Moto X (Is Out) [8.01.2013]

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VulgarDisplay

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2009
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Got my cyber Monday Dev edition for Christmas finally. After one day no complaints. Loving this phone and the battery life is simply amazing coming from a droid bionic. Haven't been able to play with everything yet but it is great for me so far.

Feels really good in the hand and pocket.
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
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Funny. My Nexus 4 is running just as fast as the day I got it, if not faster thanks to 4.3. No restores. And this is after a year.

4.3 should help ensure it continues running just fine, so long as you leave storage space available.

Your personal usage must have helped keep it running well until 4.3 became available.


The point of it being "Motorola" phones is simply ignorant, however - it was all Android phones. My Galaxy Nexus (Samsung) exhibited the same issue, even on custom ROMs, unless I completely wiped everything perfectly clean. I hadn't in a long while, but I also knew it, at its fastest, with the terrible display mine had, would still not hold a candle against the speed of even the worst performance to be had from a Moto X. Like, a year from now, as long as storage is fine and you aren't running a billion things in the background all the time and don't have any ridiculously unstable kernels or modifications... this phone should still be cooking.

I've never felt a phone perform like it has when brand new, ever, on Android. Sure, sometimes some speedy transitions, but usually I could induce stutters and other anomalies without much effort. It actually takes a concerted effort to induce such on the Moto X. Heck, even the iPhone 4S I had at work not too long ago seemed to have more performance issues than the Moto X has, thus far.

What is annoying is all the false positives I get on the voice activation. I'll be listening to music in the car or at my desk, and my phone will think it heard me say Ok Google.
Granted, part of the issue might be because I trained it so that when I say "Ok Google", it thinks that is "Ok Google Now". I didn't say Now when I trained it, so it might be too sensitive when factoring in how I say it or something.
 

fbrdphreak

Lifer
Apr 17, 2004
17,556
1
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+1 to the above
My buddy's GS3 gets sluggish at least once a year, a full factory reset brings it almost back to new. Hopefully now that he just got 4.3 it won't happen.

I too get false positives when listening to music. I think I am going to retrain it and see if that helps.

And yes, my Moto X is faster than my wife's iPhone 4s. The UI is more responsive and apps load faster. I get this phone is a lot newer, but it speaks volumes to having the right hardware and software.
 

s44

Diamond Member
Oct 13, 2006
9,427
16
81
Granted, part of the issue might be because I trained it so that when I say "Ok Google", it thinks that is "Ok Google Now". I didn't say Now when I trained it, so it might be too sensitive when factoring in how I say it or something.
Stick to "ok Jarvis"?
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
+1 to the above
My buddy's GS3 gets sluggish at least once a year, a full factory reset brings it almost back to new. Hopefully now that he just got 4.3 it won't happen.

I too get false positives when listening to music. I think I am going to retrain it and see if that helps.

And yes, my Moto X is faster than my wife's iPhone 4s. The UI is more responsive and apps load faster. I get this phone is a lot newer, but it speaks volumes to having the right hardware and software.

Yep. In terms of basic CPU, the Moto X should definitely be faster than the iPhone 4s, but there's a major variable: OS. Apple has minimal hardware differences over the generation, and thoroughly addresses the differences for each OS update. Therefore, they have a better chance of producing an OS which is more efficient on that hardware yet also eeks out all the performance they can.

Google has been a little sluggish to take hold of Android and really get into the details of hardware optimization regardless of hardware, when it can. In other ways, it still has to get more help from the hardware partners. Like Qualcomm produces a custom variant of Dalvik for certain chips of theirs (I think that is on the Moto X, for instance) which enables it to be far superior to generic Dalvik on Android. Which is helpful, considering Qualcomm CPUs do have unique micro-architecture compared to standard ARM designs that most others license direct. Though the field has been changing some - Qualcomm is huge, Apple is now using custom as well, and TI is out of the game. You've got Samsung who will manufacture custom chips (for Apple), but I think their Exynos line is standard ARM (Cortex A15 and A9).


