[MMO] World of Tanks

[LurkerPrime]

I assumed you left this game for an extended vacation.

Volt left the legion because of perceived second citizen class (which administration vehemently denied), Volt was asked to do things for Havok with little regard to helping Volt, etc etc etc. Combine that with the flap over the US landing event and Volt REQUIRED to stand down to Forge for a NON clan war event was still a recent memory. And finally, Havok asked Jam to step down as CO of Volt due to chip placements. Jam did step down, and very soon after Volt did a clan wide vote to leave the Legion.

So, where did I come in? If you really want to read it: http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index...ing/page__st__3900__pid__4382175#entry4382175. Basically, I aired dirty laundry for better or worse. I pissed Lion off something fierce. He PM'ed me calling me a liar, which I basically replied to in kind. Whatever, what is done is done.

But you know what is interesting, I was very used to platooning with 59+%'ers and I am now platooning with 52-55%'ers. Their attitude is just plain better in playing and losing or winning. I might be losing a bit more often (still winning more than 60% and that is still progress for me). Lot less stress, a lot more fun.

I really didn't see anything all that bad in there. Hell I'm surprised TBL has gone on as long as it has without any internal strife. That shit is always bound to happen, especially when you have like 500+ members. In internet games, clans rise and fall and sometimes a better clan rises from the ashes, and well sometimes not. Personally I stop giving a fuck about CW when WG made it all go to shit with the new NA map intro.

I'm glad you are having more fun without me stressing you out. I'm still taking a break from playing anyway. You still allowed on TBL TS? or did you piss lion off enough that he revoked your privilages? Honestly, I'm surprised they haven't kicked me for being inactive from CW for months. I guess they need the chips at the moment anyway (only 95 members).

 

[PowerYoga]

What I'm asking is, is the whole creation of these two ammo tiers good game balance?

It was one thing when limited almost entirely to clan wars and most said 'that's fine, they have to make money', but it's now affecting gameplay a lot more that it's for credits.

What began as a limited thing is now pretty different.

When I reference 'pay to win', I'm referring to the issue that 'free to play' games have that as they want to tempt people to spend, they are tempted to give too much advantage in winning the game to those who do. I'm not saying that has or hasn't happened with this in WoT, I'm mentioning it as part of the history as a concern for premium ammo when it was only for money, not credits.

I can see that, but a lot of people still don't use premium rounds. To be honest I don't notice too much of a difference in my play style because I still have to aim to pen stuff, and I don't notice extra pens or whatever. The only difference is tier 10 guns which have 300+ pen on heat rounds, but even those guns have limitations as HEAT gets eaten by spaced armor and slopes very easily and has no normalization. Not to mention your biggest problem at tier 10 is arty, not people slinging gold.

 

[Possessed Freak]

I'm glad you are having more fun without me stressing you out. I'm still taking a break from playing anyway. You still allowed on TBL TS? or did you piss lion off enough that he revoked your privilages? Honestly, I'm surprised they haven't kicked me for being inactive from CW for months. I guess they need the chips at the moment anyway (only 95 members).

Oh pish, you never stressed me out (if anything, you had a tendency to stress yourself out with losing 1 out of 5 games!). I blew my top once and I do regret it. Sadly I think that was the last time I platooned with you. I dunno if I am still allowed on TBL's TS. I wouldn't go there even if I was. I KNOW I pissed Lion off and I know that several of the officers back him and Sarge regardless. I also know several of them PM'ed me with attaboys. I don't need to cause any more problems than I already did, and I respect them enough not to add to it.

 

[Craig234]

I can see that, but a lot of people still don't use premium rounds. To be honest I don't notice too much of a difference in my play style because I still have to aim to pen stuff, and I don't notice extra pens or whatever. The only difference is tier 10 guns which have 300+ pen on heat rounds, but even those guns have limitations as HEAT gets eaten by spaced armor and slopes very easily and has no normalization. Not to mention your biggest problem at tier 10 is arty, not people slinging gold.

Those are all arguments though that 'it's not as big a deal as it could be' that don't address the question, is having this two-tier design of ammo a good idea for game balance?

I'm not sure it should be an option to have some tanks running around with high-pen better ammo while others get a lot more non-pens.

Equipment options, consumables seem balanced - but two tiers of ammo a good idea?

 

[LurkerPrime]

Oh pish, you never stressed me out (if anything, you had a tendency to stress yourself out with losing 1 out of 5 games!). I blew my top once and I do regret it. Sadly I think that was the last time I platooned with you. I dunno if I am still allowed on TBL's TS. I wouldn't go there even if I was. I KNOW I pissed Lion off and I know that several of the officers back him and Sarge regardless. I also know several of them PM'ed me with attaboys. I don't need to cause any more problems than I already did, and I respect them enough not to add to it.

