well (UD3 or UD5). I have seen the UD3 board hit $119 on sale and the UD5 hit $149. The motherboards in that price range are all so very similar in features. I personally would make sure it had Realtek 1150 sound onboard, because I use onboard audio. I used to be an Asus guy, but I passed on the Z170-A when it was at $120 because the reviews weren't very good at the time. It looks like with BIOS updates it is better, but the professional reviews I read about it talk about how thin it feels and the board flex. My UD5 is heavy and there is no flex.

Cases are such a personal preference. All I look for is build quality, sound reduction, and cooling performance. I have a Fractal Design R5 window version, and love it. However, it does not have a glass window.

The two 140mm case fans that came with it are quiet, move around 68 cfm, and are really good for such an inexpensive fan. I added a Noctua NF-A14 flx to it. None of these have lights, I just wanted cool and quiet.

The i5-6500 is a good chip that will serve you well for a long time.

16 Gb of ram is more than enough for gaming. You will not use more than that. There are plenty of good sets out there for $70-$90. Reviews have showed 2666-3000 is the sweet spot for performance on the z170 motherboards.
 
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Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
81
That Gigabyte motherboard would be fine, or you could get the next step up in their product line as well (UD3 or UD5). I have seen the UD3 board hit $119 on sale and the UD5 hit $149. The motherboards in that price range are all so very similar in features. I personally would make sure it had Realtek 1150 sound onboard, because I use onboard audio. I used to be an Asus guy, but I passed on the Z170-A when it was at $120 because the reviews weren't very good at the time. It looks like with BIOS updates it is better, but the professional reviews I read about it talk about how thin it feels and the board flex. My UD5 is heavy and there is no flex.

Cases are such a personal preference. All I look for is build quality, sound reduction, and cooling performance. I have a Fractal Design R5 window version, and love it. However, it does not have a glass window.

The two 140mm case fans that came with it are quiet, move around 68 cfm, and are really good for such an inexpensive fan. I added a Noctua NF-A14 flx to it. None of these have lights, I just wanted cool and quiet.

The i5-6500 is a good chip that will serve you well for a long time.

16 Gb of ram is more than enough for gaming. You will not use more than that. There are plenty of good sets out there for $70-$90. Reviews have showed 2666-3000 is the sweet spot for performance on the z170 motherboards.

Thanks for the input. Much appreciated. The R5 was on my shortlist for a long time until I decided aluminum was a must. Excellent case though.

Thanks for the thoughts on the motherboard. The Asus seemed to be one of Ian's favorites here at AT compared to others, though I've had Gigabyte's for years. Any chance they make a mITX version of the UD3 or UD5? I can't seem to find one. In fact, seems Skylake mITX boards are few and far between still, which is surprising to me.

I'll add a +1 for the i5-6500 and keep an eye out for 2666-3000 RAM. Agreed 16GB is the sweet spot. Good god, those Noctua fans are expensive. 22 bucks a pop. Guess I'll be primarily sticking with the OEM case fans, though maybe I'll pick up one or two if I get in on budget.

Any particular thoughts on going from ATX to mITX in general? I wouldn't describe myself as a hardcore gamer (I'm not overclocking and tweaking settings to get to that tier of shadow texture and stay at 60fps), but I don't want to commit to mITX for the foreseeable future if I'm missing something here. Seems like aside from the general paucity of mobo choices after a new chipset release, the only real problem is the form-factor limit of 2 RAM slots. And I don't really see this as a huge problem since 8GB sticks are the norm now, and even 16GB sticks aren't astronomical. Anything else I should be mindful of?
 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
Thanks for the input. Much appreciated. The R5 was on my shortlist for a long time until I decided aluminum was a must. Excellent case though.

Thanks for the thoughts on the motherboard. The Asus seemed to be one of Ian's favorites here at AT compared to others, though I've had Gigabyte's for years. Any chance they make a mITX version of the UD3 or UD5? I can't seem to find one. In fact, seems Skylake mITX boards are few and far between still, which is surprising to me.

