Millennials continue to get the big shaft. massive rents, college debt, mcjobs etc..

[BonzaiDuck]

I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say "their status-quo"

. . .
People always buy things on credit when credit is available. This goes back thousands of years. . . . .

Take for instance Proposition 13 in California.

I'm not taking a policy position about that, except to say that it was sold to voters as a solution for people on fixed incomes holding real-estate. But it was a convenient way to cap taxes on business properties.

Higher property taxes depress property values no less than higher interest rates, by depressing affordability and therefore -- demand. Demand shifts accordingly, moderating prices. I'm not making a policy judgment at this point, but the topic had been discussed over decades in conjunction with more general housing-bubble phenomena.

. . .

On the matter of credit, credit cards only came into widespread usage in the '60s. wages began to stagnate in the 70s. In the 1950s, you saved to buy a car or a durable-good appliance. Sure, there would have been "furniture stores" and dealerships offering credit, but the statistics show that as wages stagnated, people began to borrow more to compensate for declining savings rates. The level of household debt rose consistent with the stagnation of wages.

 

[boomerang]

Threads like these really highlight the consequences of the lack of history being taught. There have been numerous generations of people that have gotten the "short end of the stick". Look at the last century. Think of the sacrifices people were forced to make during the Great Depression. The rationing during WWII to name a few.

People are adaptable and people need little to survive. Food, clothing and shelter are all it takes. Everything else is unnecessary to support life. The population of the planet continues to grow and the most growth appears to be in areas of the planet that seem the most inhospitable to human life - at least to those of born in this nation. Humans are highly adaptable. We wouldn't be the dominant species on the planet if we weren't. Yet, many have a tendency to see themselves and others as 'victims'. Hell, we've got an entire political party dedicated to that concept.

There will always be somebody with a better smartphone than the one you can afford. It's a tough road to hoe. One to contemplate as you while away your days walking miles for water with no shoes and sleeping under the stars.

 

[realibrad]

...
. . .

On the matter of credit, credit cards only came into widespread usage in the '60s. wages began to stagnate in the 70s. In the 1950s, you saved to buy a car or a durable-good appliance. Sure, there would have been "furniture stores" and dealerships offering credit, but the statistics show that as wages stagnated, people began to borrow more to compensate for declining savings rates. The level of household debt rose consistent with the stagnation of wages.

I think its less to do with stagnated wages, and more to do with perception of wages and a desired lifestyle. The reason we say wages have stagnated is because of the relative buying power of wages. If you look at nominal wages, they have gone up pretty evenly even through recessions. Its only when they adjust for purchasing power do they say wages are flaw or slightly down.

So, when you look at how they adjust wages, they look at the average items purchased of today vs the average items purchased in the past. So a house of today the average is over 200k. If you look at homes Pre 1965 its under 20k. So, they would say that home prices have gone up 10x. Then, they would adjust for inflation and say that in 1965 20k is really 150k today. So, then the average house costs 1.3x more than it did in 1965.

So, if you then say oh houses are getting more expensive, it would seem logical, but it would be wrong. The average size of a house in 1960's was around 1,200sqf. Take the size of the average house today and its over 2,100sqf. That is an increase of over 1.75. People buy a house that is 1.75x bigger for 1.3x higher price. People never adjust for this it seems, and its quite annoying. The fact of the matter is that today, what we consider average is nothing close to what was average in the past. You can do what I did with houses and do the same for many different things.

The fact of the matter is that people buy bigger and better than before because the costs of things has gone down, and buying power has gone up, but if you look at just average, you will be mislead.

 

[realibrad]

... Hell, we've got an entire political party dedicated to that concept.

We have at least 2 political parties that play the victim role. The right thinks that the world is out to take their guns and religion. The left thinks the right is out to use their guns and their religion to take what they they have. Both are right.

 

[werepossum]

I think its less to do with stagnated wages, and more to do with perception of wages and a desired lifestyle. The reason we say wages have stagnated is because of the relative buying power of wages. If you look at nominal wages, they have gone up pretty evenly even through recessions. Its only when they adjust for purchasing power do they say wages are flaw or slightly down.

