My Nvidia Conspiracy Theory

[toyota]

HD 7970 was not a modest increase over HD 6970, it was ~45% faster and had much higher overclocking headroom. GTX680 offered a ~35% higher performance over GTX580 yet there were few complaints about GTX680 being a modest improvement.

HD 7970 was IMHO overpriced by $50, having said that it did give better price perf compared to Nvidia's GTX580 OC editions and GTX580 3GB.

HD 6970 release price: $369
HD 7970 release price: $549

49% price increase for a ~45% performance increase. So price/perf remained roughly the same. You can't blame AMD for not following the HD 6970 pricing considering it was new tech and much faster than the competition. On release the GTX680 did offer a better price/perf but that lasted only a short period before AMD price cuts and the 7970GE (re badged 7970 IMHO). Don't you think it is hypocritical to denounce AMD for releasing a GPU that was ~30% faster than the oppositions high end GPU (GTX580 3GB) for a lower price? Yet claim Nvidia are blameless for releasing a card with a similar performance increase for a 120% price increase (Titan).

For the record I think the GTX770 is an excellent GPU at last gens 2nd tier pricing so I think it gives good price/perf when taking only in that view. GTX780 and Titan pricing on the other hand is taking the piss. $250 price hike from 3rd tier to top 2nd tier card, $600 price hike from 3rd tier to top tier cards. Do you honestly think this is OK?

at launch the 7970 was around 40% faster than the 6970 and cost 45% more than the 6970 launched at. even if you want to argue that it was 45% faster then that is still the first time in many years that a next gen gpu gave no better performance per dollar than the previous gen. so yes that opened up the window for Nividia to launch a modest gk114 and beat the 7970 overall and charge 500 bucks. so no matter how you look at it, that would not have been possible if AMD had not raised the prices at the same rate as performance.

 

[blastingcap]

That's exactly why I did not go to nvidia this time and went with "Graphics by AMD Radeon HD" !

You do realize that both companies rebrand their GPUs right? Like HD5770 and HD6770 and the various permutations of the 8800/9800/GTS chip.

 

[toyota]

You do realize that both companies rebrand their GPUs right? Like HD5770 and HD6770.

AMD has some 7 series cards that were 6 and even 5 series cards originally. its so funny when people think only Nvidia does that.

 

[Face2Face]

This is the trend, and has been for quite some time. You can't blame AMD for wanting to finally make some decent profit when they released their 7 series. At that time Nvidia did not have a single card as powerful, so AMD jacked the price up. Same is now going on with the GTX 780 which also has no equal. And so the cycle repeats...

 

[Irishwhitey]

AMD has some 7 series cards that were 6 and even 5 series cards originally. its so funny when people think only Nvidia does that.

nvidia are the only ones using sleazy marketing tricks and half truths which is the difference.

 

[bystander36]

nvidia are the only ones using sleazy marketing tricks and half truths which is the difference.

What half truths and sleazy marketing are you referring to?

 

[toyota]

nvidia are the only ones using sleazy marketing tricks and half truths which is the difference.

the only ones? you clearly have some issues. I guess you joined the forums just in time for your mental meltdown.

 

[sushiwarrior]

I have to agree that while AMD and Nvidia do both rebrand, AMD tends towards low-end rebranding while Nvidia rebrands enthusiast/gamer level parts... AKA 9800GTX+/GTS250, 8800GS/9600GSO, 8800GT/9800GT, GTX680/GTX770 and the rest of the GTX7xx series besides the GTX780... AMD hasn't rebranded nearly that many products.

 

[bystander36]

AMD rebranded their 5870's to 6870's. That seems quite similar to me. I was surprised still, with the 770. I would have expected the rebrand to be a 760ti. The 70 cards usually are cut down 80 cards, but I guess since the 780 was a cut down Titan, they didn't have room for another cut down product.

 

[toyota]

AMD rebranded their 5870's to 6870's. That seems quite similar to me. I was surprised still, with the 770. I would have expected the rebrand to be a 760ti. The 70 cards usually are cut down 80 cards, but I guess since the 780 was a cut down Titan, they didn't have room for another cut down product.

um those were not rebrands at all. there were misleading though because the 6870 was slower than 5870 and 6850 was slower than 5850.

 

[Irishwhitey]

um those were not rebrands at all. there were misleading though because the 6870 was slower than 5870 and 6850 was slower than 5850.

True.

 

[Irishwhitey]

I have to agree that while AMD and Nvidia do both rebrand, AMD tends towards low-end rebranding while Nvidia rebrands enthusiast/gamer level parts... AKA 9800GTX+/GTS250, 8800GS/9600GSO, 8800GT/9800GT, GTX680/GTX770 and the rest of the GTX7xx series besides the GTX780... AMD hasn't rebranded nearly that many products.

The only re brand from amd that comes to mind was 5770/6770.

 

[toyota]

The only re brand from amd that comes to mind was 5770/6770.

they have had some low end desktop cards that were re branded. they also have plenty of mobile and oem re brands too.