Well whenever I start playing again, I guess I'll have to get VOLTs TS information. Well its that 1 out of 5 games is usually when not only MM fucks you, but so does the RNG. You know those games, the ones where not only is everyone on your team sub 50%ers, but no matter how long you aim, your shells all go in the dirt, or fly off to the next map. Essentially I blame the RNG for my frustrations.

 

[Craig234]

Conspiracy theory: some matches it sort of seems like one side, at least your tank, just has some sort of RNG factor for the match with a big increase in non-pen type numbers.

It's hard to mail down from the legitimate random numbers, but has seemed strong enough to create a suspicion the game might add one in some matches.

 

[Possessed Freak]

Well it looks like they are seriously having fun with penetration values on tanks.
http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/235399-more-heat-nerfs/

T-54 and non-Chinese tier 10 meds: now 330mm pen

American 120mm guns: now 340mm pen

American 105mm derp: now 101.6mm pen

American 75mm derp: now 91.4mm pen

USSR 76mm derp: now 75mm pen (you may as well just use AP in it at this point)

USSR 122mm derp: now 140mm pen

USSR 152mm TD: now 250mm pen (buffed!)

USSR M62 122mm gun: now 340 pen

German 75mm derp: now 87mm pen

German 105mm derp: now 104mm pen

French 75mm derp: now 91.4mm pen

British 120mm APCR got nerfed to 326mm pen

French 120mm APCR got nerfed to 325mm pen

Chinese 130mm and big 122mm (not the USSR copy): now 340mm pen

The 105's got hit HARD. ~105 pen is near useless in a tier 6-7 game so back to the 76mm! The KV-2 lost its HEAT round and its premium AP is now 136, so I guess it is a good time to retire THE DERP. It had a good run.

Granted this is all the supertesters, so it could change before release.

 

[Genx87]

Whoever is the equivalent of Stalin at Wargaming has decided that players don't get any say in map selection or game modes. Since they picked up the Guinness WR for most players online they effectively lost the excuses for forcefeeding maps and "game modes".

I will admit that they surprised me when they toned down on p2w. I did not see that coming, I thought the golden ammo, golden chocolate/coffee and golden fuel would never change. However, since then they haven't really done anything.

I hope you all like the game as it is because you are foolish if you expect real changes that go beyond adding a dog house or placing garage/vehicles "outdoors".

Gameplay will suffer because WOT doesn't have a competitor and nothing will force them to deviate from their formula. From their perspective game is done, now it's just a matter of fine tuning.

WOW is gonna fail and probably die because of War Thunder, too bad for the WOT userbase that an equivalent of War Thunder doesn't exist to ensure evolution of the game. Sad truth is that they have monopoly and they know it.

Warthunders tank game is probably the last part to be implemented. My understanding is they will work on ships next and finish with tanks. It will be years before it comes out. I do think unless Wargaming fixes World of Warplanes they may be a one hit wonder with WoT. WoWP is terribad.

 

[Genx87]

Well it looks like they are seriously having fun with penetration values on tanks.
http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/235399-more-heat-nerfs/


The 105's got hit HARD. ~105 pen is near useless in a tier 6-7 game so back to the 76mm! The KV-2 lost its HEAT round and its premium AP is now 136, so I guess it is a good time to retire THE DERP. It had a good run.

Granted this is all the supertesters, so it could change before release.

I will have to get to feeding the derps for the last time!

 

[PowerYoga]

T57 and T110E5 actually got nerfed hard, unexpected.

268/381/60 to 258/340/60. Granted I run mostly AP rounds with it and the HEAT was super powerful on that thing, but I wasn't expecting the AP nerf as well.

A lot of the heat/apcr rounds for high tier german tanks remain pretty untouched so far. Just a slight nerf for some premium rounds.

With the 105mm change the heat round is worthless in tier 6 and 7 games since it'll barely penetrate the sides of things like kv and tigers. It's probably better to run APCR rounds with the 76mm at that point. I'm glad I didn't stock too much derp rounds, but I had a good run with it and it was worth the lol factor.

 

[Genx87]

Ouch wonder if they will nerf other high tier guns as well?

 

[chimaxi83]

Just in time for me to buy that E5 ah well, can't miss what I never knew anyway.

 

[LurkerPrime]

Well with the nerf to the 105mm for the pz4, I can now sell that tank off and move my super crew somewhere else. Who knows, maybe I'll finally buy that E100 and put them on there to troll people. Especially with all the arty nerfs and HEAT pen nerfs, the E100 and maus might somewhat be viable again.

I would actually like to see some more normalization of the absurd penning higher tier HEAT/APCR rounds. The game was more interesting when shots actually bounced, and you had to either aim for weakspots or flank.

 

[stag3]

cant wait for the arty nerf, fuck arty
so tired of 4+ arty per match every match god

it's so stupid i don't even care when arty kills me now, i just go for the kills against other tanks lol

 

[Craig234]

T57 and T110E5 actually got nerfed hard, unexpected.