So, when you look at how they adjust wages, they look at the average items purchased of today vs the average items purchased in the past. So a house of today the average is over 200k. If you look at homes Pre 1965 its under 20k. So, they would say that home prices have gone up 10x. Then, they would adjust for inflation and say that in 1965 20k is really 150k today. So, then the average house costs 1.3x more than it did in 1965.

So, if you then say oh houses are getting more expensive, it would seem logical, but it would be wrong. The average size of a house in 1960's was around 1,200sqf. Take the saize of the average house today and its over 2,100sqf. That is an increase of over 1.75. People buy a house that is 1.75x bigger for 1.3x higher price. People never adjust for this it seems, and its quite annoying. The fact of the matter is that today, what we consider average is nothing close to what was average in the past. You can do what I did with houses and do the same for many different things.

The fact of the matter is that people buy bigger and better than before because the costs of things has gone down, and buying power has gone up, but if you look at just average, you will be mislead.

Well said.

 

[OverVolt]

Millenials are just thankful to even have the big shaft. Next generation probably won't even have that.

 

[zephyrprime]

Holy shit I can't believe that .3% of students receive enough money to cover everything. That is shockingly high (no sarcasm).

I certainly didn't! Not even close.

I'm surprised it's that low.

 

[OverVolt]

I'm surprised it's that low.

You could double your odds of a full ride by playing the lottery?

 

[Moonbeam]

Millenials are just thankful to even have the big shaft. Next generation probably won't even have that.

Yup, the next generations will look at the Millennials as worthless baby boomer hippies who sucked the futures our of their children, passive oxen who toil for hay under their yokes and whips.

 

[nickqt]

Im 21, and have been working a full time coorporate job since 18.

I have no college debt (never went)
I have lower rent than anyone else I know
Gas costs too much, but my car takes 93 so its partly my fault
I did my internships in high school
No degree required for IT, and ive worked for Dell, Fidelity, and a school district
Probobly cant/wont get a house
My job is fine
Robots are cool

Before you ask, I never had anyone on the inside of a company pulling me in. Every job I got was 100% on my own.

The moral of the story is that if you apply yourself, try harder than the next guy, and have some legitimate talent then you will have no problem living a comfortable life.

So, anyone who doesn't have your life is just a lazy piece of shit, because your life is the objective measure of whether you've tried.

Nice ego.

 

[realibrad]

So, anyone who doesn't have your life is just a lazy piece of shit, because your life is the objective measure of whether you've tried.

Nice ego.

I guess just skip the talent part?

 

[Moonbeam]

I guess just skip the talent part?

I would say that probably just about every kid born in Sparta grew up to be an amazing killing machine.

The moral of the story is that if you apply yourself, try harder than the next guy, and have some legitimate talent then you will have no problem living a killer life.

I saw an article today that said that people who work overtime have a 33 percent elevated risk of dying from stokes.

 

[JockoJohnson]

I guess just skip the talent part?

Of course. Equality in outcomes...isn't that what it is all about? And Benghazi.

 

[JockoJohnson]

I would say that probably just about every kid born in Sparta grew up to be an amazing killing machine.

The moral of the story is that if you apply yourself, try harder than the next guy, and have some legitimate talent then you will have no problem living a killer life.

I saw an article today that said that people who work overtime have a 33 percent elevated risk of dying from stokes.

Risk/Reward. If people want to work overtime for extra money, there is a trade-off. Look at the pro athletes with what they do to their bodies. They get lots of money but tend to live less than the avg. life span.

 

[Moonbeam]

Risk/Reward. If people want to work overtime for extra money, there is a trade-off. Look at the pro athletes with what they do to their bodies. They get lots of money but tend to live less than the avg. life span.

Not to mention it's a great way to not ever have any time to deal with feelings.

 

[JockoJohnson]

Not to mention it's a great way to not ever have any time to deal with feelings.

That's a good way to look at it. I try to just put in the required amount of time at work. If I miss out on advancement because of it, so be it. But I choose my free time over work time. Family and alone time have kept me quite healthy. And like you mentioned about overtime and strokes, I have kept my stress to a minimum.

 

[realibrad]

Of course. Equality in outcomes...isn't that what it is all about? And Benghazi.

What do you mean? I do not follow.

 

[OverVolt]

Yup, the next generations will look at the Millennials as worthless baby boomer hippies who sucked the futures our of their children, passive oxen who toil for hay under their yokes and whips.

