Mineral Oil PC - 4/7/2010 Houston, we have liftoff!! *56K Warning*

[legoman666]

Thought I might post this here now that Anandtech has upgraded to a messageboard that doesn't suck (IE, it supports pictures).
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It's that time again!

Teaser pic:

 

[legoman666]

This will be my 3rd project worklog that I have posted on bit-tech.

My first was my Wooden PC, completed in early 2004:

Worklog: http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=38878 (pics are all dead)

My second was my Aluminum/Copper PC, completed early 2008:

Worklog: http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=145057

And that brings us to now, I present to you: The Mineral Oil PC!
Link to planning thread in the Modding forum: http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=163378 Most of the following posts are copied straight from this thread, so some stuff may be out of context.

Here are my preliminary sketches (from 22/1/09):

Description of the general layout:

Bottom compartment:
2 XSPC RX360 Radiators: Link to product
6 Noctua NF-P12 120mm Fans: Link to product
1-2 Eheim 1250 120v Pumps: Link to product
3 fans will suck in, 3 will blow out

Middle tank:
Motherboard: ASUS Crosshair II Formula Link to product
CPU: Phenom II X4 940 Link to product
RAM: 8gb G.SKILL 1000mhz DDR2 Link to product
2 HD4850's: Link to product
Silverstone ST75F 750W PSU: Link to product
Thermalright IFX-14: Link to Product
2 Thermalright T-Rad^2 GPU Coolers: Link to Product

The Mobo/CPU/RAM still isn't 100% set in stone.

Top Compartment:
2x WD 500gb GP Hard Drives (maybe)
2x WD 250gb Hard Drives (maybe)
The top is an exit for cables from the"back" (top in my config) of the motherboard. If I don't go with SSD's, I'll have my hard drives in this compartment too. As you can see in the pics, the tray will have 2 handles for easy removal from the oil. Everything that will be submerged in the oil will be attached to the tray. The top of the case will also be hinged for easy access to the oil.

More Preliminary Sketches (from 24/1/09)

Just playing with the model more.

Are MCP655's submersible? I can't fit my pump(s) in the bottom compartment. I realized this when I replaced the radiator models with model's of the radiators I'll actually be using. If I can't submerge the MCP655, I'll have to stick with Eheim pumps...

Anyone know?

 

[legoman666]

More Preliminary Sketches (from 27/1/09):

Today it snowed ~5-6" overnight, so I wasn't able to make it into work. So I whittled away the day doing absolutely nothing productive. It was great. Looks like I might be stuck at home tomorrow, since it's been freezing rain/sleeting for the past 2-3 hours and we're supposed to get 4-6" more snow by the morning (it's 9:45 PM).

Here's what I did:

I modeled the Asus Crosshair II AM2 motherboard. At this time, it looks like I'm going to go with an AMD setup, unless some other sponsors come through. The latest hardware list:
ASUS Crosshair II Formula
Phenom II X4 940
8gb G.SKILL 1000mhz DDR2

It also turns out that I was seriously uninformed about TECs. The Phenom 940 is 125W TDP which means about 150w at full load. To get a deltaT of 30C between the hotside and cool side of the pelt, I would need to have a pelt with almost 400w of cooling power, which translates into something ridiculous like 600w worth of pelts. The 226w pelt I was going to buy would have produced a deltaT of 11.5C with almost no room for overclocking.
(If this doesn't make any sense, it's because I'm copying these updates from my initial log in the Modding forum)

So it looks like I'm going to stick the most massive heatsink I can find on my CPU: the Thermalright IFX-14 Extreme

Getting rid of the pelt allows me to have a single PSU instead of 2 and make the case smaller and thus cheaper.

I still need to do a lot of work on the model, it's just very tedious. I'm using the Windows 7 Beta at the moment and the hardware acceleration of Google SketchUp doesn't work. Even with a Q6600 @ 3.55ghz it's wrist-slitting-slow.

With any luck, I'll order the raw materials for the case (aluminum sheet, bar and angle, and the plexiglass) by the end of the week. Construction will commence when it arrives.

 

[legoman666]

More Preliminary Sketches (from 28/1/09):

Turns out I wasn't able to make it into work again today either. Yesterday we got 5" of snow, then 1" of sleet/freezing rain. Today we got another 4-5" of snow around 6AM. As of 5:30PM, most of the streets were still in terrible condition.

So I celebrated my free day by spending a little time making a model of the HD4850 without the cooler.

