Microsoft XP.... I think its time to start looking towards Linux...

[PCResources]

<< Linux a threat to Windows??? Yeah right. >>



I will reply... Windows a threat to Linux??? Yeah right.

Most people that have actually learned what Linux can do for them will not go back to Windows, with windows, it is the other way around...

The only true joke here is that W2K is in some versions considered a Server OS... That's a BIG joke...

You will have to pay thousands and thousands of dollars to get a working server out of a OS coupled with programs, and none of them are any good, full of security leaks, if you were to use linux instead, you could get all of it for free, the server OS, the SQL servers, several of them actually, the Mail servers, the Web servers, and anything else you would like...

Did anyone know that the US army are using Linux for many applications, if you didn't know it before, you know it now...

Patrick Palm

PC Resources

 

[ToBeMe]

Maybe Linux is/will be a threat to MS someday in the future......but they aren't as of now in any way, shape, or form..........if they or any other were, explain exactly how it comes to pass that MS actually gained another 3% marketshare in 2000????? ......MS combined O/S's = 90% Marketshare......All Other O/S's = 10% marketshare (Linux...all distros., BEos, Mac OS, Unix, etc.) I'm not blasting Linux......I just don't think they're &quot;all that&quot;......Hell, I'd of rather had BEos become the forerunner than Linux........people just don't like it and public perception is the ballgame folks! IMHO Linux will probably be no more than a &quot;niche&quot; O/S........

 

[PCResources]

<< but they aren't as of now in any way, shape, or form >>



This is wrong, you wrote &quot;in any way, shape, or form&quot; and Linux is dominant as a web server os, it will become dominant as a server OS quite soon i predict, and it has made it's entry in the hand-held market too, as well as in the integrated market, because the core is very small, this would be perfect for hand helds and integrated solutions...

I know, many people that i thought were smart absolutely refused to use windows in the dos days... Now it seems as it's the same thing all over again, if you are used to one interface, then why would you want to use another??

I believe, and many other people too, that Linux will take over sooner than you think...

Patrick Palm

PC Resources

 

[Dug]

Boy I can't wait until Linux can support my printer, scanner, sound card, monitor, router, force feedback joystick, the software I need to burn cd's, games, and whatever else I want to buy.

Just a normal home user here!

Until then Microsoft gets my measly $89 for upgrading. No big deal.

Calling in for registration will take all but 2 minutes. No big deal either. If it becomes an uproar, they will change. They can afford to.

 

[ToBeMe]

Well, ya' know, if you're going to tell me I'm wrong, I have no problem with that.......hope you're as good at taking it as you are at dishing it out though because I'll give you that linux has made some progress in the server area.....BUT....they actually LOST ground when it comes to end users.......There's a link in the O/S Forum to the article......You can forecast what ever you choose, but understand, that I may do the same and I and MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY people doubt that Linux will ever be any threat to MS as far as end users.....At the same time, I do believe that MS will be dethroned.......just not by Linux! Remember pat, I have nothing against linux and have it on a system as we speak.......I'm just able to look at things realisticly and have done enough research to form the opinion I stand by! Linux is fine......as a &quot;geek&quot; O/S!

 

[emjem]

OK you Linux lovers. How about this.

I'm going to put a new hdd in my system, put a Linux (of one flavor or another)CD in my drive and boot up. The system will boot to the Linux CD. I presume it will then have utilities to partition and format the new hdd. Or do I have to resort to MS Dos for that job?

After the hdd is ready I boot to the Linux CD and click install. 60 minutes later my system will be up and running. All devices ID'd and 100% functional, right?

Then I just install the drivers I have on CDs for 4 in 1, MS EMouse, vid card, sound card, etc. After that I'm 100% good to go. Right?

Next, I'm going to punch some keys, get my system connected and talking with Road Runner. Then I'm going to network my other PC to this one, and the two will be sharing the one Road Runner connection. Linux will walk me through that, right.

Elapsed time, hmmmmmm, 2 hours tops.

