Mp3 Frequencies....

[LASTGUY2GETPS2]

I don't know how to ask this so i'll do my best. The apple ipod headphones offer a frequency range from 20hz to 20,000hz i think. Now, if I were to buy a more expensive pair of headphones that play up to 40,000hz (A-900's) i wouldn't hear a difference would I? I mean the MP3 compresses the sound frequencies together right?

 

[Cerb]

You might hear a difference, as such specs are CRAP.
All will show 15 or 20Hz to ~20kHz. They pulled these numbers out fo their asses. After follwing advice even for $20-$40 cans, check out Headroom's buying guide.

MP3 can take low and high frequencies. Any compression be it low pass and high pass filters, lower/higher volume for better use of space, or DRC, is all form the encoder, not the format.

:heart:KSC50 & KSC35

 

[LASTGUY2GETPS2]

Okay! Thanks. That answers it perfectly.

 

[zephyrprime]

At 128kbps, all frequencies above 10K are cut off in an MP3.

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: zephyrprime
At 128kbps, all frequencies above 10K are cut off in an MP3.

Cite?
IIRC, LAME cuts it to just under 16kHz for 128kbps.

 

[Pariah]

The limit of adult hearing is typically between 15-20kHz, so no, you would not hear a difference regardless of the capabilities of any of the hardware or the encoding characteristics unless you had the ears of a cat (up to 60kHz).

 

[SickBeast]

Good headphones are a must w/ the ipod. I would go with some EC3's for convenience sake. Headphones are a tough purchase; you really need to know what you want.

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: Pariah
The limit of adult hearing is typically between 15-20kHz, so no, you would not hear a difference regardless of the capabilities of any of the hardware or the encoding characteristics unless you had the ears of a cat (up to 60kHz).

OTOH, there are people that can hear above 20kHz. Music, however, is very different from single tones. You could hear up 40kHz, but there would be very little in 99.9% of music that could be picked out over about 17kHz, and for the most part, very little that matters above 19kHz (usually low passes near 16k and 17k are near indistignuishable from the original, even when there's content you can hear above that, as our brains rock hard at error correction--unfortunately I can't seem to google it right now, though ).

 

[Pariah]

Google "frequency limits of human hearing." Every link stated the limit at 20kHz (or lower) for adults. There is no differentiation of how the tone is generated, but since we basically never listen to flat electronic tone generations, I highly doubt that's what the limit refers to. Again this is the typical limit for human adults. As with every human characteristic there are a few freaks of nature that exceed those averages, but the odds are highly against you being one of them.

 

[Cerb]

The limit is for pure tones, and is approximate. I can hear at least to 21.5kHz (next time I need a hearing test, I'll see if I can have them test higher). Since we do not hear in pure tones most of the time (white noise from electronics and and motors are an exception), but in the change of various tones, and cominations of them (one reason the same note sound different from different instruments). There are cases where things in higher frequencies can be heard. I can't recall the term now, though (what we hear is the lower-frequencies, but the high frequency's effect on the waveform does some stuff--I need to read up more ).

Where and how you grow up makes a significant difference. Many people from cities lack anything above 15k or so by their mid-twenties, simply due to excessive damage. However, much like the low-pass comment, aside from pure tones, it is often not noticed, as the brain knows what certain things should sound like.

 

[0roo0roo]

heh those headphone/speaker freq range are junk. sure it can go that low or high, whether its audible at any volume is another matter decent mp3 encoding <192kbs+ have enough quality that lower/medium end headphones are the limiting factor, not the source. eh headfi.org and headphone.com have more and tests. err that might be head-fi.org.. i forget. easy google.

 

[Sheriff]

Brightness of Harmonics are lost and a difference can be heard between MP3 files @ 128vs 192 or variable thereof with decents speakers and hearing

 

[metalmania]

Man has to be a vampire bat to hear sound over 20KHz.

