My dad found out I'm agnostic

[atybimf]

Originally posted by: lupi
Hope you're doing good in school cause ya only got three years till you're looking at the backside of the door.

I do. My mom supports my decision however, so I'm not totally screwed.

 

[ghostman]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb

That statement is more foolish than what doke said. You just pulled it out of thin air with absolutely no evidence, then concluded it by assuming it's a statement of fact. Perhaps that is your observation. But let me ask you... how many agnostics and atheists do you really know? And how many are lesser members of society than your "people of faith"? Perhaps you consider someone is a "better member of society" when they donate to your church or take part in your Sunday School bake sales.

You are all proving his point about people of faith being kinder, etc. Funny, the only posts responding to his claims are people insulting him for saying exactly what they are doing.

I disagree. My statement was responding to their statements. I consider their individual statements to be foolish and I'd like him to justify such a broad claim, but I don't insult their beliefs nor do I assume I'm better than religious folks. I actually would like to hear about these statistics (that do not come from a Christian-funded source). I'm curious whether it's based on actual data (which I doubt), or his personal opinion/observation. If you live in a religious community and all your neighbors attend the same church, do you assume that the family down the road who does not participate in church-funded activities to be lesser members of society? For example, I refuse to donate money to a church-based charity, but I volunteer every week to teach English at the youth center several miles away. The members of the two churches on either side of my block would never know that.

I know one Catholic who shoplifts from American Eagle. I know another who impregnated his 6 month girlfriend. I know another who had a child out of wedlock. I know zero agnostics/atheists in those situations. Based on my personal observation and everything I hear on the news, I should be assuming that religious folks are either hypocritical, lesser members of society, etc. But I don't make such a foolish generalization.

 

[Brentx]

I went through the same exact issues with my parents, especially my dad.

I was around 13ish when I started questioning my beliefs, and I was about 15 when I had completely dropped them. I would now consider myself an Atheist for 4 years now, as I am 19, and I am still interested in the subject of faith and why humans latch on to religion, when rationally, most of these things are not possible in the physical world.

Now that I am in college, its a very accepted thing, but when I come back to family, especially my parents and grandma, its more of an off limits conversation. I just had dinner the other day with my parents, and for the first time in 4 years since I told them, they actually sat down and had a rational conversation with me. Now they know that I am just not listening to what others tell me, which is what they had thought for some reason, but am actually questioning what is going on around me. They at least accept that, and I think they would much rather have me questioning than being a blind follower, hell, they told me that.

I took some philosophy courses in religion this semester, and man, I have more and more questions than I ever have because of them, but one thing has not changed, I am still an Atheist. These classes seem to reaffirm my atheism.

But all in all, you really need to have a good conversation with your dad. Sit him down at dinner, and tell him of your beliefs and why you changed. That is the best thing to do. I know if I tried to pretend that I was religious to my parents I would have gone crazy a couple years ago. I just can't lie to them about something like religion, and I don't think you should either.

 

[xSauronx]

Originally posted by: Luthien
Or... Your dad can send you to Jesus Camp for reconditioning. LOL

Jesus Camp Trailer

ugh

my parents sent me on a couple of 3-day youth things like that, very.....i hated it. i cant remember most of it because it was a while ago (8 years maybe? more?) and i pretty well blocked most of it from memory, but i hated it.

Acquire the Fire

a guy i went to highschool with volunteered to go, the first year i finall didnt *have* to. i warned against it; he was hoping to bang a cute chick who was going

i cant recall seeing someone so disappointed as he was on the day he got back

 

[Luthien]

Yeah Jesus Camp is just an example of our own hipocracy in the USA saying the muslims are brainwashing their children. Watch how in Jesus Camp the movie the convert this child to christ.

Coerced Conversion Let The Brainwashing Begin

One man?s eloquent assessment of the movie Jesus Camp.

Crazy Yelling Jesus Chick

 

[Luthien]

Yeah Jesus Camp is just an example of our own hipocracy in the USA saying the muslims are brainwashing their children. Watch how in Jesus Camp the movie the convert this child to christ.

Coerced Conversion Let The Brainwashing Begin


Oops double post.

 

[iamaelephant]

Tell your dad to go f*ck himself.

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: iamaelephant
Tell your dad to go f*ck himself.

idiot.

 

[ViviTheMage]

haha religion

 

[1prophet]

I do not have proof to give that God created man.


But surely one cannot deny that He did indeed create women.


Safe for work, link at bottom, unzips to 135 mb, mpg format.

