My first build in over 7 years

[peterjedi]

I am comming from Intel 850E with RDRAM 1066 (No OC). I am finally ready to upgrade.

My goal is to OC my CPU to between 3.6 ghz - 4.0 ghz using Air cooling and overclock my GPU by 10%.

Here is what I am planning to purchase.

CPU: Core i7 920 or 940

Case: Silverstone TJ09 or TJ10

Memory: 6 GB 3 x 2 GB dimms of Patriot 1600 or Corsair 1600. I would like to spend around $300 dollars here, but willing to go to $400 if I get good OC stability.

PSU: Corsair HX1000w or Ultra X3 1000w. 2nd choice would be Zalman 1000w modular.

Fans: S-Flex G-rated. Not sure if this is going to be too loud. Total of 3-5 120 fans.

CPU heatsink: Thermalright TRUE.

GPU: AMD/ATI 4870 with 1 GB of memory. I am planning to get Sapphire.

Motherboard: I don't plan to use two GPUs, but I would like to have the option to use 2 in the future. I will never use 3 GPUs. I am thinking the Asus Rampage II might be too much. I am leaning towards EVGA 132-BL-E758-A1 LGA 1366 Intel X58.

HD: 1 or 2 WD 300 GB VelociRaptors.

Any comments or suggestions are much appreciated.

 

[AVP]

Why do you want a 1000w psu? Why not say 500-600? maybe a 650-750 if you will SLI

 

[Slugbait]

Money and quality is obviously no object...so I'm curious why you are considering Ultra. And modular is nice, but if I'm going top-end for everything else, I'm going with PP&C.

I'd get one VelociRaptor (system drive) and then go for storage, like a gig-sized F1. Or, Raid the VelociRaptors, and still get the storage drive.

 

[DSF]

What's the computer going to be used for? If it's a gaming machine (and I assume it is, given the 4870) you don't gain a whole lot from Nehalem over Core2 Duo. You'll have a CPU upgrade path open in the future, but how likely are you to take advantage of that if your last build was seven years ago?

 

[theAnimal]

Originally posted by: Slugbait
Money and quality is obviously no object...so I'm curious why you are considering Ultra. And modular is nice, but if I'm going top-end for everything else, I'm going with PP&C.

That Ultra is actually pretty good.

The Antec Signature is what I would get if I had the means.

 

[peterjedi]

All good points.

This is used for some games. I guest I want to future proof my system for three years.
I've waited a while to upgrade because I didn't have to time or money. Now that I am much more stable I wanted to treat myself to some nice toys.

I am getting the 1000 PSU to cover any future upgrades that I might have. I plan to use this for 5+ years.

I can get the Ultra for $219 with only $10 shipping from directron. The Corsair PSU is for $229 with $20 mail in rebate, so final cost is $209 with %10 shipping.

I will probably go with 1 VelociRaptor, then switch to SSD in 2-3 years when the price drops and technology matures.

These are the ideas that I am playing with. I could probably save $300-$400 with C2D.

My Silverstone case will last for 8-10+ years. I plan to re-use this case when I upgrade.

I havn't pull the trigger yet. Maybe I will come to my senses in a few days.

Thanks so far for everyone's replies.

 

[jellyrole]

Since you don't upgrade very often, I would go with i7. Leaving it at stock until you want more speed then overclocking. By the time you think your system is slow, you can just drop in a new CPU and overclock it even higher.

 

[DSF]

Food for thought:

You're spending almost $1000 on the CPU, MB and RAM alone. With a Core2Duo system you could get those parts for less than $400.

Any PC you build now, whether it's Core2 or Core i7, will be outdated in two years and begging for replacement in 3 to 4 unless you don't care about playing new games. (But again, if you don't care about playing new games, why spend so much money up front?)

On the other hand, if you spend only $1000 now you'll have almost $1000 left for future upgrades, not to mention that certain things like the case, PSU, and possibly CPU cooler can be carried over to the next build.

 

[magreen]

The psu is way overkill, even for future upgrades. Your system will only draw 350W at load, maybe 150W at idle. You'll be running your psu at 15% capacity a lot of the time.

Even if you do sli in the future, you'll only be drawing 550W max. And that's a big "if" -- in another year or two your money would be better spent buying a new single video card and ebaying/throwing out your 4870 than doubling up on what you already have. I'd get no more than a 700W psu at the highest.

 

[peterjedi]

Thanks for the advise jellyrole, DSF, and magreen.

One of the reason why I would like to go with i7 is so in a couple of years I can just drop a new CPU into my motherboard.

Another reason is I have this believe that i7's motherboard would run cooler than C2D. I would like to keep the noise and heat issues down.

Do you guys think sound damping material in the case would help with the noise or is it minimal?

DSF: I assume you are talking about a C2D motherboard, 8500 CPU (OC to 4ghz), and DDR2 memory (4 GBs). This does sound interesting. You do believe this will be close to the i7 OC'ed CPU?

magreen: I was originally set on a 750w power supply, but I didn't find any of the brand names that I wanted at that wattage that was modular.

Does the 1000w PSU us more electricity than say a 500w PSU if I was to only use 400 watts of power?

