MSI Cubi video review posted

[Kaido]

$149 Broadwell Celeron barebones version review:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Bh8UxdodUY

4K Video playback:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NkucKBHjJO8

PLEX server transcoding:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBCimWidUZM

Highlights:

* Takes an mSATA (currently up to 1TB) & DDR3L RAM (2 slots, 8GB max)
* Optional 2.5" base (with a crappy connector), although you can't boot from it natively
* Step up from the previous-gen Haswell mini PC's
* Can handle the Dolphin Gamecube emulator at full speed
* Does well for HTPC purposes (Bluray MKV streaming, HD Home Run, 4K playback)
* Can handle HD transcoding in PLEX Server to a single source (maxes out CPU, but works!)

This looks like a beast...I think this is the Mini HTPC I've been looking for!

 

[386DX]

Personally I like the design of the Cubi. There's a few issues that irk me that are not necessarily MSI's fault. 4K YouTube playback is fine as it uses Google's VP9 codec and all Broadwell graphics support that. However the other prevailing 4k codec .265 is only available on the i3 model for hybrid acceleration which means the affordable Pentium and Celeron won't be able to play back most 4K content. This is frustrating as even the tablet base CherryTrail supports .265 decoding.

Regarding the Plex encoding it's like this person has never used Plex encoding before. Plex by default always uses 100% CPU when it transcodes regardless of what CPU you have. It transcodes a 5 min segment as fast as it can then throttles and repeats. To properly see how fast it's encoding you need to look at the log file it'll tell you you're transcoding at X.Y of real time. From that you can figure out how many streams the CPU can handle at once.

 

[Kaido]

Personally I like the design of the Cubi. There's a few issues that irk me that are not necessarily MSI's fault. 4K YouTube playback is fine as it uses Google's VP9 codec and all Broadwell graphics support that. However the other prevailing 4k codec .265 is only available on the i3 model for hybrid acceleration which means the affordable Pentium and Celeron won't be able to play back most 4K content. This is frustrating as even the tablet base CherryTrail supports .265 decoding.

Regarding the Plex encoding it's like this person has never used Plex encoding before. Plex by default always uses 100% CPU when it transcodes regardless of what CPU you have. It transcodes a 5 min segment as fast as it can then throttles and repeats. To properly see how fast it's encoding you need to look at the log file it'll tell you you're transcoding at X.Y of real time. From that you can figure out how many streams the CPU can handle at once.

Oh, nice trick! I just barely got my Plex Server setup at home again, been awhile. Works amazing with Plex Pass streaming it outside of my network :thumbsup:

Aside from DIY encoding, is there anything commercially that comes down the pipe in .265 format? Sounds like it might be better to wait & see how the Cherrytrail hardware works, for maximum compatibility.

 

[386DX]

Everything coming down the pipe will be H.265/HEVC format. Google was pushing it's competing standard VP9 (celeron and Pentium support this) but ultimately lost out to H.265/HEVC which is the successor to today's common H.264. Google's 4K videos on YouTube are the only real known users of the VP9 codec while 4K Blu-Ray has pucked H.265 as the codec of choice. Netflix has done the same and so have device manufacturer's as all 4K capable phones record in H.264 or H.265 codec and not Google's VP9. It's why the Celeron and Pentium Cubi makes me sad as it's nearly perfect except for the lack of H.265 makes it a capable device now but not in the near future.

 

[Kaido]

Everything coming down the pipe will be H.265/HEVC format. Google was pushing it's competing standard VP9 (celeron and Pentium support this) but ultimately lost out to H.265/HEVC which is the successor to today's common H.264. Google's 4K videos on YouTube are the only real known users of the VP9 codec while 4K Blu-Ray has pucked H.265 as the codec of choice. Netflix has done the same and so have device manufacturer's as all 4K capable phones record in H.264 or H.265 codec and not Google's VP9. It's why the Celeron and Pentium Cubi makes me sad as it's nearly perfect except for the lack of H.265 makes it a capable device now but not in the near future.

So pretty much get the i3 version or wait for Cherrytrail?

 

[VirtualLarry]

Newegg has a nice promo page up about the Cubi:
http://promotions.newegg.com/msi/15-1486/index.html?icid=313636

I like it, on the whole. Especially that you can optionally use a 2.5" SSD or not.

That said, I'm not sure what's up with not being able to boot off of the 2.5" SSD. That's a show-stopper right there for me. I hope that limitation is fixable with a BIOS rev or something.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Has anyone from AT forums purchased one of these? Can you confirm or deny what LonOnTech said in his video review about the Cubi, that you cannot boot off of the 2.5" drive?

Edit: See this post from the CPU forum. Broadwell 3825U has 2C/4T! But the Pentium in the Cubi is a 3805U, I think. I wonder if they are going to release another model, with the faster 4T Pentium chip in the future?

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37421963&postcount=1166

 

[386DX]

I have one ordered should have it this week. Will test the booting from 2.5 " drive.

