My dogs killed my neighbor's cat

[Randum]

Bottom line- they came into YOUR yard. You are not liable for this. Fill me in on the results, i am working on becoming a lawyer and i would defend you in an instant!

 

[Doboji]

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: Doboji

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: Proletariat
If my pet was killed by yours, I would seriously beat the sh!t out of you. I don't care if I get arrested.

I also wouldn't like to have any of you as neighbors either. If your dog killed someones pet, you should pay up. Now $2000 seems like a lot of money, but some restitution is in order.

I'm only pointing this out as an FYI you might want to keep in the back of your head. I'm not implying anything other then use your noggin a bit.
Most states have CCW. If you show up all pissed off on someones doorstep and proceed to start swinging, they can legally gun you down where you stand call the cops to pick up your body and be back to the table before dinner cools down.

Now most reasonable people wouldnt just start shooting.....But then again most reasonable people wouldnt let their animal run the neighborhood then try to beat the ****** out of people when the animal that was running on other peoples property gets killed either.

This doesnt sound too legit... I mean what a great way to commit murder... just call your victim up, and invite them over for tea, when they show up at the door, gun them down, call 911 and claim they tried to punch you in the head.

Or would you have to wait til they hit you a few times to prove they tried to punch you in the head, and THEN shoot them?

-Max

You'd have to prove that in the situation, you felt your life threatened and there was no other way you could settle the situation without using lethal force.

In other words you couldnt just shoot some 5'3" geek off of atot who showed up at your door and feebly tried to punch you in the head. You'd need to prove you were truly scared for your life... I think any of us would have a hard time proving that Proletariat made us scared he was gonna kill us.

-Max

 

[Ninjja]

Originally posted by: teddyv

dude, even after one year of law school, i'm telling you man, they can NOT get you for those damages. hehehe, i hate people like that too.

LoL - after three years of law school I'd tend to agree.

 

[kyparrish]

Originally posted by: EyeMWing
Why aren't you in court yet? And go absolutely BONKERS when it comes to that - make sure she tries to collect on the full $180k, which will push this out of small claims and into a real court. DO NOT request a jury, no matter how appealing the potential for humiliation. That could backfire, because there are a lot of tools like Proletariat out there. You'll find that the trial judge will EAT HER LIVER for wasting real court time on what is, at best, a small claims matter, and proceed to award you your $200.

Just read the whole thread, this is my fav. reply :thumbsup:

 

[patentman]

Originally posted by: Tsaico
I had a talk with the neighbor's "representative" because she couldn't speak. He tried at first to seem like a lawyer, refusing to identify himself other than her "legal representation". When I pressed him for his firm's name before I would speak at all, he finally fesses up that it is actually her husband's brother.

If you wanted to be a pain in the ass, what your neighbors brother did may be against the law... he materially misrepresented himself as an agent of the court (a lawyer), which is a misdemeanor in many states.... Good luck proving it without a witness though (its a he said/you said type situation without a witness)

Originally posted by: Tsaico
Anyhow, he says the cat is a Himalayan Tabby and to replace would cost $2000 for the cat, plus another $300 for misc vet setup fees (like vacinations) and finnally, assuming they kept on pace with breeding her twice a year (which they claim they were) and a litter of 5 a time, the cat would still have 9 yrs of breed time = 90 kittens that would have been sold, meaning I should owe them $180,000. If I could not pay, then they would take me to court, or perhaps find some "middle ground". If not, then they would have no option but to call cops, get my dogs impounded, and try to sue me for my personal assets.

I'm assuming your negihbor would sue you for the tort of negligence...i.e. you negligently let your dogs run free such such that they caused the death of her cat... In this case the neighbor has to prove 5 elements: 1. Duty; 2. Breach of Duty; 3. Actual Cause; 4. Proximate Cause; and 5. Harm (damage). I think her case is weak in the following respects:

First, I don't know where your duty of care with repect to your dogs extends to her cat. You maintained the dogs in the yard in a safe manner did you not? Further, even if you have a duty of care to your neighbor with respect to your dogs, you did not breach that duty with respect to her. In fact, I don;t see how you breached that duty at all. So long as you maintained your dogs in a safe manner in your yard, it is likely that a trier of fact (judge or jury) will find that you undertook reasoable precautions.

