Modern day job postings for "entry level" jobs...

[slugg]

For basic jobs, like level 1 tech support, I keep seeing things like:

- Bachelors Degree in Computer Science, Engineering, or similar
- 4 years experience


... for a tech support job? Really? At this rate, I would expect to see the following job posting in the not too distant future:

Job Title: Burger Flipper
Level: Entry Level

Requirements:
- PhD in chemical engineering, physics, or equivalent
- 20+ years experience
- Must also be good at Photoshop and Facebook
- Must have been born knowing everything

Lately, I've been trying to find a couple friends find jobs, but the requirements tend to be unrealistic. They want people with years of experience and a college degree for a basic, near-minimum-wage job. WTF?

 

[Imp]

Hint: They want to pay you at entry-level rates but use you like a senior. That or use it as an excuse to import a foreign worker who will work for peanuts while living in the employer's shack -- law says they have to advertise for locals first?

 

[rudeguy]

Ignorant and out of touch HR departments. Its a curse.

I swear the only way to really get into a job right now is through a headhunter/temp agency.

 

[Jimzz]

Hint: They want to pay you at entry-level rates but use you like a senior. That or use it as an excuse to import a foreign worker who will work for peanuts while living in the employer's shack -- law says they have to advertise for locals first?

Pretty much this.

 

[Mai72]

You have an abundance of college grads who can't find work. The more grads you have in the workforce, the greater the chance that the minimum requirements for certain jobs are going to increase.

I've heard that to get a $10 a hour job at Starbucks you need a college degree. I don't know how true this is, but I bet there is some truth to it.

 

[unokitty]

... Lately, I've been trying to find a couple friends find jobs, but the requirements tend to be unrealistic. They want people with years of experience and a college degree for a basic, near-minimum-wage job. WTF?

There are 18,000 parking lot attendants in the U.S. with college degrees. There are 5,000 janitors in the U.S. with PhDs.

Interesting times...

Uno

 

[JManInPhoenix]

Years ago I remember seeing an ad for a VB programmer. It stated that it required 10 years of experience (that language hadn't even been around that long).

 

[xanis]

Ignorant and out of touch HR departments. Its a curse.

I swear the only way to really get into a job right now is through a headhunter/temp agency.

Seems that way. I struggled finding a job after I graduated, and the best I could get in a reasonable amount of time was a contract gig with a temp agency. They're not all bad, but a lot of them are huge scumbags. Probably wouldn't deal with one again unless I was desperate.

That said, I can attest to the ridiculous entry-level job requirements. When I was looking for jobs out of college I saw A LOT of places that were asking for 3-4 years of experience for shitty entry-level positions. It's extremely frustrating.

 

[Mai72]

Also, companies are reluctant to invest time and energy into a unknown worker. They want someone with experience, so the time it takes to train a new employee is kept to a minimum. They want the new person to jump in and start immediately.

It's a catch 22. You need job experience, but how can you get the experience if companies will not even hire you because you lack the experience that they demand?

*Internship
*Work in a foreign country
*Kiss ass?

 

[poofyhairguy]

Hint: They want to pay you at entry-level rates but use you like a senior. That or use it as an excuse to give the job to the son of the boss's best friend.

FIFY if not in technology.

 

[JManInPhoenix]

Hint: They want to pay you at entry-level rates but use you like a senior. That or use it as an excuse to import a foreign worker who will work for peanuts while living in the employer's shack -- law says they have to advertise for locals first?

I believe that is true. My complex is loaded with south Asian H1B visa workers. It's not like there isn't any programmers, IT, accounting, etc people available locally - they just dont want to pay them 1st world wages.

 

[rudeguy]

Seems that way. I struggled finding a job after I graduated, and the best I could get in a reasonable amount of time was a contract gig with a temp agency. They're not all bad, but a lot of them are huge scumbags. Probably wouldn't deal with one again unless I was desperate.

For sure. But the hope is that the company will like you and want to keep you on.

 

[Mai72]

Interesting times...