Which is all to say, finally Google is really helping Android get to a level of performance parity with other OSes, and is also doing the little things that, are more about how the phone performance FEELS, as opposed to reality.
They used to blow off the whole forced-smoothness, rather letting homescreen framerate NOT take a priority, and also not even caring about consistent framerate - let it display directly what it can, be it high or low.
Then in recent years, they started doing what they could to ensure things at least looked smooth.
 

s44

Diamond Member
Oct 13, 2006
9,427
16
81
Therefore, they have a better chance of producing an OS which is more efficient on that hardware yet also eeks out all the performance they can.
This may have been true in the past, but I've heard so many people complaining about iOS 7 turning their iPhones to crap that I don't think it applies.

Meanwhile, KitKat finally has a low-spec mode...
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
This may have been true in the past, but I've heard so many people complaining about iOS 7 turning their iPhones to crap that I don't think it applies.

Meanwhile, KitKat finally has a low-spec mode...

True, but that wasn't on all iPhone models, and I don't think I noticed any kind of issues running iOS 7 on the iPhone 4s I had. I did notice people at work, who I think at least one did also have the 4s, did have those issues (battery life) - so it could have just spoken more to the apps I used compared to apps other people used. Especially on my iPhone, I was extremely conservative. Most of my main apps were still on my personal Android phone: I ain't double-dipping in two markets - chief reason, among many, why I won't abandon Android, at least, not yet. Also, Google already knows too much about me - advertising won't be nearly as effective if I abandon their platform. Google Now just keeps getting better and better, especially when combined with the Moto X. I just love it!

Anyway, that's also OS updates in a nutshell. One version might run perfectly well on everything, but something got overlooked or something added ruined the experience for some users in the next version, so the developers have to hurry up and address what is wrong. Code not optimized, major bug in the code leads to a CPU being keyed up for too long, memory leaks... that whole "the latest version is worse for me!" thing will never change, never go away. It won't always pop its head up, it won't always be the same issue or a significant issue, or it might totally ruin the experience.

For Apple, this should happen far less often, since they own and control all the devices (very few, compared to other OS developers) that run their OS. They should have the resources to extensively test new code on every single iDevice they wish to make compatible with said code.
The biggest difference is what apps any given user runs, which is probably where the breakdown actually occurred. Perhaps certain apps were grossly incompatible with certain features of the new kernel or something, which led to some previously great apps creating, for instance, memory leaks when said app is run on a specific hardware platform (say, A5).

I can't crucify Apple for such a thing, as much as I'd like to, as even owning the hardware doesn't mean you control the code 100%. Part of their app-store curating is meant to curtail possible problem apps, but they can't be perfect.

Heck, even on iOS 6, my 4s hard-locked and rebooted or had similar complete failures to respond... probably once a week, maybe less often.


It definitely has to happen far less often though, or Apple deserves to be crucified for that failure. Microsoft gets hammered all the time for minor trivialities, and you can still essentially say they don't produce the hardware or, outside of x86/x64, don't control the hardware at all. They, like Google, do try and incorporate new hardware instruction sets and strongly encourage partners/OEMs to include such hardware - but, there are so many variables, Microsoft cannot possibly test for even single-digit percentages of what their code might run on.
Mostly, the blame does actually lame on drivers for issues deriving from that, but that's not always the case.

heck, sometimes they just get rid of a feature or code, and it takes a long time to establish the replacement. That's sort of what happened with certain Wacom drivers and Windows 8. It wasn't commonly an issue outside of the Surface Pro device, if at all, but the same Wacom hardware and features found on the Surface Pro have definitely been incorporated in other devices. Few other devices, before the Surface Pro, would really be something on which you'd care to run Photoshop and go to town with pen-based drawing or edits, so... it's not the greatest example, oh well.
 
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VulgarDisplay

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2009
6,193
2
76
Battery live is making me very happy. 11h 30m 18% battery left. 4.5 hours screen on time.