 

[daniel1113]

Originally posted by: Astaroth33
He could pretend to be a good little Catholic, but that would neither be true to himself nor to his family, and nor to God (if there is a God).

Sounds like 97.5% of the catholics that I know... he'd fit right in!

 

[Mallow]

Originally posted by: doze
If you live in your parents house then you play by their rules

You have plenty of time to be an emo agnostic vegetarian (+ whatever else is currently trendy) when you grow up and move out.

LoL, you have to have religion forced on you and accept it without thinking on your own b/c you live in someone's house? You put only a thin veil over your true feelings. How untrue you are to yourself and your message.

 

[irishScott]

Originally posted by: Luthien
Yeah Jesus Camp is just an example of our own hipocracy in the USA saying the muslims are brainwashing their children. Watch how in Jesus Camp the movie the convert this child to christ.

Coerced Conversion Let The Brainwashing Begin

One man?s eloquent assessment of the movie Jesus Camp.

Crazy Yelling Jesus Chick

It's pretty bad, but we're not exactly telling them they'll get 72 virgins in heaven for blowing up Muslim kids. And that's and EXTREME minority fortunately.

 

[Luthien]

IrishScott, nah they are just telling them to take up arms and give there lives for jesus killing muslims and they will become martyrs for jesus and in heaven get everything their hearts desire. More Liars For Jesus.

 

[KoolAidKid]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Zstream
If a man did not believe in God or an afterlife of any kind he could never be trusted as he would not be logically driven to acknowledge any authority or principles outside himself.

You were wrong from the start. Morality and ethics have a purely selfish and secular beginning to them. It is VERY logical for an atheist/agnostic to be moral and ethical. One does NOT need fear of a sky fairy to understand why morality and ethics are logical and a must.

If you can't figure out why, I truly feel sorry for you. As a matter of fact, I find anyone who requires fear of an invisible being to be moral and ethical to be FAR more untrustworthy than someone who understands the logic and selfish basis of morality and ethics.

:beer:
On a related topic, Lawrence Kohlberg (a psychologist) spent his career studying moral development throughout the lifespan. In the 1950's he came up with a hierarchy of morality in which obedience through fear is the lowest level of morality and moral behavior motivated by the pursuit of universal principles is the highest. His idea was that kids start out at the lowest level and (hopefully) progress into the higher levels as they gain life experience. It's a shame that many never seem to make it out of that first level.

 

[BrownTown]

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX
I am so glad I'm not 15 anymore.

why, now you probablly have REAL problems?

 

[ballmode]

Ah society issues with america.

 

[alimoalem]

Originally posted by: JS80
lol @ the worries of a 15 year old

if you want real advice though, have an open discussion with him. best option: make it look like it's a phase then he might not worry as much and think your feelings will change

 

[niwi7]

lol i didn't take time to read through that whole site but I clicked genesis and this is what the first quote said

Genesis 1:1 - 2:3
The creation account in Genesis 1 conflicts with the order of events that are known to science. In Genesis, the earth is created before light and stars, birds and whales before reptiles and insects, and flowering plants before any animals. The true order of events was just the opposite


Just the opposite? true order of events? Nooone knows for sure how everything was created in the beginning so how can they say that? Any site that is going to make claims like that is rediculous

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: niwi7
lol i didn't take time to read through that whole site but I clicked genesis and this is what the first quote said

Genesis 1:1 - 2:3
The creation account in Genesis 1 conflicts with the order of events that are known to science. In Genesis, the earth is created before light and stars, birds and whales before reptiles and insects, and flowering plants before any animals. The true order of events was just the opposite


Just the opposite? true order of events? Nooone knows for sure how everything was created in the beginning so how can they say that? Any site that is going to make claims like that is rediculous

depending on what part of christianity you look at, they may take the bible literally or not.

i'm catholic, and the bible is a book of faith, not scientific fact. the point of genesis? god created the universe. some people do take it literally.. i honestly don't understand how you can possibly justify that, but w/e.

 

[Zstream]

Originally posted by: KoolAidKid

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Zstream
If a man did not believe in God or an afterlife of any kind he could never be trusted as he would not be logically driven to acknowledge any authority or principles outside himself.

You were wrong from the start. Morality and ethics have a purely selfish and secular beginning to them. It is VERY logical for an atheist/agnostic to be moral and ethical. One does NOT need fear of a sky fairy to understand why morality and ethics are logical and a must.

If you can't figure out why, I truly feel sorry for you. As a matter of fact, I find anyone who requires fear of an invisible being to be moral and ethical to be FAR more untrustworthy than someone who understands the logic and selfish basis of morality and ethics.

