Medical insurance pays for End-of-Life consultations

[JEDI]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/05/opinion/encouraging-end-of-life-talks.html

private insurers (Blue Cross/Medicaid) have begun covering “advance care planning” conversations as the number of aging Americans rises and many people want more input into how and where they will spend their final days (at home or in an institution) and what treatment they will receive, ranging from all-out efforts to sustain life to simple pain relief.

but Still to be heard from is Medicare.


win-win?
quality of life + less burden on tax payers?

 

[Zorkorist]

Medicaid is not a private insurer, but rather one of the largest Government expenditures.

This will be good for Government helping people die.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

Win, win?

No. We are talking about death and death is ugly.

-John

 

[CottonRabbit]

Win, win?

No. We are talking about death and death is ugly.

-John

It's far uglier when you never have a conversation about end of life care, which results in your 90 year old grandmother getting intubated and her ribs cracked before dying anyways because the default option is for all heroic measures to be taken.

 

[ivwshane]

Yes, this was part of the ACA, it was known on the right as "death panels".

 

[Zorkorist]

It's far uglier when you never have a conversation about end of life care, which results in your 90 year old grandmother getting intubated and her ribs cracked before dying anyways because the default option is for all heroic measures to be taken.

I agree.

It is ugly.

But socializing medicine is not the answer.

Let life and death, and medicine happen.

But not with the beurorcacy of Government.

That's just extra pain on pain.

Dr.'s help people live, and die, and God Damn It, Government has NOTHING to do with it.

-John

 

[brycejones]

It's far uglier when you never have a conversation about end of life care, which results in your 90 year old grandmother getting intubated and her ribs cracked before dying anyways because the default option is for all heroic measures to be taken.

100 times this. Its really depressing how rational discussions of end of life care were perverted by the whacko right wing in their zeal to kill the ACA.

 

[Zorkorist]

Bryce is obviously an expert of death.

-John

No, wait, he is a socialist, medicine, power hungry hippo.

-John

Ok, so he is both. He hates people, wants to Govern and kill them, and your tits should be sore just mentioning his name.

-John

 

[Brainonska511]

No, wait, he is a socialist, medicine, power hungry hippo.

-John

Ok, so he is both. He hates people, wants to Govern and kill them, and your tits should be sore just mentioning his name.

-John

I see you're having that multiple post problem again. Perhaps you might post here to see about getting that technical glitch fixed.

I agree.

It is ugly.

But socializing medicine is not the answer.

Let life and death, and medicine happen.

But not with the beurorcacy of Government.

That's just extra pain on pain.

Dr.'s help people live, and die, and God Damn It, Government has NOTHING to do with it.

-John

It's not about "letting stuff happen." It's laying people's choices on the table and letting them know what they can choose to have or not have done, should they end up on death's doorstep. The whole point of insurance covering talks like this is so that doctors take the time to talk about end of life care with their patients. Part of medicine isn't simply about performing heroic measures, which can be quite grizzly and lower the remaining quality of life a person might have. Part of it is making sure people are comfortable at the end and can pass away with dignity.

It's incredible how hardwired you have it in your brain that anything government is bad.

 

[brycejones]

Bryce is obviously an expert of death.

-John

What
drugs
are you on?

See your posting style is really retarded. Even worse than mcowned's

 

[brycejones]

It's incredible how hardwired you have it in your brain that anything government is bad.

From his simple minded posts I can only draw the conclusion there isn't much wiring in his brain period.

 

[Zorkorist]

I see you're having that multiple post problem again. Perhaps you might post here to see about getting that technical glitch fixed.



It's not about "letting stuff happen." It's laying people's choices on the table and letting them know what they can choose to have or not have done, should they end up on death's doorstep. The whole point of insurance covering talks like this is so that doctors take the time to talk about end of life care with their patients. Part of medicine isn't simply about performing heroic measures, which can be quite grizzly and lower the remaining quality of life a person might have. Part of it is making sure people are comfortable at the end and can pass away with dignity.

It's incredible how hardwired you have it in your brain that anything government is bad.

It's funny how you think I have things hard-wired, NOT.

I am very familiar with death, and it doesn't take an army of people to do death. I don't know how to say it clearer than that.

Death is ugly.

-John

 

[Brainonska511]

It's funny how you think I have things hard-wired, NOT.

I an very familiar with death, and it doesn't take an army of people to do death. I don't know how to say it clearer than that.

Death is ugly.

-John

And where is anyone suggesting it needs an army? How is a simple regulation an army?

Death isn't nice, but we can make it easier for people. Why force people to go through heroic, life-saving measures (that would be required unless the patient had specified otherwise) if it is something they wouldn't want? Not everyone is proactive about setting up living wills, power of attorney, and stating their wishes to the people that would make decisions in the event of incapacitation. Paying doctors for the time they take to discuss some of these issues with their patients is appropriate.

