Mississippi joins the fight for 10 comandments!

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: NerdMan

2. Make no images of anything in heaven, earth or the sea, and do not worship or labor for them.


Commandment two also violates the FIRST amendment to publish anything we like.

There are a number of caveats to that, sir; I would argue that we do not have the right to "publish anything we wish." I am sure there a number of periodicals the North American Man/Boy Love Association would like to publish, but I don't think you are going to see "Kids' Toys" on any bookshelves in the near-term.

 

[LilBlinbBlahIce]

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: NerdMan
Let's look at the Ten Commandments...

1. Have no other gods before me [the God of the Hebrews].
2. Make no images of anything in heaven, earth or the sea, and do not worship or labor for them.
3. Do not vainly use the name of your God [the God of the Hebrews].
4. Do no work on the seventh day of the week.
5. Honor your parents.
6. Do not kill.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not give false testimony against another.
10. Do not desire another's wife or anything that belongs to another.


We can clearly see that Commandment 1 clearly violates the FIRST amendment (prohibiting the preaching of another god/religion). If a state supports the ten commandments, then they are in violation of the CONSTITUTION, and therefore are an enemy of the United States.

Commandment two also violates the FIRST amendment to publish anything we like.

Commandment three also violates the FIRST amendment of free speech.

Commandments 6, 8 & 9 support the constitution / established laws so I have no problem with them.

Commandments 4, 5, 7 & 10 violates free will. I have no comment on the morals or consequenses of those actions.

Do paintings of Jesus crucified make you go out herding up Christians and nail them to a cross? It doesn't? wow. I bet it offends you as well.

Ever visit the Louvre or the Smithsonian and see religious art? Did it offend you? No, how come?

It's a friggin lump of Granite, get way over it. All you whiny ass people who can't stomach other beliefs need to grow some. Everything in this world will offend someone. It offends me reading some posts in P & N, but do I grow whining to a moderator? Fvck no. Pull your panties out and go trumpet another cause.

You forget one very important fact. These commandments are in a court house, therefor in a place that represents US law which has strict separation of church and state. If these tablets were in the Louvre, or the Smithsonian or in a private business, I don't think anyone would give a damn and it would not even have made the news.

 

[datalink7]

Originally posted by: bjc112

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
labels don't mean much. a southern democrat is sometimes about the same as a west/east coast republican

Then i guess all republicans are sometimes the same as west/east coast dems...

I tend to cut to the chase and just say Republocrates, in general, suck.

 

[DZip]

Why does the US Supreme Court still allow most of the churches, temples, and religious schools to display the American flag? Is it not the law that the church and state must be separated? Maybe the politicians and judges should go to the churches to protest (or pray) that they are removed. How many church members are offended by the sight of the American flag in front of church? Every Sunday, our congregation pray?s for the This needs to be addressed now.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: NerdMan
Let's look at the Ten Commandments...

1. Have no other gods before me [the God of the Hebrews].
2. Make no images of anything in heaven, earth or the sea, and do not worship or labor for them.
3. Do not vainly use the name of your God [the God of the Hebrews].
4. Do no work on the seventh day of the week.
5. Honor your parents.
6. Do not kill.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not give false testimony against another.
10. Do not desire another's wife or anything that belongs to another.


We can clearly see that Commandment 1 clearly violates the FIRST amendment (prohibiting the preaching of another god/religion). If a state supports the ten commandments, then they are in violation of the CONSTITUTION, and therefore are an enemy of the United States.

Commandment two also violates the FIRST amendment to publish anything we like.

Commandment three also violates the FIRST amendment of free speech.

Commandments 6, 8 & 9 support the constitution / established laws so I have no problem with them.

Commandments 4, 5, 7 & 10 violates free will. I have no comment on the morals or consequenses of those actions.

Do paintings of Jesus crucified make you go out herding up Christians and nail them to a cross? It doesn't? wow. I bet it offends you as well.

Ever visit the Louvre or the Smithsonian and see religious art? Did it offend you? No, how come?

It's a friggin lump of Granite, get way over it. All you whiny ass people who can't stomach other beliefs need to grow some. Everything in this world will offend someone. It offends me reading some posts in P & N, but do I grow whining to a moderator? Fvck no. Pull your panties out and go trumpet another cause.

You may have a point in th Federal vs State arguement(I dunno what they are), but as for it's just a lump of Granite or people can't stomach others' beliefs, you need to tell that to the protestors at the Courthouse.

Those people see this issue not as an Individual Expression or even Freedom of Religion. No, they see this as an attack on their Religion and as an attack on the US itself. They are convinced that their Religion is the Defacto National Religion, sanctioned by the State(US government) by Default. To them all the Founders were Christian and as such intended that the US was Christian as well, that whole Constitutional thing was more about not choosing one denomination rather than not choosing one religion, after all, the US is a Christian Nation! This is their thinking.