This is at work where the WiFi is horrible going in and out and there is spotty cell coverage.
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
Battery live is making me very happy. 11h 30m 18% battery left. 4.5 hours screen on time.

This is at work where the WiFi is horrible going in and out and there is spotty cell coverage.

I keep testing battery life - trying to go all day without charging... and am continually impressed with how long and how much is left.

But every time I keep forgetting to look at the battery stats.

Right now: 14hr on battery, 55% left, screen on time 1hr10m.

I'll pay better attention tomorrow to ensure I don't utilize the dock or charging during the day.

I've been even more impressed, however, considering I'll use the phone for cell streaming music and some local content in my car and at the gym, using bluetooth connections for the music. I also typically have the screen on a lot throughout my time at the gym, both to show what's playing, and to use OneNote to keep track of exercises and weights.

Today wasn't a typical day, I had far less phone in front of my face time.
I've only ever felt the need to charge it mid-day when I'm expecting/hoping to make a late night and not sure what kind of charger access I'll have. I don't want to have to start worrying at the last percentages, and I'm usually a little worried at 20%. Then again, that was my last phone, which I frequently charged throughout the day. It had the OEM extended battery, which was the same 2200mAh as the Moto X. I made use of two of those extended batteries on more than one occasion - which is partly why I so greatly feared a phone without a replaceable battery - I liked having that ability.
It'll be far, far more rare I need that now. It will happen, and I'll have one of those battery packs ready for that (extended training in the middle of nowhere tends to result in very rapid battery consumption - a lot of screen time, and barely any signal.
 
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VulgarDisplay

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2009
6,193
2
76
Coming from my last phone the motox is simply fantastic. Getting roughly 14 hours on the battery with what I consider very heavy usage for me. Lots of web browsing and games. Getting roughly 5 hours of screen on time.
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
Hopefully Europe eats this phone up.

The Moto G getting a GPE version is also a tremendous moment and one of the best decisions, among many great ones, to come out of the new Motorola.

I think Motorola is going to bounce back, in totality, and will go on to be a strong brand.

It would be better if the Moto X had some sturdier materials. I have no idea the true build quality of it, but it would be wonderful if they would make a one-piece metal body augmented with kevlar or sturdy plastic in some areas so as to not interfere with radio transmission and reception.

Granted, that may also be a consistent decision choice of Motorola, both past and present. Their devices have always had among the best, if not the best, radio reception potential - perhaps they think they could not overcome all of the attenuation unless they made some negative design choices.
Not sure. I know the unibody designs usually need some glass or plastic in the right areas, or an exposed antenna design like on the HTC One; while I don't know the full details, I do believe most of those do suffer SOME attenuation.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
30,974
8,693
136
Hopefully Europe eats this phone up.

I hope it becomes more popular as well although I think there's some suspicion of American telecoms companies in some parts of Europe at the moment. Hopefully that wont negatively impact the Moto X's sales.

For me I'd like Moto to put out a proper high end choice. I want a 5 inch screen, a 3000MAH battery, a 64gb storage option, an IRblaster, USB3 support ...

Basically all the bells and whistles, I know a lot of you like smaller screens but theres no denying that big screens are very popular and help sell phones. I just feel that if Moto stepped things up and competed properly at the high end they'd end up selling a lot more. At the moment they are in danger of looking like a budget phone manufacturer.

Edit: 32gb version not available in the UK only the 16gb one. Fail.
 
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fbrdphreak

Lifer
Apr 17, 2004
17,556
1
0
So don't you just want something like a GS4 or Note 3? The Moto X isn't the killer top feature-packed phone, it's an elegant blend of size and usability.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
30,974
8,693
136
So don't you just want something like a GS4 or Note 3? The Moto X isn't the killer top feature-packed phone, it's an elegant blend of size and usability.