 

[LASTGUY2GETPS2]

Well what I don't understand is why allow something to be encoded or recorded for that matter above 20,000hz if we can't even hear it?

 

[Dman877]

For your cat's entertainment?

 

[LASTGUY2GETPS2]

lol

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: metalmania
Man has to be a vampire bat to hear sound over 20KHz.

No, just a geeky hermit not exposed to loud noises all the time.

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: LASTGUY2GETPS2
Well what I don't understand is why allow something to be encoded or recorded for that matter above 20,000hz if we can't even hear it?

1. There are oddities in the waveform we can hear, if only occuring rarely.
2. Archiving. Why not use something of higher quality than you need, provided it isn't too expensive?

 

[LASTGUY2GETPS2]

Originally posted by: Cerb

Originally posted by: LASTGUY2GETPS2
Well what I don't understand is why allow something to be encoded or recorded for that matter above 20,000hz if we can't even hear it?

1. There are oddities in the waveform we can hear, if only occuring rarely.
2. Archiving. Why not use something of higher quality than you need, provided it isn't too expensive?

I was under the impression that the bitrate determines the quality?

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: LASTGUY2GETPS2

Originally posted by: Cerb

Originally posted by: LASTGUY2GETPS2
Well what I don't understand is why allow something to be encoded or recorded for that matter above 20,000hz if we can't even hear it?

1. There are oddities in the waveform we can hear, if only occuring rarely.
2. Archiving. Why not use something of higher quality than you need, provided it isn't too expensive?

I was under the impression that the bitrate determines the quality?

And bit-depth for PCM.
However, you have recording X. It's on tape. Tape degrades. You make a 192kHz/24-bit copy: you'll have hiss and static way up to the limit (~100kHz?). However, you've got a copy that will not degrade in quality (it can be copied perfectly), and if mastered right, will be perfect to human ears. Fifty years later, you might be able to clean it up even more--but what if some of those patterns to clean it up can take tape hiss and such that are super-sonic? If you use a CD (22.5kHz), you miss out. Lastly, with digital media of all kinds being as cheap as it is, there's not really a good reason to NOT get all of it.

 

[LASTGUY2GETPS2]

I hear ya! Thanks

 

[zephyrprime]

Originally posted by: Cerb

Originally posted by: zephyrprime
At 128kbps, all frequencies above 10K are cut off in an MP3.

Cite?
IIRC, LAME cuts it to just under 16kHz for 128kbps.

Text The confusion is due to whether or not VBR or CBR is used apparently.

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: zephyrprime

Originally posted by: Cerb

Originally posted by: zephyrprime
At 128kbps, all frequencies above 10K are cut off in an MP3.

Cite?
IIRC, LAME cuts it to just under 16kHz for 128kbps.

Text The confusion is due to whether or not VBR or CBR is used apparently.

Times out. I can only get to text, in which there is no useful documentation of encoder settings.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Originally posted by: zephyrprime
At 128kbps, all frequencies above 10K are cut off in an MP3.

That sounds about right. Most of the MP3's that I've heard, that have high freqs or some other interesting musical waveforms, sound like they are being played underwater.

I can't stand MP3 at all, even at high bitrates. Pure CD-DA for me, and hold the side order of compression, please.

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry

Originally posted by: zephyrprime
At 128kbps, all frequencies above 10K are cut off in an MP3.

That sounds about right. Most of the MP3's that I've heard, that have high freqs or some other interesting musical waveforms, sound like they are being played underwater.

I can't stand MP3 at all, even at high bitrates. Pure CD-DA for me, and hold the side order of compression, please.

Did you make any of them? I stopped P2P music not because of the RIAA, but because people don't know what they are doing, and it takes too much time and effort to get a decent rip and encoding of a song--I may as well take the chance and buy the CD for the hours it takes. I'd be suprised if you could ABX a decent rip (EAC secure mode) and LAME encode (3.90.3 or 3.96, --alt-preset standard).