I'll add a +1 for the i5-6500 and keep an eye out for 2666-3000 RAM. Agreed 16GB is the sweet spot. Good god, those Noctua fans are expensive. 22 bucks a pop. Guess I'll be primarily sticking with the OEM case fans, though maybe I'll pick up one or two if I get in on budget.

Any particular thoughts on going from ATX to mITX in general? I wouldn't describe myself as a hardcore gamer (I'm not overclocking and tweaking settings to get to that tier of shadow texture and stay at 60fps), but I don't want to commit to mITX for the foreseeable future if I'm missing something here. Seems like aside from the general paucity of mobo choices after a new chipset release, the only real problem is the form-factor limit of 2 RAM slots. And I don't really see this as a huge problem since 8GB sticks are the norm now, and even 16GB sticks aren't astronomical. Anything else I should be mindful of?

I think computers are getting smaller, but with small form factors plus performance parts, it gets too warm for my liking. I think ATX will be the norm for the foreseeable future. They only make what people are willing to buy, and there are a ton of ATX boards to choose from.

Yeah, the Noctua fans are pricey. However, at 1200 RPM they are only 19 dB. Plus, their service is the best you will find. I have had one Noctua fan start to die on me out of all the fans I ever bought. They have a 6 year warranty. You email them, they respond in a matter of hours, mail you a new one out, and all you have to do is cut a fan blade off of the defective one, and email the picture. Pretty good service and like you I play Civ5, and I want my PC to stay quiet. I hate hearing fans.

I don't think Gigabyte will release their 'Ultra Durability' motherboards in a mITX version anytime soon. They tout that line as having more copper and a ton of features, so it has been the same way for many, many years.

I would just get 16 GB of ram (2 x 8 GB). I use 3-4 GB doing regular desktop stuff. It rarely even gets near 8 GB even when gaming. You can always throw more in the future if you find you use it. 95% of people don't even need 16 GB, and those are professionals who do advanced video editing and the like.

I bought my first Asus motherboard back in 1998 I believe (K6-2 motherboard) . I only used their products for years. They were the gold standard. However, since they spun of Asrock and ended their relationship with Pegatron (who used to make most of their boards), who knows who they have make them now? Foxconn, ECS, who knows? I read they haven't made their own motherboards since 2012 I believe. They are still good I think, I just don't think they are any better than Gigabyte or Asrock anymore. I was surprised to see Foxconn makes CPU sockets for Gigabyte. The companies all seem intertwined anymore.
 

Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
81
I think computers are getting smaller, but with small form factors plus performance parts, it gets too warm for my liking. I think ATX will be the norm for the foreseeable future. They only make what people are willing to buy, and there are a ton of ATX boards to choose from.

Yeah, the Noctua fans are pricey. However, at 1200 RPM they are only 19 dB. Plus, their service is the best you will find. I have had one Noctua fan start to die on me out of all the fans I ever bought. They have a 6 year warranty. You email them, they respond in a matter of hours, mail you a new one out, and all you have to do is cut a fan blade off of the defective one, and email the picture. Pretty good service and like you I play Civ5, and I want my PC to stay quiet. I hate hearing fans.

I don't think Gigabyte will release their 'Ultra Durability' motherboards in a mITX version anytime soon. They tout that line as having more copper and a ton of features, so it has been the same way for many, many years.

I would just get 16 GB of ram (2 x 8 GB). I use 3-4 GB doing regular desktop stuff. It rarely even gets near 8 GB even when gaming. You can always throw more in the future if you find you use it. 95% of people don't even need 16 GB, and those are professionals who do advanced video editing and the like.

I bought my first Asus motherboard back in 1998 I believe (K6-2 motherboard) . I only used their products for years. They were the gold standard. However, since they spun of Asrock and ended their relationship with Pegatron (who used to make most of their boards), who knows who they have make them now? Foxconn, ECS, who knows? I read they haven't made their own motherboards since 2012 I believe. They are still good I think, I just don't think they are any better than Gigabyte or Asrock anymore. I was surprised to see Foxconn makes CPU sockets for Gigabyte. The companies all seem intertwined anymore.