Why would it be just something like a GS4? By saying that you are suggesting that the only selling point of the Moto X is it's size.
Why would it be a problem for Moto to make a "killer top feature-packed phone"? Surely that would be a great thing?

Three products would hardly be overkill. Budget Moto G, mid range Moto X and a top end Moto XL or something.
I think they'd pick up more sales that way.
The Moto X is a nice phone but it just misses the target on too many areas for me to consider and I bet a lot of other people are in the same boat.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
30,974
8,693
136
My question is why do you want that when Samsung does it already?

So there should be only one manufacturer for each screen size?

I'm not sure what your argument here is. You seem to be saying that Moto shouldn't make a high end phone because Samsung already do?
Well other manufacturers also already make mid range and budget phones. Should Moto not have bothered with the X and G as well? That seems to follow your logical path.
 

VulgarDisplay

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2009
6,193
2
76
Why would it be just something like a GS4? By saying that you are suggesting that the only selling point of the Moto X is it's size.
Why would it be a problem for Moto to make a "killer top feature-packed phone"? Surely that would be a great thing?

Three products would hardly be overkill. Budget Moto G, mid range Moto X and a top end Moto XL or something.
I think they'd pick up more sales that way.
The Moto X is a nice phone but it just misses the target on too many areas for me to consider and I bet a lot of other people are in the same boat.

I take it you haven't used one?

The moto X is fantastic. Perfect size, materials feel fantastic, build quality seems great, active display is the best feature ever created, and the always listening stuff is also very nice.

As for the battery, with 4-5 hours of on screen heavy use my battery is lasting 14 hours on average. That is amazing if you ask me.
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
So there should be only one manufacturer for each screen size?

I'm not sure what your argument here is. You seem to be saying that Moto shouldn't make a high end phone because Samsung already do?
Well other manufacturers also already make mid range and budget phones. Should Moto not have bothered with the X and G as well? That seems to follow your logical path.

This is the problem: you don't see the Moto X as Moto's high-end phone.

However, so far, it seems that Moto intends the Moto X to be their top brand.
Does it have as many glamorous of features compared to the other top-end phones? No. Does it have features other high-end phones do not have, and give them a run for their money spec-wise? Yes.


But don't forget - the new Motorola is young. They can only get so many new products out of the product pipeline so fast. Remember, it usually takes roughly 2 years for products go from initial prototype design and spec list to final product ready to ship. You don't put 10 products through the pipeline at the same time and plan on releasing them all at the same time. And the Moto X was the first out of the gate, because Motorola wanted the public to see a quality, premium phone from the brand before it saw anything else. And then a budget phone to dip into that market was the next logical move.

Motorola could very well be planning a few things. I expect new phones next year, either a third phone to complement the lineup as you suggest, or, more likely, a Moto X-2 or Xs (which would be a phenomenal name! The Moto Excess (Xs) That would demand being overstuffed with neat features.

The other thing about features though: Motorola is definitely playing the "careful manufacturer" card. They want to showcase Android in the right light, and don't want to go about adding too many things on top of the stock ROM. That's part of the charm of the Moto X. So very few software additions, but what they added was perfect in utility (potential). There isn't much carrier bloat either, though I do think Verizon may have managed to add more software than Motorola. lol

I think the next most obvious market will be redoubling their efforts on the various tablet sizes. Motorola and Tablets have not seen a particularly strong market success.
What is necessary is the one-brand, global approach like they are attempting for phones (as opposed to mainly focusing on their Verizon partnership, which has kept them alive since they sell a lot of phones on Verizon, but far from the world market penetration both Google and Motorola desire).
I suspect they will have a 7", 9", or 10" tablet sometime within the next year.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
30,974
8,693
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I take it you haven't used one?

The moto X is fantastic. Perfect size, materials feel fantastic, build quality seems great, active display is the best feature ever created, and the always listening stuff is also very nice.

As for the battery, with 4-5 hours of on screen heavy use my battery is lasting 14 hours on average. That is amazing if you ask me.