I need to model the GPU cooler I'm using and add it to the model, (the T-Rad^2) but they're actually in use right now and I'm not taking them out of the case.

I also played with the model more. I made it shorter and changed a few things.

Tonight I placed the orders for the raw materials!
I ordered the following:
18" x 24" x 3/8" Plexi - This will be the left side of the tank
24" x 24" x 1/4" Plexi - This will be the front and back of the tank
18" x 24" x 1/4" Plexi - This will be the right side of the tank
12" x 24" x 1/4" Plexi - This will be the bottom of the tank

The left side of the tank is thicker because it will have screws going into it.

96" 1.25" Angle Aluminum - This will be made into .75" pieces for the joints
192" .5" Angle Aluminum - This will be used to strengthen the corners of the plexiglass
32' .75" Bar Aluminum - This will be used structurally in the bottom of the case and for the mobo tray
9' sq .05" Sheet Aluminum - This will be used for the panels

When I say "angle aluminum" I mean this: http://www.onlinemetals.com/merchant.cfm?pid=1019&step=4&showunits=inches&id=63&top_cat=60

Here is how I will use the 1.25" stuff:

 

[legoman666]

Here's something I just found:

https://www.crystalfontz.com/product/CFA635TMFKU1.html in conjunction with

https://www.crystalfontz.com/product/UBERSCAB.html


I've used a CrystalFontz screen before on my first mod. I liked it well enough. This would allow me to use temperature curves to control the fans on the radiators. I could also monitor several oil temperatures with little sensors. I'll use this guys idea: http://www.crystalfontz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4452 to stick sensors on the inlet and outlet of the rads and perhaps in 2 other locations (top and bottom of the tank?). I could also use a flow meter to sound an alarm if the pump fails. This would be great since I won't really be able to see the oil flowing nor will I be able to hear the pump.

I made a simple sketch of what I had in mind:

This is the bottom section of the case. I was going to use 90 degree elbows for these corners since it's a tight fit, but I can simply change them to T's and stick the temperature probe in the branch pointing downwards and seal it with caulk or silicone or something.

 

[legoman666]

I was bored today so I messed around in the shop trying to come up with a decent design for the case feet. Here's what I came up with.

It was a lot of work making those 2 pieces of 1/4" aluminum perfectly round... But I think it turned out pretty well. I won't use this particular foot on the final case as it's not quite up to scratch. However I will probably use the design. Thoughts?

 

[legoman666]

Here's the process by which I make the feet. It's a lot of work.

First I made a template so I don't have 4 slightly different feet on my case.

I traced the outline onto a big piece of 1/4" thick aluminum.

I do the rough cuts with a band saw.

Then I drill a hole in the center so I can stick a bolt through it.

I made a little jig on the belt sander so I can easily do the rough sanding. I just stick the bolt with the rough cuts into the wood and slowly spin it to a circle.

It gets hot enough that I often have to dunk the aluminum into water. You can see the water boiling in this pic.

All done on the belt sander....

...Now onto the drill press. I moved the belts around to get around 2000 RPM. On the press I use various grits of sandpaper to get the edges nice and smooth.

Then I put the template back on and drill the remaining two holes.

 

[legoman666]

And tap them.

I use a bigger drill bit to countersink the screws.

I repeat the process with the piece of plexiglass and then sandwich it between the two discs of aluminum.

All done and polished. (Or at least as smooth as I care to make it.) 1 foot took about 1.5 hours to make.

Final product.

 

[legoman666]

Got some more goodies in the mail today!

The package from Crystalfontz arrived today. Thanks guys! Lots of stuff inside: the LCD, the SCAB board, 4 3 pin fan cable extensions, 4 temperature sensors, 1 cable to allow the LCD to turn on the computer, 1 molex to 4 pin floppy power connector, 2 USB cables for the LCD, 2 different length cables to connect the SCAB to the LCD and a protector for the LCD. Jeez!

I couldn't resist hooking it up and messing around with temperature controlled fan curves.

I also received my pressure switch. I couldn't resist testing this either, looks like it'll work great.

Got 2 feet done. And yes, they're different sizes. I made the one on top first. I cut it out using the band saw. The bigger one on the bottom was cut out using a hole saw. I'm not sure which method was a bigger PITA. I may make 1 more smaller foot and 1 more bigger foot . They're not different enough that it'd be noticeable as long as the big and small ones were grouped together. I hope.