Good to know the noctuas are quality tech. I really wish there were more options for mITX 1151 boards. I understand the vast majority of folks go ATX, so I guess that's the way it is. You used any of the Lian Li cases in the past? When I decided to go aluminum, I assumed they'd be at the top of the list, but honestly I couldn't find one for less than $300 which didn't look like just a metal box.
 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
I haven't used any Lian Li cases. Too expensive for my taste. I have a mental block where I can't spend more than $120 or so on cases.

I see some of these crazy expensive cases out there, and think they wouldn't make them if people didn't buy them, but some I've seen are up to $1000.

It's the same for motherboards for me also. I can't go over $200, although I prefer much cheaper than that.

I would just read some reviews on those Cadillac-type cases and see which meets your needs.
 

CorsairDemon

Member
Mar 5, 2016
41
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0
I've currently got the M3 motherboard from MSI. I'd like to say I love it, but definitely pay attention to the available PCI Express slots while others are in use with it. It looks great too.

This is just my opinion here, but seriously, run away from Gigabyte boards. Especially Intel ones. I've read and have seen so many just dead.
 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
I've currently got the M3 motherboard from MSI. I'd like to say I love it, but definitely pay attention to the available PCI Express slots while others are in use with it. It looks great too.

This is just my opinion here, but seriously, run away from Gigabyte boards. Especially Intel ones. I've read and have seen so many just dead.

This is from 2014, but it shows RMA rates amongst various motherboard manufacturers.

https://linustechtips.com/main/topi...ts-french-but-i-translated-nearly-everything/

There is not a huge failure rate of Gigabyte motherboards compared to other manufacturers. Between Asus and Gigabyte, they shipped 17 MILLION motherboards in 2015.

You can find people on the internet who claim every manufacturer is the worst company ever. All companies have hits and misses, but the remaining manufacturers have survived because they have a whole lot more hits than misses.
 
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Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
81
I've currently got the M3 motherboard from MSI. I'd like to say I love it, but definitely pay attention to the available PCI Express slots while others are in use with it. It looks great too.

This is just my opinion here, but seriously, run away from Gigabyte boards. Especially Intel ones. I've read and have seen so many just dead.

Thanks for the confirmation that those PCIE lanes need to be confirmed carefully. Will do.
 

Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
81
This is from 2014, but it shows RMA rates amongst various motherboard manufacturers.

https://linustechtips.com/main/topi...ts-french-but-i-translated-nearly-everything/

There is not a huge failure rate of Gigabyte motherboards compared to other manufacturers. Between Asus and Gigabyte, they shipped 17 MILLION motherboards in 2015.

You can find people on the internet who claim every manufacturer is the worst company ever. All companies have hits and misses, but the remaining manufacturers have survived because they have a whole lot more hits than misses.

This is useful!
 

CorsairDemon

Member
Mar 5, 2016
41
0
0
This is from 2014, but it shows RMA rates amongst various motherboard manufacturers.

https://linustechtips.com/main/topi...ts-french-but-i-translated-nearly-everything/

There is not a huge failure rate of Gigabyte motherboards compared to other manufacturers. Between Asus and Gigabyte, they shipped 17 MILLION motherboards in 2015.

You can find people on the internet who claim every manufacturer is the worst company ever. All companies have hits and misses, but the remaining manufacturers have survived because they have a whole lot more hits than misses.

Definitely! I wasn't trying to be a fanboy for one or the other, I run a repair shop and have seen so many Gigabyte Intel boards (pre-2014) completely dead with no reason. I'm sure it's not even an issue, so I really should've put it a bit less biased.
 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
I agree. Most of us old enough have had bad experiences with certain motherboard manufacturers. Mine was Abit. After getting burned by them a couple times, I wouldn't have taken one for free.

The remaining manufacturers ship a lot of motherboards. All companies will have failures to some degree, but when you look at how many boards they actually ship, the failure rate is really small. But at 1 million boards shipped, the average will roughly be 10,000 to 15,000 boards will have true problems. Asus, Gigabyte, Asrock, MSI, etc will all be roughly in this same range.

It is what is. Historically, some companies would have hit the 3-5% range, but with modern techniques, all are now much lower.
 
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