Perfect size is purely subjective. It may be perfect for you but I want a bigger one. I'm not sure how them making a bigger phone would negatively impact your experience with the X. All the other stuff you mention wouldn't need to change.

14 hours is good but would you complain about more?
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
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Perfect size is purely subjective. It may be perfect for you but I want a bigger one. I'm not sure how them making a bigger phone would negatively impact your experience with the X. All the other stuff you mention wouldn't need to change.

14 hours is good but would you complain about more?

I would complain, if it meant only one phone option for the category of premium phone from Motorola.

It's size, weight, and overall feel - not to forget about performance - is basically perfect.

What if the plans are for only maintaining a global two-phone lineup? A low-end and a premium phone. I wouldn't want the premium phone to be a monstrous brick.
And I, more than anything, want Motorola to focus on having a quality portfolio of hardware that affords them to give Apple-level attention to detail on each product. I don't want them to cheapen their lineup by offering a billion variations of their main phone - and I think the streamlined, quality lineup is what Google and the new management at Motorola is really pushing for. It'll allow for a more profitable company with a better relationship with their customers, as opposed to one focused on carriers like previously.

That said, perhaps they plan to, or at least have the capability, to offer a Moto XL (that's not following HTC's naming convention, at all!), or perhaps a Moto X6 for 6" face, or a Moto X+. Perhaps better would be to have a completely separate brand for the tabphone size. If they plan to have a certain naming convention for phones, and a naming convention dedicated to tablets, that would be something.

I don't want to see a Samsung approach, however. I'm not an investor, but I want good brands and tech and companies to succeed, and I don't want Motorola to risk going overboard. A carefully curated product lineup has the most potential for success. It helps on the accessories front to have fewer different devices and makes it easier to plan product refreshes: X-2, G-2, or whatever they plan to do for new models. I sincerely hope they are making brands to last, simple ones at that. Razr M, Razr HD, Razr Maax and etc, I found those stale - and too reminiscent of Motorola's dependence on Verizon. More importantly, it keeps the brand on the mind of the consumer, which is incredibly important.

And if they can make a decent market penetration, word of mouth and joy of use of the current products, and first-hand experience of internal hardware quality (reception quality and voice activation/active display), this first round could fuel some incredible success if Motorola gets products to worldwide destinations much faster next time around and really markets the hell out of the phones.

Ease of finding a wide-array of unique accessories that work with your phone, however, really demand careful attention to the accessory industry, which in turn means being careful with phone designs to ensure compatibility between refreshes (if desired, it helps but is not required), or, better yet, simply have enough market penetration that accessory makers see the obvious potential.


Samsung has a billion devices, sure... but quality is not on the Motorola level. Whether Samsung could achieve that by being a little more reserved in the product lineup expansion, is anyone's guess. I think Samsung is just Samsung, in that hardware and build quality are not currently on their list of true concerns for much of the markets they are in. They make some decent and reliable equipment at the high-end of each category, but they're biggest focus, more than anything else, has simply been to reach more and more markets, with more and more products. Every now and then they produce a gem compared to other available offerings, but that isn't always saying much either. They aren't low-end - I could never argue that, unless it's specifically a budget, low-end device. They make "solid" products - just, in almost every category, there are usually better manufacturers (not comparing a Samsung device to an Oppo device - rather, Sony, Panasonic, Philips, LG, etc) that have a far more "premium" product.

I digress, but I figured someone would make a point of Samsung's mobile product lineup. I'm having none of that.


In the end, Motorola will probably release a tabphone-sized product. They'll either call it a small tablet or a phone, and give it cellular voice capability. It is an important market category that they shouldn't miss out on.
For me, it was incredibly refreshing to see a premium phone release at a size smaller than basically all other premium phones - which is one of many reasons that led me to buy it. But I do recognize it's a market that is seeing a ton of interest.
 

Joe1987

Senior member
Jul 20, 2013
482
0
0
I swapped a iP5 for a Moto X (and made them give me some $ too) Have been using it this week, and I'm not impressed.