Plus $219 Ultra x3 1000w is a very good deal or $209 Corsair HX1000w.

Once again thanks for everyone's advise.

 

[DSF]

If you want to overclock the CPU to 4GHz, that's up to you, but I wasn't even implying that that's necessary. An E8500, especially if you overclock it to 4GHz, isn't going to hold you back in games for a long time.

A stock E8500 is generally within a few frames of a stock i7 920/940 from the benchmarks I've seen. It stands to reason that overclocking would yield similar results. Keep in mind, that varies from game to game. Some games there's a definite gap - 110 FPS for i7 vs. 90 for Core2Duo for example - but you have to remember that above 60 FPS any differences are going to be indistinguishable. In a lot of games these days, such as Crysis, the engine is so heavily dependent on the GPU that the CPU doesn't matter beyond a certain point.

As far as PSUs, it depends on the specific models of the PSUs. However, all PSUs are least efficient as they get close to 0 and 100% load. Your system will probably use less than 200W when idling, such as surfing the net. That puts a 1000W PSU into the "Under 20%" section of its power curve, meaning that it probably would use more electricity than a 500W PSU powering the same system. Once you put more of a load on it, such as by playing a game, that problem would disappear.

 

[magreen]

Right. It's a common misconception that a higher wattage psu uses more power, and it's definitely not true. A psu draws only as much power from the outlet as the computer demands from it.

But as DSF said, the efficiency curve changes things a bit. Every psu will have its unique efficiency curve, which is a graph of [ what percentage of AC current drawn from the wall is converted to usable DC current for the computer components and not wasted as heat ] vs. wattage. The better psus will maintain >80% across a broad range of wattages, but they tend to be most efficient at around 30-80% of their maximum wattage. Running it at under 20% of its max wattage is likely to not be running it at its peak efficiency, depending on your particular psu's efficiency curve of course. That's why you may see higher efficiency from a 500W psu than from a 1000W psu if you're only drawing 200W.

 

[brett42]

Originally posted by: peterjedi

Another reason is I have this believe that i7's motherboard would run cooler than C2D. I would like to keep the noise and heat issues down.

I don't know about the motherboards, but the i7s have 130w TDP ratings and the C2Ds are 65w, so you'd probably get a little more heat with the i7.

 

[peterjedi]

Here are two price specs for C2Q and i7 from newegg.

C2Q system:

A Core 2 Quad Q9550, 8 GB of 1066 Corsair Dominator memory, and MSI P45 motherboard will run you $636 as of 11/24/2008.

Memory:
8 GB (4 x 2 GB) Corsair TWIN2x4096-8500C5DF DDR2 1066
$119 - $10 - $40 (MIR) = $69 x 2 = $138

Motherboard:
MSI P45 Platinum (HC Edition) LGA 775
$249 - $30 - $40 (MIR) = $179

CPU:
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83GHz 12MB L2 Cache LGA 775
$319

Total is $636.

i7 system:

A i7 system with Asus P6T Deluxe LGA 1366 X58, i7 920, and Patriot Viper 6 GB (3 x 2 GB) DDR3 1600 will run you
$867 as of 11/24/2008. There are currently no rebates for this combination. I bet if I wait till Dec I should see some rebates totalling between $50-$100 dollars.

That's a $231 difference. I don't think that is a big deal. What do you people think?

I just purchased the Silverstone TJ10 Silver&Window on newegg for $269 and Western Digital VelociRaptor WD3000GLFS 300GB 10000 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM for $229. Two excellent prices.

I will probably hold off on the PSU till late December for probably a further price cut.

 

[DSF]

I think you're needlessly overspending with 8GB DDR2-1066, a Q9550 and a $180 motherboard.

You could get an E8500, 4GB of DDR2-800 or DDR2-1000 and a basic P45 motherboard for around $350. That would give you gaming performance as good as the Q9550 setup for considerably less.

 

[peterjedi]

I pulled the trigger last night. I decided to go with Q9550 with DDR2 1066, rather than i7. The difference in price is approximately $900 - $476 = $424.
I still have not purchased a motherboard yet, because the the one that I wanted was out. I was looking at GA-EP45-UD3P (Was $99).

I am looking for a solid motherboard with good capacitors, power regulation, and OC stability. I would like to overclock somwhere between 3.6 and 4.0 Ghz.

Any other suggestions?

Reusable components:

Silverstone TJ10-SW 269.99
Sapphire 100259-1GL Radeon HD 4870 1 GB 249.99
WD VelociRaptor 300GB 10,000 RPM 16 MB SATA 3.0 229.99
Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate SP1 64-bit 159.99
PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750 black 79.99
4 Thermalright 120mm x 25mm FDB 2000 RPM + Lapping kit 78.90
Thermalright TRUE 56.68
Samsung 22x DVD SH-S223Q - OEM 28.99
Samsung 22X DVD SH-S223F - OEM 24.99
Sunbeam Rheobus 4 Fan controller 19.98
total 1199.49

CPU, motherboard, and memory:

Intel Core 2 Quard Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83 309.99
Corsair Dominator 4GB DDR2 1066 69.00
total 378.00