Next, I'm going to install ALL of my existing software. Give it 15 minutes per app, maybe 50 apps, hmmmmm day and a half. As I'm going along here I'll be able to double click my WebTime icon, tie into the Atomic clock, and my PC clock will be set automatically to the correct time. Right?

Next I'm going to log on to AT forum and type you all a letter telling you how happy I am. Oops, how do I spell woopee? No problem, click an icon select American Heritage Dict and look up the word. I find it there, right click the mouse button, select copy. Click an icon and my AT message is back up in front of me. I right click the mouse and paste the correctly spelled &quot;whoopee&quot;. Right?

Then I decide to email this message to a couple of dumb MS Windows lover friends of mine. I hit Select All, right click the mouse, select Copy. Click an icon, open up my email app, place mouse cursor, right click Paste. Oh, and Linux has provided for me to load in my OE address book via a floppy backup, so I don't have a problem with finding the email addresses I want, right?

Oh forgot, also have to load my Favorites from MS IE. No problem, right?

Now I'm ready to relax. Log on to MPlayer, play a little Q3. Oops, have to download their software first. No problem, right? After getting fragged 200 times, log off, log on to Playsite, play some cards. Oops, I have to download their software first. No problem, right?

Now I'm ready for some work. Log on to Datek, select their Java App for real time stock tracking. Well, their Java app is new and a little buggy, causes IE to crash once in while -- but hey, I don't have to worry about that now, I'm using Linux, right?

Next I'll call my friend on the land line and tell him what a great OS Linux is. Oops, have to load the backup data to Address Book. No problem, right?

Anyway, only 2 days after I install Linux I'm totally up and running. Didn't have to search the web for drivers, didn't have to hunt for and/or buy any new apps. Right?

I'm about 99% sure I will be able to do all of the above with WindowsXP. Can you all tell me I can do that with Linux? And which &quot;version&quot; of Linux should I use? Is there anything else I'm missing? The Linux CD will have browser, email, paint, notebook, mplayer, accessability tools, briefcase, screen saver, power management, calculator, phone dialer, multilanguage support, system tools, dial up networking, internet connection sharing, direct cable connection, and net meeting equivalents, right?

Now don't BS me. I can't afford to be down for more than a day.

 

[Budman]

emjem,

You put it just the way i would have if i could express myself better.

I agree 100% with that Statement.

 

[MGMorden]

Emjem: Most available Linux drivers come with your distro, and virtually everyone of them comes with a software suite that is simply stunning (but completely optional if you want to build your appbase yourself). Now the drivers are an issue right now I'll admit (I can admit flaws. I still can't get 3d acceleration working on my Radeon, but the VooDoo2 is still in here ), but other than that the care-free distros (Mandrake for example) will let you do virtually all of that stuff. And you'll be able to do most all of the with WinXP, but you'll also have to add in that nice little product activation step in there.

 

[neuralfx]

in short, windows XP makes me sick

-neural

 

[Alfred]

operation system dicussion in the hardware forum?? any moderator here??

 

[JohnnyKnoxville]

Um I just wanted to know if Linux has a backdoor also that the NSA can use to keep track of me.

 

[ToBeMe]

Hmmm, no real answers emjem.......that's mainly because you can't do most of that with Linux, and everyone knows it.........As for XP....we'll see what happens when it's released.......I wouldn't be against monthly fees.......tax breaks are GOOD and I've already discussed the possibility with my CPA!

 

[Kp99]

Yup linux is a must now...

 

2 days until Mac OS X ships.


The Gatesites and the Linusians chased the tribes across the desert until they reached the Great Sea. Just as they thought they were sure to die, Lord Jobs raised his one-button staff and the Sea parted. The tribes ran across the parted waters until they reached the shore of the Cupertino, the Holy Land. With the opposing forces still in pursuit inside the Sea walls, Lord Jobs moved the icon of the parted waters into the trash bin. The Great Sea walls closed, engulfing the evil forces forever.

Lord Jobs: He burns incense, burns bushes, and burns pentagrams.