Second, even if duty and breach of duty are shown, your neighor has a causation problem. Your neighbor must show that your negligent acts were the actual and proximate cause of the harm. Actual cause is shown when "but for" the negligent act, the harm would not have occurred. Here, although it can be argued, it is likely that actual cause is met. Proximate cause, on the other hand, is much harder to show here. Proximate cause has to do with foreseeability...the more remote the negligent act is from the harm, the less likely proximate cause is met. Here, the death of your negihbors cat seems to be pretty remote from the act of letting your dogs out the door. Of course, this might be a different story if the facts were that you saw the cat in the yard, and set your dogs on it.

Third, even if, arguendo, all of the elements of tort negligence are met in your case, you have an absolute defense available to you. Namely that the plaintiff, your neighbor, volunatarily encountered the risk of harm when she allowed her cat to run about the neighborhood, knowing full well that you, her next door neighbor, owned several large dogs that patrolled your property. In U.S. courts, volenti non fit injuria, A willing victim cannot claim.

Moreover, if you live in a contributory negligence state you may or may not have an absolute defense. If your act of lettig your dogs out was negligent, so was her act of letting her cat out. In some states if a plaintiff contributes even 1% to the commision of the harm, then they cannot collect.. in other states, the amount the P can collect is reduced by the relative amount they contributed to the harm 9e.g. the jury awards $10, the plaintiff was 40% responsible for the accident, so the court gives the plaintiff $6)

Finally, if you are like me, and you think breeding cats is offensive and should be against the law, you could argue ex turpi causa non oritur acto (no right of action arises from despicable causes).... ok, this is a joke, but the other stuf is not.

With respect to damages: In most states a plaintiff can only recover "non-speculative" damages. In this case, that would mean that your neighbor could likely recover for the cost of the cat and maybe some pain an suffering. Future litters the cat "might" have had are too speculative to warrant damages, especially when replacement of the cat with another of reproducing age will compensate the plaintiff fully for any potential loss with the same amount of risk..

Finally, the grand disclaimer: I am a law student. I am not a lawyer. The information given above is not legal advice and should not be relied upon as legal advice. If you plan to undertake legal action, do not rely upon this information, get a lawyer. Any reliance upon the above informatin is at your own risk. I will not be held responsible for any harms or costs which may arise as the result of the above information.

 

[Babbles]

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: Doboji

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: Proletariat
If my pet was killed by yours, I would seriously beat the sh!t out of you. I don't care if I get arrested.

I also wouldn't like to have any of you as neighbors either. If your dog killed someones pet, you should pay up. Now $2000 seems like a lot of money, but some restitution is in order.

I'm only pointing this out as an FYI you might want to keep in the back of your head. I'm not implying anything other then use your noggin a bit.
Most states have CCW. If you show up all pissed off on someones doorstep and proceed to start swinging, they can legally gun you down where you stand call the cops to pick up your body and be back to the table before dinner cools down.

Now most reasonable people wouldnt just start shooting.....But then again most reasonable people wouldnt let their animal run the neighborhood then try to beat the ****** out of people when the animal that was running on other peoples property gets killed either.

This doesnt sound too legit... I mean what a great way to commit murder... just call your victim up, and invite them over for tea, when they show up at the door, gun them down, call 911 and claim they tried to punch you in the head.

Or would you have to wait til they hit you a few times to prove they tried to punch you in the head, and THEN shoot them?

-Max

You'd have to prove that in the situation, you felt your life threatened and there was no other way you could settle the situation without using lethal force.

Not in Texas!

 

[patentman]

Originally posted by: Randum
Bottom line- they came into YOUR yard. You are not liable for this. Fill me in on the results, i am working on becoming a lawyer and i would defend you in an instant!

Be careful before you give legal advice when you are not a lawyer....take it as friendly advice from another student of a law.

 

[KarenMarie]

feral = untamed, living in the wild.

Stray is way different. Ferals are strays, but not all strays are wild. A house cat who gets out and lost becomes a stray, that does not mean it is a feral cat.

This is getting to be beyond a joke.

counter sue for vet bills.

 

[BigJ]

Originally posted by: Babbles

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: Doboji

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: Proletariat
If my pet was killed by yours, I would seriously beat the sh!t out of you. I don't care if I get arrested.

I also wouldn't like to have any of you as neighbors either. If your dog killed someones pet, you should pay up. Now $2000 seems like a lot of money, but some restitution is in order.