 

[Zorkorist]

Have you looked at Government lately?!

They are socializing Health Care.

They are putting in place an army.

-John

 

[Brainonska511]

Have you looked at Government lately?!

They are socializing Health Care.

They are putting in place an army.

-John

You wouldn't know socialism if Karl Marx was pissing on you.

I see no government take over of health care. But please, let your evil government boogey man continue to haunt you. On a side note, did you know that mental health services are now part of required coverage for health insurance? You can finally get the help you so desperately need.

 

[Zorkorist]

You wouldn't know socialism if Karl Marx was pissing on you.

I see no government take over of health care. But please, let your evil government boogey man continue to haunt you. On a side note, did you know that mental health services are now part of required coverage for health insurance? You can finally get the help you so desperately need.

You are simply in denial.

Your children will pay for your stupidity.

-John

 

[Slew Foot]

Americans spend way too much money during the last 2 or 3 crappy months of their life. Usually its demented grandma whose had a stroke or heart attack or something, and half the family wants to do everything while the other half wants to let her go. Tons of money wasted on futile interventions because people think that some miracle is going to happen and 99 year old grandma with half a brain left is going home to do jumping jacks for Thanksgiving. This is a good and necessary step, Kaiser does it, every other country does it(actually, they just tell you to f off, you dont get a choice), if you want to get a handle on useless costs, this is a good place to start.

 

[Zorkorist]

It's not the last few months, Slew Foot, it's the last few years.

When you think you are smart enough to tell people their loved ones can't have their last few years, then you may have something.

Obviously loved ones get last few years, and those are the most expensive.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

Last few months? if only it were that easy.

-John

 

[Brainonska511]

It's not the last few months, Slew Foot, it's the last few years.

When you think you are smart enough to tell people their loved ones can't have their last few years, then you may have something.

Obviously loved ones get last few years, and those are the most expensive.

-John

So you want to hide the truth from your loved ones? Pretend that everything is a-okay? What's wrong with the doctor putting all the cards on the table for the patient to decide what's best for him or herself? After all, it's only a discussion. It's not like the doctor is taking the patient and shipping them off to the glue factory.

 

[Zorkorist]

I'm, with my loved ones, and have been, every step of the way, until death.

What I will not do, is give power to Government Hippos, and let them think they are doing it better than I.

They are not. They never will do it better than family.

-John

 

[Slew Foot]

Last few months? if only it were that easy.

-John

On average, the last year of life costs more in medical care than the rest of their life combined. Its pretty obvious when grandma is going down the crapper.

 

[fskimospy]

So wait, are conservatives in favor of death panels now?

 

[boomerang]

On average, the last year of life costs more in medical care than the rest of their life combined. Its pretty obvious when grandma is going down the crapper.

So who determines when that last year starts? Who shoots the starting pistol? That determination must be made. Once the determination is made, the revenue stream for the medical community has then been reduced. How much of that can go on before repercussions are felt?

Medical care by its very nature is about treatment versus cures. A cure is a highly desirable scenario. A one time cost and the problem is corrected. Treatment however is a lengthy commitment. Costs spread out over potentially a very long period of time. Good? Bad? Depends on your perspective. It depends on if you are the recipient, the provider or are paying for it.

So the last year of grandma's life is going to be very expensive. How about the year before that? How about the premature baby? What's the cost of that and for what length of time? What is the return on the investment in that child? Ooh, that's a harsh way of looking at it, isn't it? Will it come to that? Who gets the cancer treatment that will extend life for on average five years but with somewhat debilitating side effects? It's five years. Who deserves it and who doesn't? Everyone? No one?

Starting off with grandma isn't all that difficult. Where does it end?

 

[Victorian Gray]

So who determines when that last year starts? Who shoots the starting pistol? That determination must be made. Once the determination is made, the revenue stream for the medical community has then been reduced. How much of that can go on before repercussions are felt?

Medical care by its very nature is about treatment versus cures. A cure is a highly desirable scenario. A one time cost and the problem is corrected. Treatment however is a lengthy commitment. Costs spread out over potentially a very long period of time. Good? Bad? Depends on your perspective. It depends on if you are the recipient, the provider or are paying for it.

So the last year of grandma's life is going to be very expensive. How about the year before that? How about the premature baby? What's the cost of that and for what length of time? What is the return on the investment in that child? Ooh, that's a harsh way of looking at it, isn't it? Will it come to that? Who gets the cancer treatment that will extend life for on average five years but with somewhat debilitating side effects? It's five years. Who deserves it and who doesn't? Everyone? No one?

Starting off with grandma isn't all that difficult. Where does it end?

Congratulations, you just described medical insurance. And your point was?