Today it died after 7 hours of use - I do use my phone heavily, about 4 of those hours were streaming Pandora, the camera just flat sucks, the voice recognition is essentially useless to me. It's also the poorest quality audio when I use it for streaming, and I'm not particularly fussy about audio quality.

I can tweak it for better battery life, but the audio quality clenched it for me, moving on to something else.

I'd really like to see Google/Moto make a decent phone that I could put on Verizon's network. Damn Verizon to heck.
 
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WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
30,974
8,693
136
I would complain, if it meant only one phone option for the category of premium phone from Motorola.

I'm not sure if you're not saying that because you don't want there to be a better Moto phone than the X or you think I'm advocating scrapping the X?

It's size, weight, and overall feel - not to forget about performance - is basically perfect.

Not for me it isn't.

What if the plans are for only maintaining a global two-phone lineup? A low-end and a premium phone. I wouldn't want the premium phone to be a monstrous brick.

I really don't think that there would be much more effort needed to support a phone with just a larger screen, bigger storage and a few other tweaks. And it's just not quite there for me yet to call it premium.


Ease of finding a wide-array of unique accessories that work with your phone, however, really demand careful attention to the accessory industry, which in turn means being careful with phone designs to ensure compatibility between refreshes (if desired, it helps but is not required), or, better yet, simply have enough market penetration that accessory makers see the obvious potential.

You don't need a massive amount of sales to get a bunch of cases made. If you mean docks and the like I'd rather they concentrated on device independent versions.

Edit:accidentally the end bit
 
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destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
I'm not sure if you're not saying that because you don't want there to be a better Moto phone than the X or you think I'm advocating scrapping the X?

You previously defined a larger screen as better. I wouldn't want Motorola replacing the Moto X with a larger phone, if they do not intend to maintain more than two phones. If it's larger, it's no longer the device I want. Of the premium phone segment, there aren't that many anymore than ARE this size. This is an important market segment - not everyone wants to hold a small paperback to their ears.

Now, if they want to make a third phone, I absolutely do NOT want that phone to be better than the Moto X. If anything, make it the exact same thing but with a larger screen. MAYBE, just maybe, a better GPU to drive a higher resolution display.

Likely, any large model in the near future would likely be newer hardware, and what is hopefully the next standard-size Moto X will need to have that same hardware as well.

The Moto X is their premium phone - it was originally marketed as such, and is their baby. I want that focus and drive on the premium phone I want - if they make the largest phone the premium phone and the current Moto X size the second-level, and Moto G size the low-end... I indeed won't be happy.


Why would you want the larger model to be better than the Moto X?
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
30,974
8,693
136
You previously defined a larger screen as better.

I'm not sure I did. I did say that I want a bigger screen and that's better for me and many other people.

I wouldn't want Motorola replacing the Moto X with a larger phone, if they do not intend to maintain more than two phones. If it's larger, it's no longer the device I want. Of the premium phone segment, there aren't that many anymore than ARE this size. This is an important market segment - not everyone wants to hold a small paperback to their ears.

No one has suggested getting rid of the X. I have no idea why you think Moto can't support more than 2 phones.

Now, if they want to make a third phone, I absolutely do NOT want that phone to be better than the Moto X. If anything, make it the exact same thing but with a larger screen. MAYBE, just maybe, a better GPU to drive a higher resolution display.

In most people's eyes that would be a better phone.

The Moto X is their premium phone - it was originally marketed as such, and is their baby. I want that focus and drive on the premium phone I want - if they make the largest phone the premium phone and the current Moto X size the second-level, and Moto G size the low-end... I indeed won't be happy.

Software aside, the X isn't that premium at all. You can't expect them to artificially hold back their phones so as to not supersede yours AND expect them to become a success in the market.

Why would you want the larger model to be better than the Moto X?

Because the X is fairly lacklustre on a variety of hardware points and I want something better.
 
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