You or others say that a symbol of Buddha, Islam(if their are such things), Reverend Moon, or some other belief would not offend you, but it most certainly would offend those Protestors! It too would be an attack on their Religion, as it is an attack on the nature of the US, that being a Christian Nation.

edit: speeling

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: NerdMan
Let's look at the Ten Commandments...

1. Have no other gods before me [the God of the Hebrews].
2. Make no images of anything in heaven, earth or the sea, and do not worship or labor for them.
3. Do not vainly use the name of your God [the God of the Hebrews].
4. Do no work on the seventh day of the week.
5. Honor your parents.
6. Do not kill.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not give false testimony against another.
10. Do not desire another's wife or anything that belongs to another.


We can clearly see that Commandment 1 clearly violates the FIRST amendment (prohibiting the preaching of another god/religion). If a state supports the ten commandments, then they are in violation of the CONSTITUTION, and therefore are an enemy of the United States.

Commandment two also violates the FIRST amendment to publish anything we like.

Commandment three also violates the FIRST amendment of free speech.

Commandments 6, 8 & 9 support the constitution / established laws so I have no problem with them.

Commandments 4, 5, 7 & 10 violates free will. I have no comment on the morals or consequenses of those actions.

Pay special attention to #2 and note the Irony.

 

[friedpie]

Originally posted by: Insane3D

Why can't you respect the fact that our constitution allows for freedom of expression.

Why can't you understand that having a religous monument where it was gives the impression the government is endorsing said religion. The problem is not the monument per se, but where it is located. Having religous idols in a government building clearly violates the speration of church and state IMO.

Also, no one is taking away your right to pratice whatever religion you believe by moving ths monument.

You don't understand the law. The law says the government can't establish a national church or national religion. At that time that was a big concern. Many states had established state churches. The government didn't want there to be a national church or religion, but they did want there to be religious freedom, and freedom of religious thought and expression. Nowhere has the federal law been broken. Your argument that people might get that impression is weak and without merit. It's hysteria that does not stand up to the rule of the law. That's why 4 out of 5 people polled recently disagreed with the federal judge ruling.

BTW, the constitution gives limited powers to the federal government. James Madison said that "the powers are enumerated and it follows that all that are not granted by the Constitution are retained by the people." That means that if the federal government can not promote or regulate religion it is without the power to act on those matters also! This is one reason why Judge Roy Moore defied a federal judge's ruling to remove the statue. The federal court judge had no constitutional right to do order the statue removed. None!

That phrase "separation of church and state" came from a letter Jefferson wrote to a Church Association in Connecticut.

From here: http://www.noapathy.org/tracts/mythofseparation.html

Anytime religion is mentioned within the confines of government today people cry, "Separation of Church and State". Many people think this statement appears in the first amendment of the U.S. Constitution and therefore must be strictly enforced. However, the words: "separation", "church", and "state" do not even appear in the first amendment. The first amendment reads, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." The statement about a wall of separation between church and state was made in a letter on January 1, 1802, by Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptist Association of Connecticut. The congregation heard a widespread rumor that the Congregationalists, another denomination, were to become the national religion. This was very alarming to people who knew about religious persecution in England by the state established church. Jefferson made it clear in his letter to the Danbury Congregation that the separation was to be that government would not establish a national religion or dictate to men how to worship God.

Please read the full article.

 

[friedpie]

Tell the Judge to wear a button, then. You don't need a 2+ ton rock in a government building to "express yourself"!

You claim the judge was unconstitutional, then when you lose that argument you offer up a solution that is itself unconstitutional. lol

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: NerdMan
Let's look at the Ten Commandments...

1. Have no other gods before me [the God of the Hebrews].
2. Make no images of anything in heaven, earth or the sea, and do not worship or labor for them.
3. Do not vainly use the name of your God [the God of the Hebrews].
4. Do no work on the seventh day of the week.
5. Honor your parents.
6. Do not kill.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not give false testimony against another.
10. Do not desire another's wife or anything that belongs to another.


We can clearly see that Commandment 1 clearly violates the FIRST amendment (prohibiting the preaching of another god/religion). If a state supports the ten commandments, then they are in violation of the CONSTITUTION, and therefore are an enemy of the United States.

Commandment two also violates the FIRST amendment to publish anything we like.

Commandment three also violates the FIRST amendment of free speech.

Commandments 6, 8 & 9 support the constitution / established laws so I have no problem with them.

Commandments 4, 5, 7 & 10 violates free will. I have no comment on the morals or consequenses of those actions.

Pay special attention to #2 and note the Irony.

People aren't worshipping the monument. Defending the right to display it isn't worshiping it. Now there are symbols that people do worship in some religions of Christianity but that is a different subject

CkG

 

[DealMonkey]

I think part of the problem is you have amateurs interpreting the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, etc. Why don't you just let the USSC do their job and abide by their decisions? Do you really think you know more than the SC justices about constitutional law? Doubtful.

