My frustrations as a network engineer

[Gryz]

Give me IS-IS any day.

IS-IS is comparable to OSPF. The terminology is different, and that scares a lot of people. But once you get through that, it's actually easier to configure and troubleshoot than OSPF. And because of the protocol's design, and how the specs were written, IS-IS gives more flexibility for implementers to build more robust and scalable implementations. Easier to add modifications to the protocol too. It's the reason why so many big ISPs use IS-IS in stead of OSPF.

EIGRP has less knobs to configure. E.g. no messing with areas. Therefor it is simpler to use. EIGRP works very well in hub-and-spoke networks (with little redundancy). If you want to (and can) do proper summarization, that is a nice scalability feature too.

Still, having worked with all 3 protocols (and BGP, RIP and more), I still prefer IS-IS by a boat-length. So do most of the people I know that know routing protocols.

 

[vertika]

It's called "job security". Now stop complaining and start hoping nobody invents a GUI that automates your job

yeah it is job security that how can you secure your job and solve 100% customer problems.

 

[Harrod]

I was called up one sunday afternoon, because someones voice was down, upon getting on the conference call, I asked them if they could reach the SBC from the IAD, they said they could, but wanted to blame it on the network.

I then found out that the pbx was connected to the iad via a pri. I then asked what equipement was the customers they replied the pbx and the iad. I then asked them to see what the d channel was doing they said that it was down and then claimed that wasn't the problem. I then proceeded to ask them if the t1 is down to the iad, how is the pbx supposed to communicate with the upstream device?

 

[Saulbadguy]

Today I found a couple copies of the original "ILOVEYOU" e-mail virus sitting in someones inbox, from 5/4/2000.

Unread!!

 

[rasczak]

I prefer the stress of Netadmin to CSR any day though.

Different type of stress is easier to deal with maybe?

I feel you man. I made the jump from help desk (NMCI for those of you with prior military) to a Sys/"Network" Admin. All I can says is I wish you the best of luck. I don't miss the desk. Nor the stress.

 

[imagoon]

I feel you man. I made the jump from help desk (NMCI for those of you with prior military) to a Sys/"Network" Admin. All I can says is I wish you the best of luck. I don't miss the desk. Nor the stress.

Actually since I posted that I managed to move on and now kinda do a "jack of all trades" in a place with a competent tier 1 helpdesk. I would call it a "non-specialized Tier 3" which is pretty awesome for a person like me who doesn't mind dealing with users periodically but I want to be involved in the higher end stuff.

 

[spidey07]

As a consultant I frequently get the very firm answer of "this is how we've always done it"

That's a difficult battle to win even though thieve always done it way wrong. Tread tenderly and make recimmendations is about all you can do.

You can't outright say "you're fucking idiots that have no idea what you're doing and why I'm here in the first place".

 

[imagoon]

As a consultant I frequently get the very firm answer of "this is how we've always done it"

That's a difficult battle to win even though thieve always done it way wrong. Tread tenderly and make recimmendations is about all you can do.

You can't outright say "you're fucking idiots that have no idea what you're doing and why I'm here in the first place".

You get that as employees also but yeah I hate that one myself.

 

[Pheran]

You can't outright say "you're fucking idiots that have no idea what you're doing and why I'm here in the first place".

But it would be so much more fun this way. :biggrin:

 

[spidey07]

But it would be so much more fun this way. :biggrin:

I say it in much more subtle ways and they generally listen. One must be very politically savvy and watch words, body language and constantly portray "I'm here to help".

Network folks are generally strong type A personalities and I'm the worst of that. I have to seriously tone it down, give them enough rope to hang themselves before dropping the hammer. Look, you paid good money for me to fix your shit...ignore what you paid for at your own peril. I'm paid either way.

 

[Lithium381]

Give me IS-IS any day.

IS-IS is comparable to OSPF. The terminology is different, and that scares a lot of people. But once you get through that, it's actually easier to configure and troubleshoot than OSPF. And because of the protocol's design, and how the specs were written, IS-IS gives more flexibility for implementers to build more robust and scalable implementations. Easier to add modifications to the protocol too. It's the reason why so many big ISPs use IS-IS in stead of OSPF.

EIGRP has less knobs to configure. E.g. no messing with areas. Therefor it is simpler to use. EIGRP works very well in hub-and-spoke networks (with little redundancy). If you want to (and can) do proper summarization, that is a nice scalability feature too.

Still, having worked with all 3 protocols (and BGP, RIP and more), I still prefer IS-IS by a boat-length. So do most of the people I know that know routing protocols.

i'm learning to like ISIS though my exposure is still limited. I know Juniper is actually using modified ISIS on the backplane of their EX series and Q-Fabric switching platforms because it's so extensible and flexible!

Around here though with all the customers I've had, OSPF is still the de-facto . . .

 

[Gryz]

You can't outright say "you're fucking idiots that have no idea what you're doing and why I'm here in the first place".

Guess what vendors think when they deal with consultants. And customers.

Without kidding: there are just too many options, protocols, features. The best network design is a simple one. Like all design: it's not finished when you can't add any more stuff. No, design is finished when you can't take away any more stuff.

When running into issues, people tend to start enabling more features. Patchwork. Bandages. Keep doing this, and after a while the network is a mess. Unfortunately, once a feature is in, vendors can't take it out anymore. I bet there are still networks that depend on IP Mobile ARP. (Random example of crappy feature that adds nothing to a decent network design).