Uno

WTF? Wow!! MY father has a 4th grade education, and he has done a lot better then these people with their advanced degrees. D:

Then again, the employment scene 20-30 years ago was much different.

 

[HomerSapien]

From my experience it really is who you know. The postings are more or less a formality / requirement and really used by HR to pre-screen applicants to make it easier on hiring managers.

NPR had a show on HR hiring practices sometime back and half of the CEOs of the companies interviewed couldn't get past their own computerized screening for basic positions.

Its tough, go for all of the networking you can and get all of the certifications you can in the mean time.

Its also great when they want a 4.0 GPA, a PhD, and years of experience in a very specialized area.

 

[purbeast0]

think of it as a blessing - that company is probably a terrible place to work at anyways if they have entry positions like that. at that rate, by the time you have 20 years there you'd be a mid-level employee, and probably making a mid-level salary.

 

[Ns1]

I never let the job requirements stop me from applying.

 

[xanis]

Its tough, go for all of the networking you can and get all of the certifications you can in the mean time.

+1. My dad told me for years, "It's not what you know, it's who you know". I never realized how painfully true that was until I started hunting for jobs.

I never let the job requirements stop me from applying.

Same. You never know what'll happen; you don't lose anything but a few minutes of your time applying anyway.

 

[Imp]

think of it as a blessing - that company is probably a terrible place to work at anyways if they have entry positions like that. at that rate, by the time you have 20 years there you'd be a mid-level employee, and probably making a mid-level salary.

I doubt you'd make it to 10 years, let alone 20 years.

Why not just advertise for 5+ years, entry-level again when your current "entry-level" employee becomes expensive....

 

[sze5003]

Just apply anyway. I've been entry level at my company for 3 years now and last year I've asked for a promotion. I have been doing more and more work every year and since I asked for promotion which is only 10% increase, I've been given even more work.

They always say there needs to be an opening or something so middle managers don't have to justify to upper level why they are promoting anyone.

A lot of times managers don't even understand what you are working on anyway.

 

[Dman8777]

Treat requirements in job postings as preferences, not requirements. I've applied for and gotten several jobs even though I didn't meet their minimum reqs.

 

[Ns1]

Treat requirements in job postings as preferences, not requirements. I've applied for and gotten several jobs even though I didn't meet their minimum reqs.

this.

 

[OCGuy]

As someone who creates requirement outlines/interviews/hires, I have to say you have been given some good info in this thread.

In reality, what means more to me than anything on your entry-level resume, is someone recommending you, and how you handle yourself in the interview.

 

[SketchMaster]

Treat requirements in job postings as preferences, not requirements. I've applied for and gotten several jobs even though I didn't meet their minimum reqs.

this.

Same. I've interviewed for jobs that I wasn't "qualified" for, and then turned them down because the work was boring. I do get filtered out quite a bit because I don't have a college degree, but that's never stopped me from applying anyway.

As someone mentioned, you need to go through a temp/headhunter agency to get a lot of IT jobs these days.

If you find a good agency they will interview you internally to see if you can actually back up your skills, then they tell HR people to jog-on with their ridiculous reqs and get you in front of the managers to work your magic.

If you get a BAD agency you will be worse off than if you tried getting a job on your own. They will just take your resume, cram it into their Word template, then blast it out like an idiot to every company in a 20mi radius. You'll get interviews, but with companies that are hell holes.

 

[mmntech]

I work in the media industry and most entry level jobs require a minimum of 2 years experience. Which nobody straight out of college is going to have. The smart thing to do for perspective media students is skip internships (that aren't for college credit) and go volunteer with a community cable or radio station. That's really the only way you're going to get meaningful experience in this field. Internships aren't long enough.

 

[sze5003]

Sometimes I interviewed with a headhunter agency and some of them actually can interview you with actual questions, other agencies you are talking to some pretty woman in a short dress about crap she doesn't know or understand even after you explain it as easily as you can and all she does is smile and flirt and say wow thats great.

Then they set you up with interviews with companies and when you get there that's not what the company was looking for.

I rather have them find me postings and then have them get me an interview without having to drive and waste my time to interview with the said headhunter.