 

[386DX]

My Celeron Cubi arrived today. I updated the BIOS from 120 to 130 immediately and I can confirm the video is incorrect you can certainly boot from the 2.5" drive. In fact the 2.5" drive is SATA1 port in the BIOS and the mSATA is SATA2 port. I do admit the first time the drive didn't show up but after taking it apart it ended up being the cable got knocked loose so be extra careful putting the case back together. Speaking of the case it's a pain in the a-hole to get the bottom plate aligned and snug. You essentially have to get the metal lip of the bottom plate between the metal lip of the case and the outer plastic case if not you'll get a gap. Besides that issue the unit looks nice and a bit heavier then it looks. The BIOS also has a Windows 8 mode which basically sets it to use UEFI boot (the default) turn it off if you're installing other OS.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I updated the BIOS from 120 to 130 immediately and I can confirm the video is incorrect you can certainly boot from the 2.5" drive.

Excellent, thank you!

I think I will be getting one or maybe more of these next month.

Edit: The next thing I wonder about is, MSI claims that they support 8GB max, but for the CPU in the unit, Intel's specs list a max of 16GB. So I'm really wondering if it would be possible to put two 8GB DDR3L sticks in both slots for 16GB total. (Unless there is some sort of arbitrary BIOS limitation.)

 

[Kaido]

My Celeron Cubi arrived today. I updated the BIOS from 120 to 130 immediately and I can confirm the video is incorrect you can certainly boot from the 2.5" drive. In fact the 2.5" drive is SATA1 port in the BIOS and the mSATA is SATA2 port. I do admit the first time the drive didn't show up but after taking it apart it ended up being the cable got knocked loose so be extra careful putting the case back together. Speaking of the case it's a pain in the a-hole to get the bottom plate aligned and snug. You essentially have to get the metal lip of the bottom plate between the metal lip of the case and the outer plastic case if not you'll get a gap. Besides that issue the unit looks nice and a bit heavier then it looks. The BIOS also has a Windows 8 mode which basically sets it to use UEFI boot (the default) turn it off if you're installing other OS.

Does the kit come with the base plate for the 2.5" in the box, or is that an item you have to purchase separately?

 

[VirtualLarry]

Does the kit come with the base plate for the 2.5" in the box, or is that an item you have to purchase separately?

The Newegg promotional page that I linked, above, and the Newegg product pictures all suggest that the 2.5" drive base plate is included in the package.

I do have one more question, does the Cubi's BIOS support the ATA password feature? I would like to use mSATA or SATA 2.5" SSDs with built-in encryption, but those generally require the BIOS to support ATA passwords. I recall reading something about the Intel Broadwell-based NUC units, that they DO support this. Was wondering if Cubi was likewise, or not? This could be an important feature for business customers, especially ones that might take a mini-PC like this traveling with them to hotel / conference rooms.

 

[sm625]

Is there a DOTA 2 benchmark for that processor?

 

[386DX]

The 2.5" expander, cable and screws all come with the kit. As well as the Vesa mount and screws.

Regarding the BIOS the MSI site had a 840 version that showed up when you selected win 8 instead of 7. I flashed it and besides the number difference I didn't notice any changes. For the ATA password I there wasn't a setting for that but that could be the particular model I got (celeron) as this model doesn't have a TPM. The i3 version that supports vPro should have a TPM and possibly the password feature as they usually go hand in hand. One other thing I'd like to mention is I swear I remember seeing the cubi advertised with an Intel NIC however this model has a realtek. Not a big deal for my use but if someone was going to build a small server etc it may matter. This might be another feature only available on the i3 and higher models. Lastly for the RAM I can't say if it'll support 8GB so-dimms but there's no technical reason it shouldn't, I only had a pair of 4GB to test.

BTW I put Windows 10 technical preview on it and so far everything runs good. I haven't had a chance to test any games but I'll try to do a DOTA2 when I get the chance.

 

[VirtualLarry]

ATA password support shouldn't depend on a TPM being present, and which NIC are you saying isn't made by Intel? Newegg advertises the wifi/BT NIC as Intel, I don't know about the ethernet.

 

[386DX]

I know that a TPM isn't required for ATA password, I'm saying that there isn't an option in the BIOS for ATA password or even any TPM/vPro settings with the Celeron version that I have. Since the BIOS does seem to "hide" options.. for example when you aren't in Windows 8 mode you don't see secure boot options or UEFI options there's a good chance the Core i3/i5 version would open the vPro/ATA password settings as the MSI website specifically mentions hard drive encryption under the vPro feature.

Of course the MSI website appears to be wrong as now I look at it that's where I originally saw the Gigabit LAN port as an Intel when in fact it's a Realtek. The website has Intel 3160 listed as LAN (RJ45) but that's actually the AC WiFi. That's another thing I should mention the 2.4 GHz seems weaker then the 5GHz as in almost all location the 5GHz signal seems stronger.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Hmm, so it's possible that the i3 includes ATA password support? I don't really want a TPM.