 

[imagoon]

Guess what vendors think when they deal with consultants. And customers.

Without kidding: there are just too many options, protocols, features. The best network design is a simple one. Like all design: it's not finished when you can't add any more stuff. No, design is finished when you can't take away any more stuff.

When running into issues, people tend to start enabling more features. Patchwork. Bandages. Keep doing this, and after a while the network is a mess. Unfortunately, once a feature is in, vendors can't take it out anymore. I bet there are still networks that depend on IP Mobile ARP. (Random example of crappy feature that adds nothing to a decent network design).

I think a functional network is more important that a "simple one." Sure it is easy and simple to give a large building a /20 for all PCs but that is typically not going to be recommended.

 

[wilsonjames829]

My frustrations as a network engineer is a good advantage in our technology to promote new strategy. In computer is need to trouble shoot if undamage the computer.

 

[wkrofl]

Hey OP,

I'm a part time college student with the CompTIA A+ Certificate. I'm very interested in networking and learning about routing protocols. I just bought the Mike Myers Network + Preperation book. I'm wondering, do you have any read recommendations? I was brain storming today about network creation, you can check out my thread here http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=34915676#post34915676 and I realized that yes, I am clueless.

There is a lot that goes into networking, it is essentially the spine of IT. What do you recommend I learn and study the most if I eventually want to become a network administrator?

And... are IT Help Desk jobs supporting Word/Office/Lotus Notes/Printers a good idea? Or should I search for JR Network Admin jobs?

Thanks!

 

[rasczak]

Actually since I posted that I managed to move on and now kinda do a "jack of all trades" in a place with a competent tier 1 helpdesk. I would call it a "non-specialized Tier 3" which is pretty awesome for a person like me who doesn't mind dealing with users periodically but I want to be involved in the higher end stuff.

Great! I love the fact that I have very little user interacting with our field customers. Our devs on the other hand...I'll let you guys fill in the blanks.

 

[Zargon]

screw you cisco and your defaulting on proxy-arp for a while

plate was full already

 

[spidey07]

screw you cisco and your defaulting on proxy-arp for a while

plate was full already

It'll bite ya. There was a linksys router that took out a decent sized data center when somebody put one in all thanks to proxy arp.

 

[Zargon]

luckily these mistakes were before my time

but I found them, and now get to fix them

 

[Pheran]

screw you cisco and your defaulting on proxy-arp for a while

plate was full already

Totally agree on that one, proxy ARP on is a completely stupid default.

 

[spidey07]

Totally agree on that one, proxy ARP on is a completely stupid default.

There was a time it was needed. That time passed 13 some years ago.

Although, some of the shit Oracle, VMware and other shit are doing these days with proprietary L2 protocols including non-compliant multicast make one realize the OS/app guys aren't in the year 2013.

 

[Exterous]

Not network engineer stuff but I just wish for competent remote site help. There is only so much print server configuration I can do remotley if I can't get someone to correctly connect the ethernet cable to the printer's ethernet port.

But maybe all that lost troubleshooting time is my fault because I didnt ask our 'IT guy' out there 'did you connect the ethernet cable to the correct port?'

 

[Exterous]

The place I work doesn't seem to understand the importance of the network.
Higher up's have the mentality it's as easy as home networking w/ a Linksys router.
The server team is two to three times the size of the network team.
Apps team is even bigger, but I'll accept that, since we have all sorts of apps that need maintained & developed, etc.
What they don't seem to realize is EVERYTHING rides over the network, even voice & video.
Yet they scream & yell when there's an issue, but they're not willing to pony up when budget is submitted.

I used to work at a place like that. We had 8 offices from Boston to Alaska, one in S. Korea and another in China serving about 1100 people. Management didn't believe in standardizing equipment across buildings so there was a mix of HP and Cisco switches, Sonicwall and Checkpoint firewalls, Barracuda, Replay and MS SBS backup setups but every location had VOIP and video over IP yet we only had only 1.5 network admins (the dept manager did 'half time' as a network admin which usually ended up being 15%). The network admin was also our Exchange/AD admin and in charge of backups. Meanwhile the Dev team was 23 people strong and there were 2 dedicated DBAs.

I know the saying is 'Everyone is replaceable' but we've always wondered how long the chaos would last if he left and they brought in someone new to deal with that shit

 

[spidey07]

I can't print!

Not a network problem.

It's never a network problem. Ever.

My application isn't working, must be a network issue!

Funny, it's only your app that is having trouble. Not a network problem.

 

[Exterous]

I can't print!

Not a network problem.

It's never a network problem. Ever.

My application isn't working, must be a network issue!

Funny, it's only your app that is having trouble. Not a network problem.

*sigh*

#1 pet peeve: "Is the server down?"

Ok - we have like 17 at this office. I am going to need a bit more information

#2 pet peeve (close second): "Is the network down? I can't do x"

I get that from our Labview/DB guy all the time. He writes these labview programs but can't remember how it calls out to the DB. He tried to use passthrough-authentication on non-domain computers and blamed the network. He had a program that he swore up and down would only run locally and then print to a network printer but a 'network problem' was generating an access denied message. Turns out it called to a DB the user didn't have rights to. It wouldn't be so bad if I didn't have to argue with him every single time. At some point you think he'd get the idea to at least listen to me (and believe a log entry) before insisting what I said was going happening couldn't be going happening