Got a couple more packages in the mail today. A couple more should arrive tomorrow.

Petra's Tech Shop came through on their sponsorship. One of these nice looking XSPC radiators was provided free of charge. At low fan RPM, these out perform Feser's TFC. There's a review of them here: http://www.skinneelabs.com/Radiators/XSPC/RX120/RX120.html

Spam removed
AT Mod
Gillbot

I made a quick sketch to show how I will hold the two different sizes of L angle to the bottom of the frame. The green stuff is 1/2" and will provide strength to the acrylic frame. The red pieces are 1.25" and will be used to hold the corners together.

 

[legoman666]

I got a couple more packages today. One of them contained this:

All of the aluminum I ordered! There's a 3' x 3' x .05" sheet, 32' .75" x .75" bar stock, 16' .5" angle and 8' 1.25" angle.

I also received 3 of the 6 Noctua fan's I'll be using. I only bought 3 because I already own the other 3; they're currently in use.

Using these nifty little guys that come with the fans....

...I mounted them on to one of the radiators. It's a lot of trouble to get those little rubber things through the back of the holes so I can mount the fans. I did this so I would know the exact dimensions of the rad with the fans mounted and I can size the case accordingly.

My first corner complete! This is one of the many corners of the frame.

That's all for today! I did some more work making the frame, but I kind of messed up. There was a slight miscalculation that resulted in screws hitting each other when they shouldn't. I'll fix it tomorrow.

 

[legoman666]

I had planned on just posting one update tomorrow, but I couldn't keep the pics all to myself! So here they are:

I mentioned in my last update that I completed a little more than I had shown. Well, here it is. I was not happy with the quality of my construction. As you can see, 2 of the holes don't have screws. That's because the screws coming from the other direction ran into them. I didn't measure the spacing well enough. The other 2 arrows point towards where I was able to get the screws in, but I had to grind down the head so they didn't collide. Needless to say, it looks poor and all around unprofessional.

I decided to start over with proper planning. I made a list of the sizes of all of the pieces I will need and their locations. Each piece gets its own identifier so there will be no confusion later.

With the plans in hand, I turned to my trusty mitre saw and cut to length all of the pieces required.

Then I labeled them accordingly.

A quick mockup of how the pieces will go together.

Drilling commences.

I made a small template that allows me to drill 2 different sets of holes in the exact spacing I need with no variations. I either use the two far holes or the two middle holes.

Using the template, I made a bunch of my L brackets. Each one bracket has 2 far spaced holes and 2 closely spaced holes.

A complete corner. It turned out a lot better the second time around. My little template worked quite well.

Two corners done. These take a long time to do. For each corner I have to do the following:
Drill 12 holes through 3/4" thick aluminum.
Tap the 12 holes. (my arm hurts)
Make 3 L brackets.
Drill the holes in the L brackets.
Put everything together and hope to god that it all lines up properly.

 

[legoman666]

This is what I completed today on the frame. My arm was starting to aches from all of the holes I had to tap. I can tell the complete frame is going to be ridiculously strong. It barely has any flex in it.

I also worked on making another foot. For this, I turned to the drill press. I think I've decided to use the hole saw method to make all of the feet. They turn out a lot better and require a lot less sanding.

This hole saw is super crappy. I have to go very slowly or it gets stuck. It also shakes the press so much that the chuck on the drill press comes loose. I have to stop and retighten the chuck several times while cutting these.

Two pieces immediately after the hole saw is done with them.

The feet I've completed so far. The middle two were cut with the hole saw. The right foot was my first, and the left foot was the second.

And that's where I stopped this afternoon, my arm was aching too much. I recieved my acrylic today, but it's nothing exciting. The sheets are all covered in paper anyway. I peeled off a little from a corner just to peek, stuff looks great.

What do you guys think?

 

[legoman666]

Hurray! Update time! :clap: Summary of work since Saturday:

I finally completed all 4 feet. I gave in and made them all using the hole saw; they just come out so much better this way. They're all fairly close to the same size; no differences big enough to discern once they'll be in place at the bottom of the case.

All of the L brackets needed to complete the lower frame assembly.

The top portion of the lower frame all put together.

Decent macro shot of a corner.

Hole tapping fun. :lol:

Completed drilling and tapping the risers.

And then put it all together.

Close ups of some corners.

 

[legoman666]

It's quite sturdy. I weigh 130lbs and it didn't flex at all.