-- Jobs 21:8

 

[Mikoyan]

I've been following the progression of windows &quot;whistler&quot; or XP, for the last half-year, since the first alpha I've played around with each version. I must say I'm not impressed at all. The lastest version I aquired, was... basically a cartoon,
pictures of XP here... <-- just some shots from my experience. I found freeBSD (unix) much more enlightening than windows ever will be and had a more rewarding time. Although I don't believe John Smith who wants to use his AOL account to get email should go through the trouble of linux, at this moment in time I believe that Microsoft is taking the wrong step, and Linux distros and other such open-source OS's are taking the right step...

 

[Eug]

<< Because YOU don't have the competence to set things up doesn't mean that something sucks. One mistake many people seem to make is to think that they are the perfect result of computer skills evolution and that if they can't set something up then it must suck. >>

Actually, that's been my whole point. Linux is a geek OS, not an end-user OS. As everyone knows, most end-users (including myself often) are complete computer morons. Dumbing down serves a purpose, and that's something that many Linux proponents fail to comprehend. Who cares if the army uses Linux to serve? Who cares if my local hospital has Unix on their machines controlling radiation treatment? Who cares if my univesity has a mainframe? Who cares if my router is actually a Linux box? The bottom line is that none of those applications are the same as the Pee Three somebody is running in their kitchen to mail their baby pictures to grandma via AOL. Microsoft may be suck, but at least for this specific purpose, Linux is even more suck for the average person.

I have nothing against Linux per se. I tried very hard to like it, mainly because it's free. But now I just think that while it's suited for some uses (and is much better than Windows at them), it is very ill-suited for other uses.

 

[PCResources]

<< I'm going to put a new hdd in my system, put a Linux (of one flavor or another)CD in my drive and boot up. The system will boot to the Linux CD. I presume it will then have utilities to partition and format the new hdd. Or do I have to resort to MS Dos for that job? >>



Depending on which distro you use it will be harder or easier, all of the distros have the tools for partitioning and formatting, as you obviously never used Linux before i would recommend Mandrake 7.2, you can partition it yourself using diskdrake (which is much easier than old Fdisk) or you can let Linux do the job for you...



<< After the hdd is ready I boot to the Linux CD and click install. 60 minutes later my system will be up and running. All devices ID'd and 100% functional, right? >>



All of the partitioning and formatting is done within the installation program, you do not have to reboot... Of course when you get to this part you will already have booted from your cd, and you will have chosen install, depending on how much experience you had with linux you can choose &quot;recommended&quot;, &quot;minimal&quot; or &quot;expert&quot; installation, if you would like to you could even choose which files you want to be installed, in your case i suggest recommended... It does not take 60 minutes to install Linux on a normal computer > 500mhz, 128mb it will take you about 20-30 minutes max including the partitioning and formatting...



<< Then I just install the drivers I have on CDs for 4 in 1, MS EMouse, vid card, sound card, etc. After that I'm 100% good to go. Right? >>



The drivers are already installed, they come with the distro... If something doesn't work, you will have to get the driver from the manufacturers homepage... I suppose you would check it for updated drivers anyway, right?



<< Next, I'm going to punch some keys, get my system connected and talking with Road Runner. Then I'm going to network my other PC to this one, and the two will be sharing the one Road Runner connection. Linux will walk me through that, right. >>



You can do all of this, linux will not walk you through it (hmmm, if you want to set up a connection and a shared connection, that is pretty easy, just some clicks and some key punching, as long as you have the info about dns servers and such from your ISP), but there are plenty of tutorials for it on the net, just do a search, it really isn't that hard...



<< Next, I'm going to install ALL of my existing software. Give it 15 minutes per app, maybe 50 apps, hmmmmm day and a half. As I'm going along here I'll be able to double click my WebTime icon, tie into the Atomic clock, and my PC clock will be set automatically to the correct time. Right? >>



No, that will not work, you will have to use new apps, new office (you get Koffice with mandrake 7.2) which looks and feels much like MS Office... Or you use StarOffice which will be able to open your privious documents... Your Web time icon will not be there, but the same program is available for Linux...