I'm now thinking of getting a Cubi, but I'm having trouble deciding which model to get. Initially, I was going to just get the cheapest 1.5Ghz Celeron model, but then I was thinking, it's not a huge premium for the 1.9Ghz Pentium model, it's almost but not quite a 1:1 ratio of performance increase for price increase, so it seemed worth it to spring for the Pentium model. But now, with what you say about the i3 model possibly having support for the ATA password, it could be worth it to me to get that model. But that's another $80 premium over the 1.9Ghz Pentium model, and the i3 is only 2.0Ghz.

Edit: Looking at MSI's site, they now have an i5 model Cubi unit, but Newegg doesn't carry that one yet. And the i3 unit, the CPU used in it, on Intel's ARK site, it lists "vPro: NO", So the i3 model does not have vPro. I also noticed that the "tray price" between the i3 and i5 isn't very much. I would possibly be interested in the i5 model, depending on retail price. Both the i3 and i5 models support AVX 2.0 according to ARK, which would be useful to do distributed computing on this little thing. (Hopefully, it can handle the heat output.)

Edit: It appears that Newegg's listing is wrong, or MSI corrected their info - all of their Cubi models now list 16GB Max under specs. Matching Intel's ARK specs for the various CPUs used.

 

[taylorwmj]

My Celeron Cubi arrived today. I updated the BIOS from 120 to 130 immediately and I can confirm the video is incorrect you can certainly boot from the 2.5" drive. In fact the 2.5" drive is SATA1 port in the BIOS and the mSATA is SATA2 port. I do admit the first time the drive didn't show up but after taking it apart it ended up being the cable got knocked loose so be extra careful putting the case back together. Speaking of the case it's a pain in the a-hole to get the bottom plate aligned and snug. You essentially have to get the metal lip of the bottom plate between the metal lip of the case and the outer plastic case if not you'll get a gap. Besides that issue the unit looks nice and a bit heavier then it looks. The BIOS also has a Windows 8 mode which basically sets it to use UEFI boot (the default) turn it off if you're installing other OS.

How were you able to access the BIOS? I have 2 different Cubi's that I purchased from Amazon (1 with the Celeron, the other w/the Pentium). Having placed DDR3L RAM in either slot in both, as well as inserting a 60GB Kingston mSATA drive, upon starting either Cubi up, I can't seem to post. On both of my monitors connected via HDMI or DisplayPort (DisplayPort to DVI adapter used) I see no flash of anything on screen such as an MSI logo or even a flashing cursor. Both monitors (different brands) see no signal in each case.

I've even tried spamming the DELETE key to modify the boot order and had no luck. What memory are you using (I'm thinking that may be an issue for me) and how were you able to get to the BIOS? Thanks

 

[386DX]

How were you able to access the BIOS? I have 2 different Cubi's that I purchased from Amazon (1 with the Celeron, the other w/the Pentium). Having placed DDR3L RAM in either slot in both, as well as inserting a 60GB Kingston mSATA drive, upon starting either Cubi up, I can't seem to post. On both of my monitors connected via HDMI or DisplayPort (DisplayPort to DVI adapter used) I see no flash of anything on screen such as an MSI logo or even a flashing cursor. Both monitors (different brands) see no signal in each case.

I've even tried spamming the DELETE key to modify the boot order and had no luck. What memory are you using (I'm thinking that may be an issue for me) and how were you able to get to the BIOS? Thanks

It certainly is the DELETE key to get into BIOS, if there's no boot device I think it goes directly into the BIOS without any button press or that's how my unit behaved on first boot with no OS. I would check your memory. I'm using some DDR3L that I picked up off kijiji for cheap. They are 2x4GB Lenovo brand with Samsung chips. They are marked 4GB 1Rx8 PC3L -12800S-11-13-B4. I'd check your RAM modules and make sure you don't have any 2R modules.

 

[MSi Cubi]

Hi guyz
I just purchased cubi celeron .. must say cpu is quite crap..
always runs at 100% ..
Does anybody know what celeron version supports RAM 1600 ? or just 1333 ?

Can I flash BIOS to 850 from 1.4 ?

Thnx

 

[Kaido]

Hi guyz
I just purchased cubi celeron .. must say cpu is quite crap..
always runs at 100% ..
Does anybody know what celeron version supports RAM 1600 ? or just 1333 ?

Can I flash BIOS to 850 from 1.4 ?

Thnx

Yeah, Celerons are the lowest-end CPU you can get (eh, next to an Atom). Doing pretty much anything on them pegs the CPU at 100%. What is the model number of the one you got?

 

[MSi Cubi]

Yeah, Celerons are the lowest-end CPU you can get (eh, next to an Atom). Doing pretty much anything on them pegs the CPU at 100%. What is the model number of the one you got?

It is 008BEU..
I purchased it for £109
SSD 128GB SK-Hynix cost me £35
2x4GB SK-Hynix PC3L-14900 1867 MHz RAMs cost me £28
Total £172
I updated BIOS to 8.5 thought RAMs will start running at at least 1600 MHz but no crap..
Youtube is stuttering opening chrome is delaying web pages stuttering .. bad !

I purchased it only because i had to replace win tablet acer iconia w700p (year 2013) with Core i5 3337U as micro hdmi port gone .. no signal to tv
This tablet is 5x better than this mini pc and it is 3 years old..