Checking the spacing just to make sure I didn't make the frame too small!

Remember this?

Doing a few test cuts on a piece of scrap.

And now doing the cuts on the real thing.

From the other direction....

 

[legoman666]

Checking the fit, looks good.

View of both cuts. When I did these cuts, I backed out the screws about 1/4" to make sure I didn't chop parts of them off. If my calculations were correct, I wouldn't have cut into any screws even if I didn't back them out, but I wanted to be sure.

Oh noes! The jig slipped! This piece is unsalvagable. I've already cut a new piece of bar stock to length and am preparing it to take the place of this one.

And that's where I stopped tonight. I'd once again like to thank Petra's Tech Shop, Crystalfontz for helping me out!

Thoughts?

 

[legoman666]

Someone needs to make a mineral oil cooled computer similar to how a transformer is designed.

Like this. Transformers use natural convection to keep the oil cool. This particular transformer is made for 100% passive operation.

I got a shot of the stuff we (the utility I work for) use in transformers. Here's some data I looked up on it, thought other folks might find it interesting:
MSDS Sheet: http://www.equivashellmsds.com/Display_MSDS.asp?ID=202481
Specifications: http://www.nttworldwide.com/docs/diala-ax.pdf

The highly refined mineral oil contains <3% (w/w) DMSO-extract, according to IP346.
Highly refined mineral oils and additives.

I need to get myself a drum of it.

Edit: Sweet, I asked the dude if I could buy 10 gallons of this stuff: http://cgi.ebay.com/Shell-Diala-HFX...re-Resist_W0QQitemZ230315732658QQcmdZViewItem That would be awesome.
______________________________
Good news! I was talking to my boss at work and somehow we got to talking about this project. I explained what I was doing and why (lol, that's harder to explain than you might think) and the subject of mineral oil came up. I mentioned that I found an auction on eBay that was for the same type of stuff that we use but it would cost me ~$200 to get a hold of 10 gallons. Boss man took me to see the guy in charge of construction of new substations and told me to explain my project to him. The guy called someone up at the warehouse where we keep the oil and arranged for me to come pick up 10 gallons of the stuff for free some time next week!

Huzzah! Saves me $200. My only concern is that the stuff won't be clear. However, I've seen the inside of one of our freshly oil filled transformers and it was as clear as any other mineral oil I've seen, so I should be set.

 

[legoman666]

As tired as I am tonight, I decided to do some work.

I cut a piece of aluminum left over from my last mod to the width of the bottom of the frame. This piece will not be visible unless you somehow.... well no I can't even think of a way.

Checking the fit on the frame, looks good.

Using my trusty right angle...

...I cut the piece to length. (Dumb camera wouldn't cooperate for this pic)

I used my little puncher device to mark spots to drill. (Yes, this one isn't on the line. The line is in the wrong spot, not the punch)

Drilling the holes for the screws that hold the sheet onto the frame.

I learned on my previous mod that it is impossible to drill the holes on the sheet and frame separate. No matter how well you measure the spacing, the holes will never all line up properly. The best method is to tape the two pieces together and drill them at the same time.

More holes to tap :wallbash:

Using the drill to screw the panel to the frame.

 

[legoman666]

Not really sure what my camera was trying to focus on... the reflection I guess.

Looks pretty good.

Marking out the spacing for the case feet.

Drilling the holes through the feet and then into the bottom panel.

Then I screwed them on. The middle hole is for the LED to light up the feet.

All four feet mounted.

View from the front.

Also got a few more goodies in the mail; an aluminum ATX back panel frame, slim slot loading USB DVD burner, a 7 port USB hub that will be internalized in the bottom compartment, and a 4oz bottle of Weld-On #4 acrylic glue.

Until tomorrow...

 

[legoman666]

An update of work thus far this weekend:

Busting out the table saw to rip a few more side panels to size.

Fit looks good...

...But no so much here. But don't worry, it's a lot easier to file a panel to the correct size than it is to make a new one because it was too small.

Mounting the rad grill and radiator.

Using the provided template to cut out the hole.

And after much cursing, yelling, tears and then filing... lots of filing. Jig saw = fail. I couldn't find a way to securely hold the panel down while trying to cut out the middle. Jig saws do not like cutting objects that can vibrate freely. I ended up finishing the cuts with the Dremel; I hate Dremels.

I cut 4 pieces of 1/2" angle to length.

 

[legoman666]

2 of them mounted.