268/381/60 to 258/340/60. Granted I run mostly AP rounds with it and the HEAT was super powerful on that thing, but I wasn't expecting the AP nerf as well.

A lot of the heat/apcr rounds for high tier german tanks remain pretty untouched so far. Just a slight nerf for some premium rounds.

With the 105mm change the heat round is worthless in tier 6 and 7 games since it'll barely penetrate the sides of things like kv and tigers. It's probably better to run APCR rounds with the 76mm at that point. I'm glad I didn't stock too much derp rounds, but I had a good run with it and it was worth the lol factor.

Arty and the T110E5? What's next, they send me a note saying 'maybe play another game'?

They sure seem to be sending that message.

 

[stag3]

it's about time the T110e5 got the nerfbat tho
the is7 has been nerfed to shit, and yet again pen is going down on AP to 250 from 260? gtfo , that top speed buff made it way OP i guess /sarcasm

i haven't touched the maus or e100 in awhile since all the new guns have no issues pen'ng

 

[Genx87]

I will have to checkout the list of these nerfs. Interesting way of going about it. If the IS7's gun is nerfed to 250. I wouldnt expect any buff on the 128. I always felt that gun's pen was underpowered for its tier. I guess they are going to buff it by nerfing other guns.

I am not opposed to this kind of game change. Armor may mean something again.

 

[chimaxi83]

Is XVM not working for for anyone else?

 

[ddjkdg]

105mm HEAT nerf makes the VK 2801 even worse. Time to sell it while I still have fond memories of 3k XP games.

 

[Craig234]

it's about time the T110e5 got the nerfbat tho

Wrong.

 

[Possessed Freak]

Everybody has their favorite tanks. It hurts when their favorites get nerfed.

I had a nice argument over the nerfing of the su-26 the other week. The guy was of the opinion that it was not OP... people tend to blind themselves to certain things.

I acknowledge that the 105 HEAT is retarded. I know that arty is poorly implemented and really does silly things to the game when there are 4+ per side. I feel they did way too much power creep on the penetration of regular rounds and premium ammo on newer tanks while others have stagnated. While my all time favorite tank is getting nerfed, possibly to the point that I will retire it, I know that it is completely overpowered and will not be sad to see it nerfed.

I truly wish they did more balancing in the game for sake of gameplay instead of "historical accuracy". My solution to the 105 is this: Remove it from the tier 5 tanks, keep it an option on the TD's and tier 6+ tanks. The TD's have enough drawbacks to give them the derp. Tier 6+ tanks might be tossed into a tier 8 game with a 150 pen gun, it is a tradeoff.

 

[Craig234]

Everybody has their favorite tanks. It hurts when their favorites get nerfed.

I had a nice argument over the nerfing of the su-26 the other week. The guy was of the opinion that it was not OP... people tend to blind themselves to certain things.

I acknowledge that the 105 HEAT is retarded. I know that arty is poorly implemented and really does silly things to the game when there are 4+ per side. I feel they did way too much power creep on the penetration of regular rounds and premium ammo on newer tanks while others have stagnated. While my all time favorite tank is getting nerfed, possibly to the point that I will retire it, I know that it is completely overpowered and will not be sad to see it nerfed.

I truly wish they did more balancing in the game for sake of gameplay instead of "historical accuracy". My solution to the 105 is this: Remove it from the tier 5 tanks, keep it an option on the TD's and tier 6+ tanks. The TD's have enough drawbacks to give them the derp. Tier 6+ tanks might be tossed into a tier 8 game with a 150 pen gun, it is a tradeoff.

It's not so bad to have your favorite tank nerfed if you think it's overpowered.

The T110E5 isn't so clear on that with the T57 heavy's autoloader.

 

[Genx87]

I fully acknowledge the 105 on the M4 is ridiculously OP using premium rounds. It being nerfed is no surprise to me. It has been fun and will be until the patch hits. Went 5-1 in it last night killing 18 souls. But last night was kind of an exception for me. I went 6-0 in my T8+ games. And I played 3 games of Warthhunder winning all 3 and shooting down 12 while being shot down once. MM karma will get me tonight. Probably go 2-12.

 

[PowerYoga]

Eh, not sure what's so OP about the T57 or the T110E5's gun that it needs nerf.

The HEAT round is also getting price doubling, up to 17 gold (5400 credits) per shot. It's now a worthless round at 100 pen and at 5400 a shot. Might as well use normal HE rounds...

 

[stag3]

Wrong.

it's dominated since it came out, excellent gun, best mobility, only weakspots are the side back like other tanks.

i just hate the fact every tier X i got has been nerfed to shit LOL
maus, e100, is-7, amx50b all crap
at least i do ok with the is-4 if i angle correctly