 

[friedpie]

Nitemare: Does the U.S. Constitution not supercede individual state constitutions? Does Federal law not trump state law? Can you make a state law that violates federal law?

You need to look up the Tenth Amendment.

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

 

[friedpie]

You forget one very important fact. These commandments are in a court house, therefor in a place that represents US law which has strict separation of church and state.

They are also on display in the US Supreme Court held up by a marble statue of Moses!

NEXT!

 

[friedpie]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
I think part of the problem is you have amateurs interpreting the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, etc. Why don't you just let the USSC do their job and abide by their decisions? Do you really think you know more than the SC justices about constitutional law? Doubtful.

The US Supreme Court has not decided on the 10 commandments (probably because they have them on display in their courtroom!) so what are you talking about? It was a federal judge who ordered the statue removed. See my other messages for why that is wrong.

 

[Gaard]

The US Supreme Court has not decided on the 10 commandments (probably because they have them on display in their courtroom!)

Has it been brought to the SC?

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: friedpie

Tell the Judge to wear a button, then. You don't need a 2+ ton rock in a government building to "express yourself"!

You claim the judge was unconstitutional, then when you lose that argument you offer up a solution that is itself unconstitutional. lol

No, just saying that if "Freedom of Expression" is to be allowed, a button on the shirt makes more sense than a hunk of rock in the lobby.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: NerdMan
Let's look at the Ten Commandments...

1. Have no other gods before me [the God of the Hebrews].
2. Make no images of anything in heaven, earth or the sea, and do not worship or labor for them.
3. Do not vainly use the name of your God [the God of the Hebrews].
4. Do no work on the seventh day of the week.
5. Honor your parents.
6. Do not kill.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not give false testimony against another.
10. Do not desire another's wife or anything that belongs to another.


We can clearly see that Commandment 1 clearly violates the FIRST amendment (prohibiting the preaching of another god/religion). If a state supports the ten commandments, then they are in violation of the CONSTITUTION, and therefore are an enemy of the United States.

Commandment two also violates the FIRST amendment to publish anything we like.

Commandment three also violates the FIRST amendment of free speech.

Commandments 6, 8 & 9 support the constitution / established laws so I have no problem with them.

Commandments 4, 5, 7 & 10 violates free will. I have no comment on the morals or consequenses of those actions.

Pay special attention to #2 and note the Irony.

People aren't worshipping the monument. Defending the right to display it isn't worshiping it. Now there are symbols that people do worship in some religions of Christianity but that is a different subject

CkG

You sure about that? These people are carrying on as if God will soon smote the US for it's removal. If that's not Idol worship, what is?

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: friedpie

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
I think part of the problem is you have amateurs interpreting the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, etc. Why don't you just let the USSC do their job and abide by their decisions? Do you really think you know more than the SC justices about constitutional law? Doubtful.

The US Supreme Court has not decided on the 10 commandments (probably because they have them on display in their courtroom!) so what are you talking about? It was a federal judge who ordered the statue removed. See my other messages for why that is wrong.

Why don't you take a look for yourself at the USSC displays of the ten commandments. Why don't you see if you can spot the difference between the USSC display and Judge Moore's religious monument:

Slideshow

Let me know when you've looked at all the pictures.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: NerdMan
Let's look at the Ten Commandments...

1. Have no other gods before me [the God of the Hebrews].
2. Make no images of anything in heaven, earth or the sea, and do not worship or labor for them.
3. Do not vainly use the name of your God [the God of the Hebrews].
4. Do no work on the seventh day of the week.
5. Honor your parents.
6. Do not kill.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not give false testimony against another.
10. Do not desire another's wife or anything that belongs to another.


We can clearly see that Commandment 1 clearly violates the FIRST amendment (prohibiting the preaching of another god/religion). If a state supports the ten commandments, then they are in violation of the CONSTITUTION, and therefore are an enemy of the United States.

Commandment two also violates the FIRST amendment to publish anything we like.

Commandment three also violates the FIRST amendment of free speech.

Commandments 6, 8 & 9 support the constitution / established laws so I have no problem with them.

Commandments 4, 5, 7 & 10 violates free will. I have no comment on the morals or consequenses of those actions.

Pay special attention to #2 and note the Irony.

People aren't worshipping the monument. Defending the right to display it isn't worshiping it. Now there are symbols that people do worship in some religions of Christianity but that is a different subject

CkG

You sure about that? These people are carrying on as if God will soon smote the US for it's removal. If that's not Idol worship, what is?

Yes. To protray those that support the monument staying there as "worshipping" it is wrong. They don't pray to it, like they do to God.

DM - their symbology is the same no matter what is written on the rock(or nothing). Why does the writing make it an "establishment" offense?


CkG