:beer:
On a related topic, Lawrence Kohlberg (a psychologist) spent his career studying moral development throughout the lifespan. In the 1950's he came up with a hierarchy of morality in which obedience through fear is the lowest level of morality and moral behavior motivated by the pursuit of universal principles is the highest. His idea was that kids start out at the lowest level and (hopefully) progress into the higher levels as they gain life experience. It's a shame that many never seem to make it out of that first level.

The quote has nothing to do with fear but rather glory. If you do something that is good towards another human being you know that it will all add up in the end. I could write a book on it but I am to busy atm.

It is sort of funny that you brought up fear as it is not found in the quote. Guilty conscience much?

 

[fuzzybabybunny]

Originally posted by: Zstream

Originally posted by: KoolAidKid

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Zstream
If a man did not believe in God or an afterlife of any kind he could never be trusted as he would not be logically driven to acknowledge any authority or principles outside himself.

You were wrong from the start. Morality and ethics have a purely selfish and secular beginning to them. It is VERY logical for an atheist/agnostic to be moral and ethical. One does NOT need fear of a sky fairy to understand why morality and ethics are logical and a must.

If you can't figure out why, I truly feel sorry for you. As a matter of fact, I find anyone who requires fear of an invisible being to be moral and ethical to be FAR more untrustworthy than someone who understands the logic and selfish basis of morality and ethics.

:beer:
On a related topic, Lawrence Kohlberg (a psychologist) spent his career studying moral development throughout the lifespan. In the 1950's he came up with a hierarchy of morality in which obedience through fear is the lowest level of morality and moral behavior motivated by the pursuit of universal principles is the highest. His idea was that kids start out at the lowest level and (hopefully) progress into the higher levels as they gain life experience. It's a shame that many never seem to make it out of that first level.

The quote has nothing to do with fear but rather glory. If you do something that is good towards another human being you know that it will all add up in the end. I could write a book on it but I am to busy atm.

It is sort of funny that you brought up fear as it is not found in the quote. Guilty conscience much?

"glory" being selfishness? And what quote are you referring to? Your's? "It is sort of funny that you brought up fear as it is not found in the quote." You don't mention glory either. Sometimes "authority" and "principles" within oneself can be extremely strong. I'd certainly trust someone who is a good person and is a good person because he answers to his own conscience.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: Sqube
Kudos to you for turning a critical eye to your faith and coming to your own decision.

The fact that your father can't handle it says more about him than it does about. It's not your place to have to "fix" anything. It's his place to realize that he can't force his faith upon you. Good luck.

All kids go through this phase in their youth. Then when they grow up they realize their parents were right. They're just "confused".

1) People of faith are more happy, more successful, raise better kids, are kinder and are generally better members of society.

You can't argue with that.

I guess you are an anomaly

 

[otispunkmeyer]

Originally posted by: jjsole
The irony (and/or hypocrisy) is that choice and free will are at the heart of Christianity.

yeah, but when you get to fanatical levels of belief that all goes west, along with rationality

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Zstream

Originally posted by: KoolAidKid

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Zstream
If a man did not believe in God or an afterlife of any kind he could never be trusted as he would not be logically driven to acknowledge any authority or principles outside himself.

You were wrong from the start. Morality and ethics have a purely selfish and secular beginning to them. It is VERY logical for an atheist/agnostic to be moral and ethical. One does NOT need fear of a sky fairy to understand why morality and ethics are logical and a must.

If you can't figure out why, I truly feel sorry for you. As a matter of fact, I find anyone who requires fear of an invisible being to be moral and ethical to be FAR more untrustworthy than someone who understands the logic and selfish basis of morality and ethics.

:beer:
On a related topic, Lawrence Kohlberg (a psychologist) spent his career studying moral development throughout the lifespan. In the 1950's he came up with a hierarchy of morality in which obedience through fear is the lowest level of morality and moral behavior motivated by the pursuit of universal principles is the highest. His idea was that kids start out at the lowest level and (hopefully) progress into the higher levels as they gain life experience. It's a shame that many never seem to make it out of that first level.

The quote has nothing to do with fear but rather glory. If you do something that is good towards another human being you know that it will all add up in the end. I could write a book on it but I am to busy atm.

It is sort of funny that you brought up fear as it is not found in the quote. Guilty conscience much?

It's still the carrot on a stick. You're doing it not because you see the logic of morality and ethics, but for reward or fear. Non-believers, on the other hand see the logic behind morality and understand that society cannot exist without it.

I still have less trust for you than I do for someone who actually understands why morality exists and what part it plays in society.