<< Next I'm going to log on to AT forum and type you all a letter telling you how happy I am. Oops, how do I spell woopee? No problem, click an icon select American Heritage Dict and look up the word. I find it there, right click the mouse button, select copy. Click an icon and my AT message is back up in front of me. I right click the mouse and paste the correctly spelled &quot;whoopee&quot;. Right? >>



No problem, but you will have to use a Linux program to do it...



<< Then I decide to email this message to a couple of dumb MS Windows lover friends of mine. I hit Select All, right click the mouse, select Copy. Click an icon, open up my email app, place mouse cursor, right click Paste. Oh, and Linux has provided for me to load in my OE address book via a floppy backup, so I don't have a problem with finding the email addresses I want, right? >>



No problem, if you saved your adress book in the correct format...



<< Oh forgot, also have to load my Favorites from MS IE. No problem, right? >>



If you are using StarOffice, no problemo...



<< Now I'm ready to relax. Log on to MPlayer, play a little Q3. Oops, have to download their software first. No problem, right? After getting fragged 200 times, log off, log on to Playsite, play some cards. Oops, I have to download their software first. No problem, right? >>



I do not know if they supply Linux versions of their software, Q3 is available for Linux, and if they do not supply Linux versions of their SW, search the net for it, chanses are that someone else wrote an app for it..



<< Now I'm ready for some work. Log on to Datek, select their Java App for real time stock tracking. Well, their Java app is new and a little buggy, causes IE to crash once in while -- but hey, I don't have to worry about that now, I'm using Linux, right? >>



You are right...



<< Next I'll call my friend on the land line and tell him what a great OS Linux is. Oops, have to load the backup data to Address Book. No problem, right? >>



You are right...



<< Anyway, only 2 days after I install Linux I'm totally up and running. Didn't have to search the web for drivers, didn't have to hunt for and/or buy any new apps. Right? >>



Depending on your hardware, maybe you had to go to the manufacturers home page and get drivers, but i think that most people go there anyway, just to update their drivers...

Depending on what apps you use, maybe you did not have to hunt for any new apps... Most office, cd burning and a whole lot of other programs are included on the four cd's that came with your Mandrake dist...



<< Next I'll call my friend on the land line and tell him what a great OS Linux is. Oops, have to load the backup data to Address Book. No problem, right? >>



You are correct...



<< I'm about 99% sure I will be able to do all of the above with WindowsXP. Can you all tell me I can do that with Linux? And which &quot;version&quot; of Linux should I use? Is there anything else I'm missing? The Linux CD will have browser, email, paint, notebook, mplayer, accessability tools, briefcase, screen saver, power management, calculator, phone dialer, multilanguage support, system tools, dial up networking, internet connection sharing, direct cable connection, and net meeting equivalents, right? >>



I can tell you that even if you could use your current drivers with WindowsXP, you should upgrade them...

You should use Mandrake Linux 7.2 it will have all the things you mentioned, and the linux equivalents are waaaaaaayyyyyyy better, you cannot compare the gimp to paint, it should be compared to photoshop...

Patrick Palm

PC Resources

 

[ToBeMe]

^LOL!^ That's funny Pat! Possibly quite misleading but at least it has the humerous value! Palimino isn't delayed either is it Pat???

 

[PCResources]

<< ^LOL!^ That's funny Pat! >>



Everyone, say hi to this linux expert, he seems to know what works and what doesn't...

Without making any kind of point you tried to ridicule me, where was i misleading him? in what way??

I never stated that the Palomino core would come out today, i said soon... so where was i wrong...

Patrick Palm

PC Resources

 

[ToBeMe]

Q3 is SOON?????? Read the news Pat! No, I'm not a Linux &quot;Expert&quot; but do have a system with Mandrake 7.2 on it and I know it wouldn't be anywhere near as easy to set up as you make it sound........to many variables........I've sent systems home with people set up and running smoothly with mandrake only to have them hose it within an hour looking for something or trying to install their USB device.......you're trying to make it sound as if it is as easy as setting up a Win 2K or 98/ME system and the fact is, it just isn't! Drivers aren't available for many devices and the ones that are often are flaky at best.......Expert, no, open minded and a realist, yes.........the average Joe has a much harder time with any Linux Distro. than Windows and you should be able to admitt that! As for the Palimino........I could link the thread where you say it is ready to go right now......but why????? BTW Pat, I have no need to get into a &quot;flame war&quot; with you......I harber no ill feelings toward you personally and would like to think you are just another &quot;techy&quot;........you do however, come across as very arrogant and closed minded.........that tends to get me going because the way I see it, we all learn something new each day......especially in this business and no one, no matter how smart they think they are, knows everything and each product does have it's unique qualities........loosen up a bit and look at everything equally!