I countersunk some screws to allow the side panels to fit snugly over the corners.

Got the hole nice and filed with the rad and grill mounted.

The other side.

I cut another piece of sheet to fit the back of the case.

And then filed it to size, drilled, tapped and screwed it on. The screw on the middle left is in too far. And once again the camera is focusing on who knows what.

Poor USB hub never knew what hit it.

And that's where I stopped today. I'm sick and feeling all around miserable. Probably won't go to work tomorrow. In which case I'll probably work on the remaining side panels. Another sponsor may also be in the works. They offered some of their next gen SSDs, which have not been released yet. They might not be released in time for this project, but maybe for a future mod...

Thoughts?

 

[legoman666]

May I recommend this for cutting the aluminum sheets. I think you'd like it better. Rather pricey tho.

Thanks. The current blades in the table saw and mitre saw have no problem cutting the aluminum as is. I'll give them a look when I'm at the hardware store though.

coming along well, can't wait to see the final product.

Not the final product, but here's an update for you...

Was bored tonight, so I decided to do a little soldering...

4 LEDs in series with a 22ohm resistor for about 2.07v drop across each diode. I have the positive lead connected to the 12v line and the negative lead is connected to the 3.3v rail. Do the math -> 8.7v. Each is held in place with a generous glob of hot glue.

Not overly bright so they won't get annoying like blue LEDs. Looks pretty decent.

 

[legoman666]

I stayed home from work today because I'm sick. I did what any self respecting modder should do.... work anyway!

I used the table saw to cut another side panel.

Then repeated the same marking, drilling and tapping process. I think I've developed a twitch when I hear the word "tap." I have tapped 154 holes so far. ARGGGGGG.

And then using one of my least favorite tools, the Dremel...

...I cut the hole out for the 2nd radiator on my fresh side panel.

4 cutting wheels, 45 minutes later, and then 15 minutes of filing, the hole was acceptable.

I do not like AC Ryan Rad Grillz either. They are designed to fit on any brand radiator, which means they inevitably fit on no brands of radiators. The holes do not line up for HWLabs radiators nor for XSPC radiators. The amount of time I have to spend fudging around with the damn things is ridiculous. Radiator hole spacing really needs to be standardized so problems like this do not occur.

Grrr.

 

[legoman666]

So I'm back in town and back to work.

On my way home, I picked up the 10 gallons of oil that I got from work.

It's fairly colorless. The greenish tint in this pic kind of overstates how it appears in real life.

Remember that USB hub I destroyed? Here it is! Filing these holes took damn near forever.

The 3 ports on the right are outputs. The plug on the left is for power and the mini usb is the input.

Which leaves me 4 ports on the inside. I mounted the PCB by using double sided tape to attach it to a piece of cardboard, which has another piece of double sided tape holding it to the piece of square aluminum stock below it.

My sheets of acrylic. Together, these weight about 15lbs.

Looks like good stuff!

Hmmmmm, I wonder what has been cut recently....

I precisely measured and cut the bottom piece.

 

[legoman666]

And then the 4 sides.

And then chopped them all to the same height. I haven't done any more work on them besides this. I still need to glue them together and drill the holes for the radiator inlet/outlet.

Making sure everything fits. The top most USB port is not usable. Shouldn't be a problem though. I may end up only needing 1 port down here.

Checking the placement of the Crystalfontz LCD.

Then I printed out the template and taped it on the front panel.

I scored all the lines with a razor blade and cut the main window out with the dremel. Then I drilled the pilot holes for the buttons.

After about 3 hours with some intense needle file action...

...Looks like it fits. I'm thinking about putting a piece of copper over top of this to hide the knife marks. I was half asleep when I put the template on the front side of the panel and not the back. We'll see.

 

[legoman666]

I cut and sliced some sound proofing material for the bottom of the case.

Then I drilled 4 holes to mount the SCAB.

And stuck the screws through.

And then bolted the SCAB down.

And then I made sure it still worked.

If you remember this sketch, the two elbows will have temperature sensors in them. One will measure the oil intake temperature and the other will measure the outlet temperature.

I cut most of a barb off a T and stuck a sensor in. Then I sealed it with silicone.

You can see the sensor poking through the silicone goop. Why is this stuff red? Apparently it's high temperature silicone. It came with a wood burning stove for sealing the chimney. When I seal the corners of the tank, I certainly won't use this stuff. I think I have a syringe of clear silicone somewhere....

Until tomorrow....