Thats pretty much how the national debt works eh. Rack it up and have our children pay it off.

Here kids have my house! By the way it has an ARM mortgage and I'd only been paying the interest. Sorry!

 

[Anubis]

where I live assuming you can afford the down payment its cheaper to buy a house

the payment after escrow and such is lower then rent for a niceish place

its fing stupid

 

[JockoJohnson]

What do you mean? I do not follow.

Everybody should have an equal CHANCE to do whatever they want in this country, including running for president. However, it seems some posters want everybody to have equal OUTCOMES. No matter what their talent, motivation (or lack thereof), etc. each result of a given situation should be the same. One example is the minimum wage.

This wasn't directed at you but in response to who you replied to.

 

[realibrad]

Everybody should have an equal CHANCE to do whatever they want in this country, including running for president. However, it seems some posters want everybody to have equal OUTCOMES. No matter what their talent, motivation (or lack thereof), etc. each result of a given situation should be the same. One example is the minimum wage.

This wasn't directed at you but in response to who you replied to.

The only part I would disagree with is that everybody should have an equal chance. I don't think its splitting hairs either.

If your parents are wealthy, they are more likely to spend more money on you. If a child shows an interest in something that requires money to invest in, the child of the rich parents will have a better chance at developing in that interest. The only way to give everybody an equal chance would be to take money from a family to give to another.

Further, if you look at physical or mental disabilities that cannot be cured, then you would need to hold back some to be equal to those who are less able.

I don't think you meant to say the above though. I bet you meant something in terms of government and society.

 

[Moonbeam]

We the people overthrew an old government as to us seemed batter able to promote the general welfare. Considering that one must have money to have any welfare at all, the government must provide it either in the form of cash, destructive of personal initiative, or provide full employment to any who are willing and able to work along with sufficient wages to live a meaningful life and have sufficient to save for the future. This will require that the government not only insure that people have a living wage, but that everybody have a job. There are infrastructure needs that stretch to the moon. Later, when we live in a perfect society we can dig holes and fill them in. There is a solar industry to build. There are wastes that need to be transformed back to natural nontoxic forms, there are new scientifically designed cities to build, there are natural landscapes that need to be maintained and protected, there is a whole population of psychologically deranged people who need treatment, the jobs are endless and the needs enormous.

 

[LunarRay]

We the people overthrew an old government as to us seemed batter able to promote the general welfare. Considering that one must have money to have any welfare at all, the government must provide it either in the form of cash, destructive of personal initiative, or provide full employment to any who are willing and able to work along with sufficient wages to live a meaningful life and have sufficient to save for the future. This will require that the government not only insure that people have a living wage, but that everybody have a job. There are infrastructure needs that stretch to the moon. Later, when we live in a perfect society we can dig holes and fill them in. There is a solar industry to build. There are wastes that need to be transformed back to natural nontoxic forms, there are new scientifically designed cities to build, there are natural landscapes that need to be maintained and protected, there is a whole population of psychologically deranged people who need treatment, the jobs are endless and the needs enormous.

'When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.'

This notion is self evident!

 

[Moonbeam]

This notion is self evident!

Well, that's easy for you to say because you have a self to which it is evident, but so many of our friends here are bereft of soul altogether. They don't know fuck all, neither left from right nor top from bottom, lost zombies stumbling around in the night.

 

[werepossum]

We the people overthrew an old government as to us seemed batter able to promote the general welfare. Considering that one must have money to have any welfare at all, the government must provide it either in the form of cash, destructive of personal initiative, or provide full employment to any who are willing and able to work along with sufficient wages to live a meaningful life and have sufficient to save for the future. This will require that the government not only insure that people have a living wage, but that everybody have a job. There are infrastructure needs that stretch to the moon. Later, when we live in a perfect society we can dig holes and fill them in. There is a solar industry to build. There are wastes that need to be transformed back to natural nontoxic forms, there are new scientifically designed cities to build, there are natural landscapes that need to be maintained and protected, there is a whole population of psychologically deranged people who need treatment, the jobs are endless and the needs enormous.

Do you honestly feel that "the general welfare" is a government check?

'When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.'

This notion is self evident!

Not sure what you are trying to convey, but glad to see you haven't left our little cesspool.