 

[murdock2525]

The army uses Linux ? Boy that says it all. I did the Army thing.
That goes really good with the rest of their crap..Junk armament, junk gear,junk electronics, drunk.. moronic..management and Linux
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA............what a joke!

 

[PCResources]

<< but do have a system with Mandrake 7.2 on it and I know it wouldn't be anywhere near as easy to set up as you make it sound........ >>



I would think that choosing &quot;allocate free space&quot;, &quot;recommended&quot; and all packages is easier than any w9x installation, but maybe i am wrong here...

Linux has no support for USB devices... No, that is wrong, Linux DOES have support for USB devices, it is included in the 2.4 kernel and it is as easy to setup as it is in W9x or W2K...

I have devivered hundreds of pre-installed w9x that have had problems with it later on... So what is your point??



<< you do however, come across as very arrogant and closed minded......... >>



And your previous answer was not arrogant????????????????



<< As for the Palimino........I could link the thread where you say it is ready to go right now......but why????? >>



Provide the link why don't you... Did i say that the Palamino core was ready to go right now??? NO i did not, i didn't even mention the Palamino core... You should PM me before you start to assume things...

Patrick Palm

PC Resources

 

[ToBeMe]

Fine........You want to go there...........Go look at your post in the &quot;Poor AMD&quot; Thread for yourself!!!!! I also never said there was NO support.........but when it doesn't find a printer, mouse, and scanner upon installation, yes, I find that lacking behind Windows..........Yes, they both have various methods and levels of installation but then why can people with limited knowledge concerning a PC easily figure out Windows setup..........but call or bring it back for support trying to load Linux? As far as MY being arrogant........I've already covered that, I've watched you impolitely dismiss many people telling them flat out they're wrong and I've tried several times to &quot;discuss&quot; this rationally but you have the mindset that you are always right and everyone opposing you is wrong.......it just don't work that way all the time Pat!

 

[PCResources]

<< What about your Palimino statement?????? >>



Exactly my point... i did not mention Palamino so what about my Palamino statement, if you want some answers PM me...



<< but when it doesn't find a printer, mouse, and scanner upon installation, yes, I find that lacking behind Windows.......... >>



W9X will not detect my Tekram 395UW card, Harddrake from Mandrake Linux will, so what gives, does that mean that Windows have less support for certain HW?? Did you check the manufacturers homepage for drivers, i am pretty sure you would have checked out their homepage for updates even if you were using windows...



<< but call or bring it back for support trying to load Linux? >>



People who have no experience with computers will always have problems, and W9X is NOT easier to install than Mandrake 7.2, i do not care what you say, if you go with the standard choices Mandrake is VERY easy to set up...

You say that i am arrogant because i have to be right, but are you less arrogant trying to be right??

I have a large knowledge ranging from HW to SW, and when i experess what i know that is arrogant? Or are you just being arrogant because you express your experiences??

Maybe if i called you stupid and oblivious that would be arrogant, maybe if i told you to just shut up because you do not know what you are talking about i would be arrogant... but i didn't call you names, i didn't try to ridicule your posts, i am just having a discussion with you, you try to ridicule me unsuccesfully, so you try something else, like stating that i am arrogant... well, i just don't buy that, and i don't think anyone else here does either...

Patrick Palm

PC Resources

 

[ToBeMe]

Yeah, whatever Smartguy! I'm just going to do what all the people PM'ing me are saying.....&quot;Just ignore him!&quot; .......................Now, have fun.........and remember, you're right Pat..........You're always right pat! Hope that padded your little ego enough for today!