I'm only pointing this out as an FYI you might want to keep in the back of your head. I'm not implying anything other then use your noggin a bit.
Most states have CCW. If you show up all pissed off on someones doorstep and proceed to start swinging, they can legally gun you down where you stand call the cops to pick up your body and be back to the table before dinner cools down.

Now most reasonable people wouldnt just start shooting.....But then again most reasonable people wouldnt let their animal run the neighborhood then try to beat the ****** out of people when the animal that was running on other peoples property gets killed either.

This doesnt sound too legit... I mean what a great way to commit murder... just call your victim up, and invite them over for tea, when they show up at the door, gun them down, call 911 and claim they tried to punch you in the head.

Or would you have to wait til they hit you a few times to prove they tried to punch you in the head, and THEN shoot them?

-Max

You'd have to prove that in the situation, you felt your life threatened and there was no other way you could settle the situation without using lethal force.

Not in Texas!

Texas and Florida aren't really the norm though

 

[patentman]

Originally posted by: Babbles
Not in Texas!

Amen to that, as my criminal law professor put it, "Texas is an interesting state... in fact its the only state where the law says that if the decedent 'needed some killin', then the defendant is, in many cases, not guilty of murder."

 

[Dissipate]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: Proletariat
If my pet was killed by yours, I would seriously beat the sh!t out of you. I don't care if I get arrested.

I also wouldn't like to have any of you as neighbors either. If your dog killed someones pet, you should pay up. Now $2000 seems like a lot of money, but some restitution is in order.

Now most reasonable people wouldnt just start shooting.....But then again most reasonable people wouldnt let their animal run the neighborhood then try to beat the ****** out of people when the animal that was running on other peoples property gets killed either.

He's a communist. According to him, your land is his land.

 

[Eli]

:laugh:

Tell them to fsck off and die.

 

[Babbles]

Originally posted by: patentman

Originally posted by: Babbles
Not in Texas!

Amen to that, as my criminal law professor put it, "Texas is an interesting state... in fact its the only state where the law says that if the decedent 'needed some killin', then the plaintiff is, in many cases, not guilty of murder."

It's true!

Like many states there are some old laws still on the book, and there is one in particular that states something to the effect that if a person is on your property after sundown and does not identify themselves, then you (the property owner) are within your rights to shoot the perpetrator. I think this stems from back in the cattle rustling days.
Anyhow, I am from the Dallas/Fort Worth area, hardly some rural area, and in the past there have been news stories about a home owner shooting an intruder as they (the intruder) was in the process of breaking into their home; meaning the home owner was not necessarily acting as if it was the absolute last resort. Sure the police, obviously, get called out but the home owner rarely, if ever, gets called to a grand jury.

Perhaps I am just a product of my environment for living most of my life in Texas, but I absolutely love the "don't take crap" sort of attitude - if you are breaking into somebody's house, then don't be surprised if you get your retarded self shot.

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: Proletariat
How is getting the dying pet medical attention being nice? I don't understand this, maybe I'm operating on a different level here.

I think thats pretty much standard practice.

For someone who idolizes a South American revolutionary, you sure have some massively capitalist, American opinions on matters. Take it from someone who grew up in South America...until you have some actual third world experience, you need to STFU with the proletariat crap. There ARE no true proles in this country:roll:

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: Doboji
Oh and I still havent seen what kind of dogs we're talking about here... if you have two snarlin pit bulls in the back yard... I say they should be put down...

-Max

Put down for what? Staying in their own yard?

Should all neighborhood cats who wander about and tear up people's trash be put down, too?

 

[eits]

Originally posted by: Kalvin00
the cat came into your yard?

fvck her. tell her to take care of her own damn cat

yeah, no kidding. as soon as i heard that the bitch told you to pay $2000 for her slutty cat, i was like, "wtf? if she was all worried about a $2000 cat, she wouldn't let it outside."

ugh... idiots.

 

[eits]

HAHAHA husband's brother? wtf? what the hell trailer park do you live next to? jeez, man... you gotta move. you live by some frigging yahoos.

$180,000?!?! haha that's the point where i'd start laughing and say "go fvck your mother"

 

[SVT Cobra]

Wow those people sound horrible.

Thanks for the update, and I hope you counter-sue and win!

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: Doboji
Oh and I still havent seen what kind of dogs we're talking about here... if you have two snarlin pit bulls in the back yard... I say they should be put down...

-Max

Put down for what? Staying in their own yard?