 

[sushiwarrior]

they have had some low end desktop cards that were re branded. they also have plenty of mobile and oem re brands too.

That sort of thing doesn't really concern "enthusiasts" like us, and Nvidia and AMD are both equally bad at those rebrands (they really don't even try :'( ). We're talking about mid-high end rebrands, and the fact of the matter is Nvidia has a much worse history of rebranding.

 

[Irishwhitey]

That sort of thing doesn't really concern "enthusiasts" like us, and Nvidia and AMD are both equally bad at those rebrands (they really don't even try :'( ). We're talking about mid-high end rebrands, and the fact of the matter is Nvidia has a much worse history of rebranding.

Not saying that re branding is a bad thing I mean it's just the marketing behind it. I would have no problem with nvidia if they came out and were honest about the re brands and told it like it is. If nvidia stated for example that GTX 580 is a reworked and warmed over 480 that delvers slightly better performance and thermals or better yet just called it the GTX 480 Ultra then it would be much better and less confusing.

 

[bystander36]

Not saying that re branding is a bad thing I mean it's just the marketing behind it. I would have no problem with nvidia if they came out and were honest about the re brands and told it like it is. If nvidia stated for example that GTX 580 is a reworked and warmed over 480 that delvers slightly better performance and thermals or better yet just called it the GTX 480 Ultra then it would be much better and less confusing.

I thought every review made it clear that the 770 was a 680 with faster memory and clocks. I don't think there was anything dishonest. That said, I still don't like rebranding.

 

[sushiwarrior]

I thought every review made it clear that the 770 was a 680 with faster memory and clocks. I don't think there was anything dishonest. That said, I still don't like rebranding.

Most reviews compared it to the GTX670 more than the GTX680. Nvidia pushed a hard focus on improvements versus the GTX670 and GTX570 rather than the marginal gains over the 680.

 

[Irishwhitey]

I thought every review made it clear that the 770 was a 680 with faster memory and clocks. I don't think there was anything dishonest. That said, I still don't like rebranding.

nvidia named it 770 and marketed it as a seperate card from the 680. The legit pro reviewers of course brought to light like they indeed should that 770 is a 680.

 

[toyota]

Not saying that re branding is a bad thing I mean it's just the marketing behind it. I would have no problem with nvidia if they came out and were honest about the re brands and told it like it is. If nvidia stated for example that GTX 580 is a reworked and warmed over 480 that delvers slightly better performance and thermals or better yet just called it the GTX 480 Ultra then it would be much better and less confusing.

were you upset when AMD released 6870/6850 cards that were slower than 5870/5850? the 580 was tweaked quite a bit and besides higher clocks and higher memory bandwidth also offered more shaders, more tmus, faster FP16 texture filtering capabilities, and revised Z-culling for better tessellation. all that while running much quieter and cooler with a new vapor chamber cooler and using no more power. hell thats not too bad for a mid cycle refresh.

 

[f1sherman]

Not saying that re branding is a bad thing I mean it's just the marketing behind it. I would have no problem with nvidia if they came out and were honest about the re brands and told it like it is. If nvidia stated for example that GTX 580 is a reworked and warmed over 480 that delvers slightly better performance and thermals or better yet just called it the GTX 480 Ultra then it would be much better and less confusing.

granted... you sound confusing enough as it is.

The self entitlment of NV/AMD having to throw away perfectly next-gen viable chips just because someone might scream rebrand.
But that person already knows its a rebrand, so how exactly is he getting shafted?
Wait wait... I know, you're the voice of silent and ignorant majority.

I'll give you the ignorant part Cedar, Juniper, Turks. Google it.

 

[Irishwhitey]

were you upset when AMD released 6870/6850 cards that were slower than 5870/5850?

No cause they were not intended to be 58xx series replacement cards. That was a naming fail not marketing fail.

the 580 was tweaked quite a bit and besides higher clocks and higher memory bandwidth also offered more shaders, ...

Yes it was a true 480 the way the 480 was supposed to be from launch day one.

 

[Irishwhitey]

granted... you sound confusing enough as it is.

I suppose a certain level of background knowledge on GPUs was erroneously thought to be common knowledge around here. My bad.

 

[f1sherman]

I suppose a certain level of background knowledge on GPUs was erroneously thought to be common knowledge around here. My bad.

You can say that again :thumbsup:

The only re brand from amd that comes to mind was 5770/6770.

 

[toyota]

No cause they were not intended to be 58xx series replacement cards. That was a naming fail not marketing fail.


Yes it was a true 480 the way the 480 was supposed to be from launch day one.

so naming fail is okay if AMD does it? and 7970 GE was what the 7970 should have been on launch day. you are so blinded by your Nvidia hatred that you see nothing wrong with anything that AMD does.

I will agree that the 480/470 should have never been launched in the shape they were in. it was hilarious to watch people defend those hot loud noisy pos cards for months after launch.

 

[Irishwhitey]

You can say that again :thumbsup:

It's not confusing if you understand video cards and are a PC gamer is it ? I think it was only you that was confused. Anyway Back on topic ...