Should all neighborhood cats who wander about and tear up people's trash be put down, too?

Yeah seriously. How about dobermans, rotts, or any other big protective breed? Should they be put down too so all we have left is little worthless yappy dogs and cats?

Dogs kill cats always have always will. That bigger dogs are actually effecient in thier task should'nt be held against them. That cat is retarded for jumping into a yard manned by dogs. Darwin at work.

 

[Thorny]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: Doboji
Oh and I still havent seen what kind of dogs we're talking about here... if you have two snarlin pit bulls in the back yard... I say they should be put down...

-Max

Should all neighborhood cats who wander about and tear up people's trash be put down, too?

YES


To the cats, leave the dogs be

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: Tsaico

Cliff:
Neighor's husband's brother called trying to be a lawyer and "reason with me."
Told me I owe them $182,300 total to replace the cat and what it would have brought in over its life time.
Told them to go ahead and call the cops and my lawyer, who is really an old friend.
Cat didn't look anything like what the internet pics look like.

It's obvious that they're white trash and are trying to get some kind of payout.

Tell them to kindly Go **** themselves. And countersue them for $42 billion dollars.

 

[ta8689]

Counter sue saying that they were show dogs, the cat came into the yard, and it scratched up their faces, so they defended themselves and killed it. So say that they were show dogs and were ready to bring in 12,000 a month in show winnings. Project their lifetime to about 15 years, so she owes you $2,160,000 because they are ugly and can no longer be entered into shows. Well, i wouldnt say this in court, but give her as big of a bullshit story as she gave you. For christ sake though, how can she claim the cat her's if she doesnt have any documentation on it? It could have ran away half way across town and she could have claimed it... whos is it really? Squeeze every god damned penny out of her. And if she comes to your door, scream out the window, "you have 5 seconds to stop trespassing, or ill release the hounds!!" (like mr. burns from the simpsons)

 

[shimsham]

lol what dumbasses.

keep us updated when your lawyer hears from their "lawyer in law"

 

[Doboji]

Originally posted by: Babbles

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: Doboji

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: Proletariat
If my pet was killed by yours, I would seriously beat the sh!t out of you. I don't care if I get arrested.

I also wouldn't like to have any of you as neighbors either. If your dog killed someones pet, you should pay up. Now $2000 seems like a lot of money, but some restitution is in order.

I'm only pointing this out as an FYI you might want to keep in the back of your head. I'm not implying anything other then use your noggin a bit.
Most states have CCW. If you show up all pissed off on someones doorstep and proceed to start swinging, they can legally gun you down where you stand call the cops to pick up your body and be back to the table before dinner cools down.

Now most reasonable people wouldnt just start shooting.....But then again most reasonable people wouldnt let their animal run the neighborhood then try to beat the ****** out of people when the animal that was running on other peoples property gets killed either.

This doesnt sound too legit... I mean what a great way to commit murder... just call your victim up, and invite them over for tea, when they show up at the door, gun them down, call 911 and claim they tried to punch you in the head.

Or would you have to wait til they hit you a few times to prove they tried to punch you in the head, and THEN shoot them?

-Max

You'd have to prove that in the situation, you felt your life threatened and there was no other way you could settle the situation without using lethal force.

Not in Texas!

Well hey, I guess that makes murder in Texas real damn easy don't it? Like I said just invite your victim over for dinner and shoot his ass.... real easy.

-Max

 

[Doboji]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: Doboji
Oh and I still havent seen what kind of dogs we're talking about here... if you have two snarlin pit bulls in the back yard... I say they should be put down...

-Max

Put down for what? Staying in their own yard?

Should all neighborhood cats who wander about and tear up people's trash be put down, too?

Yeah seriously. How about dobermans, rotts, or any other big protective breed? Should they be put down too so all we have left is little worthless yappy dogs and cats?

Dogs kill cats always have always will. That bigger dogs are actually effecient in thier task should'nt be held against them. That cat is retarded for jumping into a yard manned by dogs. Darwin at work.

Yeah but I bet a tamed Lion will kill a dog real easy... Darwin at work there.. oh but wait... not just any Sam Dick or Harry can own a Lion, let alone keep one in their backyard...

Why you ask?

Oh cuz it's a fckin LION. Same concept applies to Pit Bulls when case after case after case of them killing owners, babies, children, pregnant women, what have you. Pit Bulls should be treated as the dangerous animals that they are.

-Max